What is the exact criteria to get out of Tier 3?

To add, I have massive sympathy for the pub trade, and any trade and supply chain that again will suffer. Like I had in lockdown for everyone whose livelihoods were affected, especially those who have since lost employment on a permanent basis. Let’s hope some of the funding for tier 3 is spent helping all those affected.
We are trying to control a virus though, that 6 months ago controlled us.
 
Even though we were closed for 5 months Blackpool council still made us pay a full 12 months bar license which I find despicable when we were forced to close. Also have to pay full 12 months of council tax on a hotel that’s been empty and closed more than it’s been open. Same with tv license and prs and ppl and public liability insurance. How can they charge us the full amounts is beyond me. For example public liability protects members of the public only so if I’m closed why do I have to still pay this ??
If I recall correctly the government brought the first lockdown in to 'flatten the curve' and would review it after three weeks. Not saying it is right how it has panned out for you but I can see why the council wanted those licenses, insurances etc in place to quickly fire up the town again at short notice if need be. With this in mind, anyone who thinks this current measure will be a two week only circuit breaker is automatically classed a dimwit in my book.

My own view is that the council deserve some credit for not bowing to the immense pressure to shut the town down entirely - as was the mass hysteria at the time (early summer and beyond). The problem as I see it - then and now - is pressure on govt from bedwetters who aren't sufficiently affected by all of this nonsense. Yet.
 
To add, I have massive sympathy for the pub trade, and any trade and supply chain that again will suffer. Like I had in lockdown for everyone whose livelihoods were affected, especially those who have since lost employment on a permanent basis. Let’s hope some of the funding for tier 3 is spent helping all those affected.
We are trying to control a virus though, that 6 months ago controlled us.
Now the Government are controlling us.
 
Even though we were closed for 5 months Blackpool council still made us pay a full 12 months bar license which I find despicable when we were forced to close. Also have to pay full 12 months of council tax on a hotel that’s been empty and closed more than it’s been open. Same with tv license and prs and ppl and public liability insurance. How can they charge us the full amounts is beyond me. For example public liability protects members of the public only so if I’m closed why do I have to still pay this ??
I take your point but surely it was up to central government to provide the council with the financial support so it could afford to suspend your council tax, refund the bar licence etc?

Again it wasn’t the council that closed you down; it was the Government. The council had to deal with the fall out.

That’s what the debate between Burnham and Johnson is all about. And the debate between the Lancashire and Liverpool authorities and the government last week were all about. And it looks to me as if the North has been shafted.
 
When people’s businesses, livelihoods and jobs start going to the wall - is this when the Government will take note? This has been badly handled by the government, especially when you see how other countries have handled this..... New Zealand (as an example) had under 1900 cases and only 25 deaths. For a population of 5 million and looking at other countries deaths, it’s very low.
I know there are so many conspiracies out there regarding this, some whacky - but it does get you thinking ‘just what the bloody hell is going on’
 
New Zealand (as an example) had under 1900 cases and only 25 deaths. For a population of 5 million and looking at other countries deaths, it’s very low.

It's an island on the other side of the planet with low population density and relatively little interconnection with the wider world, this is a combination of factors that you would want in a global pandemic.
 
And the connection to schools and universities is............................?
I knew it it was a mistake engaging you in discussion. Go and find your own evidence that refutes what TAM says you tiresome goon.
 
Even though we were closed for 5 months Blackpool council still made us pay a full 12 months bar license which I find despicable when we were forced to close. Also have to pay full 12 months of council tax on a hotel that’s been empty and closed more than it’s been open. Same with tv license and prs and ppl and public liability insurance. How can they charge us the full amounts is beyond me. For example public liability protects members of the public only so if I’m closed why do I have to still pay this ??
You are paying council tax as your daughter lives there. No one else has not had to pay council tax so why should you? If you pay business rates then you should have had a grant for that.
 
You are paying council tax as your daughter lives there. No one else has not had to pay council tax so why should you? If you pay business rates then you should have had a grant for that.
I don’t pay buisness rates as I’m only a small buisness. How come next door hotel gets a discount on his council tax when he doesn’t even live at the property. He also got a big discount for this years council tax. My next door neighbour who works full time got £150 refund on his council tax. Seems some got it but not others. My son got £128 knocked off his council tax aswell
 
I don’t pay buisness rates as I’m only a small buisness. How come next door hotel gets a discount on his council tax when he doesn’t even live at the property. He also got a big discount for this years council tax. My next door neighbour who works full time got £150 refund on his council tax. Seems some got it but not others. My son got £128 knocked off his council tax aswell
You don’t get a grant for buisness rates either. The buisness rates that people pay just don’t have to pay them this year
 
I don’t think it’s as simple as that Tim, I think it’s a mix of a lot of things, including schools and Uni’s but also some hospitality venues, some workplaces, some disregard for the virus full stop, cultural and certainly the make up of certain towns and cities. The thing is the government are trying to save the economy and education as well as lives. Personally I don’t think schools or Unis should have gone back and more effort should have been put into teaching virtually so they could stay home, although that has its own problems. You see, there are no easy answers so I guess it’s better have tighter restrictions on areas that have higher R numbers and high hospital capacity and less restrictions in areas that aren’t as doing a blanket lockdown will just make it more difficult for far more people.
If there's evidence that particular venues are causing a spike thrn close those venues. It's too blunt an instrument to close whole regions when spikes are demonstrably in very localised areas. I said weeks ago that it should be a localised decision using the best information to them which can go down to street level.

If it's around universities like it is is Leeds, then have local lockdowns. If it's a particular pub thats flouting the rules then close that pub.
 
I’ve said since the pubs re-opened that local “policing”should have taken place. If a pub wasn’t observing the rules and guidelines close it down for a couple of weeks.
My local Wetherspoons not that I go in has banned anyone under the age of 25 , don’t know if that helps?
 
So in summary no one has a clue as regards the question in the OP.......and you won’t do because the Government haven’t stated the exact criteria for going in and out of tiers......which is ** crazy is it not?
 
So in summary no one has a clue as regards the question in the OP.......and you won’t do because the Government haven’t stated the exact criteria for going in and out of tiers......which is ** crazy is it not?

Not really, because there are no exact criteria, it's a balanced judgement based on multiple factors, not a simple tick-box exercise.
 
I knew it it was a mistake engaging you in discussion. Go and find your own evidence that refutes what TAM says you tiresome goon.
He might start by looking at a heat map and take note of the infection rates in university towns

Also maybe reflect on why the huge upsurge in cases in early September and what had changed

It's not a case of blaming schools / universities rather not unfairly blaming and then punishing the hospitality sector
 
Not really, because there are no exact criteria, it's a balanced judgement based on multiple factors, not a simple tick-box exercise.
The problem with this is that it lends itself to allegations of unfairness/political bias. The "multiple factors" that lead to a "balanced judgement" should be clear and unequivocal to avoid such feelings.
 
Not really, because there are no exact criteria, it's a balanced judgement based on multiple factors, not a simple tick-box exercise.
You don’t KNOW that at all. You are just assuming/guessing thats the case. It could be that it’s one man’s decision, it could be that they intend to keep us in tier 3 for months from the outset but haven’t told us ......BUT without an exact criteria they don’t have to even justify leaving us in or leaving Nottingham out etc etc.....they can just take away basic freedoms and not restore them as they see fit......a much more dangerous road than many have the intelligence to comprehend *

* I don‘t mean you or anyone specifically
 
You don’t KNOW that at all. You are just assuming/guessing thats the case. It could be that it’s one man’s decision, it could be that they intend to keep us in tier 3 for months from the outset but haven’t told us ......BUT without an exact criteria they don’t have to even justify leaving us in or leaving Nottingham out etc etc.....they can just take away basic freedoms and not restore them as they see fit......a much more dangerous road than many have the intelligence to comprehend *

* I don‘t mean you or anyone specifically
You do have a point.

Does anyone remember Leicester? Returned to lockdown back in June and still in it with no signs of the restrictions being relaxed. And no-one, apart from the residents of Leicester, gives a monkeys.
 
The problem with this is that it lends itself to allegations of unfairness/political bias. The "multiple factors" that lead to a "balanced judgement" should be clear and unequivocal to avoid such feelings.

The alternative is inflexible rules that take no account of local circumstances and may be more likely to place regions in inappropriate tiers.

And in terms of allegations of unfairness/bias, you can be damn sure that the left will be making those no matter what the government does.
 
You don’t KNOW that at all. You are just assuming/guessing thats the case.

I'm basing it on what I've seen the likes of the CMO/CSA say in press conferences and in testimony before the parliamentary select committees, I could be wrong but I'm reasonably confident I'm not.
 
I'm basing it on what I've seen the likes of the CMO/CSA say in press conferences and in testimony before the parliamentary select committees, I could be wrong but I'm reasonably confident I'm not.
You miss my point....you DON’T know because it hasn’t been stated by the Govt
 
You miss my point....you DON’T know because it hasn’t been stated by the Govt

Here's what I do know: https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/1349673/Why-is-Nottingham-not-in-Tier-3-evg

My understanding is that there are two reasons the city hasn’t been placed into Tier 3.
“The first is that our hospitals aren’t currently at that level. "There is a great deal of preparation going on, but they’re not full.
“The second is that the cases haven’t spread in large numbers to the older population.
"Most of our cases are currently among younger people."


So yes, I do not know, but I'm confident I'm right.
 
Here's what I do know: https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/1349673/Why-is-Nottingham-not-in-Tier-3-evg

My understanding is that there are two reasons the city hasn’t been placed into Tier 3.
“The first is that our hospitals aren’t currently at that level. "There is a great deal of preparation going on, but they’re not full.
“The second is that the cases haven’t spread in large numbers to the older population.
"Most of our cases are currently among younger people."


So yes, I do not know, but I'm confident I'm right.
No point debating with you as you miss my point entirely .... it ain’t about “thinking you’re right”.....it’s about having published “criteria”.......there isn’t any
 
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