Kiers tax rises

Wizaard said:
Sorry, but it's getting to the point where the majority of young people will never own their own property because it's simply unaffordable.

A third of the country live in London where the average starting price is over £500,000.
Click to expand...
A third of the country live in London. No they don't. Nowhere near.
 
RUSTY_2_STANDS said:
'If they were any good they'd be in profit'
You haven't got a single clue about what it's like to run a business
But you're in good company as neither has the person who alledgedly looks after the UK's finances.
Of course there are some who take advantage and I totally condemn them.
But not all business owners are ogres who take advantage.
But you're making some very general and wide sweeping claims. I know quite a few small business
owners, a lot of whom work on very small profit margins and struggle to make ends meet.
They don't have the luxury of a guaranteed wage each month and often have to work very long hours.
Those people I mentioned in a previous post, many of whom took a risk to start up their own business
And without business owners there would be very little employment opportunities for anyone and the country
would be in a far bigger mess than what it is.
Like I said previously, the politics of envy. It's obvious you don't like anyone who has strived to better themselves
and succeeded and made a bit of money Just admit it.
Click to expand...
Small business owners are the types I have more sympathy with. They have been screwed the most over in recent years and I know there margins are getting smaller and smaller.
Seen it in the entertainment industry were pubs are literally closing mid-week as not making enough money.
It is heartbreaking when family shops that have been there for generations are going under and unfortunately I think things are only going to get worse. This country has all of its priorities wrong!
 
Jaffa_The_Hut said:
I think a lot of people will be giving Labour a wide berth at the next election.

Likewise a lot of people will be voting for Reform next time just to breakaway from the Tory/Labour stronghold.

Surely they can’t do any worse than this current shower? I mean will they see out another 4 years?
Click to expand...
Like a bet on that?
 
UTMP1989 said:
Small business owners are the types I have more sympathy with. They have been screwed the most over in recent years and I know there margins are getting smaller and smaller.
Seen it in the entertainment industry were pubs are literally closing mid-week as not making enough money.
It is heartbreaking when family shops that have been there for generations are going under and unfortunately I think things are only going to get worse. This country has all of its priorities wrong!
Click to expand...

Tenanted pubs are feeling the squeeze because they have to charge £5 - £6 a pint (£9 or £10 in London) to make a small profit
Spoons is seen as the benchmark now because beer is so cheap compared to the others.....That's why small independent pubs are doing well
OR...You can stay home, watch Sky sports and drink 4 Beers for £5......That's killing pubs, not the Government

As for retailers.....it's a dead market as the internet will deliver what you want, the next day for a better price.
We buy all our dog food in bulk from a place down south and it's more or less wholesale price...even our local pet food place is giving up trying to compete and reducing their stock levels.....it's a dying business
Would lower business rates help.......Maybe for small companies under a certain size/turnover
Would the reduction of VAT or taxes.....not really as the internet would feel the same effects
Would an 'internet tax' help.......could do for businesses based on the high street....but they will still die off

The high street as we know it is dying off.....Coffee shops, Vapes, Turkish hairdressers and betting shops........will be the only things left
 
B_Side_The_C_Side said:
Tenanted pubs are feeling the squeeze because they have to charge £5 - £6 a pint (£9 or £10 in London) to make a small profit
Spoons is seen as the benchmark now because beer is so cheap compared to the others.....That's why small independent pubs are doing well
OR...You can stay home, watch Sky sports and drink 4 Beers for £5......That's killing pubs, not the Government

As for retailers.....it's a dead market as the internet will deliver what you want, the next day for a better price.
We buy all our dog food in bulk from a place down south and it's more or less wholesale price...even our local pet food place is giving up trying to compete and reducing their stock levels.....it's a dying business
Would lower business rates help.......Maybe for small companies under a certain size/turnover
Would the reduction of VAT or taxes.....not really as the internet would feel the same effects
Would an 'internet tax' help.......could do for businesses based on the high street....but they will still die off

The high street as we know it is dying off.....Coffee shops, Vapes, Turkish hairdressers and betting shops........will be the only things left
Click to expand...
Perhaps I was wrong to blame it all on the government but they are squeezing as much as they can off of small businesses and it is the private sector which generate the revenues for the government to screw people over.
Understand your point about internet changing peoples buying habits but I honestly believe that this government would be happy to kill the high street if it meant they had more control over us. Let’s face it they have completely lost control of London and I imagine Birmingham or Manchester will be the next one to have the streets controlled by gangs.
The rates council charge are bloody atrocious no wonder small businesses are continually getting bankrupt or laying people off.
My final point is you correctly mention the streets been made up of Turkish Barbers and Vapor shops. Well why the hell are the government not going after these dodgy businesses, you don’t need to be a genius to work out its all money laundering. The barbers next to the uncle Albert I have seen it lying empty all day and then undesirables driving up in 100k range rovers popping in!
I go to Liverpool quite frequently and that is the polar opposite plenty of shops, cafes, traditional pubs and not that over-priced. It is much cleaner than London, Manchester and so not sure how they have maintained there city when most UK cities are turning into ghettos.
 
UTMP1989 said:
Perhaps I was wrong to blame it all on the government but they are squeezing as much as they can off of small businesses and it is the private sector which generate the revenues for the government to screw people over.
Understand your point about internet changing peoples buying habits but I honestly believe that this government would be happy to kill the high street if it meant they had more control over us. Let’s face it they have completely lost control of London and I imagine Birmingham or Manchester will be the next one to have the streets controlled by gangs.
The rates council charge are bloody atrocious no wonder small businesses are continually getting bankrupt or laying people off.
My final point is you correctly mention the streets been made up of Turkish Barbers and Vapor shops. Well why the hell are the government not going after these dodgy businesses, you don’t need to be a genius to work out its all money laundering. The barbers next to the uncle Albert I have seen it lying empty all day and then undesirables driving up in 100k range rovers popping in!
I go to Liverpool quite frequently and that is the polar opposite plenty of shops, cafes, traditional pubs and not that over-priced. It is much cleaner than London, Manchester and so not sure how they have maintained there city when most UK cities are turning into ghettos.
Click to expand...
I pretty much agree with that. We went to Liverpool last weekend. Stayed over in Southport and got the train to Liverpool.
The city centre and waterfront are a pleasure to visit these days.
But still some pretty run down areas outside the centre. As there are in most cities.
You mention Council charges. I draw plans for a living. The government in April allowed
councils to almost double the planning application fee for domestic works.
It's now not far off £600! And has there been an improvement in the service provided?
Absolutely not.
And that's at a time when building costs, particularly materials, are sky high.
You think about extending your house and you've got a near £600 bill for starters.
Then after planning you have to obtain Building Regs approval from the council.
And that fee is a similar amount.
No wonder the country is struggling for growth.
 
UTMP1989 said:
Perhaps I was wrong to blame it all on the government but they are squeezing as much as they can off of small businesses and it is the private sector which generate the revenues for the government to screw people over.
Understand your point about internet changing peoples buying habits but I honestly believe that this government would be happy to kill the high street if it meant they had more control over us. Let’s face it they have completely lost control of London and I imagine Birmingham or Manchester will be the next one to have the streets controlled by gangs.
The rates council charge are bloody atrocious no wonder small businesses are continually getting bankrupt or laying people off.
My final point is you correctly mention the streets been made up of Turkish Barbers and Vapor shops. Well why the hell are the government not going after these dodgy businesses, you don’t need to be a genius to work out its all money laundering. The barbers next to the uncle Albert I have seen it lying empty all day and then undesirables driving up in 100k range rovers popping in!
I go to Liverpool quite frequently and that is the polar opposite plenty of shops, cafes, traditional pubs and not that over-priced. It is much cleaner than London, Manchester and so not sure how they have maintained there city when most UK cities are turning into ghettos.
Click to expand...
'They have lost control of London...controlled by gangs'.

That's utter nonsense. I do wonder if some people ever go out, or just read disinformation on the internet.

I do agree with you about cash only barbers and vape shops.
 
Wizaard said:
'They have lost control of London...controlled by gangs'.

That's utter nonsense. I do wonder if some people ever go out, or just read disinformation on the internet.

I do agree with you about cash only barbers and vape shops.
Click to expand...
Yes I’ve had spells or living in Canary Wharf for work and if you wonder deep into tower hamlets or south Bermondsey it is rife with gang culture and like a ghetto.
Even the bloody locals warned me not to go walk about. It is full of pick pocketers on tubes (seen people arrested) and now the new trend is nicking mobile phones.
Granted there is parts of London were only multi-millionaires live like Kensington, Primrose Hill etc
My point is about the poorer parts in the east end of London it must be the most unsafest place to live in the UK.
You can honestly think that London doesn’t have problems with gangs compared to the rest of the UK?
Even retired police officers have written journey saying it is much violent now than what it’s ever been.
 
UTMP1989 said:
Yes I’ve had spells or living in Canary Wharf for work and if you wonder deep into tower hamlets or south Bermondsey it is rife with gang culture and like a ghetto.
Even the bloody locals warned me not to go walk about. It is full of pick pocketers on tubes (seen people arrested) and now the new trend is nicking mobile phones.
Granted there is parts of London were only multi-millionaires live like Kensington, Primrose Hill etc
My point is about the poorer parts in the east end of London it must be the most unsafest place to live in the UK.
You can honestly think that London doesn’t have problems with gangs compared to the rest of the UK?
Even retired police officers have written journey saying it is much violent now than what it’s ever been.
Click to expand...
I'm saying all cities have good and bad areas, but to say it's controlled by gangs isn't what I see. That's also the case for most cities.
 
RUSTY_2_STANDS said:
I pretty much agree with that. We went to Liverpool last weekend. Stayed over in Southport and got the train to Liverpool.
The city centre and waterfront are a pleasure to visit these days.
But still some pretty run down areas outside the centre. As there are in most cities.
You mention Council charges. I draw plans for a living. The government in April allowed
councils to almost double the planning application fee for domestic works.
It's now not far off £600! And has there been an improvement in the service provided?
Absolutely not.
And that's at a time when building costs, particularly materials, are sky high.
You think about extending your house and you've got a near £600 bill for starters.
Then after planning you have to obtain Building Regs approval from the council.
And that fee is a similar amount.
No wonder the country is struggling for growth.
Click to expand...
Yes in my opinion Liverpool has now replaced London as the best city to visit in the UK.
Yes I know about parts of Liverpool like Croxteth etc but as far as I recall that has always been quite derelict. I was making the comparison with Liverpool as the city centre is so clean with plenty of shops and not run down like most major cities.
I obv don’t have much experience as you with regards to council budgets but I am not surprised at what you have said, I have a friend who helps with exhibition and he has a very small unit no joke he was like £800 for his water charges and it is a very small business he has. His unit is not even city centre based.
 
Wizaard said:
I'm saying all cities have good and bad areas, but to say it's controlled by gangs isn't what I see. That's also the case for most cities.
Click to expand...
Agreed but the difference I feel with London is that it has really really affluent areas (best and richest in UK) and on the other hand the burghs I mentioned in previous posts I would not feel comfortable walking through the high rise council flats and I guarantee any (innocent) teenager who lives in a rival post code would literally be in danger if they took a walk through.
I have also spent time working in Glasgow, Edinburgh, Liverpool, Leeds, Newcastle, Sheffield etc and I don’t think the social/gang cultures are anywhere near as bad as London.
Btw my post is not meant to bring London down as it is still one of my favourites for an away day. Special shout out to the Manor Arms (West Ham) pub in Tower Hamlets that’s were I go when the Pool are are in the city 👍
Even at home games I have had great times with Millwall supporters pre-match.
 
You said they couldn't mess it up as much as the uni parties IIRC which presupposes they have to win. I don't understand Reform fans that party has picked the worst policies of Johnson and Truss and put them on steroids. It'll be a sh*tshow.
 
Cuthbert said:
No. Take VAT it is at a flat rate for everyone
Click to expand...
The more you spend, the more you pay, and who mentioned VAT anyway?

In any event, I think we're already past the inflection point on the Laffer curve, any tax rises are now likely to cost the country money in the mid to long term.
 
Just keep taxing the workers. Continue to make it a grim existence for anyone on the average national wage, and now probably those on twice the average national wage.

Doesn't matter if you're 18 or 60 we will find more and more clever ways to tax you and your disposable income in becoming so low, that you're getting to the point that you just cannot be arsed working anymore.

We've got 34 million people registered as in work in this country. Around 24 million people claimed a combination of benefits from Department for Work and Pensions (DWP) between August 2023 and August 2024
 
Lost Seasider said:
The more you spend, the more you pay, and who mentioned VAT anyway?

In any event, I think we're already past the inflection point on the Laffer curve, any tax rises are now likely to cost the country money in the mid to long term.
Click to expand...
I mentioned VAT as it’s a tax. Pay a huge amount of VAT each year.
 
bill40 said:
You said they couldn't mess it up as much as the uni parties IIRC which presupposes they have to win. I don't understand Reform fans that party has picked the worst policies of Johnson and Truss and put them on steroids. It'll be a sh*tshow.
Click to expand...
I’ve just read that Farage wants to cut the minimum wage for young people. Just a typical conservative…desperate to shaft the young generations.
 
RUSTY_2_STANDS said:
I pretty much agree with that. We went to Liverpool last weekend. Stayed over in Southport and got the train to Liverpool.
The city centre and waterfront are a pleasure to visit these days.
But still some pretty run down areas outside the centre. As there are in most cities.
You mention Council charges. I draw plans for a living. The government in April allowed
councils to almost double the planning application fee for domestic works.
It's now not far off £600! And has there been an improvement in the service provided?
Absolutely not.
And that's at a time when building costs, particularly materials, are sky high.
You think about extending your house and you've got a near £600 bill for starters.
Then after planning you have to obtain Building Regs approval from the council.
And that fee is a similar amount.
No wonder the country is struggling for growth.
Click to expand...
Are you an architect?

I’m an environmental consultant specialising in flood risk and definitely seeing an increase in requests for specialist reports for small householder extensions. By definition if your house/extension is in a flood zone then you need to consider flood risk but some of the correspondence I see from the Councils / EA is incredibly disproportionate to the works being undertaken.

The quality of planning services provided by local authorities definitely varies council to council but unfortunately there are too many that are quite frankly awful and display no pragmatism or common sense.
 
20togo said:
so then you acknowledge she will break the manifesto pledge if it happens.
Click to expand...
Did you hear the Blessed Nigel go back on all of Reform's promises yesterday? Does that make him a liar?

No longer any tax cuts, and the black hole in the finances (which, of course, was a myth), is now to be filled with cuts to public services, benefits and public sector pensions. No mention of wealth taxes, of course.

Bet you'll take an interest in politics when the pension cuts bite. May have to have fewer winter cruises.
 
Wizaard said:
Did you hear the Blessed Nigel go back on all of Reform's promises yesterday? Does that make him a liar?

No longer any tax cuts, and the black hole in the finances (which, of course, was a myth), is now to be filled with cuts to public services, benefits and public sector pensions. No mention of wealth taxes, of course.

Bet you'll take an interest in politics when the pension cuts bite. May have to have fewer winter cruises.
Click to expand...
nope didn't hear it. Never had a winter cruise yet although the other day the missus said she'd like to do a Christmas one when we've got a few personal issues sorted out.

Now being debated that Labour deliberately lied to get into power. Hard to disagree with that wouldn't you say?
 
Last edited:
20togo said:
nope didn't hear it. Never had a winter cruise yet although the other day the missus said she'd like to do a Christmas one when we've got a few personal issues sorted out.

Now being debated that Labour deliberately lied to get into power. Hard to disagree with that wouldn't you say?
Click to expand...
No. Circumstances change. Adults react to those changes.

Do you never ever change your mind over anything?

Scratch that, no you don't.

Just to inform you. Does this make him a liar?

Nigel Farage: Huge tax cuts not currently realistic - BBC News https://share.google/G5rc7lQ0zmdP5W8ss
 
Wizaard said:
No. Circumstances change. Adults react to those changes.

Do you never ever change your mind over anything?

Scratch that, no you don't.

Just to inform you. Does this make him a liar?

Nigel Farage: Huge tax cuts not currently realistic - BBC News https://share.google/G5rc7lQ0zmdP5W8ss
Click to expand...
You just know that if Reform ever get into power the first thing they will do is blame previous governments. It will be funny watching their supporters reconcile that when they are currently adamant that previous governments cannot be blamed!
 
It looks pretty likely that income tax is going to go up but will be balanced by an equal cut in employee NI. Will have no effect on take home pay on anybody in work but will impact any income that is not currently subject to NI (eg pensions, rental income, interest, etc).
 
bollieboy said:
It looks pretty likely that income tax is going to go up but will be balanced by an equal cut in employee NI. Will have no effect on take home pay on anybody in work but will impact any income that is not currently subject to NI (eg pensions, rental income, interest, etc).
Click to expand...
so she's correcting the balls up she made by putting it up in the first place because she's realising that what she did was of no benefit to the economy growing that she stated it would be.
 
bollieboy said:
It looks pretty likely that income tax is going to go up but will be balanced by an equal cut in employee NI. Will have no effect on take home pay on anybody in work but will impact any income that is not currently subject to NI (eg pensions, rental income, interest, etc).
Click to expand...
It's all speculation at the moment but I wouldn't be surprised about this.
In my understanding a move like this would result in more taxation for any worker earning more than the NI limit;
  • NI contributions are taken on income up to about £32k - after that it's 0 - can someone tell us the limit?
  • if tax went up by 2p and NI down by 2p
  • person on 40k would have to pay an extra £160 in tax p.a. (£8,000 x 0.02) - £13.33 per month
That would still be very unpopular but as you say would protect everyone earning up to the NI limit.
 
20togo said:
so she's correcting the balls up she made by putting it up in the first place because she's realising that what she did was of no benefit to the economy growing that she stated it would be.
Click to expand...
Nope - bringing down employee's NI not employer's NI.
 
Killingmesoftly said:
Socialism is great until you run out of other peoples money to pay for it…..if you ran a house like this and the previous govt ran the country you’d be evicted……
Click to expand...
Capitalism is great too. All the wealth accumulated by a minute percentage of individuals leaving the rest to fight over the scraps and blame each other for the problems created by the wealthy.
 
ElBurroSinNombre said:
It's all speculation at the moment but I wouldn't be surprised about this.
In my understanding a move like this would result in more taxation for any worker earning more than the NI limit;
  • NI contributions are taken on income up to about £32k - after that it's 0 - can someone tell us the limit?
  • if tax went up by 2p and NI down by 2p
  • person on 40k would have to pay an extra £160 in tax p.a. (£8,000 x 0.02) - £13.33 per month
That would still be very unpopular but as you say would protect everyone earning up to the NI limit.
Click to expand...
No - it drops to 2 % above the UEL of £967 per week (£50,270 pa) which is were 40 % tax band kicks.

If NI goes down 2 % then it wouldn't make any difference as it will drop to 0 above UEL - obviously they might make 2 % reduction only up to UEL and keep the 2 % rate above UEL which in effect would be an increase in tax from 42 % to 44 % for anybody earning over £50,270 pa.
 
bollieboy said:
No - it drops to 2 % above the UEL of £967 per week (£50,270 pa) which is were 40 % tax band kicks.

If NI goes down 2 % then it wouldn't make any difference as it will drop to 0 above UEL - obviously they might make 2 % reduction only up to UEL and keep the 2 % rate above UEL which in effect would be an increase in tax from 42 % to 44 % for anybody earning over £50,270 pa.
Click to expand...
Thanks for the clarification - it's quite a good plan tbh and they will continue to argue that there are no tax rises for 'working people'.
 
Well, well, well..

A manifesto lie. Imagine the outrage had this been done by another party?

First income tax rise since 1975, when.. wait for it.. Denis Healey put an income tax rise in.

That party for the people, doing things for the people.. again.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top