There may be trouble ahead. (again).

And on that basis, you can be called out for a misrepresentation of the facts. Some would say a lie, designed to cause division. For what it's worth, the EU includes Spain, so having their men on the border meets the terms anyway. It's a bit unnecessary to have people travel from Denmark to man a border in Southern Spain.

Frontex is a European coastguard and border agency. The clue is in the word 'agency'. Unlike Spain, it doesn't have sights set on taking over Gibraltar. That's why the UK is not only prepared to allow Frontex to exercise border control but has agreed with the EU and Gibraltar that it would do so.

So where exactly is the lie designed to cause division?
 
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Really, crikey you lot are proper shape shifters aren't you. Wow this govt arw so honest and up front, they're british upper class with stiff upper lips. Anyway it taken this article below which is interesting:

This is likely to change radically. The plan is that Gibraltar’s port and airport become the new frontier of Schengen. Those arriving from the UK will have their documents checked; those coming from one of the 22 EU/Schengen countries won’t. Rubbing in the point, the men and women checking the documents of British visitors will be members of the EU’s border guard, Frontex. There’s a row brewing over whether Gibraltar will become a part of Schengen or be merely connected to it, but the direction of travel is clear enough.

The joint statement attempts to sound tough stating that ‘a joint operation’ with Frontex will only initially last for four years, and will stop if Spain, the UK or Gibraltar don’t like the way it is working.

You would have thought that checks of their beloved blue passports might be enough to give Brexiteers apoplexy – but it doesn’t end there. In this topsy turvy world while the UK has now left the customs union, Gibraltar will join it for the very first time.

The new closer relationship with the EU isn’t likely to end there – it is almost inevitable that its VAT regime and trade regulations will be extended to the Rock for the first time.

Gibraltar’s chief minister Picardo notes the irony that the Rock is likely to have a closer relationship with the EU than it ever did during the 48 years when it, and the UK, were members of the club. He tells me: “Ironically post Brexit we and the region around us may enjoy greater certainty about the fluidity of goods and people but I don’t think that changes what you might call our spiritual identity.”

Although Spain has signed up to the proposed plan, the whole EU isn’t yet formally involved. The treaty is meant to be done and dusted by the end of June but this seems unlikely – the EU's rather frosty statement merely points out “the relevant services in the Commission are currently examining the request in view of proposing the next steps in line with the Commission Declaration on possible Future Arrangements between the Union and the UK in respect of Gibraltar”.

If they are in no rush, the UK has to put up with it. The foreign secretary has suggested getting it right is more important than sticking to a timetable, so he will be flexible.

****

There’s a warning from history – the Treaty of Utrecht was only partially agreed in 1713 – it took another two years to be completed. More worrying than a slipping time table is what might go wrong.

In the current atmosphere even the easy things are likely to prove difficult. Some assumed with Brexit a reality and the basic deal done the hard words would be forgotten and a new business like relationship would prevail. The reverse appears to be true – predictably on both sides of the relationship there’s an assumption of antagonism.

From the suspension of the Northern Ireland protocol and the refusal to grant the EU ambassador full diplomatic rights, to the appointment of Lord Frost to the cabinet, through the new low of the unseemly row over vaccines, the atmosphere has got steadily worse. Asked about this new potential for friction by Gibraltarian journalists Raab seemed sanguine – he said the stumbling blocks had been mostly dealt with in the framework agreement. Still, there's more potential for take than give – privately everyone involved recognises the fraught relationship between the UK and the EU will make a difficult job harder still. But when I ask the chief minister if he is worried, he is diplomatic: “Given how Gibraltar and Spain have unfortunately caused difficulties for Brussels in the past I’m sure they won’t want to waste the opportunity, where there is an agreement between us, to clinch that in treaty form.”

He adds: “The issues that Brexit has made us grapple with have been as difficult as we imagined at the time of the vote but we can see an opportunity for Gibraltar to flourish despite our departure from the European Union – I will work very hard to make the Brexit I didn’t want, the success those who did, highlighted it might be.”

****

The only other place under British rule to share a land border with an EU country is of course Northern Ireland where history makes the issue of borders even more fraught. It is leaving the customs union while the neighbouring EU member, the Republic of Ireland naturally stays in (neither have ever been part of Schengen). With the great fear that a hard border – with customs checks and the like – could lead to political violence, the solution, currently causing a huge row, is the awkward notion of customs check’s ‘in the Irish Sea’, in other words between one part of the UK and another.

Would the planned Gib deal be another answer? Hardly. The big difference is that Gibraltar’s citizens do at least seem to share a common vision – while almost 96% voted to remain in the EU, in 2002 99% also voted to stay exclusively British. The duality of what is on offer for the Rock would clearly divide in Northern Ireland, by reinforcing its separateness from Great Britain, and underscoring its closeness to Ireland.

The risks for Gibraltar are obviously less serious even if it all goes wrong.

But it is a long time since the Rock has been about hard power and practical advantage – it’s potency lies what it stands for – a hollow drum to beat to rally the troops. This is the price of Brexit, the British holding fast to their pride in possession, content to pay the price of the EU extending the reach of one of its most precious policies –the freedom of movement within its borders.

When ever the new treaty is signed don’t expect a future Trevelyan to suggest it cements “the maritime, commercial and financial supremacy of Great Britain” in the post Brexit world.
Didn’t read your post but just saw the length of it, deduced you must have spent ages on it to “debate” with a load of noddies like me who you have never met and whose ideas are set already......just thought you may want to reflect on how you spend your time 😂
 
Frontex is a European coastguard and border agency. The clue is in the word 'agency'. Unlike Spain, it doesn't have sights set on taking over Gibraltar. That's why the UK is not only prepared to allow Frontex to exercise border control but has agreed with the EU and Gibraltar that it would do so.

So where is the lie designed to cause division?
Blimey you’re back pedalling at a rate of knots.

Frontex is indeed the European border and Coastguard agency. And yes the U.K. and Gib have surrendered sovereignty by agreeing Frontex could exercise border control over Gib.

The lies (causing division) are people claiming that the U.K. and Gib didn’t surrender sovereignty when they signed the framework agreement. They clearly signed the agreement and surrendered sovereignty by doing so.

The question now is who they surrendered sovereignty to. You and I agree it was Frontex. The question now is whether Frontex can delegate the function to the Spanish police. You and I agree that’s a bit of a try on.

All your bollux about Spanish Police taking over Gib Willy nilly was just that. Complete bollux.
 
Blimey you’re back pedalling at a rate of knots.

Frontex is indeed the European border and Coastguard agency. And yes the U.K. and Gib have surrendered sovereignty by agreeing Frontex could exercise border control over Gib.

The lies (causing division) are people claiming that the U.K. and Gib didn’t surrender sovereignty when they signed the framework agreement. They clearly signed the agreement and surrendered sovereignty by doing so.

The question now is who they surrendered sovereignty to. You and I agree it was Frontex. The question now is whether Frontex can delegate the function to the Spanish police. You and I agree that’s a bit of a try on.

All your bollux about Spanish Police taking over Gib Willy nilly was just that. Complete bollux.

You're doing again what you always do. Making up stories about what posters say and then when it's clear your accusations don't hold water you come out with insults. Come back when you learn how to debate like a grown up.
 
You're doing again what you always do. Making up stories about what posters say and then when it's clear your accusations don't hold water you come out with insults. Come back when you learn how to debate like a grown up.
Okey dokey.

Point me to the stories I’ve made up.

And while you’re at it point me to the insults.

Once you’ve done that you may have some credibility when it comes to debating.
 
'They are now insisting that Spanish border guards should be stationed at Gibraltar’s port, airport and waters to enforce the bloc’s rules and that they should have the right to enter the territory to apprehend people and do other enforcement work and carry out surveillance there under EU rules.'

This, at the same time as the EU, is now refusing to co-operate on crimes committed by their own population or sharing any information about criminality or terror threats with the UK.

You couldn't make it up.
You need to do some homework. It was us who decided we weren't going to share data anymore.
 
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