supporter engagement

B

basilrobbie

Guest
Do you value it?

Do you think you are entitled to it ?

How do you feel about people with more money than you being able to buy influence with your club?

It's closer than you think....



www.mancity.com

City and Socios.com launch Manchester City fan token

English Premier League leaders, Manchester City, have joined forces with Socios.com to launch the Manchester City $CITY Fan Token.
www.mancity.com www.mancity.com
 
I'm more concerned about people with more money than us being able to buy influence with our governments?
 
Phil_bfc deux said:
I'm more concerned with BST putting forward a top table member into the SLO role during the interim board times

Talk about jobs for the boys
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This Socios thing has been flagged up by the FSA as one of its targets, so I'm a bit concerned that someone from within its ranks has brought it up on here.
That said I've concerns myself but they're working on kicking me out, so it looks like it has to be their way or no engagement at all for regular fans.

Beware of wolves in sheep's clothing, Seasiders.
 
basilrobbie said:
Do you value it?

Do you think you are entitled to it ?

How do you feel about people with more money than you being able to buy influence with your club?

It's closer than you think....



www.mancity.com

City and Socios.com launch Manchester City fan token

English Premier League leaders, Manchester City, have joined forces with Socios.com to launch the Manchester City $CITY Fan Token.
www.mancity.com www.mancity.com
Click to expand...
Do you understand any of that?

I didn't.
 
Plumbs said:
This Socios thing has been flagged up by the FSA as one of its targets, so I'm a bit concerned that someone from within its ranks has brought it up on here.
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"Within its ranks"?

You've been told many times that this isn't true.
 
TSSeasider said:
Do you understand any of that?

I didn't.
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It means the richest fans get the best engagement,tickets, meets with players and generally the real fans get pushed to the back of the queue.

Ironically enough its the fans who have bought into Sky TV etc that have pushed this sort of nonsense along, where we find money is everything and things like the loyalty and sacrifice of the real fans amounts to a hill of beans*.

The Football Supporters Association knew this and other 'evils of the modern game' were coming,but have failed spectacularly to get veryone involved; not least because they drink from the poison chalice by taking funds from the table as it were.
 
Plumbs said:
It means the richest fans get the best engagement,tickets, meets with players and generally the real fans get pushed to the back of the queue.

Ironically enough its the fans who have bought into Sky TV etc that have pushed this sort of nonsense along, where we find money is everything and things like the loyalty and sacrifice of the real fans amounts to a hill of beans*.

The Football Supporters Association knew this and other 'evils of the modern game' were coming,but have failed spectacularly to get veryone involved; not least because they drink from the poison chalice by taking funds from the table as it were.
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Do you think "real" fans can't be rich?

I'm not picking a fight just interested.
 
TSSeasider said:
Do you think "real" fans can't be rich?

I'm not picking a fight just interested.
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I think they can -like say the Gallagher brothers with Man City - but essentially it is /was a working mans game, so hard to reconcile that with wealth.

The way football is going / has gone however is it needs as fair wedge to follow your club,where at say Arsenal its a grand to sit behind the goal.
In Blackpool folk are generally hard up and paying for a season ticket is beyond many peoples pockets, particularly if there are families involved and cash is tight.

'A rich mans game' seems about right to me.
 
Plumbs said:
I think they can -like say the Gallagher brothers with Man City - but essentially it is /was a working mans game, so hard to reconcile that with wealth.

The way football is going / has gone however is it needs as fair wedge to follow your club,where at say Arsenal its a grand to sit behind the goal.
In Blackpool folk are generally hard up and paying for a season ticket is beyond many peoples pockets, particularly if there are families involved and cash is tight.

'A rich mans game' seems about right to me.
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Used to be two for a quid jumping over the Kop turnstile, I’ve even crawled under😮🍊⚽️👍
 
Plumbs said:
I think they can -like say the Gallagher brothers with Man City - but essentially it is /was a working mans game, so hard to reconcile that with wealth.

The way football is going / has gone however is it needs as fair wedge to follow your club,where at say Arsenal its a grand to sit behind the goal.
In Blackpool folk are generally hard up and paying for a season ticket is beyond many peoples pockets, particularly if there are families involved and cash is tight.

'A rich mans game' seems about right to me.
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One of the benefits of being lower league shoite is not having £1000 season tickets in soulless grounds.
Even better is not having to weigh out £000s following them around Europe like my mate does with Liverpool 😂
 
Chunkylad said:
One of the benefits of being lower league shoite is not having £1000 season tickets in soulless grounds.
Even better is not having to weigh out £000s following them around Europe like my mate does with Liverpool 😂
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Exactly-my thoughts entirely.
I never did the European thing 20 years ago, and tbo couldn't afford the time and money to do it if it happened along.

Going back to the OPs link in one way I think its a good thing if clubs go down this route, join their European Super League and have fans watching who can afford to get ripped off. That way the rest of us can enjoy what's left with a more traditional game and an affordable expense.
 
The problem is that the Premier League is now a global export - 30 years ago, Arsenal , Man City fans etc were usually all locals, with not much interest from the outside world. Now we’ve football beamed into homes and bars around the world, you’ve got people that have never lived in the local area to a club being ‘lifelong’ fans. You’ve got clubs selling tickets as part of a tourist package -football is now an attraction for a day as the London Eye is etc. And of course, the super rich owners that pump money into a club, want the success and prestige that comes with it but also don’t particularly need fans as they’ve enough money not to worry, tv deals etc.
Football as we knew it is dead barring going down the leagues, therefore top clubs giving rich fans priority shouldn’t surprise anyone, it’s a natural evolution of the model they build themselves on. As someone said, perhaps the sooner these clubs leave and join an elite super league, perhaps the better for the rest of the teams.
 
Junior_BentsPlatformShoes said:
The problem is that the Premier League is now a global export - 30 years ago, Arsenal , Man City fans etc were usually all locals, with not much interest from the outside world. Now we’ve football beamed into homes and bars around the world, you’ve got people that have never lived in the local area to a club being ‘lifelong’ fans. You’ve got clubs selling tickets as part of a tourist package -football is now an attraction for a day as the London Eye is etc. And of course, the super rich owners that pump money into a club, want the success and prestige that comes with it but also don’t particularly need fans as they’ve enough money not to worry, tv deals etc.
Football as we knew it is dead barring going down the leagues, therefore top clubs giving rich fans priority shouldn’t surprise anyone, it’s a natural evolution of the model they build themselves on. As someone said, perhaps the sooner these clubs leave and join an elite super league, perhaps the better for the rest of the teams.
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I hate debating this type of subject as people are fiddling around the edges but are powerless to stop the progression of capatilism in football.
King Canute springs to mind!

The money needed to compete at the top level demands all possible revenue sources are exploited and maximised, demand will drive supply and until an equilibrium price is reached the clubs willl increase prices. In turn as the price increases the customers will want a better experience, it's cyclical.

Basic economics, history is littered with people trying and failing to change this, the only way is to reduce customer demand, fan boycotts will become more common but theses will have limited success as consumer reach and demand is so high for the big clubs that the boycotting fans will be simply replaced by more premium experience seekers.

Stop fighting it and support a club with lower demand!
 
Phil_bfc deux said:
No I didn't

But i also didn't apply to be the Russian president but that doesn't mean i can't be critical of the process
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Difference is that we all know who the SLO is and he is good bloke who puts loads of effort in.

Maybe your a bit jealous because he's in there making a difference who knows?
 
TwelveAngryMen said:
Did you apply ?
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Its misleading to suggest this because the Trusts ask for applications, and effectively vet anyone they either approve of or dislike.

In practice the Trusts inc BST could ban anyone who doesn't tick all their boxes, and the FSA would back them to the hilt on this. This also applies to individuals who might be denied any sort of appeal, so its almost like how Momentum used to operate within the Labour Party.
In fact there is evidence to suggest its the same people.
 
Plumbs said:
Its misleading to suggest this because the Trusts ask for applications, and effectively vet anyone they either approve of or dislike.

In practice the Trusts inc BST could ban anyone who doesn't tick all their boxes, and the FSA would back them to the hilt on this. This also applies to individuals who might be denied any sort of appeal, so its almost like how Momentum used to operate within the Labour Party.
In fact there is evidence to suggest its the same people.
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Don't go down that line. Some of our RWNJs will literally explode and we need as many fans as we can get.
 
Junior_BentsPlatformShoes said:
The problem is that the Premier League is now a global export - 30 years ago, Arsenal , Man City fans etc were usually all locals, with not much interest from the outside world. Now we’ve football beamed into homes and bars around the world, you’ve got people that have never lived in the local area to a club being ‘lifelong’ fans. You’ve got clubs selling tickets as part of a tourist package -football is now an attraction for a day as the London Eye is etc. And of course, the super rich owners that pump money into a club, want the success and prestige that comes with it but also don’t particularly need fans as they’ve enough money not to worry, tv deals etc.
Football as we knew it is dead barring going down the leagues, therefore top clubs giving rich fans priority shouldn’t surprise anyone, it’s a natural evolution of the model they build themselves on. As someone said, perhaps the sooner these clubs leave and join an elite super league, perhaps the better for the rest of the teams.
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Great post 👏
 
Plumbs said:
Its misleading to suggest this because the Trusts ask for applications, and effectively vet anyone they either approve of or dislike.

In practice the Trusts inc BST could ban anyone who doesn't tick all their boxes, and the FSA would back them to the hilt on this. This also applies to individuals who might be denied any sort of appeal, so its almost like how Momentum used to operate within the Labour Party.
In fact there is evidence to suggest its the same people.
Click to expand...

Are you saying that the SLO job is a BST appointment? Because that's rubbish, it is the club who appoints the SLO, and nobody else. Not sure what all the Momentum guff is, are you saying that the SLO is a secret Trot or something?
 
Wizaard said:
Don't go down that line. Some of our RWNJs will literally explode and we need as many fans as we can get.
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Oh ok.
I wont also mention that the Trusts use each other to give an 'independent ' assessment of how they conduct their AGMs and finances, where for instance Huddersfield Trust gave Leeds' the green light recently. However the Financial Conduct Authority have now taken punitive action against Leeds on this, given their accounts haven't been filed in accordance.

Christine Seddon was copied into this at the time as a third party witness,however the Football Supporters Association of which she (and Tony) are National Council members still allow this nonsense to continue.

To paraphrase an iconic contributor on this site, we get the national fans group we deserve.
 
Plumbs said:
Its misleading to suggest this because the Trusts ask for applications, and effectively vet anyone they either approve of or dislike.

In practice the Trusts inc BST could ban anyone who doesn't tick all their boxes, and the FSA would back them to the hilt on this. This also applies to individuals who might be denied any sort of appeal, so its almost like how Momentum used to operate within the Labour Party.
In fact there is evidence to suggest its the same people.
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BST didn’t vet the applications
There were four
All were interviewed and Steve appointed
The three others all agreed to assist him and were appointed to assistant roles
 
TwelveAngryMen said:
BST didn’t vet the applications
There were four
All were interviewed and Steve appointed
The three others all agreed to assist him and were appointed to assistant roles
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I didn't say they did but its FSA policy to do so and in my opinion it stinks, along with all the other misleading nonsense they use to justify their existence.

Like I've always said BST are miles ahead of most (if not all) of the Trusts around the country, but the main organisation is a clique and run for the benefit of the top table in my experience.

Interesting of course to see the FSA head honcho appear on here for a while, which begs the question as to who alerted him to this place.

*btw expenses are paid to National Council and individual Trusts. The Leeds lot even claim for bus fares to meetings within the City (rolls eyes)
 
Plumbs said:
I didn't say they did but its FSA policy to do so and in my opinion it stinks, along with all the other misleading nonsense they use to justify their existence.
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Yes you did.

"Its misleading to suggest this because the Trusts ask for applications, and effectively vet anyone they either approve of or dislike."

Your words. On this thread. What stinks is you lying about decent people like Steve, for God knows what reason.
 
FedoraExplorer said:
Yes you did.

"Its misleading to suggest this because the Trusts ask for applications, and effectively vet anyone they either approve of or dislike."

Your words. On this thread. What stinks is you lying about decent people like Steve, for God knows what reason.
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I haven't lied about anything but stated what the Trusts do as a recruitment policy, where they also hold elections either side of an AGM.

Its been pointed out several times on this forum that there is now a disconnect between the SLO and BST, and of which I haven't directly referenced on this thread.

In fact if you can point to one lie on here I've made about him then kindly supply the link.
 
I'm all for fan being as involved with the club as they can be barring them being in the boardroom. I'm not a member of any fans group as none of them represent me, because of this I don't have a voice within the club. It would be nice to have a platform where I could put my opinions and ideas for the club without having to go through a fans group. I've never liked that the club can pick and choose the SLO either, that should be a fans decision, but again that would probably just go to the supporters groups rather than the fan base at large.
Edit: I would like to say that I think the SLO has done a decent job and I do appreciate how much work he puts is, this isn't aimed at him at all.
 
FedoraExplorer said:
Yes you did.

"Its misleading to suggest this because the Trusts ask for applications, and effectively vet anyone they either approve of or dislike."

Your words. On this thread. What stinks is you lying about decent people like Steve, for God knows what reason.
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Don't think he's having a got at Steve, tbf.

But he has contradicted himself at least twice on this thread. And if TAM says he's wrong, that's good enough for me.
 
Plumbs said:
I didn't say they did but its FSA policy to do so and in my opinion it stinks, along with all the other misleading nonsense they use to justify their existence.

Like I've always said BST are miles ahead of most (if not all) of the Trusts around the country, but the main organisation is a clique and run for the benefit of the top table in my experience.

Interesting of course to see the FSA head honcho appear on here for a while, which begs the question as to who alerted him to this place.

*btw expenses are paid to National Council and individual Trusts. The Leeds lot even claim for bus fares to meetings within the City (rolls eyes)
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If you didn't say it you inferred it
And it's nonsense
 
I bleed Tangerine said:
I'm all for fan being as involved with the club as they can be barring them being in the boardroom. I'm not a member of any fans group as none of them represent me, because of this I don't have a voice within the club. It would be nice to have a platform where I could put my opinions and ideas for the club without having to go through a fans group. I've never liked that the club can pick and choose the SLO either, that should be a fans decision, but again that would probably just go to the supporters groups rather than the fan base at large.
Edit: I would like to say that I think the SLO has done a decent job and I do appreciate how much work he puts is, this isn't aimed at him at all.
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I think we have an exceptional SLO who is one of us - and it says a lot that the other three candidates work collaboratively with him
i wrote the brief for the role and MB and the rest of the board embraced it - as did Simon on taking over
It's the ideal solution - but clearly not enough for some who need to give their heads a wobble
 
Plumbs said:
I didn't say they did but its FSA policy to do so and in my opinion it stinks, along with all the other misleading nonsense they use to justify their existence.

Like I've always said BST are miles ahead of most (if not all) of the Trusts around the country, but the main organisation is a clique and run for the benefit of the top table in my experience.

Interesting of course to see the FSA head honcho appear on here for a while, which begs the question as to who alerted him to this place.

*btw expenses are paid to National Council and individual Trusts. The Leeds lot even claim for bus fares to meetings within the City (rolls eyes)
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Your issues with Leeds shouldn't permeate this board IMO The situations are unrelated and your attempts to draw correlations misconceived
 
It's 4 not 5 but otherwise 100% agree

I can say hand on heart this wasn't a shoe in for someone from BST as well as MB went through a rigorous interview process
 
TSSeasider said:
Cheers TAM.

Seems to me that we've got 5 volunteers acting in a "bridge" capacity with the club then.

If we don't wait to go via the SLO because of his association with BST we can choose the others.

None getting paid, so I can't see the issue.
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I thought Steve left his position with BST when he was appointed SLO?
 
TwelveAngryMen said:
Your issues with Leeds shouldn't permeate this board IMO The situations are unrelated and your attempts to draw correlations misconceived
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My issues are with the FSA who have an agenda with/for the socios.com, and I'm making others aware of this as I thought the OP was pushing it given his position in the FSA.
That's democracy and free speech and its nothing to do with any other club, but as ever the criticism of contributors comes from one particular section of posters.

That only gives credence to the belief that there is some agenda pushing going on, especially with regards to the influence and moderation on this site.
 
Plumbs said:
My issues are with the FSA who have an agenda with/for the socios.com, and I'm making others aware of this as I thought the OP was pushing it given his position in the FSA.
That's democracy and free speech and its nothing to do with any other club, but as ever the criticism of contributors comes from one particular section of posters.

That only gives credence to the belief that there is some agenda pushing going on, especially with regards to the influence and moderation on this site.
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I don't know how many times I have to say this. But I hold no position whatsoever with the FSA. I posted the OP because I thought people would be interested in what I think is a worrying development. That's all.
 
basilrobbie said:
I don't know how many times I have to say this. But I hold no position whatsoever with the FSA. I posted the OP because I thought people would be interested in what I think is a worrying development. That's all.
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I dont know how many times I have to say this but you've been actively involved in a Trust, ran for FSA elections so have definitely been in a position to push their agendas-good or bad.

I do agree though that socios.com is a worrying development but probably expected, and its been burning for a while and really old news.

What might help with any misunderstandings is if you didnt regularly post FSA campaigns etc, because it looks like your acting on their behalf. Mind you- you're perfectly entitled to do that anyway.
 
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