EU starting to panic at the possibility of no deal Brexit

T

tangerinenotorange

Well-known member
It seems that Brussels is ready to compromise on 'level playing field' rules for business which have threatened to torpedo a post-Brexit trade deal in a sign the EU may be losing its nerve as the end of the month approaches.

Belgian MEP Geert Bourgeois, trade spokesman with European Conservatives and Reformists (ECR) group warned MEPs not to patronise Britain and voiced his concern at the prospect of the UK becoming a low tax-driven tiger economy analogous to Singapore which would undercut the EU in world markets.

Speaking in the European Parliament, Dutch MEP Derk Jan Eppink hit out at the EU while also reminding the members states that the bloc would not even exist without the UK's help. In his speech, Mr Jan Eppink commented on the proposed vast new financial aid package put forward by Germany and France which will give even greater control to the EU Commission. He asked "why are we punishing the Brits over a democratic vote to leave?. They are looking to the future and we're just a small pedantic club with no strategic vision."

Looks like the ponderous sinking EU ship is starting to hold water. Even its strongest economy Germany has been shocked by the prospect of losing 102,000 jobs in the event of the UK walking away with no deal.

Nobody said the split would be easy, but the EU is on the brink of civil war and I'd rather be in our position than theirs.

www.express.co.uk

Brexit threat: Panicking EU must convince Barnier to compromise NOW

PANICKING politicians on the continent have been urged to convince EU negotiator Michel Barnier to adopt a more realistic approach to negotiations with Britain "before it is too late".
www.express.co.uk www.express.co.uk
 
tangerinenotorange said:
Nobody said the split would be easy, but the EU is on the brink of civil war and I'd rather be in our position than theirs.

www.express.co.uk

Brexit threat: Panicking EU must convince Barnier to compromise NOW

PANICKING politicians on the continent have been urged to convince EU negotiator Michel Barnier to adopt a more realistic approach to negotiations with Britain "before it is too late".
www.express.co.uk www.express.co.uk
Click to expand...

Actually a lot of people said the split would be very easy, including our oven ready Prime Minister. Don't rewrite history. You'll be pulling down statues next.
 
Tail Wags Dog - the EU are the grown ups and whatever spin Johnson puts on it, an extension in all but name will be agreed, the EU will let him claim it as a victory in an effort to stop him from taking his ball home(s) and causing untold damage to both sides. It was madness to start with, what would it be with a Brexit and COVID double whammy!
 
Italexit could be on the cards if they decide to hold a referendum.Arriverdeci!
 
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Bottle said:
Tail Wags Dog - the EU are the grown ups and whatever spin Johnson puts on it, an extension in all but name will be agreed, the EU will let him claim it as a victory in an effort to stop him from taking his ball home(s) and causing untold damage to both sides. It was madness to start with, what would it be with a Brexit and COVID double whammy!
Click to expand...


The UK doesn't want an extension. It's the EU that is begging for one. The UK is definitely holding the upper hand. I wouldn't go as far as to say holding the aces, but we are in a better position than the EU considering the global economic mess we all find ourselves in. For those who don't follow developments in the European Parliament there have been some interesting exchanges there, such as on Wednesday when Finnish MEP Laura Huhtasaari called for the euro to be dismantled. The Finns Party member said: "I would like to congratulate Great Britain they just saved around €80 billion by leaving the EU. Soon no one in Britain will even dare to admit voting against Brexit. The European Commission proposal for a recovery fund is another step towards a centralised debt union and the proposal is illegal according to article 125”.

The analogy of the EU being a big old leaking boat with each of the crew pulling in different directions is accurate. In addition to Brexit it lumbers from crisis to crisis following increased pressure on the Euro currency and the massive decline in its popularity amid accusations that it abandoned member states at the height of the coronavirus crisis. I also think that, going forward, Boris does have in mind a Singapore style free market economy. Good for him. This is what he was voted in for so let's see if he can do it.
 
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It’s all posturing and part of the negotiations on both sides. There will be a deal once everyone has been seen to be standing their ground until the 11th hour and a basic foundational trade deal is carved out.
 
clappers said:
It’s all posturing and part of the negotiations on both sides. There will be a deal once everyone has been seen to be standing their ground until the 11th hour and a basic foundational trade deal is carved out.
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Agree with that. It will probably end up with the UK aligning closely with EU regulations with ability to diverge in certain, limited areas which will then be subject to tarrifs. The UK government will sell it as a great deal and that will be swallowed by Brexit supporters whilst in reality we will be in a reduced level of sovereignty when compared with being a member of the EU.
 
Top of the range BMW for every household in 🇬🇧

Will look nice on the drive, alongside the top of the range Toyota we’ll get from the trade deal with Japan 👍

So excited!! Can’t wait!!!
 
Trammo said:
Italexit could be on the cards if they decide to hold a referendum.Arriverdeci!
Click to expand...
Interesting.

I've always maintained that the EU would at some point would alter and that a Northern European Premier League would follow, at least Economically.

So if Italy does leave this will be a step closer and Italy would be free to export Parmesan, Lambretta's and Reversing lights.
 
Trammo said:
Italexit could be on the cards if they decide to hold a referendum. Arriverdeci!
Click to expand...


I don't believe that Italy is ready to leave the EU as the pressure to do so is coming mainly from minority parties like Italia Libera, but it could well decide to leave the Eurozone and that in itself could lead to the collapse of the Euro and maybe ultimately of the EU. Having said that, there's presently a huge amount of bad feeling in Italy towards the EU. "Italians remember that Christine Lagarde (President of the European Central Bank) announced on March 13, just as coronavirus was truly beginning to overwhelm hospitals, that the pandemic was an Italian problem only. This was the catalyst that saw ordinary Italians begin to remove EU flags from public display and replace them with Russian and Chinese flags in gratitude to the significant assistance that these two countries gave to Italy when it was abandoned by Brussels and Berlin."


theduran.com

Will Italy be the next country to leave EU?

Italy can be the catalyst for the disintegration of the European Union
theduran.com theduran.com
 
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Tommy, two articles you’ve quoted on this thread, one from a right wing nut job politician from Finland who believes in creationism and supports the Donald and now this from a journalist known for his racist slurs and neo nazi associations

has somebody given you The Bumper Book of Fascism for Father’s Day
 
HaHa Reci. To be fair, one of my posts was in response to a post regarding the possibility of Italy leaving the EU and I did say I didn't agree with the analyst's opinion that Italy was ready to leave, only with his comments about the Italian anger at being deserted by the EU during the pandemic, which is common knowledge. And the statement of the Finnish MEP in the European Parliament is on record. Make your own mind up on that. My opinion regarding the fragile state of the EU doesn't depend on those comments. I could have quoted a variety of media reports about the EU being in crisis with internal unrest, Brexit, its budget, Eurozone etc.
 
The EU is on the brink of civil war? For fucks sake I've read some shite on here but that's got to be the biggest load of bull I've read. The UK is the one that's splintered, the union is looking a tad uneasy and England appears to be descending onto a culture war.
 
Shandypants said:
The EU is on the brink of civil war? For fucks sake I've read some shite on here but that's got to be the biggest load of bull I've read.
Click to expand...


I'm not going to go over the full extent of the EU crisis and the cliff edge on which the Eurozone precariously balances because I know you are intelligent enough to understand the situation, but I'll outline some of the issues as you seem to think it's "a load of bull".

It's no secret that the EU project is being questioned by its own members. The European Central Bank has warned that its previous recession predictions were underestimated and the bloc faces a massive economic crisis, one literally unheard of in peace time. The ECB wants the richest economies to lower the borrowing costs for their poorer neighbours in order to keep the Eurozone afloat, but the 19 country bloc is set to be put under pressure by huge debt piles racked up by mainly Greece, Italy, France, Portugal and Spain. Meanwhile, there is growing frustration and anger at the EU over its coronavirus response, after Italy threatened to quit the bloc and Portugal lashed out at ‘repugnant’ EU member-states.

The pandemic has sparked an unprecedented crisis throughout the European Union, with a huge rift erupting between the 27 member-states. Failure to agree a joint EU economic response to the crisis has already set off a wave of furious criticism from leaders in Italy, Portugal and Spain. The northern European countries rejected the plea of nine EU countries for 'corona bonds' to soften the economic impact of the pandemic. Angry exchanges during a video conference between EU leaders revealed ‘intense disagreements’ with Spanish Prime Minister Pedro Sanchez telling other EU leaders that the future of the ‘European project’ is at stake, while Italian Prime Minister Giuseppe Conte questioned whether the EU was sufficiently adaptable to survive. French TV claimed Angela Merkel admitted the arguments threatened the stability of Europe. Following the heated exchanges, Italian newspaper headlines condemned the EU response, describing Brussels as dead. Italian opposition leader Matteo Salvini said Italy should consider leaving the EU once the country wins its fight against the outbreak. Portuguese Prime Minister Antonio Costa picked out the Dutch as the main hurdle, describing their rejection of the proposal as repugnant. He went on to lash out at the recurring pettiness of the Dutch government for refusing to help them.

Add to all this the total disagreement over EU financial budgeting, the reluctance of wealthier states to bail out poorer members, the incipient bankruptcy of at least six member states and the pressure on Brussels to save jobs threatened by a no deal Brexit, including 102,900 in Germany alone. If you think my description of that as "the brink of civil war" is shite, you're entitled to your opinion. Everyone else can make their own minds up.
 
tangerinenotorange said:
I'm not going to go over the full extent of the EU crisis and the cliff edge on which the Eurozone precariously balances because I know you are intelligent enough to understand the situation, but I'll outline some of the issues as you seem to think it's "a load of bull".

It's no secret that the EU project is being questioned by its own members. The European Central Bank has warned that its previous recession predictions were underestimated and the bloc faces a massive economic crisis, one literally unheard of in peace time. The ECB wants the richest economies to lower the borrowing costs for their poorer neighbours in order to keep the Eurozone afloat, but the 19 country bloc is set to be put under pressure by huge debt piles racked up by mainly Greece, Italy, France, Portugal and Spain. Meanwhile, there is growing frustration and anger at the EU over its coronavirus response, after Italy threatened to quit the bloc and Portugal lashed out at ‘repugnant’ EU member-states.

The pandemic has sparked an unprecedented crisis throughout the European Union, with a huge rift erupting between the 27 member-states. Failure to agree a joint EU economic response to the crisis has already set off a wave of furious criticism from leaders in Italy, Portugal and Spain. The northern European countries rejected the plea of nine EU countries for 'corona bonds' to soften the economic impact of the pandemic. Angry exchanges during a video conference between EU leaders revealed ‘intense disagreements’ with Spanish Prime Minister Pedro Sanchez telling other EU leaders that the future of the ‘European project’ is at stake, while Italian Prime Minister Giuseppe Conte questioned whether the EU was sufficiently adaptable to survive. French TV claimed Angela Merkel admitted the arguments threatened the stability of Europe. Following the heated exchanges, Italian newspaper headlines condemned the EU response, describing Brussels as dead. Italian opposition leader Matteo Salvini said Italy should consider leaving the EU once the country wins its fight against the outbreak. Portuguese Prime Minister Antonio Costa picked out the Dutch as the main hurdle, describing their rejection of the proposal as repugnant. He went on to lash out at the recurring pettiness of the Dutch government for refusing to help them.

Add to all this the total disagreement over EU financial budgeting, the reluctance of wealthier states to bail out poorer members, the incipient bankruptcy of at least six member states and the pressure on Brussels to save jobs threatened by a no deal Brexit, including 102,900 in Germany alone. If you think my description of that as "the brink of civil war" is shite, you're entitled to your opinion. Everyone else can make their own minds up.
Click to expand...
Civil War generally means people are shooting at each other. I don’t think that has happened yet?

Undoubtedly the EU is undergoing a lot of strain as the Northern Nations are asked to bail out the Southern Nations. Yet Again. And are wondering why they should. But then as we are frequently told these are “unprecedented times”.

I suspect the EU will keep its shit together. But if it doesn’t, and European unity disintegrates into chaos and “Civil War”, I’m not sure that’s a win for the UK?
 
tommytwojags said:
HaHa Reci. To be fair, one of my posts was in response to a post regarding the possibility of Italy leaving the EU and I did say I didn't agree with the analyst's opinion that Italy was ready to leave, only with his comments about the Italian anger at being deserted by the EU during the pandemic, which is common knowledge. And the statement of the Finnish MEP in the European Parliament is on record. Make your own mind up on that. My opinion regarding the fragile state of the EU doesn't depend on those comments. I could have quoted a variety of media reports about the EU being in crisis with internal unrest, Brexit, its budget, Eurozone etc.
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You always talk a lot of sense to me Tommy. The problem arises when people with very fixed views try to twist your logic 👍
 
I must agree Lala.Over the years whether the topic is current affairs or football I` ve nearly always agreed with TTJ and always look forward to his contributions unlike the nonsense spouted by some of the loony left on here.
 
tangerinenotorange said:
It seems that Brussels is ready to compromise on 'level playing field' rules for business which have threatened to torpedo a post-Brexit trade deal in a sign the EU may be losing its nerve as the end of the month approaches.

Belgian MEP Geert Bourgeois, trade spokesman with European Conservatives and Reformists (ECR) group warned MEPs not to patronise Britain and voiced his concern at the prospect of the UK becoming a low tax-driven tiger economy analogous to Singapore which would undercut the EU in world markets.

Speaking in the European Parliament, Dutch MEP Derk Jan Eppink hit out at the EU while also reminding the members states that the bloc would not even exist without the UK's help. In his speech, Mr Jan Eppink commented on the proposed vast new financial aid package put forward by Germany and France which will give even greater control to the EU Commission. He asked "why are we punishing the Brits over a democratic vote to leave?. They are looking to the future and we're just a small pedantic club with no strategic vision."

Looks like the ponderous sinking EU ship is starting to hold water. Even its strongest economy Germany has been shocked by the prospect of losing 102,000 jobs in the event of the UK walking away with no deal.

Nobody said the split would be easy, but the EU is on the brink of civil war and I'd rather be in our position than theirs.

www.express.co.uk

Brexit threat: Panicking EU must convince Barnier to compromise NOW

PANICKING politicians on the continent have been urged to convince EU negotiator Michel Barnier to adopt a more realistic approach to negotiations with Britain "before it is too late".
www.express.co.uk www.express.co.uk
Click to expand...


Been on the magic mushrooms again TNO?

These are the recorded side effects
  • Altered perception of time and space
  • Feeling as if the world is fake
  • Feeling as if you’re in a dream (not that you think you’re sleeping, more that things seem unreal, like a dream)
  • Rapid mood changes, sometimes from very positive to very negative
  • Very sensitive mood
  • Dizziness
  • Fatigue (people on shrooms often find themselves wanting to lie on the floor, or not move much. This effect seems less prominent with LSD, as opposed to shrooms)
  • Large pupils
  • Hard to concentrate
  • “Sporadic, transient increases in blood pressure or heart rate”
  • Nausea
  • Nervousness/anxiety
  • Unusual or odd thoughts
  • Yawning

I hope you're ok when the effects wear off!
 
Ollygon said:
Been on the magic mushrooms again TNO?

These are the recorded side effects
  • Altered perception of time and space
  • Feeling as if the world is fake
  • Feeling as if you’re in a dream (not that you think you’re sleeping, more that things seem unreal, like a dream)
  • Rapid mood changes, sometimes from very positive to very negative
  • Very sensitive mood
  • Dizziness
  • Fatigue (people on shrooms often find themselves wanting to lie on the floor, or not move much. This effect seems less prominent with LSD, as opposed to shrooms)
  • Large pupils
  • Hard to concentrate
  • “Sporadic, transient increases in blood pressure or heart rate”
  • Nausea
  • Nervousness/anxiety
  • Unusual or odd thoughts
  • Yawning

I hope you're ok when the effects wear off!
Click to expand...


I'm glad you've spent so much time giving a medical diagnosis Olly because you can't dispute the facts I've posted.
 
tangerinenotorange said:
I'm not going to go over the full extent of the EU crisis and the cliff edge on which the Eurozone precariously balances because I know you are intelligent enough to understand the situation, but I'll outline some of the issues as you seem to think it's "a load of bull".

It's no secret that the EU project is being questioned by its own members. The European Central Bank has warned that its previous recession predictions were underestimated and the bloc faces a massive economic crisis, one literally unheard of in peace time. The ECB wants the richest economies to lower the borrowing costs for their poorer neighbours in order to keep the Eurozone afloat, but the 19 country bloc is set to be put under pressure by huge debt piles racked up by mainly Greece, Italy, France, Portugal and Spain. Meanwhile, there is growing frustration and anger at the EU over its coronavirus response, after Italy threatened to quit the bloc and Portugal lashed out at ‘repugnant’ EU member-states.

The pandemic has sparked an unprecedented crisis throughout the European Union, with a huge rift erupting between the 27 member-states. Failure to agree a joint EU economic response to the crisis has already set off a wave of furious criticism from leaders in Italy, Portugal and Spain. The northern European countries rejected the plea of nine EU countries for 'corona bonds' to soften the economic impact of the pandemic. Angry exchanges during a video conference between EU leaders revealed ‘intense disagreements’ with Spanish Prime Minister Pedro Sanchez telling other EU leaders that the future of the ‘European project’ is at stake, while Italian Prime Minister Giuseppe Conte questioned whether the EU was sufficiently adaptable to survive. French TV claimed Angela Merkel admitted the arguments threatened the stability of Europe. Following the heated exchanges, Italian newspaper headlines condemned the EU response, describing Brussels as dead. Italian opposition leader Matteo Salvini said Italy should consider leaving the EU once the country wins its fight against the outbreak. Portuguese Prime Minister Antonio Costa picked out the Dutch as the main hurdle, describing their rejection of the proposal as repugnant. He went on to lash out at the recurring pettiness of the Dutch government for refusing to help them.

Add to all this the total disagreement over EU financial budgeting, the reluctance of wealthier states to bail out poorer members, the incipient bankruptcy of at least six member states and the pressure on Brussels to save jobs threatened by a no deal Brexit, including 102,900 in Germany alone. If you think my description of that as "the brink of civil war" is shite, you're entitled to your opinion. Everyone else can make their own minds up.
Click to expand...
So we're not facing a recession because we've left? The EU is facing the same problems that the pandemic has caused everywhere but as one of the largest trading blocs with long established agreements in place they're in a better position than many to get through it.

Those on their own with no deals at all in place...how do you think they're placed to deal with the biggest recession in 300 years?
 
Wizaard said:
So we're not facing a recession because we've left? The EU is facing the same problems that the pandemic has caused everywhere but as one of the largest trading blocs with long established agreements in place they're in a better position than many to get through it.

Those on their own with no deals at all in place...how do you think they're placed to deal with the biggest recession in 300 years?
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So long as I get my “top of the range” Beamer and Toyota - for free !!!! - on my drive: as promised! I don’t care 👍
 
Clearly a distraction story as usual, mixed in with the standard EU will collapse, Italy are next nonsense.

If you want to know which economy gets less from No deal ask why the pound is losing value.....again. It's back at 91p which is just about the lowest it's been since the referendum. It was at 69p in the Greek crisis, which means the whole of the UK has been devalued by 30%.

These stories are just there to comfort the people who chose brexit and deflect the scrutiny from the people who recommended it.

When the average German wages is equivalent to buying blackpool tower maybe people will realise, there again probably not.
 
Foolweary said:
Clearly a distraction story as usual, mixed in with the standard EU will collapse, Italy are next nonsense.

If you want to know which economy gets less from No deal ask why the pound is losing value.....again. It's back at 91p which is just about the lowest it's been since the referendum. It was at 69p in the Greek crisis, which means the whole of the UK has been devalued by 30%.
These stories are just there to comfort the people who chose brexit and deflect the scrutiny from the people who recommended it.
When the average German wages is equivalent to buying blackpool tower maybe people will realise, there again probably not.
Click to expand...


You can turn a blind eye, but you can't hide the truth. The Eurozone is a half-completed monetary union that is going to collapse sooner rather than later.

www.express.co.uk

Brexit domino effect: Four countries tipped to follow UK out of EU

THE EU might be on the verge of a catastrophic collapse, as a prominent academic has suggested four countries could follow Britain out of the bloc.
www.express.co.uk www.express.co.uk
 

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The EU should be quaking in their boots. Boris has just killed tens of thousands of his own citizens so a few hundred thousand on the dole will be water off a duck's back to him. Boris just doesn't care which when you are playing a game of chicken puts you in a very strong position.
 
tangerinenotorange said:
You can turn a blind eye, but you can't hide the truth. The Eurozone is a half-completed monetary union that is going to collapse sooner rather than later.

www.express.co.uk

Brexit domino effect: Four countries tipped to follow UK out of EU

THE EU might be on the verge of a catastrophic collapse, as a prominent academic has suggested four countries could follow Britain out of the bloc.
www.express.co.uk www.express.co.uk
Click to expand...
So you quote the Express to prove a point about the collapse of the EU, the most pro Brexit paper of all.
 
It's an interesting article.

I don't think the collapse of the EU is in any way imminent. But it does have problems ; a small number of relatively wealthy nations are carrying a number of the newer arrivals from Southern Europe, and our departure will exacerbate that. Italy is falling out of love with the EU, some aspects of French political opinion has been antipathetic for some time . Either one of those two choosing to leave really would put the cat among the pigeons.

If Russia continues to be perceived as the major threat to European security, it is entirely possible that new sub-alliances may grow up along the Baltic/North Sea corridor ; we would do well to cultivate them if they look viable.
 
Wizaard said:
So you quote the Express to prove a point about the collapse of the EU, the most pro Brexit paper of all.
Click to expand...

You do this all the time. If an article is in a paper you don't like it can't be true. It doesn't matter who is reporting, the Eurozone has absolutely no chance of surviving for any length of time. Is there a single expert who says otherwise? When the Euro goes, all hell will break loose. That might or might not split the EU apart. Only time will tell.
 
tangerinenotorange said:
You do this all the time. If an article is in a paper you don't like it can't be true. It doesn't matter who is reporting, the Eurozone has absolutely no chance of surviving for any length of time. Is there a single expert who says otherwise? When the Euro goes, all hell will break loose. That might or might not split the EU apart. Only time will tell.
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Confirmation bias. The day the likes of the Express say a single positive comment about the EU will be the first.
 
No deal is clearly not the way to go with 100k UK jobs at stake and 400k in the EU. That's why a deal will be reached.
 
Seasider1887 said:
No deal is the only way to go.
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Of every post you have ever made, do you ever think you have remotely, and I'm talking on any level here, convinced me, or anyone for that matter, to take any of your facts, research, statements of truth, fanciful opinions seriously and has persuaded me think on any level what you say may have some gravitas. I'll give you a clue, as I think you need all the help you can get, it begins with N.
 
Tangiverse said:
Of every post you have ever made, do you ever think you have remotely, and I'm talking on any level here, convinced me, or anyone for that matter, to take any of your facts, research, statements of truth, fanciful opinions seriously and has persuaded me think on any level what you say may have some gravitas. I'll give you a clue, as I think you need all the help you can get, it begins with N.
Click to expand...
How many letters?
 
Shandypants said:
It doesn't work like that does it? You're swallowing the nonsense they need us more than we need them. Go and reread what Greg Clarke said....
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100,000 in this country, 400,000 split between 27 countries. Just who's got the shitty end of that stick.
 
Wizaard said:
Germany has a population of at least 10 million more than us, so I'm sure they'll cope.
Click to expand...

I think the damage to the German car sector will be significantly more damaging to them, especially at a time when they will be expected to bail out the rest of the EU as it comes out of the pandemic. Just to add that I don't believe a no deal will happen for the very reasons outlined above
 
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tangerinenotorange said:
I think the damage to the German car sector will be significantly more damaging to them, especially at a time when they will be expected to bail out the rest of the EU as it comes out of the pandemic. Just to add that I don't believe a no deal will happen for the very reasons outlined above
Click to expand...
Luckily we've no car industry left.
 
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