Moscow now

[Jaffa_The_Hut]

I'm only teasing. I think you're quite an interesting study, actually.

Must be the Fleetwood connection.

 

[hertfordseasider]

I'm only teasing. I think you're quite an interesting study, actually.

Bloody Commie!!

 

[basilrobbie3]

Red Robbie, if you don't mind.

 

[Bloodtangerine]

Trump negotiated the withdrawal deal in Doha and it was implemented by his administration. By the time the Biden administration took over there were only 2500 US troops remaining in Afghanistan.

You’re correct that the final evacuation was a clusterfeck, and Biden has certainly been criticised for that, but arguably he had very few options left to him given the situation he inherited from the previous administration.

I know I’m correct

 

[Beachcomber]

'Uncle Vlad' ! FFS he is a mass murderer and criminal.

An alternative scenario is that Trump is elected, Putin, very happy with Trump's lukewarm support for NATO, tries to broker an agreement to stop the fighting in Ukraine in exchange for territory (as you envisage). Putin then sets his sites on gaining territory in one of the Baltic states who would, like Ukraine, find it difficult to defend themselves alone. This puts other NATO members into a difficult position and ends up with the eventual breakup of the organisation completely changing world dynamic and placing more power in the hands of China, India and Russia. A 'new' NATO emerges without the US and Hungary but is significantly weaker etc., etc. The world is plunged into chaos and a conflict breaks out in the Balkans etc. etc. It's all pure speculation.

The short answer is that anything could happen. However, If you think that appeasing Putin by ceding territory in a sovereign country to him is the correct course of action, I would say that you are completely wrong. All that will do is embolden him.

The Russians have no interest in the Baltic states or Finland because the people aren’t Russian. They have an interest in eastern Ukraine because the people are Russian. Thatcher sent her armada to the south Atlantic to free a couple of thousand Brits from Argentine’s junta, but you say that Russia can’t be allowed to protect its own kin on its doorstep. This is total nonsense. As for NATO, Russia would choose to end the whole world (including itself) rather than be defeated by a gaggle of social and moral degenerates and born-again Nazis.

 

[Archibald Knox]

There is a significant Russian minority in Latvia, of 24% of the population. Similarly for Estonia with 23% ethnic Russians.Lithuania has only 5% Russians. Compare those figures with 17% in Ukraine overall although mainly in the east of the country.

They immigrated into the Baltic soviets in the years after WW2 as part of the Soviet Union’s “denazification” efforts. They seem to be well-assimilated and dispersed though and are not fomenting rebellion. Being now part of the EU must be very helpful in that regard.

But whether Putin will try and wind them up is another question, so I would not be so sure as to say “the Russians have no interest in the Baltic states because there are no Russians there”.

 

[Theoneandonly]

The Russians have no interest in the Baltic states or Finland because the people aren’t Russian. They have an interest in eastern Ukraine because the people are Russian. Thatcher sent her armada to the south Atlantic to free a couple of thousand Brits from Argentine’s junta, but you say that Russia can’t be allowed to protect its own kin on its doorstep. This is total nonsense. As for NATO, Russia would choose to end the whole world (including itself) rather than be defeated by a gaggle of social and moral degenerates and born-again Nazis.

Falklands was to distract from domestic situation and about oil

 

[Jaffa_The_Hut]

The Russians have no interest in the Baltic states or Finland because the people aren’t Russian. They have an interest in eastern Ukraine because the people are Russian. Thatcher sent her armada to the south Atlantic to free a couple of thousand Brits from Argentine’s junta, but you say that Russia can’t be allowed to protect its own kin on its doorstep. This is total nonsense. As for NATO, Russia would choose to end the whole world (including itself) rather than be defeated by a gaggle of social and moral degenerates and born-again Nazis.

Just a thought.

Why couldn’t these people in Ukraine who want to be Russian just move over the border to Russia?

Wouldn't have been a war if they had done it.

 

[Beachcomber]

Just a thought.

Why couldn’t these people in Ukraine who want to be Russian just move over the border to Russia?

Wouldn't have been a war if they had done it.

The result of that if enacted would simply amount to ethnic cleansing. Similar suggestions are being made right now about the Palestinians in Gaza. Former German leader Merkel has stated that the EU/NATO bloc never had any intention of going ahead with Minsk 2. The Minsk accords would have peacefully settled the situation in Ukraine that began with the 2014 Maidan coup. Russia tried to push for these agreements to be actioned. Alas to no avail.

 

[Beachcomber]

There is a significant Russian minority in Latvia, of 24% of the population. Similarly for Estonia with 23% ethnic Russians.Lithuania has only 5% Russians. Compare those figures with 17% in Ukraine overall although mainly in the east of the country.

They immigrated into the Baltic soviets in the years after WW2 as part of the Soviet Union’s “denazification” efforts. They seem to be well-assimilated and dispersed though and are not fomenting rebellion. Being now part of the EU must be very helpful in that regard.

But whether Putin will try and wind them up is another question, so I would not be so sure as to say “the Russians have no interest in the Baltic states because there are no Russians there”.

Fair point, but as you say generally well-assimilated. Mr Belokon, for example, is an ethnic Russian, but apparently Latvian first. That said, so far at least, the Baltic Russians haven’t suffered eight years of deadly assault as the eastern Ukrainian people did prior to the current war.

 

[Matesrates]

There’s a significant number of English living in Spain, I think we should invade.

 

[Jaffa_The_Hut]

The result of that if enacted would simply amount to ethnic cleansing. Similar suggestions are being made right now about the Palestinians in Gaza. Former German leader Merkel has stated that the EU/NATO bloc never had any intention of going ahead with Minsk 2. The Minsk accords would have peacefully settled the situation in Ukraine that began with the 2014 Maidan coup. Russia tried to push for these agreements to be actioned. Alas to no avail.

Ethnic cleansing is when they are forced out like we saw in Bosnia and the Jews in Germany pre 1939 I’m talking about the repatriation of them with their homeland their country of choice that’s not ethnic cleansing.
What about the Ukrainians that lived in the Dombass and Crimea yes I know they were in a minority but don’t they count? They’ve been forced out haven’t they? That’s what’s called ethnic cleansing.

 

[Archibald Knox]

Fair point, but as you say generally well-assimilated. Mr Belokon, for example, is an ethnic Russian, but apparently Latvian first. That said, so far at least, the Baltic Russians haven’t suffered eight years of deadly assault as the eastern Ukrainian people did prior to the current war.

I feel your logic is back to front and flawed. It was the ethnic Russian rebels supported clandestinely by Russian Army units with missile batteries that assaulted Ukrainian villagers, not the other way around. The Donbas militia rebelled because they and Russia did not like Ukrainians removing the corrupt Russianophile President, Yanukovych, who refused to sign the EU-Ukraine Association Agreement.

By the end of the EuroMaidan protests in February 2014, Yanukovych fled from Ukraine and was removed by the parliament in what is termed the Revolution of Dignity, but Russia refused to recognise the interim pro-Western government, calling it a junta and denouncing the events as a coup d'état sponsored by the United States.

The Russians would never have invaded if the Ukraine had not given up the nuclear weapons stationed there and under their control in 1994 which was in return for security guarantees and those of territorial integrity from Russia. Instead, later in 2014, Russia invaded Crimea and fomented the militia in the “Donetsk People’s Republic” breaking all promises. The West has made big diplomatic mistakes but it is Putin who is the bad actor.

The Baltic states look at this history with fear as long as Putin remains in power.