As supporters..

Just look at the Jocks.
Rarely qualify for major tournaments and suffer embarrassing defeats.
They are overjoyed at holding England and still a possibility of progressing for the first time.

They are a happy bunch
 
Lytham_fy8 said:
We don't really deserve to win anything as a country do we?

Do other nations have quite the amount of miserable 'told you so' know it alls that we do?
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Probably.

I think the nation's with expectations do anyway. Spain and Italy have full blown mental TV phone in melt down culture, probably worse than ours.

Without wishing to trigger more accusations of inverse snobbery I quite envy countries with no real expectation where they support their team with a degree of stoic, bleak humour. It just looks like more craic to follow Iceland or Ireland really. You mostly lose but when you don't, you enjoy it.

England, when we win, it's 'the wrong sort of win' and when we lose or draw it's a meltdown.
 
Macseasider said:
Good point but I think the media are certainly responsible for brainwashing people into thinking that we are one of the big boys in tournaments. This leads to nationwide disappointment I guess.
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Could be, or maybe there's just a large proportion of miserable football fans in this country, look how many here wanted Critchley out early on because we weren't immediately winning. Or maybe they just shout the loudest in an effort to validate their self proclaimed expert status.

It didn't used to be like this, people just used to go to the match and enjoy it, a few times there'd be huge shouts if we were really shit like bits of the late 80s early 90s but you never got someone giving a 14 page dossier on where the manager was going wrong on the way home.
 
Macseasider said:
Good point but I think the media are certainly responsible for brainwashing people into thinking that we are one of the big boys in tournaments. This leads to nationwide disappointment I guess.
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On the flip side a) we *should* (on the basis of the resources we have at least) be competitive and b) isn't it natural to start any season convinced that *this will be the year* - even if that only last for about 10 minutes!

We have just had 3 out of the 4 places in European finals, the Premier League is the world's richest, we have one of the deepest professional league structures in the world.

I know none of that really means much, but on a simple level, it's mental to think that Iceland can beat us, Scotland can outplay us and so on and so forth. We're a relatively large nation as well. How do Belgium do it with a fraction of our population? (Not just now, they were really good for a period in the 80s as well) - how have Sweden qualified again and again and again and again and done quite well with some regularity, even though they've got a fraction of our resources. Croatia! How on earth? That's smaller than Scotland!

I think we all fall for the hype, but it's one of those things. It doesn't make sense that with all the domestic successes in Europe, that our national team hasn't reached a final for 50+ years. One year, it feels, we must do it.
 
td53 said:
On the flip side a) we *should* (on the basis of the resources we have at least) be competitive and b) isn't it natural to start any season convinced that *this will be the year* - even if that only last for about 10 minutes!

We have just had 3 out of the 4 places in European finals, the Premier League is the world's richest, we have one of the deepest professional league structures in the world.

I know none of that really means much, but on a simple level, it's mental to think that Iceland can beat us, Scotland can outplay us and so on and so forth. We're a relatively large nation as well. How do Belgium do it with a fraction of our population? (Not just now, they were really good for a period in the 80s as well) - how have Sweden qualified again and again and again and again and done quite well with some regularity, even though they've got a fraction of our resources. Croatia! How on earth? That's smaller than Scotland!

I think we all fall for the hype, but it's one of those things. It doesn't make sense that with all the domestic successes in Europe, that our national team hasn't reached a final for 50+ years. One year, it feels, we must do it.
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I think people get carried away with the PL success, how much of it is built on English talent and English managers?
 
Lytham_fy8 said:
Could be, or maybe there's just a large proportion of miserable football fans in this country, look how many here wanted Critchley out early on because we weren't immediately winning. Or maybe they just shout the loudest in an effort to validate their self proclaimed expert status.

It didn't used to be like this, people just used to go to the match and enjoy it, a few times there'd be huge shouts if we were really shit like bits of the late 80s early 90s but you never got someone giving a 14 page dossier on where the manager was going wrong on the way home.
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I don't think that's international games only. I think it comes from the everyone is a pundit culture (says a man who write a blog ffs) and I really,strongly agree that the humour has gone.

One of my favourite ever moments was when we getting tanked against York (I think) and there was obviously loads of grumbling and some lad stands up in the south stand and puts on a plummy voice and shouts "C'mon chaps! Try harder what!" and the whole ground laughed.

I can't imagine that happening now. People just want to rage and point out the faults of others. There'd be a thread on here with

"WHO IS THE WANKER WHO THINKS ITS FUNNY WE LOST?"
 
It’s the old saying - in the PL England players are playing with the best players in the world.

When England plays the English players are playing against the best players in the world.

As for fan expectations in other countries - I genuinely have no idea at all.
 
Lytham_fy8 said:
I think people get carried away with the PL success, how much of it is built on English talent and English managers?
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I agree. But the resources (i.e we've a lot more people and money than Iceland!) are none the less undeniable. Whether we use those resources well is a different matter. It also has to be said that the players we do produce are playing domestically at a high level and the old excuse that 'English football doesn't translate to the international game' is rendered somewhat redundant when you've got Pep,Klopp, Tuchel etc defining what the domestic style is.
 
td53 said:
I don't think that's international games only. I think it comes from the everyone is a pundit culture (says a man who write a blog ffs) and I really,strongly agree that the humour has gone.

One of my favourite ever moments was when we getting tanked against York (I think) and there was obviously loads of grumbling and some lad stands up in the south stand and puts on a plummy voice and shouts "C'mon chaps! Try harder what!" and the whole ground laughed.

I can't imagine that happening now. People just want to rage and point out the faults of others. There'd be a thread on here with

"WHO IS THE WANKER WHO THINKS ITS FUNNY WE LOST?"
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Your blog is ace though, I don't mean considered thought after the match, more the immediate ranting when things haven't gone exactly to plan.

Your point about the fella at York is what I mean, supporting used to be a laugh, even when we were shit, which was most of the time, nowadays it seems to be an existential ordeal for some.
 
As l said on the match thread last night, there is no problem in drawing a match but it’s the way the team is set up and how the players are performing, that last night was not acceptable. I have seen first hand how the German fans turned their backs on the national team in the 2002 WC because of how the team was performing and they made the finals!
 
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Lytham_fy8 said:
We don't really deserve to win anything as a country do we?

Do other nations have quite the amount of miserable 'told you so' know it alls that we do?
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Indeed because you end up with endless threads about a locally placed minnow coming shooting up the leagues, then whinging about them never being rivals and poking fun at every opportunity.

Wouldn't happen on here though.
 
Lytham_fy8 said:
Your blog is ace though, I don't mean considered thought after the match, more the immediate ranting when things haven't gone exactly to plan.

Your point about the fella at York is what I mean, supporting used to be a laugh, even when we were shit, which was most of the time, nowadays it seems to be an existential ordeal for some.
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Several things spring to mind.

1) If you look at say, 606 it's gone from being a brilliant and whimsical thing under Danny Baker and a shit, but still quite gentle thing with David Mellor to 'c'mon Liverpool fans, ring up if you want Klopp out?!' - it's like constant trolling on the radio and TV. Not 4 hours of sport on 2 followed by music.

2) As football has become 24/7 media income, there always has to be a narrative. The narrative that's constructed is one of blame and anger. If you're losing, then there needs to be an enquiry... The story requires a villain/hero.

3) I think increasingly there's a strange cultural thing whereby being associated with a club who loses is 'embarrasing' as opposed to 'stoic' or 'loyal' or just 'one of those things' - my other half always says 'were you playing then?' whenever I say 'we' won. Which is kind of true. But I think it's become more and more internalised that as opposed to the football being an event you enjoy going to or watching, that winning/losing is everything and somehow not being furious/bereft at a defeat means you aren't a 'proper' fan.

4) Just as 'the media' is 24/7 so is stuff like this. We used to watch the football, have a pint or whatever and talk about other stuff. It didn't get raked over endlessly. Does it merit it really? (again, that's a bit rich cos I've added to that)
 
Lytham_fy8 said:
Youth football must play a part in that, how many Uruguayan kids have their parents screaming to 'just bloody lump it' on the sideline?
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Yeah, definitely. Read some mad stuff on the number of assaults on refs and coaches at youth football the other day. I've no idea if that's replicated in other countries or not but it was insane. One story about how a coach wouldn't make a sub so parent comes over and headbutts him unconscious, another about a 15 year old ref giving up because of abuse and threats. Loads about coaches giving up coaching skills and fun because parents give them shit if they don't play the biggest lads and just play to win.

I'm not sure if that derives from 'football' or is a reflection of 'society' that manifests in football.

Dunno if those inverted commas were needed.
 
Lytham_fy8 said:
Your blog is ace though, I don't mean considered thought after the match, more the immediate ranting when things haven't gone exactly to plan.

Your point about the fella at York is what I mean, supporting used to be a laugh, even when we were shit, which was most of the time, nowadays it seems to be an existential ordeal for some.
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Despite what goes in here, it's very rare that I come away from a game not having had a real laugh at some point, even if it's just fat shaming some inept linesman*

*As a woke leftie, I obviously immediately hate myself for it.
 
Spanish fans for one don't seem the most welcoming when they're not happy about something tbf. We won't be alone in tutting at things.

Don't deserve to win, nobody does, you have to earn it. But it'd be brilliant if it did one day. That or don't qualify for anything for ages and see if the focus shifts to just being grateful to be there.

As good as winning Le Tournoi was in 1997, or to have won that nations league finals thing would have been, I think it would lift the national mood to do it on the big stage. Football is a huge focus for many and to release that pressure valve thats built up, or maybe be able to back up the flawed superiority complex of our national psyche, if thats what it is, would be immense.

I actually think Southgate will be gone straight after this tournament but not on results. More because can't give any more to controlling the media side and its no longer worth it for him.
 
People just want to see some excitement and skill.

I dont think anyone really thinks we're the very best but with the players we have they should certainly be able to give anybody a game.

That last performance lacked everything.

No guile, no skill, not beating a man hardly, no inventiveness, not trying things to break through , 1-2's, feints etc.

There was no quick passing.

All I want to see is some if the above, use their brains and we would then have created much more and beaten a poor Scotland side

When we come up against better sides anything can happen and with the right manager and philosophy and freedom to play and not being overly defensive, we should be giveing anyone a tough game and causing them some problems.
 
JJpool said:
People just want to see some excitement and skill.

I dont think anyone really thinks we're the very best but with the players we have they should certainly be able to give anybody a game.

That last performance lacked everything.

No guile, no skill, not beating a man hardly, no inventiveness, not trying things to break through , 1-2's, feints etc.

There was no quick passing.

All I want to see is some if the above, use their brains and we would then have created much more and beaten a poor Scotland side

When we come up against better sides anything can happen and with the right manager and philosophy and freedom to play and not being overly defensive, we should be giveing anyone a tough game and causing them some problems.
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2823673.main_image.jpg
 
GrahamwantshisOates said:
Just look at the Jocks.
Rarely qualify for major tournaments and suffer embarrassing defeats.
They are overjoyed at holding England and still a possibility of progressing for the first time.

They are a happy bunch
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The Jocks celebrating like they had won the whole thing FFS.
A draw and we are calling for the managers head and their partying in the street.

They where as equally shite as us.
 
It could be worse, we were one newspaper sting away from having Allardyce leading us in to a major tournament.
 
I think England fans do have a right to be miffed about our consistent under achievement, with some of the players/squads we've had over the years it is shambolic we haven't achieved more. Never even reaching a final since 66 is ridiculous.

I reckon all major footballing nations have fans with a level of over-reaction when their team doesn't do well, didn't a footballer in South America get shot for scoring an own goal? I don't think we've reached that level yet, the burning of effigies is as ridiculous as we've got (and that is absolutely ridiculous).

It's one of them ain't it, there exists aspects of Blackpool's fanbase that I don't like it but if we ended up winning a Champions League I wouldn't find it any less deserving. Same goes for England, it's such a wide fanbase there will always be aspects of it I don't enjoy but you've just gotta crack on
 
Bloodtangerine said:
We have loads of young players coming through. That stereotype of parents saying “lump it” is well out of date.
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Granted but the effect on players (from parents) is detrimental and has caused issues, where the FA etc have had to take action.

Any filming of Uruguayan kids playing football in Blackpool schools is frowned upon but Monty video it.
 
Plumbs said:
Granted but the effect on players (from parents) is detrimental and has caused issues, where the FA etc have had to take action.

Any filming of Uruguayan kids playing football in Blackpool schools is frowned upon but Monty video it.
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Blimey Plumbs, that was a stretch even for you 😀
 
Plumbs said:
Granted but the effect on players (from parents) is detrimental and has caused issues, where the FA etc have had to take action.

Any filming of Uruguayan kids playing football in Blackpool schools is frowned upon but Monty video it.
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Ur a guy who likes a pun.
 
Lytham_fy8 said:
We don't really deserve to win anything as a country do we?

Do other nations have quite the amount of miserable 'told you so' know it alls that we do?
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No we don’t deserve anything as a Country at all in sporting, political or any other terms Lytham because most people in the Country are thick Wankers.....is that your point??
 
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