The Ground

Morty

Morty

Well-known member
Yes - the East could be improved - e.g. facilities under the stand, stanctions removed to make the entire ground cantilever....

But - don't increase the capacity! One thing that is spot on is the atmosphere. Players home and away comment on it as do the fans. This is because when we get 8500 plus the place is rocking.....10000 plus and its superb!

Ewood Park, Deepdale, DW Stadium are all far too big and any atmosphere simply drifts away. I completely understand the need for ground improvements but increasing our capacity would be a big mistake and costly! Spend the cash on the team!

I know many posters won't agree with the above but how many times have we sold out since the prem?
 
The only way they can increase the capacity is build a new East which no home fans are in anyway.
So yes make a bigger stadium of around 20k and it won't lose the atmosphere.
 
Absolutely. A packed smaller ground has far better atmosphere and is more intimidating than a large empty ground. BUT we should plan for the future. If we carry on as we are I can only see our gates increasing. If we get to the prem then we should find a way to accomodate bigger gates. In this high tech world it is not beyond the capabilities of architects to create an expandable facility.
 
It's a good point of view, but for me I would increase to 20,000 making the east a two tier stand split between home and away.
I feel you have to look to the future and be positive, just like our badge 'Progress'.
 
I said exactly the same thing on here a few weeks ago.

People said I was similar to Oyston and lacked ambition.

So expect some passionate disagreement 😄
 
seasideone said:
Have I dreamed this, but was the West designed with the ability to put a stand above it??
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Karl claimed this was the case and used it to justify the added expense of the stand when compared to similar structures going up at other clubs… whether it’s true or not is questionable though. It is a very easy thing to say to justify large sums leaving the club and there was very very little likelihood of the reality ever needing to be proven. Not like Karl or Owen to lie about this sort of thing though so there’s no reason to doubt the West could be expanded without too much difficulty…
 
Morty said:
Yes - the East could be improved - e.g. facilities under the stand, stanctions removed to make the entire ground cantilever....

But - don't increase the capacity! One thing that is spot on is the atmosphere. Players home and away comment on it as do the fans. This is because when we get 8500 plus the place is rocking.....10000 plus and its superb!

Ewood Park, Deepdale, DW Stadium are all far too big and any atmosphere simply drifts away. I completely understand the need for ground improvements but increasing our capacity would be a big mistake and costly! Spend the cash on the team!

I know many posters won't agree with the above but how many times have we sold out since the prem?
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No no no, how are we supposed to grow as a club without capacity.

You've seen yourself recently the east is off limits, leaving wasted seats.

Even with a new east there will still be big sections not used for segregation.

Building a bigger east won't hurt the atmosphere of the stands we already have.

What if we got to the prem, you have to plan for the future.

We haven't had the capacity to give that many deals to attract new fans.

Have some ambition.

Also the atmosphere as said won't be affected in the existing stands and actually its about the fans in those stands, not the stands themselves.

When we go to Deepdale we'll create a great atmosphere.
 
Hazi said:
We are heading to the Prem followed by champions league we will need the extra seats
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I agree that we will need a bigger capacity and better facilities when we play Dortmund and Real Madrid.
Their supporters are not used to temporary stands, portaloos, and no refreshment facilities.
 
JJ - I love your passion and ambition but we have had one season in the top flight in the last 50 years. We should have a contingency plan if we get to the prem, in the meantime the ground is plenty big enough.

The old Bloomers generated a great atmosphere and the new one isn't far off. The issue with the segregation in the East is definitely an issue that can be solved after all we coped fine in the Prem and the Championship with away fans in the East before.
 
I think it needs to be about 20k. 1k over or under is fine but finish the ground and join it up and whatever that is then so be it. Brentfords ground is only 17.5k and they are in the Prem and will be fine. Clubs don't rely on gate receipts to generate the money there unlike in the championship so it needs to be big enough for the big championship game crowds but no too big to change the dynamic of the fans atmosphere. 20k will do that.
 
I think we should probably think about reducing the capacity to around 10,000, which will ensure we can pack out the stadium, even if we get relegated.

I’d solve the current over-capacity problem by making all the seats slightly bigger and also make the gangways larger.

This would also solve the issues outside the ground too 👍
 
bfcpete said:
Build a bigger east stand to bring the capacity to at least 20k and make tha a home stand. Give the south over to the away support. The stadium will still be rocking, but allows some scope for growth.
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I always hated going in the east, sun in your eyes so you can hardly see. I’d leave the away fans there personally. Plus I never like having away fans behind the goal, makes one end of the ground feel like an away match for the team. Build the east a bit bigger and keep the away support over there IMO.
 
Agree with the comment about half full stadiums if increasing capacity but an enclosed stadium down the east and corners with similar amount of seating currently should increase the noise
 
BFC_BFC_BFC said:
I think we should probably think about reducing the capacity to around 10,000, which will ensure we can pack out the stadium, even if we get relegated.

I’d solve the current over-capacity problem by making all the seats slightly bigger and also make the gangways larger.

This would also solve the issues outside the ground too 👍
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Fuck the stadium off altogether and the team can just play on Stanley park! My nan knits jumpers so instead of risking losing money on shirt sales we can just get her to knit them all and she'll charge us nothing as it gives her something to do!

In fact why don't we fuck off the whole football lark and we can set up a ten pin bowling team. Very low risk due to the low overheads! And most bowling alleys are already built so we wouldn't have to worry about building our own!
 
Silly bollocks aside - we just need to build the other east corner to join the ground up and then that'll mean (hopefully) there will be enough facilities to hold a full crowd in the east.
 
BFC_BFC_BFC said:
I think we should probably think about reducing the capacity to around 10,000, which will ensure we can pack out the stadium, even if we get relegated.

I’d solve the current over-capacity problem by making all the seats slightly bigger and also make the gangways larger.

This would also solve the issues outside the ground too 👍
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I don’t agree with all of your points BFC3, but the bigger seats one is a good idea. There are some right lard arses in our block.
British Standard seat sizes were designed between the World Wars when people tended to be thinner. With the current obesity crisis seats need to be at least 30% bigger, or make anyone with a BMI of over 30 buy two seats which would help to boost ST sales
Add in the extra pie sales and it’s win-win
 
Morty said:
Yes - the East could be improved - e.g. facilities under the stand, stanctions removed to make the entire ground cantilever....

But - don't increase the capacity! One thing that is spot on is the atmosphere. Players home and away comment on it as do the fans. This is because when we get 8500 plus the place is rocking.....10000 plus and its superb!

Ewood Park, Deepdale, DW Stadium are all far too big and any atmosphere simply drifts away. I completely understand the need for ground improvements but increasing our capacity would be a big mistake and costly! Spend the cash on the team!

I know many posters won't agree with the above but how many times have we sold out since the prem?
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So what your saying is yesterday is as good as it gets and you want to stick with that. Thats the pinnacle.
Its not like the plan is to add 10k and make it another Deepdale is it? Just 3k more to give us a bit of expansion while keeping the atmosphere. Its a no brainer. I cant believe you experienced that atmosphere yesterday and not think we're worth a little bit more .
 
Morty said:
Yes - the East could be improved - e.g. facilities under the stand, stanctions removed to make the entire ground cantilever....

But - don't increase the capacity! One thing that is spot on is the atmosphere. Players home and away comment on it as do the fans. This is because when we get 8500 plus the place is rocking.....10000 plus and its superb!

Ewood Park, Deepdale, DW Stadium are all far too big and any atmosphere simply drifts away. I completely understand the need for ground improvements but increasing our capacity would be a big mistake and costly! Spend the cash on the team!

I know many posters won't agree with the above but how many times have we sold out since the prem?
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I almost posted the same yesterday. Yes improve but don’t lose the atmosphere. Thats the beauty of having a fan owner I think he’ll take this into account. We’re not just a vanity project to him.
 
Morty said:
JJ - I love your passion and ambition but we have had one season in the top flight in the last 50 years. We should have a contingency plan if we get to the prem, in the meantime the ground is plenty big enough.

The old Bloomers generated a great atmosphere and the new one isn't far off. The issue with the segregation in the East is definitely an issue that can be solved after all we coped fine in the Prem and the Championship with away fans in the East before.
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Yes but we now sit 1 division outside, it's not impossible, as we found out.

We may also, even at this level, progress in cups and get some big teams.

That's how you grow by attracting new fans.

Right now we're limited.

There's no harm in building an East and corner that takes us up to 20k.

We can give away fans 4k ish and reap the financial rewards at times.

It won't affect the atmosphere in the 3 remaining sides.

Having a corner and half the east for pool fans means we will have about 15k, once we account for segregation, for pool fans.

Meaning we can do deals and incentives to attract new fans.

Its not like weve been in the championship for years and have had good owners for years and been trying to attract fans with deals and done everything, but just can't increase it.

We've not even begun to try yet, as capacity limits it.

Were on an upwards curve but not at the peak of it.

If 1k fans bring a child and partner for eg, there's an extra 2k. The more you get people in the more it sticks.

We had over 10k pool fans yesterday, yet apparently according to Oyston we were only locking 50 to 100 out at the time of the south stand redevelopment. Maybe 7k home fans.

This despite a general downturn in numbers post covid, years of lost fans and being shite and having no ambition and a run down stadium.

I think we can continue to grow.
 
I'd fill in both corners for now, but if there's already issues with the North lobbing stuff at the east it might be viewed as a safety hazard
 
PNENIL said:
So what your saying is yesterday is as good as it gets and you want to stick with that. Thats the pinnacle.
Its not like the plan is to add 10k and make it another Deepdale is it? Just 3k more to give us a bit of expansion while keeping the atmosphere. Its a no brainer. I cant believe you experienced that atmosphere yesterday and not think we're worth a little bit more .
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Yesterday was great. But we all saw empty seats. When we regularly fill those seats then I would take the next step. I'm not saying every game has to be a sell out but I am saying that sell outs shouldn't be unknown. Attracting another 2 or 3 thousand fans won't be easy. Far from it. We aren't an affluent town.

Simon Sadler deserves huge credit for what he's done. The club is open with the fans. The pitch looks worthy of league football and the ground looks cared for once again. Then there's the team.

What we don't know is just how deep his pockets are. There are billionaire owners that struggle to make an impact in the prem.

To be fair JJ makes some excellent points and you are correct as well - we should always strive to be better, but we must never put at risk our magnificent club ever again. Bradford, Sunderland, Ipswich, Portsmouth, Sheffield Wednesday, Bolton. These are all clubs who over reached. Their owners had enough of writing checks.

I'm just enjoying focusing on football and the club on threads like this with posters like yourself instead of talking about court cases, boycotts, club accounts etc. Long may it continue.

Oh, and Up the Pool!
 
If you didn't have a purchase history you couldn't get a ticket yesterday, I work with a guy who would like to have taken his son to the match but there were hoops to get through so didn't bother. We haven't got the facilities to increase the fan base. Plenty are following the results and thinking "I'd like a look at that" but we just can't let them in for the big matches like yesterday that could get them hooked.
We haven't the room to offer incentives to new supporters like the old quid a kid scheme. We averaged around 14k for 4 seasons and that was under the Oystons, with Simon Sadler and Neil Critchley at the helm we can attract new fans just as the football Ollie's team did but to do that we also need a bigger ground. A minimum 20k. Our fans can create an atmosphere anywhere. The North Stand is absolutely rocking this season, no need to change anything about that stand, acoustics are superb though the concourse is not ideal but apart from that.
 
Morty said:
Yesterday was great. But we all saw empty seats. When we regularly fill those seats then I would take the next step. I'm not saying every game has to be a sell out but I am saying that sell outs shouldn't be unknown. Attracting another 2 or 3 thousand fans won't be easy. Far from it. We aren't an affluent town.

Simon Sadler deserves huge credit for what he's done. The club is open with the fans. The pitch looks worthy of league football and the ground looks cared for once again. Then there's the team.

What we don't know is just how deep his pockets are. There are billionaire owners that struggle to make an impact in the prem.

To be fair JJ makes some excellent points and you are correct as well - we should always strive to be better, but we must never put at risk our magnificent club ever again. Bradford, Sunderland, Ipswich, Portsmouth, Sheffield Wednesday, Bolton. These are all clubs who over reached. Their owners had enough of writing checks.

I'm just enjoying focusing on football and the club on threads like this with posters like yourself instead of talking about court cases, boycotts, club accounts etc. Long may it continue.

Oh, and Up the Pool!
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On the empty seats, the planner was sold out certainly north and west stands, yet there they are.

Presumably people who have a ST who can't attend particular match, covid maybe, living abroad as I know a few said they bought one.

But also yes only those with a purchase history could go, which is crap as some fans may have ben in the past but under one person's name who buys them, so not on the system. Or entirely new.

Surely we should also be able to do an address check and other checks if needs be, to identify if its a pool fan or not and not turn them away.

Someone mentioned previous purchase history this season also, not sure of ture but a bit limiting if so.
 
Daft to wait until we’re selling out to develop the stadium as any development means we’re running with a capacity below our actual needs for 12 months minimum. Now is the time to build whilst we can just about fit the regular home support and a limited away allocation within the existing permanent stands. If we wait until we’re averaging over 12,500 week in week out (which we’re pretty much at now) then every game we sell out we’re essentially losing money and in the bigger games where we could sell 18000/20000+ we’re losing loads of money.

20000 capacity is the bare minimum this club should aim for. We need to be able to offer away clubs 5000+ tickets because they will sell them regularly and that’s money in our pockets. PNE fans won’t like it but they’re gonna give us 5600 tickets and in return Blackpool fans will put about £250k to £300k into PNE in just one day. When PNE come here later this month we’ll give them just 2200 tickets and due to that and our smaller facilities we’ll earn around just £100k from them.

So PNE are already at financial advantage of £200k and until we level the playing field and have similar facilities clubs with big away ends (like PNE) can potentially earn £200k more each home game. That’s potentially £4.5 million each season.
 
Satriale's Pork Store said:
Don't quite see where you get £250-300k from?

Not even half that probably?
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5600 x 50 = 280000 (Tickets at £30 plus spends in the bars, food, programmes, bookies etc) possibly a bit optimistic but if you include corporate it’s likely not far off. Let’s be honest if tickets were £40+ it would still be a sell out.
 
Would be class if our North stand was extended higher likes some of the grounds in Germany.

Signal-Iduna-Park_bvbinfobild_regular.jpg
 
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LA1 Seasider said:
5600 x 50 = 280000 (Tickets at £30 plus spends in the bars, food, programmes, bookies etc) possibly a bit optimistic but if you include corporate it’s likely not far off. Let’s be honest if tickets were £40+ it would still be a sell out.
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It’s an interesting analysis but can’t help thinking your figures are a fair bit out.
Top price tickets for the pne away end are £20 (excluding VAT) and when you factor in youngsters and oaps, the average income per ticket will probably nearer £18 rather than £30.
 
It's all about the east for me. It holds 5000 and yet the away fans get half (and the Nobbers only get 2200) and the rest is empty. Why is this happening, when it was full in the premier league?

Our capacity is now restricted to about 14000, it would appear. Perhaps we should give the south to the away fans, if this enables us to fill the east with home fans?

In terms of redevelopment, I'd only be looking at the east. We'd want to get up to at least 18000 I think. To get to 20000 would require something like an 8000 seat stand.
 
I think some people need to be realistic about attendances at Bloomfield Rd.
Yes, it'd be great to fill the ground and have 18/20000 there but we all know that 14000 in this division is the most we'll get apart from a couple of matches.
Sadler will have to shell out big money to get the East stand redeveloped, how long would it take him to recover that outlay on the back of large away followings?
We now have a good following and yes itd be great to increase the capacity for home fans but the reality is these floaters only want to come to a big cup match or against fierce rivals, again, on that basis how long would it take to recover the outlay Sadler would be paying?

We also have a police force in this area who dont seem to want to do their job at present. What would be the point of building an 8000 seater East stand if the police say you can only half fill it?

It's an awkward situation to be in.
 
Wizzerboy said:
I think some people need to be realistic about attendances at Bloomfield Rd.
Yes, it'd be great to fill the ground and have 18/20000 there but we all know that 14000 in this division is the most we'll get apart from a couple of matches.
Sadler will have to shell out big money to get the East stand redeveloped, how long would it take him to recover that outlay on the back of large away followings?
We now have a good following and yes itd be great to increase the capacity for home fans but the reality is these floaters only want to come to a big cup match or against fierce rivals, again, on that basis how long would it take to re over the outlay Sadler would be paying?

We also have a police force in this area who dont seem to want to do their job at present. What would be the point of building an 8000 seater East stand if the police say you can only half fill it?

It's an awkward situation to be in.
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I think you also have to look at the bigger picture. Times have changed a lot in the past 20 years. Most clubs have new stadiums or have redeveloped theirs. All the new grounds are outside of town centres, away from residential areas. We live in a far more challenging world, where people film everything, challenge everything on social media. Lancashire police somehow manage to look after Burnley, Blackburn, Nobbers and us, yet only seem to have an issue with us. That's the first thing I'd be looking at.
 
L’étranger said:
It’s an interesting analysis but can’t help thinking your figures are a fair bit out.
Top price tickets for the pne away end are £20 (excluding VAT) and when you factor in youngsters and oaps, the average income per ticket will probably nearer £18 rather than £30.
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Tickets for PNE won’t be £20 surely ?! And I’m talking potential figures. For a very high profile match we could charge what we like. Some Championship teams charge best part of £40 for a ticket for away fans and as we are the away match every club looks out for we can justify milking that particular cash cow week in week out. We’ve got to make the most of our unique situation and that means allowing large away followings but absolutely milking them dry.

Atm PNE can and do tap that revenue stream we simply don’t have. As do every other championship club with a large away end. Over the course of a season that gives them a huge chunk of money which we don’t have and that means we’re constantly operating at a disadvantage until we do something to level up the playing field.

Yes the £4.5 million figure is based on PNE selling 5600 tickets at £30 and then doing £20 per head on other spends. It’s not going to happen but the fact is it COULD happen. They have the ability to outearn us to quite a significant level and I for one don’t want them having that advantage when we could easily do the same.

We need to turn large away followings at Bloomfield Road into our advantage.
 
LA1 Seasider said:
Tickets for PNE won’t be £20 surely ?! And I’m talking potential figures. For a very high profile match we could charge what we like. Some Championship teams charge best part of £40 for a ticket for away fans and as we are the away match every club looks out for we can justify milking that particular cash cow week in week out. We’ve got to make the most of our unique situation and that means allowing large away followings but absolutely milking them dry.

Atm PNE can and do tap that revenue stream we simply don’t have. As do every other championship club with a large away end. Over the course of a season that gives them a huge chunk of money which we don’t have and that means we’re constantly operating at a disadvantage until we do something to level up the playing field.

Yes the £4.5 million figure is based on PNE selling 5600 tickets at £30 and then doing £20 per head on other spends. It’s not going to happen but the fact is it COULD happen. They have the ability to outearn us to quite a significant level and I for one don’t want them having that advantage when we could easily do the same.

We need to turn large away followings at Bloomfield Road into our advantage.
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Yes adult tickets for the away stand have been £20 plus VAT for all matches so far this season.
 
L’étranger said:
Yes adult tickets for the away stand have been £20 plus VAT for all matches so far this season.
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Cardiff fans paid 27 and all the others 23 the away club wavers the pound commission they get for selling the ticket.
That's why we are a quid dearer.

Nobbers are paying 27 not sure what VAT has got to do with anything not as if you can claim it back. 😁
 
L’étranger said:
Yes adult tickets for the away stand have been £20 plus VAT for all matches so far this season.
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PNE clearly recognise the M6 was built for a reason and that was to avoid Preston at all costs!
I’d be surprised if they kept it at £20 for us seeing as we’re gonna charge them £30.
I hope they do though.

Still think if we had that capacity for away fans we could charge pretty much whatever we wanted and still not see away fans numbers drop at Bloomfield Road. As I’ve said time and time again Blackpool have an opportunity to turn away fans into a means of generating income that other clubs can’t and therefore can provide us with an advantage that lets us close the gap on clubs with bigger home fan bases and with wealthier owners. An extra couple of million generated from away fans can pay for 3/4 top class Championship players every season or over the course of a decade pays for a new stand or training ground.
 
poolseasider said:
Cardiff fans paid 27 and all the others 23 the away club wavers the pound commission they get for selling the ticket.
That's why we are a quid dearer.

Nobbers are paying 27 not sure what VAT has got to do with anything not as if you can claim it back. 😁
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We’re talking about Preston’s tickets, not Blackpool’s, do keep up😏.
LA was doing a comparison / analysis of income. You have to exclude VAT to get a more accurate picture.
 
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