Sunak - The Tax Cutting Chancellor

seasideone said:
That's fine thinking that - but to think someone is different is prejudice.
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The last year or so has fully demonstrated that THEY think they are different. They have considered it and decided that they are better and above the law. Prejudiced against the vast majority if you like.

Rules are for the rest of us, and a mere inconvenience for them to be flouted at will.

That's what's undermining democracy.
 
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Wizaard said:
The last year or so has fully demonstrated that THEY think they are different. They have considered it and decided that they are better and above the law. Prejudiced against the vast majority if you like.

Rules are for the rest of us, and a mere inconvenience for them to be flouted at will.

That's what's undermining democracy.
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They were operating within the rules and the law, so how is this case applicable to your argument!?
 
I am not a Tory, a floating voter. She is following the letter of the law. She pays tax on her earnings in India, which is right and proper as the business is there and she pays tax on anything she earns here, she also pays £30,000 a year tax to this country for her Non Dom status and still pays any taxes on money she earns here.

The usual lefties and righties just blustering in without actually reading the facts, but as a neutral and looking at it reasonably without ingrained political bias, it's actually a great media story but it's actually just piss and wind. The rules is the rules, until someone changes them, which they won't by the way, then all this political chest thumping is actually very funny but predictable to read.
 
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hertfordseasider said:
I am not a Tor, a floating voter. She is following the letter of the law. She pays tax on her earnings in India, which is right and proper as the business is there and she pays tax on anything she earns here, she also pays £30,000 a year tax to this country for her Non Dom status and still pays any taxes on money she earns here.

The usual lefties and righties just blustering in without actually reading the facts, but as a neutral and looking at it reasonably without ingrained political bias, it's actually a great media story but it's actually just piss and wind. The rules is the rules, until someone changes them, which they won't by the way, then all this political chest thumping is actually very funny but predictable to read.
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We don't know she's paying tax in India, or America or here. The suspicion is that her tax is paid in somewhere like the Caymans at a miniscule rate.

Anyway, is it right that the partner of the man accountable for the revenue of the nation can avoid taxes, whether legal or not?

It's a moral issue.
 
Wizaard said:
We don't know she's paying tax in India, or America or here. The suspicion is that her tax is paid in somewhere like the Caymans at a miniscule rate.

Anyway, is it right that the partner of the man accountable for the revenue of the nation can avoid taxes, whether legal or not?

It's a moral issue.
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I don’t agree. And I think Sunak is a slippery slime ball, I just think this is a political stick to beat with. Do we know she isn’t paying tax in India, they said she did on radio 5 this morning.

There are laws and as far as I can see she isn’t breaking any. If I had a company here and was earning billions and paying a fortune in tax here but I lived in Spain I wouldn’t expect to pay tax again on my British earnings, but I would fully expect to pay tax in Spain if I earned money in Spain and wouldn’t expect to pay tax again in the UK.

Plus she pays £30,000 to HMRC every year to keep her non Dom status plus tax on anything she earns here. Does she earn anything here? I have no idea.

It’s the rules, until they are changed then it is what it is, I would say the same if it was Kier Starmers wife who was a non Dom with a successful business abroad. Let me tell you, any person who is a business owner or self employed, no matter what political persuasion will try and get the best for themselves out of the currant tax system. It’s those who break the law by evading tax who need to be chased.
 
If there’s a financial loophole any politician or a politicians wife/spouse will exploit it.

I say any politician wether Labour Conservative Lip/Dem or whatever.

It’s always amazing however but once found out they soon change over.

Nice to see Boris defending Rushi though saying wifes/partners shouldn’t be dragged in to it.

Really?

No mention of his Green card. 🤣
 
Macseasider said:
The best thing about this thread is the 3 days Lost Seasider has spent in desperation to defend his snivelling Tory heroes.

And then Mrs Sunak comes out and says yeah it's really greedy and not fair play - I'll start paying. Brilliant!
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They need to round up all the ministers from all sides and see what dodgy tax dealings they do in the background, there will be loads.
 
Macseasider said:
The best thing about this thread is the 3 days Lost Seasider has spent in desperation to defend his snivelling Tory heroes.

And then Mrs Sunak comes out and says yeah it's really greedy and not fair play - I'll start paying. Brilliant!
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Not really, all this shows is that the amount of tax at stake was likely minimal.

On a wider point, I don't think it's at all healthy that we've established the principle that wives and families are fair game, and Labour have as much to lose from this as everyone else (google Diane Abbott's son for example), but it's where we are so I guess we have to live with it.
 
Lost Seasider said:
Not really, all this shows is that the amount of tax at stake was likely minimal.

On a wider point, I don't think it's at all healthy that we've established the principle that wives and families are fair game, and Labour have as much to lose from this as everyone else (google Diane Abbott's son for example), but it's where we are so I guess we have to live with it.
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Whataboutery at its finest. Regardless of political persuasion I believe that politicians should lead by example, that said your comparison is a poor one. One is the chancellor, you know the bloke who decides how much tax you pay, whilst his wife has taken a decision to reduce tax as much as possible. She hasn't broken any rules and if he was a backbencher or worked for a bank no one could give a toss, but he isn't. It's compromised his position and shows they put personal greed over leading by example. Abbot's son sounds like a right cnut, so what? He's been sent to jail for his trouble, how can you compare the two.....
 
In the USA it has been a tradition for many years for incoming Presidents to release their full tax records to the public... except when Trump arrived of course, who spun many lies to give reasons why he couldn’t/wouldn’t. Because he had paid bugger all tax for the past 10 years by allegedly inflating and deflating the value of properties to show fictitious losses.

If you want to clean up politics then pass a law that anyone elected to Parliament or elevated to the Lords has to release their full tax records for the past five years. Better still, make it a de facto rule that HMRC releases their tax records as soon as they are elected. That would keep a lot of dodgy characters away from standing.

And would probably also render the House of Lords redundant too, since political party-funding non-dom businessmen would think twice about trying to buy their peerages.
 
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Lost Seasider said:
Not really, all this shows is that the amount of tax at stake was likely minimal.
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Minimal? £4.4 million tax payable for last year alone... Minimal? And she has been playing the system since 2009. She could have funded the building of a major hospital all by herself over the past 10 years ! Errrrr.... just like Capt. Sir Tom Moore did in the last year of his life. Compare and contrast, as the examiners like to say.
 
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Shandypants said:
Whataboutery at its finest. Regardless of political persuasion I believe that politicians should lead by example, that said your comparison is a poor one. One is the chancellor, you know the bloke who decides how much tax you pay, whilst his wife has taken a decision to reduce tax as much as possible. She hasn't broken any rules and if he was a backbencher or worked for a bank no one could give a toss, but he isn't. It's compromised his position and shows they put personal greed over leading by example. Abbot's son sounds like a right cnut, so what? He's been sent to jail for his trouble, how can you compare the two.....
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Desperation.
 
Incredibly it seems like RS is already on the run and out of Downing Street according to the news this morning?
 
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Barring in mind we haven't had a Labour Party for nearly 50 years the current UK dept stands at nearly three trillion and growing at a rate of £5,000 a second.
The truth however is much worse, factoring in all liabilities including state and public sector pensions, the real national debt close to five trillion, some £78,000 for every person in the UK. You can only blame one party for that!
 
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kuriousoranj said:
That maybe true, but we've had 50 years of Conservative or Thatcherite polices. Take your pick.
Over the last 8 years the ND has more than doubled.
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That's not the information I have, and in the 6 years to 2019 debt to GDP actually shrank by 15%.

Of course, Covid has damaged things over the last two years, but can you imagine where we'd be if Corbyn had been in power instead?
 
kuriousoranj said:
That maybe true, but we've had 50 years of Conservative or Thatcherite polices. Take your pick.
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Lost Seasider said:
That's not the information I have, and in the 6 years to 2019 debt to GDP actually shrank by 15%.

Of course, Covid has damaged things over the last two years, but can you imagine where we'd be if Corbyn had been in power instead?
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He's never had the opportunity?????
We've just established no Social Democrat has been anywhere near power for half a century. Screen Shot 2021-10-18 at 14.06.55.png
You sound like a zombie!
 
Lost Seasider said:
That's not the information I have, and in the 6 years to 2019 debt to GDP actually shrank by 15%.

Of course, Covid has damaged things over the last two years, but can you imagine where we'd be if Corbyn had been in power instead?
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I know I'll regret this but pray tell, how does Covid, a virus in worldwide circulation and one which has not overwhelmed a single existing health service in the western world damage UK GDP more than any other country? I'm not a fan of Grandad Magic but he was calling out a lot of the stupid shit we were doing throughout the last two years. The same economy and health damaging stupid shit that you - singlehandedly on this board now it seems - continue to rationalise.
 
Regardless of the rights and wrongs of this situation, it has been a political kneecapping par excellence. Sunak is so damaged that he is thinking of giving up politics altogether according to the MoS. He is out of the running to be the next PM. I wonder what he hopes to achieve with his enquiry into the leak? Suppose he can prove it came from the PM's office (as it is rumoured). What then? If it did come from Johnson then he certainly displayed uncharacteristic competence in destroying Sunak's aspirations.
Also, I wonder what the supporters of Sunak's position would think of this likely source for the leak. Does it make it better that the narcissist in no. 10 arranged this? Who do you support Johnson or Sunak? The PM and chancellor at war, briefing against each other - so much for the national interest (it's like Brown vs Blair all over again).
 
ElBurroSinNombre said:
Regardless of the rights and wrongs of this situation, it has been a political kneecapping par excellence. Sunak is so damaged that he is thinking of giving up politics altogether according to the MoS. He is out of the running to be the next PM. I wonder what he hopes to achieve with his enquiry into the leak? Suppose he can prove it came from the PM's office (as it is rumoured). What then? If it did come from Johnson then he certainly displayed uncharacteristic competence in destroying Sunak's aspirations.
Also, I wonder what the supporters of Sunak's position would think of this likely source for the leak. Does it make it better that the narcissist in no. 10 arranged this? Who do you support Johnson or Sunak? The PM and chancellor at war, briefing against each other - so much for the national interest (it's like Brown vs Blair all over again).
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Serves him right for colluding and sitting on those party photos for two years. Was never going to outsmart the slippery pig. I won't give Pfeffel credit for much but the guy is a shrewd operator.
 
rockontommy said:
I know I'll regret this but pray tell, how does Covid, a virus in worldwide circulation and one which has not overwhelmed a single existing health service in the western world damage UK GDP more than any other country?
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I'm struggling to find up-to-date data on the subject, so if you have a source that backs up that claim, please feel free to share it, otherwise I think the short answer is "it didn't".

I know much was made of our economic performance in 2020, but there were significant differences in the way that we calculated GDP compared to our European neighbours that caused that.

Specifically, when the likes of France etc sent teachers and other PSW's home doing nothing on full pay, they continued to record the amounts paid to them as economic activity and part of GDP, in contrast the UK recognized the reduction in actual economic activity, i.e. that they weren't doing anything, and this resulted in a much bigger hit to GDP in 2020, but a much faster rebound in 2021.
 
Lost Seasider said:
I'm struggling to find up-to-date data on the subject, so if you have a source that backs up that claim, please feel free to share it, otherwise I think the short answer is "it didn't".

I know much was made of our economic performance in 2020, but there were significant differences in the way that we calculated GDP compared to our European neighbours that caused that.

Specifically, when the likes of France etc sent teachers and other PSW's home doing nothing on full pay, they continued to record the amounts paid to them as economic activity and part of GDP, in contrast the UK recognized the reduction in actual economic activity, i.e. that they weren't doing anything, and this resulted in a much bigger hit to GDP in 2020, but a much faster rebound in 2021.
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Let me simplify things. How does Covid affect UK GDP more than any other country?
 
ElBurroSinNombre said:
Regardless of the rights and wrongs of this situation, it has been a political kneecapping par excellence. Sunak is so damaged that he is thinking of giving up politics altogether according to the MoS. He is out of the running to be the next PM. I wonder what he hopes to achieve with his enquiry into the leak? Suppose he can prove it came from the PM's office (as it is rumoured). What then? If it did come from Johnson then he certainly displayed uncharacteristic competence in destroying Sunak's aspirations.
Also, I wonder what the supporters of Sunak's position would think of this likely source for the leak. Does it make it better that the narcissist in no. 10 arranged this? Who do you support Johnson or Sunak? The PM and chancellor at war, briefing against each other - so much for the national interest (it's like Brown vs Blair all over again).
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With the cost of living crisis shitstorm to come RS might well want to get out of politics altogether because I am pretty sure it is going to get very uncomfortable for whoever is chancellor especially one who is already implicitly involved in things.
 
ElBurroSinNombre said:
Regardless of the rights and wrongs of this situation, it has been a political kneecapping par excellence. Sunak is so damaged that he is thinking of giving up politics altogether according to the MoS. He is out of the running to be the next PM.
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Probably does the party a favour in the long run, although the party and the country are happy enough to be led by a woman, I'm less sure they're ready to be led by an Indian yet, thus an awkward conversation has been dodged.
 
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