Squad was never good enough

Lytham_fy8 said:
It's pretty much what we did at Newcastle away in 2010 from memory, although it wasn't a must win it was very much a need a win. 4-1 wasn't it?

No idea about Dobbie, no one has.
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The Newcastle game was a blip rather than the norm. You can’t possibly compare the intent of that team and the question posed. We were passing it along the back and to Grimmy at 3-1 down today… it’s programmed in, day in day out from Captain Gillette and the IPad twins.
 
Hockaday’s Quiff said:
The Newcastle game was a blip rather than the norm. You can’t possibly compare the intent of that team and the question posed. We were passing it along the back and to Grimmy at 3-1 down today… it’s programmed in, day in day out from Captain Gillette and the IPad twins.
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Kurt asked, I gave him an example, we were shit that day and most of the support was just happy to be there.
 
I think this Shiggy character is on a wind up and a run chase. It’s obvious we’ve underachieved with Critchley at the helm. We should easily have made the top 6 with this squad of players.
 
Hertsseasider said:
Pretty much today's team though I'd have played Lavery ( if fit) with Joseph. My point is that we never played the same team on a consistent basis. The players list confidence through not playing together regularly
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We didn’t because we were not consistent either individually or as a team. You are not scoring enough with those 2 upfront. Hamilton will still look bewildered and frustrate, midfield will still not have the physicality or running ability to dominate and after today Hubby will still ball watch instead of being aware. Pick any formation you want but you will see the need to change the team because we would take one step forward and 2 steps back. I do question any teams mental strength and effort when they are good at home but awful away.
 
There’s been some games this season that have been a stroll with us being such a better team, but the inconsistency away against the lower teams cost us dearly
 
I think the squad has many deficiencies, however could’ve made the playoffs at a canter if they didn’t blow it against bad teams - they’re a top 6 squad in what’s a poor L1 season, I guess we’ve ended up roughly round that point.

Personally I think all parties have a lot to answer for, just a shitshow.
 
Halifax71 said:
His away tactics have been shite 90% of he time. Evidence - 48 points at home, 25 points away.
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The majority of away performances have been absolutely awful, sometimes a team has one or two players underperforming but in some games we’ve had 6/7 sometimes 8 and that’s down to the system adopted by Critchley!
 
The job of any head coach is to get every last bit out of the squad at their disposal. Critchley managed that the first time round. Has he managed it this season? It’s pretty obvious the answer is no.
 
Today’s game summed up the entire effort this season. We had moments of real football let down by moments of lack of concentration. We should never have been relying on the last day. Poor results against poor teams (Cheltenham away anyone?) cost us.

Ultimately I think the squad was ok; but the tactics did not suit them for a lot of the time. For that look to the coaching staff.

Dogma / hubris - take your pick.

For that look to the management of the club.

End result - L1. This manager is going nowhere (see point above about Dogma/ Hubris).

Ok - L1 again. How will it be different next season Mr Sadler??
 
I think if you beat the Champions 4-0 away, drill 3rd place 4-1 at home, beat 4th 2-1 away, do the double over 5th placed and be unbeaten against 6th place you can safely say you’re good enough to get in the top 6.

The problem has been that against good teams who come at us we’re fine but against physical, defend deep, close the space teams away from home we’ve been horrific and the worst bit is we’ve never tried to adopt a new tactic or system to counteract it.

That’s piss poor when you think about it.
 
Shiggy said:
Where is the evidence it was any better than 8th, where it sat all pretty much all season? You can’t just pick out individual performances. Every team picked up good results. You’ve got to have the quality and character to sustain it for long periods. The squad didn’t do that.

It can’t just all be on the manager. they had 46 games to prove they were as good as a lot of our fans seem to think they were. They didnt do that
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1 win away from the play offs ffs. Don't get me wrong I completely understand your overreaction. Quite frankly it's bad enough on this forum after every negative result and bound to be worse on the last day.

For what it's worth I think it's been a disappointment not hitting top 6. However we really needed to stabilize after last season and we have. I'm looking forward to a 24/25 promotion season (apologies for the positivity).
 
Burnnazzer said:
In Critchley’s promotion season he ended up playing 4 4 2 or 4 4 1 1 , mainly because he knew his 2 central midfielders had legs and ability to dominate. I would like to know his reason for never playing that formation, ever, this season. He either thought we didn’t have the players or he was not pragmatic enough to change. If it works you don’t change but away from home we were that bad it was crying out for innovation. His biggest failing in my eyes was that he never addressed our away form, where we always looked negative. First 2 seasons we played a high pressure game , winning the ball back quickly, why did that go out of the window. He needs to tell the fans why he did what he did, then we might understand.
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Agree.
 
Adams Kebab said:
I think if you beat the Champions 4-0 away, drill 3rd place 4-1 at home, beat 4th 2-1 away, do the double over 5th placed and be unbeaten against 6th place you can safely say you’re good enough to get in the top 6.

The problem has been that against good teams who come at us we’re fine but against physical, defend deep, close the space teams away from home we’ve been horrific and the worst bit is we’ve never tried to adopt a new tactic or system to counteract it.

That’s piss poor when you think about it.
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Yep. This is the single biggest element that we should consider in all this. We've lost the same type of game to the same type of side all season and it's never changed. Yesterday encapsulated the season perfectly. Started with promise and then fizzled out to nothing as we huffed and puffed but never looked like getting anything useful going because they closed us down, won all the bits and pieces and were able to break effectively with pace and purpose.
 
3-5-2 has been a shambles especially away from home:
- Ends up a back 5 with no width in attacking positions.
- 3 defenders all over the place and not playing in unity.
- Wing backs not stopping crosses
- Not dealing with crosses into the box
- Players out of position

I have never seen a more pathetic team away from home in all my life. That is on Critchley.

He has drained the club knowing what is the point of winning at home when Critchley's tactics turn us into San Marino away from home.

Over complicated bollocks is the phrase I have been using all season and for me in the end it sums up Critchley this season.

Critchley won promotion on a simple formation. Why has he tried to reinvent the wheel and look so incompetent whilst doing so.
 
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Whenever we get the ball we go wide. There is nothing through the middle. We are so reliant on wing backs crossing the ball that by the time they have progressed to the final third, the opposition are all set. We create very few chances, particularly away from home, hence the low number of goals scored.
 
straightatthewall said:
Yep. This is the single biggest element that we should consider in all this. We've lost the same type of game to the same type of side all season and it's never changed. Yesterday encapsulated the season perfectly. Started with promise and then fizzled out to nothing as we huffed and puffed but never looked like getting anything useful going because they closed us down, won all the bits and pieces and were able to break effectively with pace and purpose.
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I’ve put it on another thread but we’ve played 46 league games and come from behind twice to win a game (Posh away, Bolton home) and twice to draw (Oxford away, Cods away). 4 games out of 46, we’ve been able to come back!

To me that shows a complete lack of bollocks on the pitch but crucially in the dugout with a clear inability to change a game by switching systems or players to get a positive result.

Every sub is like for like or in recent weeks done to have what we hold and nullify. Norburn on last week for a striker which meant we sat back and Virtue in games before. No switch of formations, no throw the kitchen sink at them whilst losing, just a stick to the rigid process and it’ll eventually work. People big up Calderwood like he’s Carlo Ancelotti but having seen what I’ve seen this season there’s no way NC would have gone 4-4-2 in the promotion season without him and he’d have eventually been tinned.

We’ve lost 12 away games, out the bottom 8 with 24 points to play for we’ve got 7 points in away games. That is clearly a problem, but our head coach has done fuck all to change it. So wet it’s unbelievable.
 
Adams Kebab said:
I’ve put it on another thread but we’ve played 46 league games and come from behind twice to win a game (Posh away, Bolton home) and twice to draw (Oxford away, Cods away). 4 games out of 46, we’ve been able to come back!

To me that shows a complete lack of bollocks on the pitch but crucially in the dugout with a clear inability to change a game by switching systems or players to get a positive result.

Every sub is like for like or in recent weeks done to have what we hold and nullify. Norburn on last week for a striker which meant we sat back and Virtue in games before. No switch of formations, no throw the kitchen sink at them whilst losing, just a stick to the rigid process and it’ll eventually work. People big up Calderwood like he’s Carlo Ancelotti but having seen what I’ve seen this season there’s no way NC would have gone 4-4-2 in the promotion season without him and he’d have eventually been tinned.

We’ve lost 12 away games, out the bottom 8 with 24 points to play for we’ve got 7 points in away games. That is clearly a problem, but our head coach has done fuck all to change it. So wet it’s unbelievable.
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The critical element going forward is whether there is a football person at the club that can enforce change. I don't think anyone really expects NC to get binned, so the only other option is for someone above him recognising that this way has not been the right way.
 
straightatthewall said:
Yep. This is the single biggest element that we should consider in all this. We've lost the same type of game to the same type of side all season and it's never changed. Yesterday encapsulated the season perfectly. Started with promise and then fizzled out to nothing as we huffed and puffed but never looked like getting anything useful going because they closed us down, won all the bits and pieces and were able to break effectively with pace and purpose.
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The fizzling out bit is also indicative of the squad not being good enough. We always had enough cover for the defence but almost everyone before the game yesterday looked at that bench and though “I hope we are not chasing goals at the end of the game”?

There’s some really good comments on both sides in this thread. When it clicked and Rhodes finished his chances we battered teams. When Rhodes got injured we rarely looked capable of finishing chances. So then we were hoping for a moment of Kaddy magic to save us.

We didn’t have either the players or the managers tricks to beat the big low block teams (unless Rhodes took his chance) our wide play was pretty poor all season (squad again / formation).

It just feels like time to say goodbye to the players and start afresh.
 
straightatthewall said:
The critical element going forward is whether there is a football person at the club that can enforce change. I don't think anyone really expects NC to get binned, so the only other option is for someone above him recognising that this way has not been the right way.
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It’s clear to me what Simon Sadler knows about football isn’t a great deal, almost Alan Partridge esque “Did you see the match? Which one? I dunno?”…

He’s relied on highly paid CEO’s, Head’s of Recruitment and Head Coaches which is fine if they are good at what they do. I don’t see any joined up thinking in recruitment. Our best two players this season have been Dembele and Rhodes but I don’t see them being brought in to suit NC’s system with the latter from the Sheff Wednesday link especially when you think we also got Byers from that same link. Recruitment is key. We 100% needed another striker in January but for whatever reason didn’t get one. Whether that was loyalty to what we had or budget I don’t know but even if we created chances we’ve ended the last 13 games with Jake Beesley as our main central striker. He’s scored 3 goals & started every game. There’s no chance in hella team is going to win promotion with him as your main striker but so many would rather slate Kyle Joseph. He’s no doubt been a disappointment but he’s not had the amount of starts Beesley has. I can only think it’s been cos he can win the odd header after we’ve made 19 passes and pumped a diagonal or long ball.

We need 6-7 players go in the starting 11 this summer and the squad needs padding for the bench. I don’t think NC has got it in his locker to do it. I don’t see it on what we’ve seen and what he’s been unable to change and enhance. Apter has to get a chance but I don’t think he’ll be a NC player fitting into the robust shape and structure. If you ever want a prime example of NC it’s him putting Emmerson the bench and then saying “it wasn’t fair to put him on at 3-1 down”. Wasn’t fair?! Without sounding like Roy Keane he’s a fuckin footballer, it’s not the Boy Scouts or the Sunday school club at church. Whack him on. It was 15 mins! It’s fairer than making him travel there and not fuckin playing him. What a wet wipe. We needed goals but we didn’t not to want to be fair on a professional footballer. Pathetic.

Mike Tyson famously once said “everyone has a plan till you get punched in the face”… if we don’t get punched we’re fine but when we do, we’re fucked and usually throw the towel in… “Coming on for Blackpool it’s number 17 Matty Virtue”…
 
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Chunkylad said:
The fizzling out bit is also indicative of the squad not being good enough. We always had enough cover for the defence but almost everyone before the game yesterday looked at that bench and though “I hope we are not chasing goals at the end of the game”?

There’s some really good comments on both sides in this thread. When it clicked and Rhodes finished his chances we battered teams. When Rhodes got injured we rarely looked capable of finishing chances. So then we were hoping for a moment of Kaddy magic to save us.

We didn’t have either the players or the managers tricks to beat the big low block teams (unless Rhodes took his chance) our wide play was pretty poor all season (squad again / formation).

It just feels like time to say goodbye to the players and start afresh.
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I think one of the obvious points around our ability to create and score is whether you believe the players are utilised in a way that gets the most from them. I don't think that's been the case with any of the strikers/forwards. Rhodes 'worked' because he's a class act who can finish all sorts of half chances.

Lavery needs games and balls behind or across the box. Joseph looks like he's better in a 3 and Beesley probably works better with service in.

For all 3, the system stifles them through lack of service from wide or lack of capability to play a certain way. It has generally stopped Carey from being an effective attacking threat too.

And for the record, I realise that you can genuinely question the ability of all those players anyway.
 
straightatthewall said:
I think one of the obvious points around our ability to create and score is whether you believe the players are utilised in a way that gets the most from them. I don't think that's been the case with any of the strikers/forwards. Rhodes 'worked' because he's a class act who can finish all sorts of half chances.

Lavery needs games and balls behind or across the box. Joseph looks like he's better in a 3 and Beesley probably works better with service in.

For all 3, the system stifles them through lack of service from wide or lack of capability to play a certain way. It has generally stopped Carey from being an effective attacking threat too.

And for the record, I realise that you can genuinely question the ability of all those players anyway.
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The formation definitely hasn’t suited our forwards. In a way that Yates looked twice the player when he had Simms or Madine alongside him as opposed to playing as the lone CF. As you say, Rhodes is class and looked it but his recent injury record told us we couldn’t expect a full 46 games out of him.
 
Critchley must shoulder a massive part of the failure to make the play offs but I keep reading that the squad was more than good enough, but we're they? These are some of our squad already rubbished on here.

Connolly
Virtue
Norburn
Husband
Beesley
Lavery
Kouassi
CJ
Joseph
Marv
Oakley-Boothe
Carey
Weir

Now, it's not that I don't agree, some improved as the season went on, some didn't. But by my reckoning that's almost half the squad, we can't have it both ways, they're either good enough or shite.
Critchley is ultimately responsible but our current crop of players are necessarily all that.
 
We haven't had good enough options up front. Rhodes last goal was December. We'd have been fine with a striker or two providing goals since Xmas. If your strikers aren't finishing you will come unstuck against all types of opposition.

We focused on extending Rhodes' loan and then immediately lost him to injury. And had no effective back up, with Lavery and Joseph seriously under performing. This isn't really Sadler's fault, and it's not entirely down to NC either.

Joseph will need to do a lot more next season to justify the investment. Lavs looks a spent force in need of new pastures. Critch needs to find better strikers, somehow. But his job is to coach, he doesn't have time to scout outside of the opposition teams he sees during the course of the season.

I think Bees, KJ and Kouassi will all be here next season. Lavs prob not? We actually need two or three new strikers I think. Plus new wide players, a new Byers and a new Marv.
 
BFCJonny said:
I think this Shiggy character is on a wind up and a run chase. It’s obvious we’ve underachieved with Critchley at the helm. We should easily have made the top 6 with this squad of players.
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Yes we’ve underachieved.

No we shouldn’t have “easily” made the top 6 with this group of players.

People keep saying that without providing any explanation for their reasoning.
 
Adams Kebab said:
I think if you beat the Champions 4-0 away, drill 3rd place 4-1 at home, beat 4th 2-1 away, do the double over 5th placed and be unbeaten against 6th place you can safely say you’re good enough to get in the top 6.

The problem has been that against good teams who come at us we’re fine but against physical, defend deep, close the space teams away from home we’ve been horrific and the worst bit is we’ve never tried to adopt a new tactic or system to counteract it.

That’s piss poor when you think about it.
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Can I not easily respond to that by saying that if you lose to teams in the bottom 8 without scoring or creating many chances you can safely say you're not good enough to get in the top 6?

I agree partially with some of your other posts about tactics and I see the reasoning for why he could've/should've adopted a new system against the more defensive teams.

But ultimately I think our failures are equally down to players AND manager this season, which is where many appear to disagree with me. Yes you can argue that if the manager played a different system we might have scored more goals and picked up more points, but you can also argue that might have happened if we weren't relying on Joseph/Lavery/Kouassi for goals.

I just don't understand why it's widely accepted that it's all the manager's fault but is controversial to say that a lot of the players in this squad simply weren't good enough over the 46 games to earn a play off place.
 
straightatthewall said:
I think one of the obvious points around our ability to create and score is whether you believe the players are utilised in a way that gets the most from them. I don't think that's been the case with any of the strikers/forwards. Rhodes 'worked' because he's a class act who can finish all sorts of half chances.

Lavery needs games and balls behind or across the box. Joseph looks like he's better in a 3 and Beesley probably works better with service in.

For all 3, the system stifles them through lack of service from wide or lack of capability to play a certain way. It has generally stopped Carey from being an effective attacking threat too.

And for the record, I realise that you can genuinely question the ability of all those players anyway.
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I agree with some of your points but not the one about service from wide. I think a lot of our goals came from wide areas this season.
 
Shiggy said:
Where is the evidence it was any better than 8th, where it sat all pretty much all season? You can’t just pick out individual performances. Every team picked up good results. You’ve got to have the quality and character to sustain it for long periods. The squad didn’t do that.

It can’t just all be on the manager. they had 46 games to prove they were as good as a lot of our fans seem to think they were. They didnt do that
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The players should not have listened to the manager I agree but when he drops form players without any explanation they must of felt like they were pissing into the wind
 
Shiggy said:
Can I not easily respond to that by saying that if you lose to teams in the bottom 8 without scoring or creating many chances you can safely say you're not good enough to get in the top 6?

I agree partially with some of your other posts about tactics and I see the reasoning for why he could've/should've adopted a new system against the more defensive teams.

But ultimately I think our failures are equally down to players AND manager this season, which is where many appear to disagree with me. Yes you can argue that if the manager played a different system we might have scored more goals and picked up more points, but you can also argue that might have happened if we weren't relying on Joseph/Lavery/Kouassi for goals.

I just don't understand why it's widely accepted that it's all the manager's fault but is controversial to say that a lot of the players in this squad simply weren't good enough over the 46 games to earn a play off place.
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It’s definitely not all the managers fault but in any industry the buck stops with the gaffer.

If the same people are doing the same things wrong it’s up to the man in charge to sort it, he lessened the chance of us making a final at Wembley (don’t think any head coach does that) by playing fringe players who’d played earlier rounds and we’ve lost so many away games in the same fashion and he’s not been able to change it. That’s on the players too but he’s in charge of the players. Do I think we’ve helped Marv or Gabriel this season by asking them to play in a way they aren’t comfortable? Nope. CJ Hamilton isn’t a wing-back. We all know it, but one man thinks he knows best.

As a team any chance we’ve had an opportunity to get in the top 6 we’ve bottled it, shown weakness and lacked intensity & desire to win. It’s down to both of them I do agree but I’ve no faith now in our head coach and his assistants being able to change this next season having seen what I’ve seen this season, because I don’t think he’s strong enough or has the bollocks to do it.

Hope I’m wrong but that’s my thoughts.
 
The squad's ok - nothing great, and there are some very weak players in there.
Our passing has been woeful, never anybody showing for the ball, panicky defending, and mostly toothless in attack when Rhodes wasn't playing.
Makes you wonder what they worked on in training.
Coaching, set-up, team selection, and tactics have been poor - and that's down to NC.
I think most on here are saying the same thing.
 
Vince McLean said:
The squad's ok - nothing great, and there are some very weak players in there.
Our passing has been woeful, never anybody showing for the ball, panicky defending, and mostly toothless in attack when Rhodes wasn't playing.
Makes you wonder what they worked on in training.
Coaching, set-up, team selection, and tactics have been poor - and that's down to NC.
I think most on here are saying the same thing.
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Not what I’m reading.

Lots seem to think this squad was capable of automatic promotion or “easily” top 6, without really explaining how they’ve come to that conclusion.
 
Lytham_fy8 said:
I bet you all a tenner that had it been Dobbie managing this squad to three points off the play offs people would be a lot harsher on the players and demanding that Sadler back the manager next season.

There's literally fuck all evidence that the squad was anything special.
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I don’t think the squad is anything special but it was good enough for top six in a really poor league.
The evidence is that our home form was comfortably top six with the players we have. We should have been able to replicate that away from home and we didn’t.
I’m also confident if Dobbie had been in charge we would have at least given it a go away from home.
 
Superbretty said:
I don’t think the squad is anything special but it was good enough for top six in a really poor league.
The evidence is that our home form was comfortably top six with the players we have. We should have been able to replicate that away from home and we didn’t.
I’m also confident if Dobbie had been in charge we would have at least given it a go away from home.
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But like Shiggy says above, there's not really much evidence that we had a top six squad?
 
Lytham_fy8 said:
But like Shiggy says above, there's not really much evidence that we had a top six squad?
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So if we had top six home form, which we did, are you suggesting that Critchley overachieved in the home games and the away games were simply our natural level?
 
seasidelytham said:
Well I agree with you 100%…unlike many with their tangerine tinted glasses. Yes on occasions we have been good enough…but the season is played over 46 games and as you say this squad is not good enough, never has been to bring any consistency in performances. It’s all well and good raising your game for the so called bigger teams, but as we know you have to deliver week in and week out. Good teams do that and we cannot class ourselves as a good team.
Depending upon what Sadler wants for the club ( one can only assume that as a fan, he wants to see attractive football challenging for promotion ) then he has a big summer ahead. He, together with the recruitment team and Manager ( Critchley won’t be sacked yet) need to orchestrate a massive overhaul of the playing staff.
Its easy to forget the state the club was in when he took over, and all the stuff off the field that he inherited has cost millions which otherwise could have been directed to improving the playing side of things. From his perspective, until the east stand is developed and the training ground built, I believe if we can stay in Div 1 ( comfortably) with the occasional foray into the play offs, he will be delighted.
Just my thoughts but constant changing the manager rarely achieves the desired outcome. Stability is crucial for a club like Blackpool.
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Oxford replaced Manning and despite a sticky start Buckingham got them into the play-offs. Barnsley had three managers, the interim boss Devaney for the final game, they scraped into the play-offs. Stability is important and I was ok with Critchley coming back but his utter refusal to play any other system particularly away from home has been a major factor in not getting in the play-offs. Also his two sidekicks don't appear to bring anything to the table. Too many players seem to have been marginalized before we even kicked a ball Andy Lyons being a prime example. Critchley may be a good coach, although that is now open to question but he is definitely not a manager and not a man-manager.
 
straightatthewall said:
The critical element going forward is whether there is a football person at the club that can enforce change. I don't think anyone really expects NC to get binned, so the only other option is for someone above him recognising that this way has not been the right way.
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A Gary Bowyer type who is steeped in this type of environment. Like Calderwood he would cut through all of the Liverpool Academy bullshit and dish out the advice to both Critchley and more importantly Sadler.
 
If the squad was good enough we'd be worried about losing our out of contract players and other clubs coming in for our better ones but I don't think that's the case with this lot,but I agree Critchley should have at least got us to the Play-offs he's made some really strange decisions on team selection at times
 
Squad was never good enough and yet anyone remember the Tranmere fans comment who said ‘Blackpool must have an exceptional squad to loan out Rob Apter!’
 
In my opinion, this squad was easily strong enough for the play offs at least.
Constantly changing line ups, never giving players a run at games loses confidence.
Defeats at Cambridge, Burton, Cheltenham, port ** Vale, that what hurt us.
Joseph was a star at Swansea, Lavs over in Ireland, they don't become bad overnight, it's on the manager, the mind set for games.
Piss poor manager.
 
The league wasn't the best.
We had a great home record
Away record was abysmal and tried nothing different to change it.

In summary our home record should have been more than enough for playoffs at least, with a half decent away record.
The squad was good enough in a bang average league.
 
Shiggy said:
Manager will get a lot of the stick and rightly so. Ultimately this season was a failure and the bulk of the responsibility lies with him. I backed him all season but he never really proved me right.

However, that squad is really poor. Best players were loans and 2 of them came in January. Rhodes being out for half the season was a bad stroke of luck but we shouldn’t have been so reliant on him for goals.

Yes we had a real star in Dembele but every squad in this division had their standouts. We were far too reliant on ours due to the lack of attacking quality around him.

The majority of the squad have been given chance after chance and ultimately failed to deliver. Big changes needed in summer.
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Agree with that and an additional point that supporters overestimated the quality of the squad, many of whom were involved in the previous seasons shit show and many poor results. We got stabilisation and consolidation from NC this season. We now need good quality investment in all positions for a proper promotion push next season.
 
Shiggy said:
Not what I’m reading.

Lots seem to think this squad was capable of automatic promotion or “easily” top 6, without really explaining how they’ve come to that conclusion.
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We were 3 points off. Fine margins. Rhodes getting sent off for example.
 
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