Going against the data and the science

ElBurroSinNombre said:
It is not a simple choice between drop all restrictions or stay as we are until next year and to characterise the situation as a binary choice between the two is plain nuts. A gradual lifting of restrictions is completely possible.

There are lots of things the government could do, an obvious one is to make it mandatory to wear a mask on public transport. This rule would be completely enforceable and in fact many airlines actually already do this despite being outside of government jurisdiction.
Another enforceable rule would be to mandate the wearing of masks in shops, again very easy to understand and completely enforceable.
It seems that the Covid passport is back on the agenda, I wouldn't be surprised if this became mandated at some future point for certain types of venue. Again completely enforceable and easy to understand for the general public.
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Well okay, but the only difference I can see is that you want masks to be mandatory even though that's not ever been effectively enforced anyway, whereas the government has gone for an advisory approach.

To be honest, compared to other routes of transmission it's likely so minor as to make no difference anyway, which is why face coverings weren't recommended to start with.

Also, we are afaik still keeping the self-isolation rules, we have test and trace so it's not as if we're throwing caution to the wind.
 
What would normally happen when 'experts' paid by the taxpayer to 'advise' the government on policy, don’t like the decision then taken by the elected government and whistleblow their views on social media?
There's a case for loads of SAGE members to be sacked. I hate the cunts.
 
Lost Seasider said:
Well okay, but the only difference I can see is that you want masks to be mandatory even though that's not ever been effectively enforced anyway, whereas the government has gone for an advisory approach.

To be honest, compared to other routes of transmission it's likely so minor as to make no difference anyway, which is why face coverings weren't recommended to start with.

Also, we are afaik still keeping the self-isolation rules, we have test and trace so it's not as if we're throwing caution to the wind.
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Double vaccinated won't have to self isolate if they test negative.
 
BigHandsOliverKahn said:
It sounds like the Chief Medical Officer is starting to realise the need for some precautions...
Whitty getting jittery
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These rules and restrictions cannot go on forever as much as you are desperate for them to.

Unlocking is always going to be risky, there will never be the perfect time in some people’s eyes. It’s funny because about 6 weeks ago, when daily cases were down to 1,500-2,000, that still was too early and reckless to go earlier than the Roadmap... “new variants”... “not enough vaccinated”... it just goes on and on.

At some stage we have to take that risk or we will be living with restrictions indefinitely. That is not an option. I know you would be happy for the rest of your life to live under restrictions but it isn’t an option for a normal person.

When your life is devoid of meaning and joy your only goal is to project misery and hysteria onto others rather than self reflection, I find it so so weird you are desperate for more cases and deaths to keep this thing going, what a sad little mood hoover you are.
 
Adams Kebab said:
These rules and restrictions cannot go on forever as much as you are desperate for them to.

Unlocking is always going to be risky, there will never be the perfect time in some people’s eyes. It’s funny because about 6 weeks ago, when daily cases were down to 1,500-2,000, that still was too early and reckless to go earlier than the Roadmap... “new variants”... “not enough vaccinated”... it just goes on and on.

At some stage we have to take that risk or we will be living with restrictions indefinitely. That is not an option. I know you would be happy for the rest of your life to live under restrictions but it isn’t an option for a normal person.

When your life is devoid of meaning and joy your only goal is to project misery and hysteria onto others rather than self reflection, I find it so so weird you are desperate for more cases and deaths to keep this thing going, what a sad little mood hoover you are.
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What a childish response to such a serious situation.

You really can't see the damage this flippancy is about to inflict. Come September when we have to go into a much harder lockdown because of the urge from people like you to throw all precautions away, you'll be the first to start whinging.
 
BigHandsOliverKahn said:
What a childish response to such a serious situation.

You really can't see the damage this flippancy is about to inflict. Come September when we have to go into a much harder lockdown because of the urge from people like you to throw all precautions away, you'll be the first to start whinging.
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Childish? What being grown-up and accepting that life has to carry on after 18 months?

Keep watching those figures, you’re desperation for them to go up is obvious.
 
Adams Kebab said:
Childish? What being grown-up and accepting that life has to carry on after 18 months?

Keep watching those figures, you’re desperation for them to go up is obvious.
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You actually just said that it's people who want to keep some precautions in place who want numbers to go UP?

You really aren't making any logical sense whatsoever, are you?!
 
BigHandsOliverKahn said:
What a childish response to such a serious situation.

You really can't see the damage this flippancy is about to inflict. Come September when we have to go into a much harder lockdown because of the urge from people like you to throw all precautions away, you'll be the first to start whinging.
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Okay so what's the alternative? We go back into a lockdown until the winter where we know it's going to be worse? So basically, we just stay inside for the rest of our lives.

Every 20 odd minutes someone dies driving on our roads or in an RTA, do we just stop driving cars?
 
BigHandsOliverKahn said:
It sounds like the Chief Medical Officer is starting to realise the need for some precautions...
Whitty getting jittery
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The flip side is that if you try to suppress this wave there's a risk that you end up pushing it into the autumn/winter flu season, at which point you're placing huge pressure on the healthcare system through multiple different routes.

67% of the population is fully vaccinated, the remainder are in low risk groups and 62% of them have one vaccine dose, we're about as ready for this as it is possible to be and there's a strong case for getting this wave out of the way now.



BigHandsOliverKahn said:
............come September when we have to go into a much harder lockdown because of the urge from people like you to throw all precautions away,..............
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The modelling seems to suggest a peak in around the 3rd week of August, so by September cases should be going down anyway and further lockdown measures would be redundant.

In any event this idea that we're throwing all precautions away is nonsense, we're still keeping self-isolation and test and trace, the care home visiting rules remain in place, most people (particularly in vulnerable groups) are going to keep wearing masks and remain cautious, really all that's changed is that the behaviour is no longer mandated by law.

Finally, I'll repeat my earlier point that about the only change I've seen suggested is that face masks should be mandatory rather than recommended, an utterly trivial difference.
 
SeasideKurt said:
Okay so what's the alternative? We go back into a lockdown until the winter where we know it's going to be worse? So basically, we just stay inside for the rest of our lives.

Every 20 odd minutes someone dies driving on our roads or in an RTA, do we just stop driving cars?
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The bedwetters don't have an alternative Kurt. Even if 100% of the population were double jabbed, they would then turn their attentions to long covid and say it's not safe to open up and have the virus circulate in society due to the risks of that.
Some people genuinely never want this to end.
 
cruzzer said:
Today’s numbers are again horrendous and rising.
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You really are a bundle of joy.
Have you considered how many people are dying from preventable cancer, and whilst we refuse to move to normality, these people will not be picked up early enough. I would hazard a bet that the numbers will be horrendous and rising
 
cruzzer said:
50 deaths today, over 210 in the past 7 days. Over 560 hospital admissions today and over 3,200 in the last 7 days.

That’s at case rates of 35,000. Triple it to what Javid thinks will happen and we’ll hit over 150 deaths a day, and over 9,000 hospital admissions a day.

The NHS will be seriously overwhelmed and we’ll be back at square one. All could be avoided by waiting until IMO mid August, the time when the MP’s are all on holiday and the cat at No. 10 is running the country.
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Although the 50 deaths came from those infected 3 to 4 weeks ago. At the time this was about 10,000 cases a day. I think you need to ten fold this as we might hit 100,000 cases per day by the end of this month. With that taken into consideration then we could be looking at 500 deaths a day. This shouldn't cripple the NHS but I wouldn't say 500 deaths a day is a figure people would find acceptable.

Hopefully it won't be that high but as the data between deaths and cases lags by about a month month then this could be very close to the figure that we are about to see.
 
Lost Seasider said:
Some early indications that infections might be starting to peak: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/20...just-one-sixteenth-level-seen-previous-waves/

The most recent data from the King's College Zoe app, which has been monitoring symptomatic Covid since the beginning of the pandemic and tends to track ahead of official figures, suggests cases are plateauing.

And from here: https://covid.joinzoe.com/data

View attachment 7180

There could be a long tail on this wave though.
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Looks mildly encouraging. No wobbles like this one in the other two peaks either.
 
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