Indian variant

M

Matesrates

Well-known member
They’re doing surge testing and vaccinations in affected areas to try to suppress the virus and stop it spreading, but they’re saying it will become the dominant variant in the uk. So what’s the point?
 
On the radio yesterday they said that 'Of the 20 brought in with the Indian variant, none had actually had an inoculation'.
Unbelievable.
They are not all youngsters either.
 
They put India on the Red List far too late and let 20,000 Indians back into the country before they finally did. Boris always bangs on about learning from the lessons but this may come back and haunt him as it could have a serious impact on the Roadmap out of this pendemic. He was quick to put Bangladesh and Pakistan on the Red List much earlier than India who both had far less infection rates.
 
Indian variant probably not more infectious after all. PHE have said

"Secondary attack rates for contacts of non-travel cases with VUI-21APR-01, VOC-21APR02 or VUI-21APR-03 were not significantly different from that for contacts of non-travel cases with VOC-20DEC-01."

I’ll let you know this on here as it won’t make the mainstream news, too positive.
 
To be honest AK it doesn't matter if it isn't more infectious - the fact is it's caused a massive issue that may delay our exit from restrictions because 20k have come back from a country ravaged with the new strain of virus and we have let them self-isolate ( and clearly many haven't ) just so as to not upset Modi
 
Adams Kebab said:
Indian variant probably not more infectious after all. PHE have said

I’ll let you know this on here as it won’t make the mainstream news, too positive.
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Except it was on the BBC news yesterday (Matt Hancock said exactly that).

You appear to be so wrapped up in your conspiracy world that you are posting misinformation.

You are right though it is positive news, but for the reasons TAM points out, it appears to be an own goal which may delay the `road map`...
 
TBF TAM it makes a very significant difference and so it does matter... It's likely to mean the difference between continuing on plan or winding back the measures and re-entering lockdown.
 
BFC_BFC_BFC said:
TBF TAM it makes a very significant difference and so it does matter... It's likely to mean the difference between continuing on plan or winding back the measures and re-entering lockdown.
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Can't imagine this country will entertain a 4th lockdown, let's be honest.
 
TwelveAngryMen said:
To be honest AK it doesn't matter if it isn't more infectious - the fact is it's caused a massive issue that may delay our exit from restrictions because 20k have come back from a country ravaged with the new strain of virus and we have let them self-isolate ( and clearly many haven't ) just so as to not upset Modi
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I agree with you regarding the people returning, I’ve dared to say before that political games are being played with the restrictions, the Indian saga highlights it.

I think according to Spud though that makes me a conspiracy theorist.
 
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BFC_BFC_BFC said:
If the Indian Variant was (as suggested) 50% more transmissable than the Kent one, then we'd very likely have had little choice in the matter.
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I think you'd see more protests and probably riots if they put another lockdown on peoples shoulders. Especially after 70/80% of the country has been vaccinated and it'll be summer.
 
BFC_BFC_BFC said:
If the Indian Variant was (as suggested) 50% more transmissable than the Kent one, then we'd very likely have had little choice in the matter.
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The difference is though, that unlike when the Kent variant hit, no one had been vaccinated, now were well into the programme and that will make a huge difference.

There is a positive as well, in that those in the affected areas are coming forward in their droves to get vaccinated.
 
spudgun said:
Except it was on the BBC news yesterday (Matt Hancock said exactly that).

You appear to be so wrapped up in your conspiracy world that you are posting misinformation.

You are right though it is positive news, but for the reasons TAM points out, it appears to be an own goal which may delay the `road map`...
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Misinformation ha ha... you’re mixing me up with Sage.

Wrapped up in a conspiracy world? I think the restrictions and the scaremongering is a joke, we had 72 hours of this Indian variant being plastered on every news stream, social media, on here and more. Businesses and human beings don’t need that, when guess what?! It’s nowhere near as bad as was made out.

On Friday night, my daughters High School emailed saying that kids no longer needed to wear masks. 1 hour later they emailed again saying on the instruction of Lancs CC and due to the Indian variant they did. It’s bollocks.

If you think this makes me a conspiracy theorist then book me a one way ticket to Button Moon please, can I just ask do I have to wear a mask on the journey, or does Covid know when I’m having a drink or eating a sarnie. Let me know Spud.
 
SeasideKurt said:
I think you'd see more protests and probably riots if they put another lockdown on peoples shoulders. Especially after 70/80% of the country has been vaccinated and it'll be summer.
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Yep I agree, you probably would see more protests.

Matesrates said:
The difference is though, that unlike when the Kent variant hit, no one had been vaccinated, now were well into the programme and that will make a huge difference.

There is a positive as well, in that those in the affected areas are coming forward in their droves to get vaccinated.
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The modelling that was completed, based on the virus being 50% more transmissable, had accounted for vaccination. So whilst vaccination will have a huge impact, significant numbers of people still would have died apparently.

It is a positive that people are becoming motivated to get the vaccine...It does make you wonder if perhaps vaccine compliance levels had started to slip😉
 
spudgun said:
www.bbc.co.uk

Covid: Increasing confidence jabs work against Indian variant

There is "increasing confidence" Covid vaccines are effective against the variant, Matt Hancock says.
www.bbc.co.uk

Like I said, it was reported on the main stream news yesterday. You claimed it wasn`t. Misinformation...
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Can I just say a special thank you to & Matty Hancock for this. Just the 48 hours of variants without clear evidence and many people thinking there will be local lockdowns or an increase in hospitalisations and deaths again, all good for people’s mental health.

When’s the 5pm presser to put the Countries mind at ease? I presume today yeh?
 
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As in computer program development, you can do all the testing in the world looking for bugs/glitches or complete failure, but until you go live, especially in customer facing software, you really don’t know what dumb* thing a user is going to do (* or a “I didn’t think to test that scenario” moment)

Same with coming out of lockdown and opening things up like they have today. They will have modelled various situations, but at the last moment a new aggressive variant has thrown a big spanner into their predictions.

I don’t think they wind back the re-opening of indoor dining/drinking/non-essential shops etc. But we may see a cagier approach to removing all restrictions.

What they have shown is that they can now respond quickly to “local” situations rapidly and have plans in place to deal with outbreaks so the whole country won’t have to suffer, but may mean some local inconvenience in an affected area - how they stop people simply going to another town where restrictions might not be in place is another matter - I guess they might be relying on people to show some common sense (so we are screwed then!)
 
TangerineBayern said:
They put India on the Red List far too late and let 20,000 Indians back into the country before they finally did. Boris always bangs on about learning from the lessons but this may come back and haunt him as it could have a serious impact on the Roadmap out of this pendemic. He was quick to put Bangladesh and Pakistan on the Red List much earlier than India who both had far less infection rates.
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It seems that the Joint Biosecurity Centre updated their risk assessment on 19 April and both England and Scotland (and I presume Wales & NI) added India to the red list on the same day:

Ministers have taken the decision to put India on the acute risk list of travel countries after the Joint Biosecurity Centre increased India’s risk rating.
https://www.gov.scot/news/india-placed-on-red-list-of-travel-countries/

Pakistan and Bangladesh were red listed over concerns about SA and Brazil variants rather than absolute case numbers, also at the time India had fewer cases per capita than the UK, there was a stronger case for putting most of the EU on the red list than India.

India was red-listed due to the rapid rise in cases, although even then they were at about 1/3 of the level in France.

Finally B.1.617.2 was only upgraded from VUI to VOC on 6 May, about 2 weeks after India was added to the red list.
 
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There ought to be supervised quarantine and testing for those coming in from red list countries. No excuse not to do this.
 
clappers said:
There ought to be supervised quarantine and testing for those coming in from red list countries. No excuse not to do this.
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https://www.gov.uk/guidance/red-amber-and-green-list-rules-for-entering-england

If you have been in a country or territory on the red list in the last 10 days you will only be allowed to enter the UK if you are a British or Irish National, or you have residence rights in the UK.

On arrival in England you must: quarantine in a managed hotel, including 2 COVID-19 tests
 
Lost Seasider said:
https://www.gov.uk/guidance/red-amber-and-green-list-rules-for-entering-england

If you have been in a country or territory on the red list in the last 10 days you will only be allowed to enter the UK if you are a British or Irish National, or you have residence rights in the UK.

On arrival in England you must: quarantine in a managed hotel, including 2 COVID-19 tests
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It was far too late in the case of India and with a pre-warning to allow people the get back ahead of the quarantine rules.
 
Lost Seasider said:
It seems that the Joint Biosecurity Centre updated their risk assessment on 19 April and both England and Scotland (and I presume Wales & NI) added India to the red list on the same day:

Ministers have taken the decision to put India on the acute risk list of travel countries after the Joint Biosecurity Centre increased India’s risk rating.
https://www.gov.scot/news/india-placed-on-red-list-of-travel-countries/

Pakistan and Bangladesh were red listed over concerns about SA and Brazil variants rather than absolute case numbers, also at the time India had fewer cases per capita than the UK, there was a stronger case for putting most of the EU on the red list than India.

India was red-listed due to the rapid rise in cases, although even then they were at about 1/3 of the level in France.

Finally B.1.617.2 was only upgraded from VUI to VOC on 6 May, about 2 weeks after India was added to the red list.
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The government has reacted late to the Indian variant, it doesn’t matter how many ways the turd needs to be polished it was late and we are having to pay a price for it. The lessons have not been learned about border closures and given we are an island it’s not rocket science as we all saw the problems unfold infront of our very eyes on the news in India well before they decided to put them on the red list. Allowing 20k at risk people into the UK is unacceptable.
 
straightatthewall said:
It was far too late in the case of India and with a pre-warning to allow people the get back ahead of the quarantine rules.
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Scotland acted on the same day and did the exact same things, it was the day the scientific advice changed, the UK actually acted earlier than most of the rest of Europe in this case.
 
Lost Seasider said:
Scotland acted on the same day and did the exact same things, it was the day the scientific advice changed, the UK actually acted earlier than most of the rest of Europe in this case.
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Doesn’t matter what anyone else did. It was too late. It was happening in real time in front of our eyes and it was very clear what should have happened. It didn’t.
 
straightatthewall said:
Doesn’t matter what anyone else did. It was too late. It was happening in real time in front of our eyes and it was very clear what should have happened. It didn’t.
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What day do you think they should have been put on the red list and what is the basis for your opinion?

I promise you'll find no mention of "Indian variant" on here before May 7th
 
Davepick said:
On the radio yesterday they said that 'Of the 20 brought in with the Indian variant, none had actually had an inoculation'.
Unbelievable.
They are not all youngsters either.
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Darwinism again Dave.
Cull those too stupid to get a vaccination when it’s available to you. If not available due to health reasons, then live in a socially distanced bubble and inform all those in tour life why you’re doing it.

If you’re going to mix with others in close proximity indoors, be over 50 and not get a vaccine - it’s likely that the outcome won’t be great
 
The issue with this Indian variant is that it also tends to make the under-40s age group very sick and hospitalises them, not just oldies, whereas they tended to have less severe symptoms from the previous variants. That we have only just started vaxxing this age group in the UK compounds the problem enormously and risks overloading our hospitals again. That’s why we have emergency vaxxing in Bolton and Blackburn - to try and catch the bolting horses after Bozo kept the stable door open for three weeks longer than he should have.

Amongst the 20,000 unsupervised air travellers in those last three days alone there were over 300 sources of CV+ infection identified on arrival and probably more incubating the virus caught on the flight itself. We knew the 300+ from their positive tests on arrival and, although that test does not identify the variant, it seems bloody obvious that people arriving from India would be carrying their dominant highly infectious variant. It’s a side-issue how and why were they allowed on the flight in the first place, but we found the problem and should have dealt with it immediately and properly.

And yet the Govt allowed these people to travel home on public transport and relied on their goodwill to isolate properly. They could have drafted in Army transport to take these people home securely, for example. It’s a complete organisational failure from the top AGAIN. How many times more will he always take the wrong decision? Has his mind been affected by long-Covid? Actually, no. Max Hastings told us two years ago he was not fit to be PM and would be useless in a crisis.
 
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Lost Seasider said:
Source?
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Several BBC News reports over the past week from their in-country correspondents visiting overloaded Indian hospitals and interviews with their doctors. They said they were seeing a high proportion of under-40s amongst their patients.
 
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Archibald Knox said:
Several BBC News reports over the past week from their in-country correspondents visiting overloaded Indian hospitals and interviews with their doctors.
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I don't think you can compare the effects of the Indian variant on the Indian population with it's effect on the UK population.
I'm not dismissing genuine concerns about this new variant though.
 
Insider said:
I don't think you can compare the effects of the Indian variant on the Indian population with it's effect on the UK population.
I'm not dismissing genuine concerns about this new variant though.
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Why not? Compare, I mean.
 
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Archibald Knox said:
Several BBC News reports over the past week from their in-country correspondents visiting overloaded Indian hospitals and interviews with their doctors.
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I've seen no such reports and can find no evidence to support your claim.

Also correspondents visiting hospitals is not reliable evidence.
 
Then you didn’t watch the news I did. Journalists are not stupid and neither are Indian doctors. It’s called anecdotal evidence, evidence from their own eyes. Conservatively, you should believe it until proven otherwise. If you don’t then you have to accept there might be a risk.
 
Lost Seasider said:
I've seen no such reports and can find no evidence to support your claim.

Also correspondents visiting hospitals is not reliable evidence.
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And in this article...
www.theguardian.com

‘The system has collapsed’: India’s descent into Covid hell

Many falsely believed that the country had defeated Covid. Now hospitals are running out of oxygen and bodies are stacking up in morgues
www.theguardian.com www.theguardian.com
“In the space of just 12 days, the Covid positivity rate doubled to 17%, while in Delhi it hit 30%. Hospitals across the country have filled to capacity but this time it is predominately the young taking up the beds; in Delhi, 65% of cases are under 40 years old.”

“Dr Amit Thadhani, director of Niramaya hospital in Mumbai, said this time round the virus was “much more aggressive and much more infectious” and was now predominately affecting young people. “Now it is people in their 20s and 30s who are coming in with very severe symptoms and there is a lot of mortality among young people,” he said.”

Satisfied?
 
TangerineBayern said:
They put India on the Red List far too late and let 20,000 Indians back into the country before they finally did. Boris always bangs on about learning from the lessons but this may come back and haunt him as it could have a serious impact on the Roadmap out of this pendemic. He was quick to put Bangladesh and Pakistan on the Red List much earlier than India who both had far less infection rates.
Click to expand...
In the throes of negotiating a trade deal when this came out. All those banging on about economy losing out to health concerns will be delighted.
 
Archibald Knox said:
And in this article...
www.theguardian.com

‘The system has collapsed’: India’s descent into Covid hell

Many falsely believed that the country had defeated Covid. Now hospitals are running out of oxygen and bodies are stacking up in morgues
www.theguardian.com www.theguardian.com
“In the space of just 12 days, the Covid positivity rate doubled to 17%, while in Delhi it hit 30%. Hospitals across the country have filled to capacity but this time it is predominately the young taking up the beds; in Delhi, 65% of cases are under 40 years old.”

“Dr Amit Thadhani, director of Niramaya hospital in Mumbai, said this time round the virus was “much more aggressive and much more infectious” and was now predominately affecting young people. “Now it is people in their 20s and 30s who are coming in with very severe symptoms and there is a lot of mortality among young people,” he said.”

Satisfied?
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The answer will be no.
 
Wizaard said:
In the throes of negotiating a trade deal when this came out. All those banging on about economy losing out to health concerns will be delighted.
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Wizaard said:
In the throes of negotiating a trade deal when this came out. All those banging on about economy losing out to health concerns will be delighted.
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Zoom or more secure conference facilities are available with legally binding electronic signatures would have secured the trade detail, me thinks Wizaard.
 
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