Minutes of Monday's Structured Dialogue Meeting attached

SLO_BFC said:
One of many good reasons for having fans group representatives at SD meetings is so they can feed back to their members what transpired at the meetings in a more anecdotal and nuanced way than the bald minutes would ever do - and I hope they have all done that or plan to do so shortly. I know that only caters to a percentage of the fan base (though a sizeable one).
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And what about those who aren't a member of a club?

I am a member of a club, Blackpool Football Club, and as a season ticket holder I would have expected better communication from my club than member of Yorkshire Seasiders or Basil get from their club or group
 
TangerinePeel said:
Unsure how I feel about some of the comments made in that, I don't like the notion that we shouldn't be treated like normal football fans of any other club because we're coming off the back of Oyston. We as a fanbase have been extremely supportive of the new board financially I think, selling out 4k season tickets in rapid time, many refusing refunds last time, spending at the club shop and watching via iFollow week in, week out.

I have no stake in the season ticket refund debate as I didn't buy one, I pay for every iFollow game individually home and away. It just strikes me a bit odd that a question about the training ground resulted in a tangent about season ticket refunds, almost as if they wanted to make sure they got their dig in and villainize a portion of our fanbase who could be asking due to the same economical impact of covid that BG literally mentions as to why people shouldn't be asking for refunds. A lot of that doesn't sit right with me, it is certainly divisive as you can see examples of in this very thread.

I think the higher ups at the club need to develop a thicker skin as responding in this manner doesn't strike me as professional at all. It comes across as a threat, basically outright saying that Sadler might stop funding the club if it continues. BG literally states there that a MINORITY of fans asking about refunds could be enough to prevent Sadler investing anymore, when afterwards he admits the majority of the fanbase have been investing back into the club heavily in a literal financial crisis - that really worries me if true.

I can not explain how grateful I am of Simon Sadler, my suggestion for the East Stand was for it to be named after him, I have plans to commission an away day flag which honours Sadler - I don't think my gratitude can be questioned. I just do not like the implication coming from the board that we as a fanbase have to just shut up when it comes to the club, just pump your money back in - it is a bit of a disgrace really to speak to fans of a football club from the most deprived town in this country, during an economic crisis over the request of a refund.
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I think that’s a really decent and fair post, from all angles 👏
 
Long-shanks said:
Wow! Theres that many supporters groups that I didnt know we had that many supporters for.

Might start up my own group to get an invite to the next meeting so I dont need a DVD sent to me.... who's up for joining the Blackpool Old Lads Local Official Clubs Koala Special ....... Bollocks for short. You get a badge for a £25 entry signing on fee.
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There aren't really
Bit of a charade
I can get inviting reps from the exiles but there are groups there who only rep themselves
Would be good to have some younger fans
 
SLO_BFC said:
One of many good reasons for having fans group representatives at SD meetings is so they can feed back to their members what transpired at the meetings in a more anecdotal and nuanced way than the bald minutes would ever do - and I hope they have all done that or plan to do so shortly. I know that only caters to a percentage of the fan base (though a sizeable
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I reckon we should all join tangerine Seasiders. A beacon of truth in these times of unrest 👍
 
SLO_BFC said:
Just FYI the request to live-stream (or at least record and release on YouTube) these SD meetings has been put to the club on more than one occasion. It's not a step they've been prepared to sanction up to now, preferring to let the minutes do the job they're designed to do. IMHO the meetings are conducted in a constructive, frank and professional manner with the board giving considered and detailed responses to the questions posed. There is certainly no ranting and no need for a Jackie Weaver.
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Thanks for your replies so far but could you please give the reasons why the club won’t sanction live streaming or record / release on the several occasions that you have asked for this on behalf of the fans

LA1 who attended the last meeting mentioned this

‘I think the worries about any sort of accidental embarrassment are valid ones’

is this something that was mentioned at the meeting but not included in the minutes?

the first question in the meeting, ‘pls would the Club look into holding an online fans forum’ was seemingly not addressed by BM in his answer

i look forward to your reply
 
Recidivist3 said:
Thanks for your replies so far but could you please give the reasons why the club won’t sanction live streaming or record / release on the several occasions that you have asked for this on behalf of the fans

LA1 who attended the last meeting mentioned this

‘I think the worries about any sort of accidental embarrassment are valid ones’

is this something that was mentioned at the meeting but not included in the minutes?

the first question in the meeting, ‘pls would the Club look into holding an online fans forum’ was seemingly not addressed by BM in his answer

i look forward to your reply
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Not sure it's the SLO's role to do that
The question has been asked more than once - not gone back through the minutes but I'm pretty sure BST have raised at previous meetings
We have our answers - it's no
 
I've read most of the responses on this thread and I'm struggling to understand why BG would say that.

The fans who led a campaign which helped create the conditions for SS to buy the club, that cleaned pigeon shit off the seats, who have given him the warmest of welcomes, who understand what he's trying to do and have put their hard earned cash into the club should not have been caveated with "there are a few who'd like their money back."

There will be so few people making that issue to even mention it seems remarkably churlish and shortsighted. Then to threaten SS will stop supporting the club because of this tiny minority; really?

We've been told before there are no other buyers out there and that really, really rankles.

IF the cub are going to continue doing this, I think they need to be far more considered in either how they answer or how the answers are presented - a live stream is probably a better way, so we can all judge the intent behind the answers.

That answer feels like a mis-step to me.
 
TwelveAngryMen said:
There aren't really
Bit of a charade
I can get inviting reps from the exiles but there are groups there who only rep themselves
Would be good to have some younger fans
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Agree 100%... problem being that the average age on here is 50 (guestimate) and we all love a good moan on here - only pleasure we get nowadays. The young lads and girls, and all LGBT+ to be fully inclusive, of all our fans are probably out having to much of a good time to give a toss if Ben G's tone of voice is high, low, raised, super sonic... they couldnt give a monkeys.
 
TSSeasider said:
I've read most of the responses on this thread and I'm struggling to take understand why BG would say that.

The fans who led a campaign which helped create the conditions for SS to buy the club, that cleaned pigeon shit off the seats, who have given him the warmest of welcomes, who understand what he's trying to do and have put their hard earned cash into the club should not have been caveated with "there are a few who'd like their money back."

There will be so few people making that issue to even mention it seems remarkably churlish and shortsighted. Then to threaten SS will stop supporting the club because of this tiny minority; really?

We've been told before there are no other buyers out there and that really, really rankles.

IF the cub are going to continue doing this, I think they need to be far more considered in either how they answer or how the answers are presented - a live stream is probably a better way, so we can all judge the intent behind the answers.

That answer feels like a mis-step to me.
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Good point TS
Apparently it's been a feature on facebook but in ' the lions den ' of AVFTT it's pretty much a non-issue
Think we all appreciate what Simon has done and save exceptional circumstances you'd like to think we all realise we are in his together
EG I still think there is a role for safe standing and I think this should be fan led not funded by Simon
 
Mark_GT said:
Two questions from me:
1. Who the fuck are the "Tangerine Seasiders"? - I've read the explanation by the way but dear me............
2. What would possess BSA to ask this question, apparently immediately following on from the rather emotional sounding response from the club to a less inflammatory question about the training ground?;
"Given that it is unlikely that 2020/21 season ticket holders will be able to attend live home matches, how is the Club planning to compensate them for the 2021/22 season? And given many other clubs have offered refunds to 2020/21 season ticket holders, why did the Club not offer season ticket holders the option to take a season break to protect their existing preferred seats?" (BSA)

This just takes me right back to the reason why some chose not to oppose the Oystons, and once they were booted out, certain Mushrooms' stout and in my view immoral defence of their right to the best seats in the house at the expense of those who made an effort.
This group should be put out to grass. It's embarrassing!
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I can’t imagine those who, like me (and you), dedicated ourselves to the NAPM campaign want any compensation I’d just like my seat back. I’ve saved 4 years of money but spent (it feels like) 4 years outside the ground watching ‘them’ go into the ground every Saturday.
 
TwelveAngryMen said:
Not sure it's the SLO's role to do that
The question has been asked more than once - not gone back through the minutes but I'm pretty sure BST have raised at previous meetings
We have our answers - it's no
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Cheers, TAM, though I’d much prefer an answer from the SLO. I’m sure you understand

In the meantime, why are the reasons ‘secret’

I’d love to quote BG talking about ‘openness’ but I’d be going back to that earlier meeting once again
 
This was the reply in Sept

Can future fan meetings (SDs and general forums) be live streamed for those who can't attend to watch at home? (BST) BG: Function of these is working well as it is, but club may look into this into future.
 
From November

Regarding comments on Message Boards – it’s not a fair reflection of what the majority think. (Tony Hodgson - BST)

BG – Thanks. Maybe we have given them more credence because of the questions submitted tonight. We welcome all feedback as long as it’s fair. Football is a game of opinions, but some are beyond what anyone wants to read. JA - Take no notice of comments that are unfair as the majority of people are behind the Club.
 
I think it’s fair to say that the function of fans meetings is no longer ‘working well as it is’, if indeed it ever was.
 
Personally I'd say mx it up and live stream
The Cods did a great streamyard ( think podcast format ) event with Pilley and Grayson last month
Imagine the positivity in getting the management team or Simon on that type of format
In these strange times you have to think out of the box as to how you engage
The new preview show is a good start but regular and meaningful social media content is so important right now
 
Recidivist3 said:
Thanks for your replies so far but could you please give the reasons why the club won’t sanction live streaming or record / release on the several occasions that you have asked for this on behalf of the fans

LA1 who attended the last meeting mentioned this

‘I think the worries about any sort of accidental embarrassment are valid ones’

is this something that was mentioned at the meeting but not included in the minutes?

the first question in the meeting, ‘pls would the Club look into holding an online fans forum’ was seemingly not addressed by BM in his answer

i look forward to your reply
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Hi,

Steve (the SLO) asked whether or not the club would reconsider live streaming the forum - alluding to the fact the question had been asked at least once before.

I can’t remember who (either Ben or Brett) indicated that whilst they’d love to get the forums opened up to a much wider audience when they can do them in person in the Matthew’s suite they don’t necessarily see the benefit of doing them via zoom or a live stream in their current guise as they don’t think it would add to the forum itself and would potentially create a scenario where ‘IF’ something embarrassing or improper were to happen that it could ultimately go viral and embarrass the club and all those involved.
They don’t expect anything like that but obviously no one does until something happens and therefore by not live streaming the club are basically protecting themselves from such a risk. They’re not putting the club in any unnecessary awkward positions and I think that’s a fair approach to take.

That being said, as has been seen by the fall out from the minutes, the club may need to reconsider that as naturally minutes and well intentioned feeeback from people such as myself and basilRobbie may not be enough for some.
 
The answer to that is to delay by 30 mins or an hour so you can edit if there's a significant issue - there wouldn't be in reality

Of course if you do a live event that will be covered ' live ' via mobiles
 
LA1 Seasider said:
I also found it odd no one else jumped on the Revoe story so I’m pleased I asked about that. I think the board were completely caught out with that story being released by the Gazette. I’m pleased I asked about the penthouse too as I think there’s a lot of stories they would like to share but possibly can’t at this time.

I don’t know about you Robbie but I completely understand why the board are reluctant to open the meetings up on a large scale (I think the worries about any sort of accidental embarrassment are valid ones) but when you have the fall out we’ve seen today and tonight following the minutes you must hope they reconsider.

Very nice to be able to (possibly) put a face to a name now too ! Pleasure to digitally meet you.
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It was a pleasure to meet you too.

On opening the meetings up - I genuinely can see both sides of it. I understand the desire from fans to be able to feel involved - I feel it myself. On the other hand I can see it from the club's point of view too. They want some measure of control over format and content, and also want to be sure they have a broad spectrum of fans groups "in the room". This approach delivers all that. People shouldn't forget that these meetings do require a fair amount of preparation, particularly from the club as host. They naturally want as a big a bang from their buck as they can get.

It is no accident that the issue under discussion was the first question, in my view. It was BST's first question too, because it is the one we get asked most often. I expect that a similar question will be asked again in the future.

And on questions, I can only speak for the way that BST approached it. We notified our Members of the date, and asked for questions. We supplemented those we got from them with questions from the Committee. At the SLO's request, we sent them ALL up, and tried to order and group them in a way that made sense (so we had several questions on the youth team from one Member, and similar questions from a number of Members about the hotel penthouse in two groups). Every Member who submitted a question was told what the process was, and promised that any question not answered on the night would be followed up. Everyone who asked a question that was answered was notified privately beforehand of the club's response to it.

I don't think we can make it any more transparent and inclusive than that. I also thought that we got full answers to questions where the club felt able to offer them. From that point of view, the meeting was successful and this spat over ST's should be judged in that wider context - in my opinion.
 
RossendaleSeasider said:
Thanks for uploading, Steve.

I think the comments from BG are unnecessarily antagonistic and arrogant. SS has had so much goodwill and financial support from the fans, and this is about the 4th or 5th time the club have officially come out criticised fans for comments they've made online. Unless they are libellous or illegal, then this seems a ridiculous overreaction. Every fan I know is massively grateful to SS for everything he's done.
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You have to admit some of the fans on here are too critical. Some of the comments re the game being called off the other night are a good example. Some people were coming out with all sorts of shit without knowing the facts!
 
TwelveAngryMen said:
The answer to that is to delay by 30 mins or an hour so you can edit if there's a significant issue - there wouldn't be in reality

Of course if you do a live event that will be covered ' live ' via mobiles
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I personally would like to see the forums live streamed.
I think there may be some issues at Blackpool FC which make it more difficult than other clubs though;
1) only recently have the club been getting a media team together who would be able to manage such an event (as we saw tonight such a team is now in place and active so maybe this is less of an obstacle moving forwards) and we’ve been behind clubs like Fleetwood who did have those teams in place for a while now.
2) given the clubs recent history questions may be a bit more complex and ‘difficult’ to answer in a public forum. Fleetwood fans will be asking about booking 2 Taxi’s or 1 for the upcoming away games whereas Blackpool fans will be asking about potentially ongoing legal matters... I’m sure TAM knows more about that than I do but I can imagine the less info out in the open the better.
3) Simon works full time in Hong Kong so can’t really be available for these forums - as such questions are left to a fairly sizeable management structure (by other clubs standard) so whilst AP at FTFC can be there in person and give all the answers as gospel BFC don’t necessarily have that luxury.
4) The running of BFC is quite possibly a lot more complex and time consuming than we realise. There’s likely a lot more hands in a much larger number of pies than at clubs like FTFC therefore the ability to give straight forward answers becomes difficult and the number of possible questions and topics is much larger.
5) The interest in BFC is probably a lot greater than other clubs. How many would want to watch the forum ? How many questions would it create and how would those subsequent questions then be answered ?

It obviously can be done but much greater minds than mine would need to get their heads around it and I imagine much greater minds than mine have already given it a lot mire thought than me.

I just think it’s maybe not as straight forward as comparing BFC with Fleetwood or any other club at this time.
 
Not sure I agree Robbie
There are 5-6 people who are in the room at every meeting who have no real mandate and that leaves others feeling disenfranchised
BST to be fair mix it up as to who's there but we could do with some young guns as well as the old guard The average age of the attendees must have been 50+
Inevitably therefore there is a bit of ' same old ' with each one and the questions reflect that
Didn't Linton comment as much ?
I also think minutes generally are rather stale ( J4F being an honourable exception ) whilst a stream - even if delayed - would attract far more traction
 
TwelveAngryMen said:
Not sure I agree Robbie
There are 5-6 people who are in the room at every meeting who have no real mandate and that leaves others feeling disenfranchised
BST to be fair mix it up as to who's there but we could do with some young guns as well as the old guard The average age of the attendees must have been 50+
Inevitably therefore there is a bit of ' same old ' with each one and the questions reflect that
Didn't Linton comment as much ?
I also think minutes generally are rather stale ( J4F being an honourable exception ) whilst a stream - even if delayed - would attract far more traction
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Tim, if we confine the meetings to people with a "mandate" (however defined), I can guarantee that a lot of people would be very unhappy about that as well. I take your point about people being disenfranchised, but the best way to feel part of it is to submit a question. Very few people do, for whatever reason, and to be fair to the club they can only respond to what comes in from us.

LA1 makes some interesting points about how the meetings might evolve, and I hope they do, not least because of the point that you made about keeping it fresh. In fact, the challenge that Brett left us with was to try to break new ground with the questions that come forward next time. And if the same issues keep coming up, then equally, the challenge for the club will be to reconsider their earlier answers.
 
basilrobbie said:
Tim, if we confine the meetings to people with a "mandate" (however defined), I can guarantee that a lot of people would be very unhappy about that as well. I take your point about people being disenfranchised, but the best way to feel part of it is to submit a question. Very few people do, for whatever reason, and to be fair to the club they can only respond to what comes in from us.

LA1 makes some interesting points about how the meetings might evolve, and I hope they do, not least because of the point that you made about keeping it fresh. In fact, the challenge that Brett left us with was to try to break new ground with the questions that come forward next time. And if the same issues keep coming up, then equally, the challenge for the club will be to reconsider their earlier answers.
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Think we will have to agree to disagree on this one
Bar the three larger fans groups there needs to be far more rotation
The meetings also need a far wider reach
Stale minutes might interest you and I but it's not for the younger demographic
 
A good thread, certainly the last page which I have just read now.

Good discussion and suggestions afforded consideration even if people don't agree.

I don't want to go on but I think it's good to see people who clearly have the best interests in the club respecting differing views and opinions but I feel that although this is certainly the norm when people have each others respect (Tim and Robbie would be a good positive example of this), the opinions of outsiders may be dismissed far too easily and they can often find themselves criticised for voicing valid concerns that may deemed as unimportant, totally irrelevant, too negative etc, etc.

*** Note - Not suggesting that specifically Tim or Robbie do not consider the opinions of others ***
 
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Wouldn't it be easy for the club to survey supporters and address themes that emerge as part of that?

I do that in my job, send out an email to X number of people, go thorough the answers, boil it down to 3 or 4 themes and then make a response.

Ok, there's thousands of us, but how many people are actually going to fill the survey in and even with a lot of responses, it doesn't take *that long* to do.

It seems a bit convoluted having all the different fans groups and taking questions from people who represent groups that even die hard fans don't know who they are.

In terms of younger fans, you could do a 'ask me anything?' type event online. Wouldnt be too hard to host on Facebook or similar and club reps only address relevant questions.

Look at how the podcast and Lee do it. It's essentially the same thing. Someone chooses what comments to show and the club reps respond.
 
First
Many thanks for putting the link up and sharing the minutes. It is a good read and very interesting.

my thoughts on the refund issue for what it’s worth is this....yes, we all read the small print when we bought season tickets and knew that we would miss games. BUT in all honesty did many people think that we would miss all season and not see one game (apart from the one game v Swindon)? I know I didn’t. I thought it would be for about the first 4 or 5 games at most. I don’t want a refund, but I would welcome some acknowledgement that fans havent got what they paid for and have actually effectively donated money to the club. the Answers given by BG come across as very arrogant, and don’t recognise this.

I was also somewhat irked by the tone of addressing how much SS has put in and we should all be grateful and he has had it worse than anyone. Again, yes we are grateful, but as others have said he went into this with his eyes open. It almost comes across that we should feel sorry for him. I bet 99% of us would swap his bank balance for ours, even after his losses. £250 for some of our fans might well be as much a sacrifice as £4m for SS.

I always worry when people treat the masses/majority with messages addressed to effectively the lowest common denominator. Better in my book to ignore the detractors and praise/work work witH those with positivity and encourage them to keep going.

the contrast between the negative paragraphs/answers and those where he was eulogising over the volunteers is there to be seen and I know that I was much more supportive when reading those
 
O4tonygreen said:
First
Many thanks for putting the link up and sharing the minutes. It is a good read and very interesting.

my thoughts on the refund issue for what it’s worth is this....yes, we all read the small print when we bought season tickets and knew that we would miss games. BUT in all honesty did many people think that we would miss all season and not see one game (apart from the one game v Swindon)? I know I didn’t. I thought it would be for about the first 4 or 5 games at most. I don’t want a refund, but I would welcome some acknowledgement that fans havent got what they paid for and have actually effectively donated money to the club. the Answers given by BG come across as very arrogant, and don’t recognise this.

I was also somewhat irked by the tone of addressing how much SS has put in and we should all be grateful and he has had it worse than anyone. Again, yes we are grateful, but as others have said he went into this with his eyes open. It almost comes across that we should feel sorry for him. I bet 99% of us would swap his bank balance for ours, even after his losses. £250 for some of our fans might well be as much a sacrifice as £4m for SS.

I always worry when people treat the masses/majority with messages addressed to effectively the lowest common denominator. Better in my book to ignore the detractors and praise/work work witH those with positivity and encourage them to keep going.

the contrast between the negative paragraphs/answers and those where he was eulogising over the volunteers is there to be seen and I know that I was much more supportive when reading those
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I don't know if the community trust christmas present donate x and we'll match it with x thing was a test run but they should by now know that there is goodwill there but nobody is capable of donating four million just to stop someone else being a martyr. It either carries on or it fails. Someone has to be in the paying seat in every taxi.
 
Sorry but if I’m SS I’d not be happy with BG’s response. You can’t come out with what he did whether SS/they are pissed off about refunds and/or people complaining. Maybe once but not numerous times. Totally unprofessional. They will have known full well a small number of fans will always moan or ask for refunds.

99% of our fan base appreciate what we have now and will back SS all the way but why’ll always be a small negative of people moaning that’s just life.
 
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Brett&Murphs. said:
Sorry but if I’m SS I’d not be happy with BG’s response. You can’t come out with what he did whether SS/they are pissed off about refunds and/or people complaining. Maybe once but not numerous times. Totally unprofessional. They will have known full well a small number of fans will always moan or ask for refunds.

99% of our fan base appreciate what we have now and will back SS all the way but why’ll always be a small negative of people meaning that’s just life.
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Not unprofessional at all.

Ive read and re-read the minutes and the relevant paragraphs and cant for the life of me see what all this fuss is about.

When you read what BG says in those two paragraphs I just dont see what the problem is.

Is it not understandable that SS may get a little fed up when hes invested millions from his own pocket to secure the club's future to hear some people demanding refunds for season tickets when the terms upon which they were bought were clear ?If you couldnt go the stadium you would get an ifollow pass to watch the games.

Its been suggested that SS knew exactly what he was taking on when he bought the club in the summer of 2019. Really ? So he knew that Covid was round the corner and that his first season as owner would be cancelled ? He knew that fans wouldnt be allowed back in the ground for over a year 9 months into his ownership and that match day revenue would suffer enormously as a result ? He isnt a clairvoyant.

I agree he knew the score when he took over but could not have foreseen the unprecedented crisis which has caused him to lose more money than he envisaged.

At the end of the day SS wasnt in the market to buy a football club, He saw from afar that the club he supports was in real trouble and stepped in to help for the benefit of us all. He is fully entitled to get cheesed off by the minority who are moaning when he continues to invest millions of pounds in making substantial improvements and covering the losses.

The fact that BG felt able to share this with the fans groups is very refreshing as its in the spirit of openness and transparency.

SS and BG are just fans like us one of which has the means to put substantial monies in. I suspect the main thing that disappoints them is the fact that the requests for a refund suggest we are not all in this together during these very difficult times.

Im astonished at some of the comments on here. Think we should draw a line under it now and move on.

BG is a very important member of the board who puts himself out for the club and like his fellow board members works very hard and spends many hours trying to make it better.
 
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Good read this thread with some very sensible views. I wonder if The Board we should start paying this Board a consultancy fee?(JOKE).
Of course it does prove the Board reads this board and social media which of course Karl did for lots of different reasons. Karl did actually get lots of good advice (not just about where to stick his gun) but the famous "I'm on the train" thread. Of course Karl never accepted advice from anyone.
Of course there is nothing to stop you e-mailing the Board at anytime. It's not something I've done but I might give it a try and see how that works out.
 
AngelBFC said:
Not unprofessional at all.

Ive read and re-read the minutes and the relevant paragraphs and cant for the life of me see what all this fuss is about.

When you read what BG says in those two paragraphs I just dont see what the problem is.

Is it not understandable that SS may get a little fed up when hes invested millions from his own pocket to secure the club's future to hear some people demanding refunds for season tickets when the terms upon which they were bought were clear ?If you couldnt go the stadium you would get an ifollow pass to watch the games.

Its been suggested that SS knew exactly what he was taking on when he bought the club in the summer of 2019. Really ? So he knew that Covid was round the corner and that his first season as owner would be cancelled ? He knew that fans wouldnt be allowed back in the ground for over a year 9 months into his ownership and that match day revenue would suffer enormously as a result ? He isnt a clairvoyant.

I agree he knew the score when he took over but could not have foreseen the unprecedented crisis which has caused him to lose more money than he envisaged.

At the end of the day SS wasnt in the market to buy a football club, He saw from afar that the club he supports was in real trouble and stepped in to help for the benefit of us all. He is fully entitled to get cheesed off by the minority who are moaning when he continues to invest millions of pounds in making substantial improvements and covering the losses.

The fact that BG felt able to share this with the fans groups is very refreshing as its in the spirit of openness and transparency.

SS and BG are just fans like us one of which has the means to put substantial monies in. I suspect the main thing that disappoints them is the fact that the requests for a refund suggest we are not all in this together during these very difficult times.

Im astonished at some of the comments on here. Think we should draw a line under it now and move on.

BG is very important member of the board who puts himself out for the club and like his fellow board members work v hard t and spend many hours trying to make it better.
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A few things.

Firstly, we are not "all in this together " as has been meme'd a million times. Same storm, different boat. I dare say, those in the upper echelons of BFC have bigger and more water tight boats than many of our fans who will have seen their earnings plummet due to Covid restrictions restricting their ability to earn (generally) low pay. That's not about the politics of envy, just a statement of reality.

Just 12 weeks ago "hundreds of kids will wake up in Blackpool without a Christmas present; please donate" - but don't ask for a refund??? Honestly, it takes some for of disconnect to perhaps consider the two things aren't linked.

Of course, nobody was forced to buy a season ticket and nobody was forced to donate, but it's not a very nice look. Chuck in SS will stop supporting the club, and really, that is such an unnecessary statement. Why say that now? What could possibly be gained, they've alienated fans unnecessarily.

And to regurgitate the previous owners lines about there being no other SS? It's an ubelievably crass remark. Sunderland have just been taken over by a billionaire - but the last set of owners were saying "you're lucky to have us"

I actually think there needs to be a standing item on any future meetings. Something to the effect of "what more could we as fans do?"

It would allow The Club to paint the picture of where they need the most help and perhaps give them time to think of support which we can help with, over and above the Bob Geldof " give us your ** money!"

Truth be told, we may only be an income stream to maximise to them, and that's fine, be honest about it.

There's a whiff of condescension coming in; unhappy we've got an unplayable pitch; I'll delete my Twitter account,a small number of people asking for a refund, SS will stop putting money into his business. Not a good, not a good look at all.

It's not been the best of weeks for the club, they really ought to reflect on what they are saying and how it can be perceived.

And FWIW I'm glad we've got this ownership, I'm delighted he's investing across the board and had ambitions for the future and I'll continue to put as much money in to enjoying the football for as long as I can BUT that doesn't mean I'll agree with everything they say and do and I'll say so and I should be able to do that, without the threat of SS stopping his investment.
 
TSSeasider said:
A few things.

Firstly, we are not "all in this together " as has been meme'd a million times. Same storm, different boat. I dare say, those in the upper echelons of BFC have bigger and more water tight boats than many of our fans who will have seen their earnings plummet due to Covid restrictions restricting their ability to earn (generally) low pay. That's not about the politics of envy, just a statement of reality.

Just 12 weeks ago "hundreds of kids will wake up in Blackpool without a Christmas present; please donate" - but don't ask for a refund??? Honestly, it takes some for of disconnect to perhaps consider the two things aren't linked.

Of course, nobody was forced to buy a season ticket and nobody was forced to donate, but it's not a very nice look. Chuck in SS will stop supporting the club, and really, that is such an unnecessary statement. Why say that now? What could possibly be gained, they've alienated fans unnecessarily.

And to regurgitate the previous owners lines about there being no other SS? It's an ubelievably crass remark. Sunderland have just been taken over by a billionaire - but the last set of owners were saying "you're lucky to have us"

I actually think there needs to be a standing item on any future meetings. Something to the effect of "what more could we as fans do?"

It would allow The Club to paint the picture of where they need the most help and perhaps give them time to think of support which we can help with, over and above the Bob Geldof " give us your ** money!"

Truth be told, we may only be an income stream to maximise to them, and that's fine, be honest about it.

There's a whiff of condescension coming in; unhappy we've got an unplayable pitch; I'll delete my Twitter account,a small number of people asking for a refund, SS will stop putting money into his business. Not a good, not a good look at all.

It's not been the best of weeks for the club, they really ought to reflect on what they are saying and how it can be perceived.

And FWIW I'm glad we've got this ownership, I'm delighted he's investing across the board and had ambitions for the future and I'll continue to put as much money in to enjoying the football for as long as I can BUT that doesn't mean I'll agree with everything they say and do and I'll say so and I should be able to do that, without the threat of SS stopping his investment.
Click to expand...
Engagement is a two way thing and it can’t be stifled to contain only positive opinions and positive feedback.
If you go down the road that allows only worship and praise and no alternative constructive questioning then what are the board or the owner actually gaining in terms of customer and fan insight.
All insight should be a valuable commodity for the owner, whether it’s agreed with or not.
SS is an amazing custodian and we are eternally grateful. But nobody and no organisation should ever be beyond critique or questioning.
Abuse is a separate issue and I can’t say I’ve seen much of that, if any heading SS’s direction 👍
 
And one last thing before I shut up; why wouldn't the owner put money into the club/business; it's normal business practice and certainly normal football practice.

Granted, it's possibly a bigger investment than he expected, and certainly Covid will have reduced the income but it's not something to hold over the supporters.

Frustrating.
 
TSSeasider said:
And one last thing before I shut up; why wouldn't the owner put money into the club/business; it's normal business practice and certainly normal football practice.

Granted, it's possibly a bigger investment than he expected, and certainly Covid will have reduced the income but it's not something to hold over the supporters.

Frustrating.
Click to expand...
Possibly a bigger investment????? It’s fooking massively over what he thought he might have to put in to keep us safe...... see Angel’s thread above for about another 5 reasons why 🙄
 
TSSeasider said:
And one last thing before I shut up; why wouldn't the owner put money into the club/business; it's normal business practice and certainly normal football practice.

Granted, it's possibly a bigger investment than he expected, and certainly Covid will have reduced the income but it's not something to hold over the supporters.

Frustrating.
Click to expand...
It may be normal football practice. It certainly isn’t normal business practice ... quite the contrary
 
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