Newholland
Well-known member
Going to be hell of task teaching cattle to climb all those steps…
New bypass
- Thread starter Slamdunk
- Start date
Newholland
Well-known member
I have lived in Hambleton all my life …. fcuked if I can see much benefit..
tangerine_neil
Well-known member
They might be able to get up, but they won‘t be coming down the other side.
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tangerine_neil
Well-known member
When you wait 3 decades for a bypass route, you hope and expect it will be better and add value.
It’s not the type of bypass to ease traffic flow through a village, for example, like the Broughton bypass or the many good examples around Preston. So why doesn’t it head towards the M55 junction at J3? The Romans were able to construct straight roads, yet we seem to struggle with the concept.
There seems to be a new road planning fascination with replacing perfectly functioning roundabouts with overly complicated traffic light junctions. Please stop it. That’s several already and all of them have made things worse.
It just does a loop back to Windy Harbour. They’ve basically changed a more direct route for a loop and added time onto the journey.
Why close a perfectly fine road, which was recently widened as part of a separate development at Windy Harbour. The top end of Garstang Rd also ceases to have a significant function, as indicated by very little traffic.
What they have built (in terms of its total length) would actually go half way to the motorway. Except it’s in the wrong direction.
Did they need to build a dual carriageway? Sure, that‘s a preference, but Yeadon Way and Amounderness Way operate perfectly well as single lanes with busy traffic flow. The issue is the introduction of unnecessary traffic lights.
Why close that section of the old Garstang New Road and force people onto the new bypass? Surely, two roads are better than one when it comes to easing congestion. Wasn’t that the whole point of this expensive waste of time & money.
Why hold a public consultation when they just ignore the feedback and concerns? Typical box-ticking exercise. No doubt they live elsewhere and won’t be affected by their poor decisions.
Then there’s the wasted money -
from running over schedule;
the ridiculously over-engineered gargantuan footbridge, when a pedestrian crossing would suffice;
the money spent changing a roundabout into a giant traffic light junction;
the extra junction added on Mains Lane, when the new bypass could have gone directly from the original River Wyre roundabout;
the underpass near Singleton;
resurfacing a road which is going to be closed;
using what appears to be the UK supply of tarmac to make the road pitch and curve like a test track.
It’s not the type of bypass to ease traffic flow through a village, for example, like the Broughton bypass or the many good examples around Preston. So why doesn’t it head towards the M55 junction at J3? The Romans were able to construct straight roads, yet we seem to struggle with the concept.
There seems to be a new road planning fascination with replacing perfectly functioning roundabouts with overly complicated traffic light junctions. Please stop it. That’s several already and all of them have made things worse.
It just does a loop back to Windy Harbour. They’ve basically changed a more direct route for a loop and added time onto the journey.
Why close a perfectly fine road, which was recently widened as part of a separate development at Windy Harbour. The top end of Garstang Rd also ceases to have a significant function, as indicated by very little traffic.
What they have built (in terms of its total length) would actually go half way to the motorway. Except it’s in the wrong direction.
Did they need to build a dual carriageway? Sure, that‘s a preference, but Yeadon Way and Amounderness Way operate perfectly well as single lanes with busy traffic flow. The issue is the introduction of unnecessary traffic lights.
Why close that section of the old Garstang New Road and force people onto the new bypass? Surely, two roads are better than one when it comes to easing congestion. Wasn’t that the whole point of this expensive waste of time & money.
Why hold a public consultation when they just ignore the feedback and concerns? Typical box-ticking exercise. No doubt they live elsewhere and won’t be affected by their poor decisions.
Then there’s the wasted money -
from running over schedule;
the ridiculously over-engineered gargantuan footbridge, when a pedestrian crossing would suffice;
the money spent changing a roundabout into a giant traffic light junction;
the extra junction added on Mains Lane, when the new bypass could have gone directly from the original River Wyre roundabout;
the underpass near Singleton;
resurfacing a road which is going to be closed;
using what appears to be the UK supply of tarmac to make the road pitch and curve like a test track.
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Raging_Bull
Well-known member
Neil, all these points should be put before the planners in an open public forum, because some idiot should be made accountable, because quite frankly what has gone on here is nothing short of scandalous and as somebody mentioned, the chimps at Blackpool Zoo could have come up with a more sensible solution to what has been a problem road for many years.
Tangerine10
Well-known member
I was thinking similar Benny's. There are so many examples of councillors making decision for personal gain. I knew someone who worked at WBC years ago and the corruption was off the scale. The whole project has been a complete shambles and seems to benefit nobody. There needs to be an inquiry into why it takes 3 years to change a roundabout and the bridge to nowhere is a monstrosity.Questions need to be asked as to why this road was ever commissioned. The millionaire houses on Mains Lane seem to be the only benifactors for this £170,000,000 road to nowhere. Apparently North West highway commission didn't want this road and it was the councils insisting on it, so I wonder how much influence the wealthy had on this build. And as for Kier who have built it it seems like they must have used the whole countries tarmac supply with the thickness they have laid it in places
Tangerine10
Well-known member
Does anyone the procedures necessary to start an inquiry?
Someone needs to answer for this to avoid stupid projects of this ilk being granted in the future.
Someone needs to answer for this to avoid stupid projects of this ilk being granted in the future.
Jaffa_The_Hut
Well-known member
We look out on the bypass from the rear of our house on moorfield park Poulton me and the Mrs spend ages looking out of the bedroom window at the traffic chaos it’s different every day.
Yesterday was an Ambulance with the blues and twos going but it couldn’t get past the cars in the queue just shocking to see this morning we watched an old red tractor puffing along the road doing about 10 mph the queues behind were horrendous about half a mile long.
You are guaranteed to see standing traffic in both directions at rush hour times midweek both mornings usually 8-9am and afternoons around 3:30-5:30pm so avoid at all costs at peak times.
Yesterday was an Ambulance with the blues and twos going but it couldn’t get past the cars in the queue just shocking to see this morning we watched an old red tractor puffing along the road doing about 10 mph the queues behind were horrendous about half a mile long.
You are guaranteed to see standing traffic in both directions at rush hour times midweek both mornings usually 8-9am and afternoons around 3:30-5:30pm so avoid at all costs at peak times.
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Killingmesoftly
Well-known member
Went through yesterday coming back from Lancaster and it was just bumper to bumper at about 4pm…traffic was okay and moving before and after new bit…what a fuk up…plus what is it actually bi-passing?.. I don’t get how a 2 lane road going back to a single carriageway can improve flow, and also traffic lights instead of roundabouts is surely slowing traffic…and why open it when it’s clearly nowhere near finished…?..
Tangerine10
Well-known member
Might be untrue, but someone told me the constructors were on some sort of pay incentive to open it up by Dec 18.
Sounds plausible but it clearly wasn't and still isn't finished.
Surly that means they didn't meet the condition.
Sounds plausible but it clearly wasn't and still isn't finished.
Surly that means they didn't meet the condition.
Jaffa_The_Hut
Well-known member
Just walked the dog down Garstand road and mobile speed camera just as your entering the 30 mph zone.
As if the misery of long queues ahead isn’t enough.
As if the misery of long queues ahead isn’t enough.
Jaffa_The_Hut
Well-known member
I heard Kier the constructors would have been penalised with a hefty fine had the road not opened before the new year.
Did you and the dog slow down to 30 Jaffa?Just walked the dog down Garstand road and mobile speed camera just as your entering the 30 mph zone.
As if the misery of long queues ahead isn’t enough.
Victorsponge
Well-known member
Those long winter nights must just fly bye in your house!We look out on the bypass from the rear of our house on moorfield park Poulton me and the Mrs spend ages looking out of the bedroom window at the traffic chaos it’s different every day.
Yesterday was an Ambulance with the blues and twos going but it couldn’t get past the cars in the queue just shocking to see this morning we watched an old red tractor puffing along the road doing about 10 mph the queues behind were horrendous about half a mile long.
You are guaranteed to see standing traffic in both directions at rush hour times midweek both mornings usually 8-9am and afternoons around 3:30-5:30pm so avoid at all costs at peak times.
tangerine.com
Well-known member
This could be an updated version on Alfred Hitchcock's 'Rear window'.We look out on the bypass from the rear of our house on moorfield park Poulton me and the Mrs spend ages looking out of the bedroom window at the traffic chaos it’s different every day.
Yesterday was an Ambulance with the blues and twos going but it couldn’t get past the cars in the queue just shocking to see this morning we watched an old red tractor puffing along the road doing about 10 mph the queues behind were horrendous about half a mile long.
You are guaranteed to see standing traffic in both directions at rush hour times midweek both mornings usually 8-9am and afternoons around 3:30-5:30pm so avoid at all costs at peak times.
MartonBornandBred
Well-known member
In the eyes of the law, driving too slowly or braking without good cause is an offence under the scope of inconsiderate and careless driving.Just walked the dog down Garstand road and mobile speed camera just as your entering the 30 mph zone.
As if the misery of long queues ahead isn’t enough.
So has the mobile speed camera been brought out to come down heavy on slow drivers?
Tangerine Tractor
Well-known member
I no longer live that end of the coast but used to commute from Thornton to the M55 daily so know the issues.
What I would say is to wait for it all to be completed and tweaked before passing judgement. Nobody could see the sense in the remodelling of the lights at windy harbour a few years ago, but when complete and before all the new bypass work, it was much smoother. Likewise Norcross Roundabout. It was widely criticised after remodelling, but there are hardly any queues on it now.
I’ve been talking to traffic planners a lot recently in different issues, and one thing I have learned is that their modelling is very sophisticated. Traffic lights are far more intelligent and advanced than before, and introducing them will invariably improve traffic flows, either on a roundabout like at Norcross or by replacing a roundabout like at skippool.
It really isn’t drawn out in the back of a fad packet. There is a huge amount of work and planning gone into it, and the technology used to work out the solutions is quite impressive. Everything is thought about, and everything is done for a reason. Once the road is properly finished and all the temporary stuff removed, give it a few months to bed in and it will make a big difference. The lights will learn from usage and get more efficient by themselves. It will eliminate the daily queues up mains lane to singleton cross roads in the morning, and the other way from windy harbour in the evening. From what I’ve seen at skippool, even temporary lights were causing less quieting than the old roundabout did at peak periods.
What I would say is to wait for it all to be completed and tweaked before passing judgement. Nobody could see the sense in the remodelling of the lights at windy harbour a few years ago, but when complete and before all the new bypass work, it was much smoother. Likewise Norcross Roundabout. It was widely criticised after remodelling, but there are hardly any queues on it now.
I’ve been talking to traffic planners a lot recently in different issues, and one thing I have learned is that their modelling is very sophisticated. Traffic lights are far more intelligent and advanced than before, and introducing them will invariably improve traffic flows, either on a roundabout like at Norcross or by replacing a roundabout like at skippool.
It really isn’t drawn out in the back of a fad packet. There is a huge amount of work and planning gone into it, and the technology used to work out the solutions is quite impressive. Everything is thought about, and everything is done for a reason. Once the road is properly finished and all the temporary stuff removed, give it a few months to bed in and it will make a big difference. The lights will learn from usage and get more efficient by themselves. It will eliminate the daily queues up mains lane to singleton cross roads in the morning, and the other way from windy harbour in the evening. From what I’ve seen at skippool, even temporary lights were causing less quieting than the old roundabout did at peak periods.
GoWest
Well-known member
Ahhhh....thanks, it's for the cattle is it? I was being very judgemental and thought it was simply for the weaker legged pedestrians in society so they didn't have such a steep climb up the steps. Makes sense now.
Couldn't they have used a cow cable car arrangement instead and turned it into another tourist attraction, not dissimilar to The Tower in the 19th century?
I await the interesting replies...
Parky1953
Well-known member
Speed limits and standards of driving do not change for anyone in the case of emergencies JJ!I had a similar experience, only some idiot Sunday driver in an electric car was blocking me getting to an emergency...
Drive safely and arrive alive my friend.
southshore
Well-known member
...and the 'bridge to nowhere isn't even open yet. It been finished for nigh on 6 months and is a public footpath.
JJpool
Well-known member
No, but when you get the news your goldfish isn't well, you don't tend to be thinking straight.Speed limits and standards of driving do not change for anyone in the case of emergencies JJ!
Drive safely and arrive alive my friend.
Parky1953
Well-known member
Holy shite! Sorry man. I didn’t realise. How is he?
Holy shite! Sorry man. I didn’t realise. How is he?
Holy shite! Sorry man. I didn’t realise. How is he?
JJpool
Well-known member
That's the thing, I forgot, I don't have one.Holy shite! Sorry man. I didn’t realise. How is he?
Holy shite! Sorry man. I didn’t realise. How is he?
Holy shite! Sorry man. I didn’t realise. How is he?
Parky1953
Well-known member
That doesn’t matter one jot! It happens.
Preston doesn’t have a Cathedral but reckons it’s a City!
Archibald Knox
Well-known member
One thing I am uncertain of… is Mains Lane from Windy Harbour/Glasform traffic lights up to the Shell Garage going to re-open fully?
If not, then how does one get to the Shard Bridge when coming from the M55? The new bypass takes one a long way past the Shard Bridge and one would have to double back rather awkwardly.
Perhaps I have misunderstood?
If not, then how does one get to the Shard Bridge when coming from the M55? The new bypass takes one a long way past the Shard Bridge and one would have to double back rather awkwardly.
Perhaps I have misunderstood?
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seasiderjohn
Well-known member
Through singleton
TwelveAngryMen
Well-known member
Singleton is the new bypass to the bypass
Fargo99
Well-known member
Yep came through Singleton tonight on the way back from Kirkham. Cuts a big corner.
Bennys_was_a_mob
Well-known member
You didn't happen to live down Mains Lane did you
As for the lights, they change the priorities to suit. They're doing it now with the temps across Garstang Road, creating terrible queuing traffic both ways and this will end once they open the road fully, then miraculously the traffic will flow better and everyone will forget how utterly shite it has been for 3 years.
They've now changed the priorities at Windy Harbour and no queues suprise suprise.
So why didn't they just sort the traffic light priorities properly at Skippool and the end of Mains Lane instead of spending +£170 million on a useless by pass, which will take a duel carriageway down to single lane 3 miles before the motorway junction?
A public enquiry needs to happen regarding this waste of money, the North West Highways did not want this road they rightly thought it was a waste of money, councils and wealthy councillors pursued the building of this road, with the main benifactors being the millionaires on Mains Lane.
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Newholland
Well-known member
It’s my understanding that work is due to commence shortly on mains lane east of the shard lane junction to de trunk this section to give increased priority to pedestrians/cyclists and horse riders thus dissuading traffic.
Again, my understanding, ALL Over Wyre traffic will use the Skippool junction, irrespective of destination..
tangerine_neil
Well-known member
The road will be closed off halfway down the already barricaded off part of Garstang New Rd, past the Shell petrol station.It’s my understanding that work is due to commence shortly on mains lane east of the shard lane junction to de trunk this section to give increased priority to pedestrians/cyclists and horse riders thus dissuading traffic.
Again, my understanding, ALL Over Wyre traffic will use the Skippool junction, irrespective of destination..
tangerine_neil
Well-known member
todayistheday
Well-known member
Think I heard once Owen O had a bit of that land up at Singleton, lools like he got lucky again.
Newholland
Well-known member
Farm traffic access only?
tangysider
Well-known member
Is it not actually longer in mileage than mains Lane to windy harbour?Got caught this morning cutting through Singleton to turn left at Shell Garage took 20 minutes from Singleton Lodge to get through… get onto Garstang Road and there’s no cars on there
Then hit the lights halfway down… it’s made a 7-8 minute journey, 25 minutes.
Tonight gave up and turned round.
Brilliant.
Certainly felt it
tangerine_neil
Well-known member
Sorry. I don’t agree with that at all.
The re-modelling of the earlier A585 Windy Harbour to Skippool improvements was much more than just lights. It was significantly widened, with additional lanes added towards the M55 junction. There was already a set of lights there. This work did add benefits. A more significant issue was the queues westbound, which clearly needed an additional lane in that direction, but alas, never happened.
Norcross roundabout never had any major issues. Some accidents caused by speeding idiots. That’s about it.
Now there are daily accidents and a nice collection of wing mirrors and broken glass on the traffic islands. It’s too complicated, most people aren’t sure what lane to be in. The road markings are too late and often blocked with traffic. It’s dangerous to be sitting in a queue on a roundabout, waiting for the lights to change and cars cutting in behind you. The traffic queues are also worse than before. To claim otherwise, no matter how sophisticated they are meant to be, simply isn’t a reflection of reality. To use a fund designated to easing congestion to actually make it worse, is unforgivable.
Regarding planners and remodelling, it’s clear that primary consideration is not given to traffic flow. It’s often down the list of priorities, after pedestrian, cyclist, and in Skippool’s case, equestrian concerns. I’m all for helping pedestrians and cyclists, but any crossings should be away from the junction - at a safe distance for the traffic to be able to stop in time. There‘s absolutely no reason why these junctions should try to integrate everything, and end up a complicated and expensive mess. What’s wrong with a pedestrian crossing, away from the junction?
There‘s no examples, locally at least, where traffic lights replacing a perfectly good roundabout have improved queues and traffic flow. The only time traffic moves well now near Bispham Rd / `St Walburgas Rd is when the lights aren’t working! The traffic lights on the M55 J3 roundabout which have to be turned off because traffic starts backing up onto the motorway!
The new temporary lights at Skippool are a real issue. Queues have increased in all directions. What used to be 5-10 minutes getting out of Poulton is now 30 minutes plus, and all other routes are busier as people try to avoid the chaos. Smarter lights is not going to fix this.
From what I’ve seen, traffic flow hasn’t been prioritised (and it really should be).
There is no justification in the world for closing perfectly good roads. I assume they are trying to force everyone onto the new bypass.
There‘s no alternative easy routes for emergency vehicles, accidents, breakdowns, etc.
The whole area is now gridlocked at peak times, down to rank bad planning and poor decisions.
The things that needed doing (e.g., a bypass directly to the motorway junction 3, a dual carriageway towards Norcross, an extra lane westbound on Garstang Rd, were never done.
All is not lost though, in the unlikely event they change the junctions back to roundabouts and they could potentially in the future add another road from Garstang Rd that actually does go to the motorway. But it’s unlikely, given the cash wasted on this futile exercise.
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tangerine_neil
Well-known member
Yes. Access to the fields. Useful
tangerine_neil
Well-known member
Yes. It‘s a big curve, where Mains Lane is more direct.
GJJW
Well-known member
Absolute joke this morning with queues back to Norcross roundabout at 6.10am.
Details on how to complain and who to can be found at the link below:
www.catsmith.co.uk
Details on how to complain and who to can be found at the link below:
Immediate Action on Windy Harbour Chaos - Cat Smith - Cat Smith
I’ve been frustrated by the devastating delays across the Shard Bridge for Hambleton and Knott-End residents, and others Over Wyre who are now facing incredible waits following the part-opening of the new A585 Windy Harbour junction. I’ve been caught up in this myself many times over the past...
www.catsmith.co.uk
GJJW
Well-known member
For any constituent queries, please direct them to the project inbox: A585windyharbourtoskippool@nationalhighways.co.uk and our dedicated scheme webpage for the latest information: www.nationalhighways.co.uk/our-roads/north-west/a585-windy-harbour-to-skippool.
Jaffa_The_Hut
Well-known member
All depends what time and what direction you are heading.
I drove to Nobberland at 07:45 this morning going from Poulton/Garstang road along the new bypass down to windy harbour traffic was absolutely fine going that way hardly any traffic and through the lights at windy harbour without stopping however the queues coming the other way were just horrendous traffic was queued from the Garstang road junction beyond windy harbour traffic lights well over a mile the outward journey took me 30 minutes Poulton to Preston.
I made the return journey at 11:45am and did it in exactly 20 minutes with no issues at all traffic was clear both directions.
I noticed by about 4:30/5:00pm as I live overlooking the bypass the traffic was queued solid in both directions.
I drove to Nobberland at 07:45 this morning going from Poulton/Garstang road along the new bypass down to windy harbour traffic was absolutely fine going that way hardly any traffic and through the lights at windy harbour without stopping however the queues coming the other way were just horrendous traffic was queued from the Garstang road junction beyond windy harbour traffic lights well over a mile the outward journey took me 30 minutes Poulton to Preston.
I made the return journey at 11:45am and did it in exactly 20 minutes with no issues at all traffic was clear both directions.
I noticed by about 4:30/5:00pm as I live overlooking the bypass the traffic was queued solid in both directions.
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