East stand for P***ton at home

Steb said:
I can’t see home fans being in the east as away fans have started coming in from the north end to stop the trouble of them coming out of the south at full time.
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Except that there was some sort of trouble at the north east end either after Fulham or before Huddersfield, so the police then decided to let the Huddersfield fans out straight onto Bloomfield Road.
 
BFC_BFC_BFC said:
Doh!! Because that's how you go about building and developing a fanbase, as opposed to going out of your way to prevent new fans from coming, perhaps?
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Doh!! Because if they really wanted to come, they’d have made the effort already, after our promotion. Fact is, there are empty seats elsewhere in the ground, so the East is currently a non-argument for home fans.
 
BFC_53 said:
If we give them a third of the ground (which is pretty much what the East stand is), then it's a disgrace. You're not telling me that there is nothing the club can do to ensure the north half of the stand is given to home fans. It really needs to do whatever it takes.
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53, don’t you mean a quarter.?
 
TimperleyTangerine said:
Doh!! Because if they really wanted to come, they’d have made the effort already, after our promotion. Fact is, there are empty seats elsewhere in the ground, so the East is currently a non-argument for home fans.
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A couple of things…

1. How do you know that haven’t made the effort already?

2. Why would you ever want to restrict attendances to ‘regular fans’ only? We’re a Football Club, not some private members club…. The more people we can attract the better surely?

Fact is that this is a huge game and for any big game we should be aiming to maximise the number of home supporters and use the game as a springboard to develop attendances… your attitude to this is totally backward mate… Are you Karl Oyston in disguise?
 
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I was put in the North End of the East for the Oxford game it was bloody freezing as it doesn't have any sides and open to the elements.
Add on Portaloos no food or drink(I know they weren't open), posts obscuring view and poor seating it really is a crap end then charge a floater 28 quid for the privilege you'd be lucky to see them again!
 
I honestly think it completely bizarre that so called fans are pushing the idea for away fans in the empty East seats rather than trying to get more home fans in
 
BFC_BFC_BFC said:
A couple of things…

1. How do you know that haven’t made the effort already?

2. Why would you ever want to restrict attendances to ‘regular fans’ only? We’re a Football Club, not some private members club…. The more people we can attract the better surely?

Fact is that this is a huge game and for any big game we should be aiming to maximise the number of home supporters and use the game as a springboard to develop attendances… your attitude to this is totally backward mate… Are you Karl Oyston in disguise?
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1. We’ve had empty seats in other stands, at every game this season. All those who have wanted to attend have been able to.

2. I don’t want to restrict attendances, what a ridiculous observation. I agree, we need to attract new fans and that’s why my lad is a Pool fan. I want to see true fans attending regularly, as opposed to just big games. There is work to do to achieve that, and I respect your point of view, but there is inherent risk opening up the East to floating fans (or giving more seats to Preston).

How old are you, get a grip. I’ve been a fan for 40 years, started at the very lowest times, and I’m born & bred in Manchester, and travel for every game. If the old site was still accessible, you’d find that I was advocating boycotting games, before NAPM became a thing. That good enough for you.
 
Eternaloptimist said:
53, don’t you mean a quarter.?
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In terms of % of capacity it's more like a third I think, but not quite as much as that. It's between a third and a quarter......not sure what that makes it in a fraction, they were never my strong point! I always decimalise my betting app for this reason 🤣
 
TimperleyTangerine said:
1. We’ve had empty seats in other stands, at every game this season. All those who have wanted to attend have been able to.

2. I don’t want to restrict attendances, what a ridiculous observation. I agree, we need to attract new fans and that’s why my lad is a Pool fan. I want to see true fans attending regularly, as opposed to just big games. There is work to do to achieve that, and I respect your point of view, but there is inherent risk opening up the East to floating fans (or giving more seats to Preston).

How old are you, get a grip. I’ve been a fan for 40 years, started at the very lowest times, and I’m born & bred in Manchester. If the old site was still accessible, you’d find that I was advocating boycotting games, before NAPM became a thing. That good enough for you.
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1. Empty Seats at a few games isn’t evidence. It’s perfectly possible that 12,000 - 15,000 different individual home supporters have already attended games this season…. The fact that all of them haven’t attended all the games doesn’t mean they won’t all want to attend the Preston Game.

2. You suggested we shouldn’t open up the East and your reasoning was “Why make special arrangements for people who only want to turn up for a derby”…

I mean is it not obvious that a derby or a big cup game is going to attract more fans? Why would you adopt the attitude that essentially amounts to ‘if they can’t be arsed turning up every game, then fuck them’ ? It’s just daft!

We’ve had all these years of none-attendance with the Oystons and more recently Covid, the Club needs to be doing everything possible to get home fans back in the ground and these big games are the ones that present the biggest opportunity…. Fair enough, if there are safety reasons etc, but if we can get more in then we should do so..
 
BFC_BFC_BFC said:
1. Empty Seats at a few games isn’t evidence. It’s perfectly possible that 12,000 - 15,000 different individual home supporters have already attended games this season…. The fact that all of them haven’t attended all the games doesn’t mean they won’t all want to attend the Preston Game.

2. You suggested we shouldn’t open up the East and your reasoning was “Why make special arrangements for people who only want to turn up for a derby”…

I mean is it not obvious that a derby or a big cup game is going to attract more fans? Why would you adopt the attitude that essentially amounts to ‘if they can’t be arsed turning up every game, then fuck them’ ? It’s just daft!

We’ve had all these years of none-attendance with the Oystons and more recently Covid, the Club needs to be doing everything possible to get home fans back in the ground and these big games are the ones that present the biggest opportunity…. Fair enough, if there are safety reasons etc, but if we can get more in then we should do so..
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1. You talk about my evidence, but what do you have other than pure speculation and absolute confidence that your view is right. Our home support has been pretty consistent, and it’s highly unlikely there have been 12-15k different fans in attendance.

2. What is your point - I’ve made my view perfectly clear about the East, for floating fans and away fans. I’ve referred to inherent safety issues. Fact is, the East is a temporary stand and not designed for safe segregation. We have seen already this season the risks of fans mixing on entry and exit.

Money grabbing on a big match is something the O’s would have done, irrespective of the risks.

Tickets should only be sold to existing fans with a purchase history - it would be madness to allow new fans to register and purchase tickets for this match - how would the club know if these were new Pool fans or PNE?

I’d argue that any new fan, disappointed at not being able to attend the derby, would be incentivised to become a more regular attender or ST holder. That’s the only way to see the big games. That addresses your point about attracting new fans. If you just make it easy to pick & choose, you don’t achieve any sustainable improvement.
 
I'm looking forward to a game with no racial. Homophobic , sexist, ageist, or weightist chanting and is chanting about club colours offensive to colour blind people? The game is ruined 😪
 
TimperleyTangerine said:
1. You talk about my evidence, but what do you have other than pure speculation and absolute confidence that your view is right. Our home support has been pretty consistent, and it’s highly unlikely there have been 12-15k different fans in attendance.

2. What is your point - I’ve made my view perfectly clear about the East, for floating fans and away fans. I’ve referred to inherent safety issues. Fact is, the East is a temporary stand and not designed for safe segregation. We have seen already this season the risks of fans mixing on entry and exit.

Money grabbing on a big match is something the O’s would have done, irrespective of the risks.

Tickets should only be sold to existing fans with a purchase history - it would be madness to allow new fans to register and purchase tickets for this match - how would the club know if these were new Pool fans or PNE?

I’d argue that any new fan, disappointed at not being able to attend the derby, would be incentivised to become a more regular attender or ST holder. That’s the only way to see the big games. That addresses your point about attracting new fans. If you just make it easy to pick & choose, you don’t achieve any sustainable improvement.
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Hold on a minute.... "Absolute confidence that my view is right"

Where did you come up with that notion from?

I said, it is 'Perfectly Possible' and not "absolutely certain".... Are your trying to suggest that exactly the same individuals have attended all our home league games so far this season? Some people will have attended 1 game out of four, some 2 games, some 3 games and some 4... The fact that the number of people has been 'consistent' does not mean that the same individual people have attended the games. You would normally expect that the number of actual individuals who are regularly attending games is around 15-20% higher than the average home attendance. (so average crowds of 10,000 would mean 12,000 individuals attending games.

My point is that your attitude towards this is backward.... You come across as some type of uber-fan who places themselves on a pedestal, because they've attended a few football games. There are all sorts of reasons why people may or may not have been able to attend games this season and even if they just wanted to turn up for the Preston game in any case it really shouldn't matter.... As forward thinking fans and a forward thinking football club we need to have a more progressive approach to developing our fan base.

It has nothing to do with "money grabbing" and everything to do with capitalising on the big games as an opportunity to get people through the gates. The hope then is that floating supporters will enjoy the experience and want to come back....That's what it's all about surely?

And how would any new fan be incentivised to become a more regular supporter (assuming that they aren't in the first place) by the fact that they can't get tickets. Surely they'll just be incentivised to go and support a different Club who can be bothered to make the effort to accomodate more than a handful of fans?

Your last paragraph is absolute nonsense BTW..... the ONLY way that a Club can ever expect to be able to develop its fanbase effectively is by having more space available than is necessary and being able to accommodate significant swings in attendances for the bigger games. The lack of available space at BR has been a massive limiting factor for the Club for years and has negatively impacted on the fanbase.
 
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BFC_BFC_BFC said:
Hold on a minute.... "Absolute confidence that my view is right"

Where did you come up with that notion from?

I said, it is 'Perfectly Possible' and not "absolutely certain".... Are your trying to suggest that exactly the same individuals have attended all our home league games so far this season? Some people will have attended 1 game out of four, some 2 games, some 3 games and some 4... The fact that the number of people has been 'consistent' does not mean that the same individual people have attended the games. You would normally expect that the number of actual individuals who are regularly attending games is around 15-20% higher than the average home attendance. (so average crowds of 10,000 would mean 12,000 individuals attending games.

My point is that your attitude towards this is backward.... You come across as some type of uber-fan who places themselves on a pedestal, because they've attended a few football games. There are all sorts of reasons why people may or may not have been able to attend games this season and even if they just wanted to turn up for the Preston game in any case it really shouldn't matter.... As forward thinking fans and a forward thinking football club we need to have a more progressive approach to developing our fan base.

It has nothing to do with "money grabbing" and everything to do with capitalising on the big games as an opportunity to get people through the gates. The hope then is that floating supporters will enjoy the experience and want to come back....That's what it's all about surely?

And how would any new fan be incentivised to become a more regular supporter (assuming that they aren't in the first place) by the fact that they can't get tickets. Surely they'll just be incentivised to go and support a different Club who can be bothered to make the effort to accomodate more than a handful of fans?

Your last paragraph is absolute nonsense BTW..... the ONLY way that a Club can every expect to be able to develop it's fanbase effectively is by having more space available than is necessary fan being able to accommodate significant swings in attendances for the bigger games. The lack of available space at BR has been a massive limiting factor for the Club for years and has negatively impacted on the fanbase.
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Of course fans will have attended different games, but whatever the mix, we haven’t had 12-15k fans.

I can assure you I’m no uber-fan, just an ordinary fan, passionate and proud. We both would love to see every seat sold out, and the club needing to look at further development of the ground. However, we simply don’t sell out in the North, West and South, in more than 90% of games. That is a fact, and if we have another 500-1000 about to join the fanbase, they can be accommodated in those stands. The numbers I’ve quoted would be a 5-10% increase, so quite significant.

For avoidance of doubt, my reasoning is primarily based on potential security issues. Let’s hope that the planned development of the East will give us the extra and safe capacity you refer to.
 
TimperleyTangerine said:
Of course fans will have attended different games, but whatever the mix, we haven’t had 12-15k fans.

I can assure you I’m no uber-fan, just an ordinary fan, passionate and proud. We both would love to see every seat sold out, and the club needing to look at further development of the ground. However, we simply don’t sell out in the North, West and South, in more than 90% of games. That is a fact, and if we have another 500-1000 about to join the fanbase, they can be accommodated in those stands. The numbers I’ve quoted would be a 5-10% increase, so quite significant.

For avoidance of doubt, my reasoning is primarily based on potential security issues. Let’s hope that the planned development of the East will give us the extra and safe capacity you refer to.
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You have no idea how many fans have attended BR this season.... And that's the point... You are going off attendances and over a typical season well over 15,000 individual home fans will have attended BR at one game or another. So we need to be looking to accommodate them all collectively for a big game if possible.

Well if you're no 'uber-fan' then i'm struggling to understand your disdain for fans who (for whatever reason) have not attended all of the games so far this season. Your post came across very much like you feel that fans who just turn up for big games are not worthy of our consideration or concern.

I suspect that there are only a small number of Clubs in the UK that regularly sell out for more than 90% of the games in a season. That's just normal... If you look at most Clubs in the Championship then the Highest attendance in any given season is likely to be 50% higher than the average and even then, they would still not be filling the ground, as there would be space for segregation etc.. So the idea that a 5-10% buffer is anything like enough to properly accommodate the bigger games is just wrong (as I said before it smacks of Karl Oyston and his '50-100' being locked out mentality).

I can see where people are coming from and I get your point about security issues.... And that should be the most significant consideration, when the Club are considering options to accommodate fans.
 
BFC_BFC_BFC said:
You have no idea how many fans have attended BR this season.... And that's the point... You are going off attendances and over a typical season well over 15,000 individual home fans will have attended BR at one game or another. So we need to be looking to accommodate them all collectively for a big game if possible.

Well if you're no 'uber-fan' then i'm struggling to understand your disdain for fans who (for whatever reason) have not attended all of the games so far this season. Your post came across very much like you feel that fans who just turn up for big games are not worthy of our consideration or concern.

I suspect that there are only a small number of Clubs in the UK that regularly sell out for more than 90% of the games in a season. That's just normal... If you look at most Clubs in the Championship then the Highest attendance in any given season is likely to be 50% higher than the average and even then, they would still not be filling the ground, as there would be space for segregation etc.. So the idea that a 5-10% buffer is anything like enough to properly accommodate the bigger games is just wrong (as I said before it smacks of Karl Oyston and his '50-100' being locked out mentality).

I can see where people are coming from and I get your point about security issues.... And that should be the most significant consideration, when the Club are considering options to accommodate fans.
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Nowhere have I demonstrated distain for fans who have been unable to attend ALL matches this season. Your words not mine.

I have said that I would love to see the fanbase grow. We are on the same page there.

However, I don’t have much sympathy for fans that haven’t attended ANY games and only turn out for big games - they make a conscious choice and accept the risk that they may not get tickets for the big games.

For this game in isolation I don’t think the club needs to take security risks by opening up the remainder of the East, with the additional expenditure that would be needed.

SS will have a business model and fanbase projection at low, medium and high growth. He will make investment decisions based on those projections. He has already identified a need to develop the East, so the wheels are in motion. In the meantime, the likely scenario is that for 22 of our 23 home games this season, we will have capacity in the other 3 stands.

It’s getting boring, so let’s agree we want the fanbase to grow, but we have differing views on how that can be achieved.
 
TTractor said:
Except that there was some sort of trouble at the north east end either after Fulham or before Huddersfield, so the police then decided to let the Huddersfield fans out straight onto Bloomfield Road.
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It’s not well designed for herding away fans in and out
 
I think it's pretty reasonable to assume that the demand will be there to fill the North end of the East stand with home fans. This is the biggest game of the season. We are playing against our arch rivals for the first time in 8 years.

15k home fans for the homecoming. Operating at virtually full capacity (not always 100% due to the bizarre sales strategy of the Oyston's) during the Premier League season. I think it is fair to assume that we can sell the additional 2.5k or whatever it is in the Northern side of the East.

In my opinion, as soon as the Police and 2 clubs decide on an exact date and time, this needs to be advertised and tickets need to be made available. If sales are going well (which they will) then home fans should be given every opportunity to be given that half of the East. It would be ludicrous to give Preston fans priority over Blackpool fans whether they are 'floaters' or not.
 
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