Is it *football itself* that's the problem?

[hills98]

We weren't especially attacking though with those players. We went up on the 2nd lowest goals for a promoted side in a decade. We survived by fighting and hitting on the break in general. Not doing that down, but it was a long way from Holloway stuff. I agree we pressed well, but it was more about containment a lot of the time. We stopped teams playing very well.

No I agree, I've kind of combined two points there really, not a fully formed thought! Holloway had Southern and Vaughan who were superb out of possession and Adam and GTF (and Dobbie) who had magic powers. Critch didn't and won't play that way, but Dobs tried to do something similar in his 6 games at the end of the season and it was entertaining and almost worked

 

[Albert Ross]

This is an interesting discussion, and it's not a simple and straightforward one. Some thoughts...

- Football at the top European level is awash with money and has been professionalised beyond anything we could have imagined.
- This has pushed down through lower levels of pro football.
- Coaching and tactics have been ramped up as a result. We see formula football.
- Kick and rush in mud wasn't a great spectacle. It gets romanticised I think.
- Relegation is very expensive.
- Pressure for results is huge.
- Football always had shit games and great games and still has. EPL and Champions League games can be brilliant, despite all the coaching.
- Teams don't sit back and play for a draw very often, as they did before three points for a win.
- Blackpool's Jekyll and Hyde stuff this season demonstrates that we can be both very dull and very exciting. It's a choice. Both are possible.
- Critch wants to combine consistency and control with entertainment.
- He's not managing to achieve it very much this season, up to now. He seems to want to get control first.

Critchley wants to get control at the expense of entertainment. So far he’s achieving neither with consistency. The European Cup was a treasured achievement, unfortunately with the Champions League , not only is the title a misnomer, the overriding consideration is money.

 

[voyeur]

Critchley wants to get control at the expense of entertainment. So far he’s achieving neither with consistency. The European Cup was a treasured achievement, unfortunately with the Champions League , not only is the title a misnomer, the overriding consideration is money.

But the football in the Champions League is often excellent. And that is what we are discussing here.

 

[Albert Ross]

But the football in the Champions League is often excellent. And that is what we are discussing here.

That wasn’t the thread title, it was whether football itself was the problem. Not the excellence or lack of same in a particular league. Which was manufactured for the financial benefit of a select group of clubs and not for the benefit of fans, nor the game as a whole.

 

[ThereisonlyoneChrisMalkin]

Just the odd shot would be nice.

3-5-2 is built on a solid foundation and we look like conceding at every opportunity whilst offering very little going forward. It's a tactical clusterfuck.

This sums it up perfectly. We are playing with loads of attacking players but in a very defensive set up. Example CJ and dale as wing backs. They aren’t very good defensive players but are so deep they are offering little going forward.
Would you play salah and Diaz as wing backs or Messi and Ronaldo???
No….it would be letting the oppositions defence have an easier day and that’s what we are currently doing.

Because the wing backs are the only wide players, we have nobody over-lapping them to create overloads. So what is happening is, when it gets to one of them that it just comes back inside again allowing time for the opposition to get in position and hard to break down. Rhodes and whoever up top just in isolation

 

[Wizaard]

Is there no room for an aggressive 4-3-3 a-la Holloway? Play football but in the right part of the pitch? Seemed to work in Dobbies brief stint.

I understand the keep ball philosophy, and get that it's fashionable because it's very effective for the top clubs, but they are playing against teams who if you let them have the ball will hurt you. For Blackpool, who are playing in L1, I'd prefer a higher tempo and when you lose the ball, have a very disciplined press and disciplined out of possession structure. I'm sure not every set of players can do it, but if you build a squad with that mindset I don't see a problem. I think we did it (high tempo and press I mean) and it worked well when we had Dougall and Wintle or Dougall and Stewart, with Yates harrying from the front. Fit them into a 4-3-3 / 4-2-3-1 and I think it'd be a decent approach.

Edit, I know we don't have Yates/Wintle/Sicknote anymore, but players of their ilk.

Under Dobbie we lost 3 as well won 3.

 

[tangerinesince88]

Agree with this completely. Modern football is very boring. Even today, a 4-0 win, was actually quite boring with very little goalmouth action, excitement or spontaneity. Critch’s approach is a symptom of modern football unfortunately.

 

[hills98]

Under Dobbie we lost 3 as well won 3.

yeah we did but to put that into context, the preceding 6 games, we had a record of 1-1-4 (the win being against a bizarrely poor QPR that i think my u10's would have beaten that night).

IMO for the entirety of McCarthy's disaster, we were playing truly dismal football where it looked like we were trying not to lose by too many goals. In that context, picking up the same squad and getting them fighting for the cause, achieving 3-0-3 was a miraculous turnaround.

 

[PoolWarrior]

Is Critchley caution and backwards/sideways etc actually just a symptom of the general trend of football?

Thee technical ability in the game has improved due to most players now passing through a formal academy coaching structure, teams are better at things like retaining the ball ans shape work and thus it's much less chaotic.

There's a strong argument that we've never had more quality in English football and never had as many good pitches or large professional coaching set ups either.

Tactics are more developed and varied (I read a stat this week that only 1 in 19 teams has played 442) with analytics and analysis meaning managers are far less likely to base decisions purely on hunches and instinct alone.

Is quality and entertainment the same thing?

Could have written the same post about England on Friday.

 

[voyeur]

Under Dobbie we lost 3 as well won 3.

Bloody hell Wiz, it was a miracle we won 3 out of 6 after the months that preceded it. In a very tough league with demoralised players.

 

[td53]

Under Dobbie we lost 3 as well won 3.

Under Dobbie, we averaged 1.5 points per game which, extended across 46 games would have given us 69 points and that season would have seen us in 6th or 7th depending on goal difference.

 

[Wizaard]

Under Dobbie, we averaged 1.5 points per game which, extended across 46 games would have given us 69 points and that season would have seen us in 6th or 7th depending on goal difference.

Critchley is a far better manager than Dobbie though.

 

[Wizaard]

Bloody hell Wiz, it was a miracle we won 3 out of 6 after the months that preceded it. In a very tough league with demoralised players.

Already down so it didn't really matter.

Shackles off and all that. No pressure.

 

[voyeur]

Already down so it didn't really matter.

Shackles off and all that. No pressure.

Blimey give him no credit for making a silk purse out of a sow's ear.

And you're wrong anyway. We weren't relegated until we had one match remaining iirc.

 

[Wizaard]

Blimey give him no credit for making a silk purse out of a sow's ear.

And you're wrong anyway. We weren't relegated until we had one match remaining iirc.

He did a good job in the circumstances, but I'm glad it wasn't a permanent appointment. It would have been a sentimental appointment, pandering to the ex-player obsession some of our fanbase have. If some had their way, only ex players would be in consideration.

Mathematically we weren't relegated, but in reality we'd long gone.

 

[voyeur]

He did a good job in the circumstances, but I'm glad it wasn't a permanent appointment. It would have been a sentimental appointment, pandering to the ex-player obsession some of our fanbase have. If some had their way, only ex players would be in consideration.

Mathematically we weren't relegated, but in reality we'd long gone.

If you say so! I'm not in the slightest obsessed with ex players, but he got us sorted in a jiffy, after months of abject football, we still had a chance of staying up with all that rides on that, and if he'd been in charge for the previous game against Cardiff he likely would have achieved it. With players who had lost the will to live. I think you are dismissing what he did far too lightly, personally.

 

[voyeur]

Critchley is a far better manager than Dobbie though.

Again. Based on what? Guesswork?

 

[Wizaard]

Again. Based on what? Guesswork?

I'm basing it on him getting us promoted then keeping us up comfortably. If it was so easy why did it all go to shit so quickly?

Dobbie was, and is, completely inexperienced.

It's all opinions, but I'm happy with our manager and think Sadler made exactly the right decision to settle everything down after a disastrous season.

 

[td53]

He did a good job in the circumstances, but I'm glad it wasn't a permanent appointment. It would have been a sentimental appointment, pandering to the ex-player obsession some of our fanbase have. If some had their way, only ex players would be in consideration.

Mathematically we weren't relegated, but in reality we'd long gone.

I don't agree. I was absolutely against "get Dobbie in" shouts for exactly that reason. When we got Dobbie in, I was kind of expecting him to be equally ineffective as the previous incumbents but with a bit more love from the stands.

I was very impressed with pretty much everything he did. Tactically, speaking about games, motivation, involving youth effectively etc. Basically, what we can see as fans. Yes, it was end of season, but what could he do about that? Literally the only question I could really ask of him is 'should you have stiffened the midfield against Millwall" and even then, I don't think that was an obvious howler.

We are where we are. I'm happy enough with Critch if he's willing to do what he did yesterday regularly - i.e. unleash our ability against the many fairly industrial teams in the league. That is ironically, pretty much why I wanted the Dobster to be honest - i.e. he didn't seem frightened to try and win. If Critch will apply that against sides like Shrewsbury etc, then lovely. Save the tactical masterclasses for games like Saturday where we're playing equals.

 

[poolseasider]

Bloody hell Wiz, it was a miracle we won 3 out of 6 after the months that preceded it. In a very tough league with demoralised players.

End of season so you have to takes things into context.

Fans still blab on about Derby and Peterborough form 2022 defeats when clearly our players where already on the beach.

 

[voyeur]

I'm basing it on him getting us promoted then keeping us up comfortably. If it was so easy why did it all go to shit so quickly?

Dobbie was, and is, completely inexperienced.

It's all opinions, but I'm happy with our manager and think Sadler made exactly the right decision to settle everything down after a disastrous season.

I'm happy with Critch too. What I'm saying is that you have no idea if f Dobbie is better or worse than Critch but you claimed to know. "Critchley is a far better manager than Dobbie".

We may now be in the automatic places if Dobbie had continued. Quite possibly! It's been a pretty painful 3.5 months with players out of position. I'll defend Critch against excess criticism, but he has strengths and weaknesses.

 

[voyeur]

End of season so you have to takes things into context.

Fans still blab on about Derby and Peterborough form 2022 defeats when clearly our players where already on the beach.

Derby and Peterborough games we were mathematically safe. 5 of Dobbie's 6 games were played with a chance of survival. And massively reversed our previous diabolical form. Not the same at all.

 

[poolseasider]

Derby and Peterborough games we were mathematically safe. 5 of Dobbie's 6 games were played with a chance of survival. And massively reversed our previous diabolical form. Not the same at all.

The teams we played against in those wins on the other hand?
Wigan down.
Birmingham safe.
Norwich no where near play offs.
Takes two to tango so we might have been trying to survive/new coach bounce/pride for crap season etc but did those we beat have that Derby & Peterborough moment.

 

[voyeur]

The teams we played against in those wins on the other hand?
Wigan down.
Birmingham safe.
Norwich no where near play offs.
Takes two to tango so we might have been trying to survive/new coach bounce/pride for crap season etc but did those we beat have that Derby & Peterborough moment.

Yes to an extent. But Mick's team would have lost Squires Gate.