Thorniley Most Wanted

B

Bloodorange

Well-known member
This lad must be unique in the game given how his career has unfolded since signing for Pool 2 years ago.

He is first wanted by Simon Grayson when signed in Jan 20 then not wanted initially by his successor Neil Critchley.

Subsequently he was wanted for the remainder of the 20/21 season only to be not wanted for the start of the 21/22 season but history has repeated itself whereby he is now wanted for the remainder of this season.

Not only that he is asked to re debut in a new formation away from home against the best side and leading scorer in the division and puts in an accomplished performance.

He must have something and can anyone on here ever remember him having a bad game?.

Not only that he fulfills more than one position and naturally plays left.My question is what's not to like?.Its a mystery how we keep flirting with letting him go.

Are we being kind in that he is simply deemed as slightly behind others and for the sake of game time we let him go out on loan?

Or are we blind in that we don't quite see the value he offers to us whereby he should simply be a fixture in the starting eleven at Pool more often?
 
Did well in a back 3 on Saturday but think he would be exposed for pace as one of 2 centre-backs. If he had more pace he'd be a more than decent championship player.
 
Grayth said:
He's a bloke who plays centre back competently and without fuss. That gets some people drooling for some reason.

A squad player with value.
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Thorniley, for me, is one of our best defenders.
He's been treated shit by Blackpool but still gives stirling performances.
Maybe you'd prefer if he was like most of today's footballers who throw everything out the cot when things aren't going their way.
As for the drooling comment🤦‍♂️
Is not playing in your position competently and without fuss a standard for playing professional football?
Drooling? Come on😁
 
Has
Wizzerboy said:
Thorniley, for me, is one of our best defenders.
He's been treated shit by Blackpool but still gives stirling performances.
Maybe you'd prefer if he was like most of today's footballers who throw everything out the cot when things aren't going their way.
As for the drooling comment🤦‍♂️
Is not playing in your position competently and without fuss a standard for playing professional football?
Drooling? Come on😁
Click to expand...
Has he actually been treated like shit? I don't really think so.

We gave him a 2 year contract and we pay his wages. He made 26 appearances last season in a promotion campaign in which he shared the duties with Ekpiteta, Ballard and Gretarsson, 3 very good CBs, and Husband, who has been a warrior for us. And he received defensive coaching free of charge from Neil Critchley and Colin Calderwood. Critch has then made sure he gets football this season by loaning him to Oxford and it's very possible we paid some of his wages. He's been brought back and given an opportunity to step up to Championship level and further his career, playing the full game immediately on his return.

Treated like shit? I think that's a bit ridiculous tbh. Critch does his utmost to look after all his players within the confines of what is possible, and with the goal of getting the best results on the pitch and developing players for the future. He's not some dickhead manager.
 
voyeur said:
Has
Has he actually been treated like shit? I don't really think so.

We gave him a 2 year contract and we pay his wages. He made 26 appearances last season in a promotion campaign in which he shared the duties with Ekpiteta, Ballard and Gretarsson, 3 very good CBs, and Husband, who has been a warrior for us. And he received defensive coaching free of charge from Neil Critchley and Colin Calderwood. Critch has then made sure he gets football this season by loaning him to Oxford and it's very possible we paid some of his wages. He's been brought back and given an opportunity to step up to Championship level and further his career, playing the full game immediately on his return.

Treated like shit? I think that's a bit ridiculous tbh. Critch does his utmost to look after all his players within the confines of what is possible, and with the goal of getting the best results on the pitch and developing players for the future. He's not some dickhead manager.
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Well said Voy
 
Wizzerboy said:
Thorniley, for me, is one of our best defenders.
He's been treated shit by Blackpool but still gives stirling performances.
Maybe you'd prefer if he was like most of today's footballers who throw everything out the cot when things aren't going their way.
As for the drooling comment🤦‍♂️
Is not playing in your position competently and without fuss a standard for playing professional football?
Drooling? Come on😁
Click to expand...
I think people go overboard with competent CB play, that's all. Saw him touted on here as player of the year last season.

I'm happy to have him in the squad for all the reasons you mention. If we sold him, we'd replace him easily.
 
voyeur said:
Has
Has he actually been treated like shit? I don't really think so.

We gave him a 2 year contract and we pay his wages. He made 26 appearances last season in a promotion campaign in which he shared the duties with Ekpiteta, Ballard and Gretarsson, 3 very good CBs, and Husband, who has been a warrior for us. And he received defensive coaching free of charge from Neil Critchley and Colin Calderwood. Critch has then made sure he gets football this season by loaning him to Oxford and it's very possible we paid some of his wages. He's been brought back and given an opportunity to step up to Championship level and further his career, playing the full game immediately on his return.

Treated like shit? I think that's a bit ridiculous tbh. Critch does his utmost to look after all his players within the confines of what is possible, and with the goal of getting the best results on the pitch and developing players for the future. He's not some dickhead manager.
Click to expand...
He was deemed surplus to requirements and told to find another club in the Jan window last season. When we went down with loads of injuries he was taken back into the fold and played admirably.
Start of this season, shipped out to Oxford ( not even given a chance at Pool)
Then allegedly used as a bargaining tool in the Brannagan deal, that fell through and here he is again back at Bloomfield Rd.
In at the deep end against the champions elect and apart from the first 10 mins didn't put a foot wrong.
His attitude is 1st class
 
Bloodorange said:
This lad must be unique in the game given how his career has unfolded since signing for Pool 2 years ago.

He is first wanted by Simon Grayson when signed in Jan 20 then not wanted initially by his successor Neil Critchley.

Subsequently he was wanted for the remainder of the 20/21 season only to be not wanted for the start of the 21/22 season but history has repeated itself whereby he is now wanted for the remainder of this season.

Not only that he is asked to re debut in a new formation away from home against the best side and leading scorer in the division and puts in an accomplished performance.

He must have something and can anyone on here ever remember him having a bad game?.

Not only that he fulfills more than one position and naturally plays left.My question is what's not to like?.Its a mystery how we keep flirting with letting him go.

Are we being kind in that he is simply deemed as slightly behind others and for the sake of game time we let him go out on loan?

Or are we blind in that we don't quite see the value he offers to us whereby he should simply be a fixture in the starting eleven at Pool more often?
Click to expand...
Yeah Wycombe away tuesday night he was one of the worst players on the pitch. He’s had a very good game against fulham because he has clearly got himself fitter and leaner but one good performance (although very good) still doesnt define him yet and i wouldn’t be best pleased if i saw his name ahead of keogh or marv on a sat to be honest.
 
UltraNorthStand said:
Yeah Wycombe away tuesday night he was one of the worst players on the pitch. He’s had a very good game against fulham because he has clearly got himself fitter and leaner but one good performance (although very good) still doesnt define him yet and i wouldn’t be best pleased if i saw his name ahead of keogh or marv on a sat to be honest.
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So one good performance doesn't define him but you've picked out one bad performance more than 2 years ago on his debut?
 
Wizzerboy said:
He was deemed surplus to requirements and told to find another club in the Jan window last season. When we went down with loads of injuries he was taken back into the fold and played admirably.
Start of this season, shipped out to Oxford ( not even given a chance at Pool)
Then allegedly used as a bargaining tool in the Brannagan deal, that fell through and here he is again back at Bloomfield Rd.
In at the deep end against the champions elect and apart from the first 10 mins didn't put a foot wrong.
His attitude is 1st class
Click to expand...
I don't doubt his attitude is first class. It needs to be, it's his career, and he's a good lad. Critchley's attitude is first class too. He has used Thorniley as he deemed best, got him a club to play football at, improved him as a player, given him a Championship opportunity. Not treated like shit at all. Emotive loaded language. He's been behind people in the pecking order, it happens. Ekpiteta, Gretarsson, Ballard, Keogh, Husband etc. There are squad players in every squad.
 
Goforgoal said:
And Keogh is comparable to Usain Bolt ? Pace in a central defender , whilst useful, isn’t everything. Reading of the game and positioning is far more important.
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I wouldn't want Keogh and Thornily as the 2 centre backs against a decent Championship striker with pace.
 
UltraNorthStand said:
Yeah Wycombe away tuesday night he was one of the worst players on the pitch. He’s had a very good game against fulham because he has clearly got himself fitter and leaner but one good performance (although very good) still doesnt define him yet and i wouldn’t be best pleased if i saw his name ahead of keogh or marv on a sat to be honest.
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It’s not one good performance though, when brought back into the team last season after being frozen out for months, he didn’t let himself or us down. It’s a matter of opinion whether he’s good or not, but he has definitely been badly treated.
 
voyeur said:
Has
Has he actually been treated like shit? I don't really think so.

We gave him a 2 year contract and we pay his wages. He made 26 appearances last season in a promotion campaign in which he shared the duties with Ekpiteta, Ballard and Gretarsson, 3 very good CBs, and Husband, who has been a warrior for us. And he received defensive coaching free of charge from Neil Critchley and Colin Calderwood. Critch has then made sure he gets football this season by loaning him to Oxford and it's very possible we paid some of his wages. He's been brought back and given an opportunity to step up to Championship level and further his career, playing the full game immediately on his return.

Treated like shit? I think that's a bit ridiculous tbh. Critch does his utmost to look after all his players within the confines of what is possible, and with the goal of getting the best results on the pitch and developing players for the future. He's not some dickhead manager.
Click to expand...
He's been treated poorly.

He wasn't given an opportunity last year and it got absurd. Husband, Turton and Nottingham all started league games ahead of him. At one point, a centre back got injured in a game Thorniley was on the bench for and Demi Mitchell came on instead of him and a full back went to centre half. What the hell must Thorniley have felt like then?

Husband was sent off twice and still got the chance to play their again.

Thorniley played perfectly well in the tinpot cup games he was allowed but that didn't earn him a chance.

He was then told he could leave, only to be thrown in against Brighton (probably the best attacking side we've faced under Critch) where he did ok. He then did ok all through the run in, he had one poor game but otherwise was pretty much good to excellent.

Then he was loaned out to somewhere he seemed happy at because he seemingly didn't deserve a shot at championship football for some reason.

Then he was brought back in similar circumstances to the previous season against the best attacking team we've played this year and again, barely put a foot wrong.

Was he treated 'like shit?' - no, maybe not. Did he get a fair crack of the whip? No. He didn't.

I feel quite strongly that he's a player Critch got wrong. He's not some dickhead manager, that's very true, but he's also human and managers do get it wrong. Whoever they are. Critch clearly didn't rate him. That is indisputable. Had he rated him, he'd have played him before he had literally no choice to do so. Seriously, would you rather Marvin and Thorniley or Marvin and Michael Nottingham? Marvin and Thorniley or Marvin and Ollie Turton? Critch made the decisions he did.

That's not a reason to castigate Critch, it's just, in my view, one of the inevitable errors he has made. As all managers do.

Thorniley has just got on with it. Every credit to him for that.
 
Grayth said:
I think people go overboard with competent CB play, that's all. Saw him touted on here as player of the year last season.

I'm happy to have him in the squad for all the reasons you mention. If we sold him, we'd replace him easily.
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I agree, but at times last year we didn't have competent players playing at centre half and he got no chance. As above, that's all in the past, but it's nice to see a player come back from the cold and prove themselves.

I just like his hangdog determination. He always looks a bit like he's taking the bins out. He doesn't look very athletic. I like the mad little moments where he fancies himself as a footballer too.
 
Credit to him for coming back here and after a shaky start on Saturday I thought he generally did well. I dont want to sound a c here as hes getting some love this week and rightly so for stepping back in for a hard game at a higher level but I dont view him as somebody long term for Blackpool. For one thing he doesnt do well with balls over the top. I used to find his distribution quite poor under Grayson as he would just hoof it high up rugby style anywhere and Ive seen him turn his back on attackers running at him. Im pleased he is getting plaudits this week and the Oxford lot obviously like him. I just think thats his level imo. Happy to be proved wrong but I think we can do a lot better.
 
td53 said:
He's been treated poorly.

He wasn't given an opportunity last year and it got absurd. Husband, Turton and Nottingham all started league games ahead of him. At one point, a centre back got injured in a game Thorniley was on the bench for and Demi Mitchell came on instead of him and a full back went to centre half. What the hell must Thorniley have felt like then?

Husband was sent off twice and still got the chance to play their again.

Thorniley played perfectly well in the tinpot cup games he was allowed but that didn't earn him a chance.

He was then told he could leave, only to be thrown in against Brighton (probably the best attacking side we've faced under Critch) where he did ok. He then did ok all through the run in, he had one poor game but otherwise was pretty much good to excellent.

Then he was loaned out to somewhere he seemed happy at because he seemingly didn't deserve a shot at championship football for some reason.

Then he was brought back in similar circumstances to the previous season against the best attacking team we've played this year and again, barely put a foot wrong.

Was he treated 'like shit?' - no, maybe not. Did he get a fair crack of the whip? No. He didn't.

I feel quite strongly that he's a player Critch got wrong. He's not some dickhead manager, that's very true, but he's also human and managers do get it wrong. Whoever they are. Critch clearly didn't rate him. That is indisputable. Had he rated him, he'd have played him before he had literally no choice to do so. Seriously, would you rather Marvin and Thorniley or Marvin and Michael Nottingham? Marvin and Thorniley or Marvin and Ollie Turton? Critch made the decisions he did.

That's not a reason to castigate Critch, it's just, in my view, one of the inevitable errors he has made. As all managers do.

Thorniley has just got on with it. Every credit to him for that.
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That's a very good post Mitch, I can't argue with any of that. He wasn't given a fair crack of the whip at key moments, you're right. I just didn't like the treated like shit thing. The truth is somewhere in the middle, and you have it about right I reckon. 👍
 
Goforgoal said:
And Keogh is comparable to Usain Bolt ? Pace in a central defender , whilst useful, isn’t everything. Reading of the game and positioning is far more important.
Click to expand...
Keogh makes up a yard with his positioning intelligence on the pitch, he is light years above Thorniley on knowhow.
 
td53 said:
He's been treated poorly.

He wasn't given an opportunity last year and it got absurd. Husband, Turton and Nottingham all started league games ahead of him. At one point, a centre back got injured in a game Thorniley was on the bench for and Demi Mitchell came on instead of him and a full back went to centre half. What the hell must Thorniley have felt like then?

Husband was sent off twice and still got the chance to play their again.

Thorniley played perfectly well in the tinpot cup games he was allowed but that didn't earn him a chance.

He was then told he could leave, only to be thrown in against Brighton (probably the best attacking side we've faced under Critch) where he did ok. He then did ok all through the run in, he had one poor game but otherwise was pretty much good to excellent.

Then he was loaned out to somewhere he seemed happy at because he seemingly didn't deserve a shot at championship football for some reason.

Then he was brought back in similar circumstances to the previous season against the best attacking team we've played this year and again, barely put a foot wrong.

Was he treated 'like shit?' - no, maybe not. Did he get a fair crack of the whip? No. He didn't.

I feel quite strongly that he's a player Critch got wrong. He's not some dickhead manager, that's very true, but he's also human and managers do get it wrong. Whoever they are. Critch clearly didn't rate him. That is indisputable. Had he rated him, he'd have played him before he had literally no choice to do so. Seriously, would you rather Marvin and Thorniley or Marvin and Michael Nottingham? Marvin and Thorniley or Marvin and Ollie Turton? Critch made the decisions he did.

That's not a reason to castigate Critch, it's just, in my view, one of the inevitable errors he has made. As all managers do.

Thorniley has just got on with it. Every credit to him for that.
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Good post td53 and l'm a big fan of Thorniley, but in his earlier games he was prone to getting caught on the blind side with balls over the top. He certainly became a much improved player when given regular games.
 
Hazi said:
Keogh makes up a yard with his positioning intelligence on the pitch, he is light years above Thorniley on knowhow.
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He should be he has a dozen more years experience and I wasn’t comparing the two. The point I was making is that speed isn’t everything.
 
td53 said:
He's been treated poorly.

He wasn't given an opportunity last year and it got absurd. Husband, Turton and Nottingham all started league games ahead of him. At one point, a centre back got injured in a game Thorniley was on the bench for and Demi Mitchell came on instead of him and a full back went to centre half. What the hell must Thorniley have felt like then?

Husband was sent off twice and still got the chance to play their again.

Thorniley played perfectly well in the tinpot cup games he was allowed but that didn't earn him a chance.

He was then told he could leave, only to be thrown in against Brighton (probably the best attacking side we've faced under Critch) where he did ok. He then did ok all through the run in, he had one poor game but otherwise was pretty much good to excellent.

Then he was loaned out to somewhere he seemed happy at because he seemingly didn't deserve a shot at championship football for some reason.

Then he was brought back in similar circumstances to the previous season against the best attacking team we've played this year and again, barely put a foot wrong.

Was he treated 'like shit?' - no, maybe not. Did he get a fair crack of the whip? No. He didn't.

I feel quite strongly that he's a player Critch got wrong. He's not some dickhead manager, that's very true, but he's also human and managers do get it wrong. Whoever they are. Critch clearly didn't rate him. That is indisputable. Had he rated him, he'd have played him before he had literally no choice to do so. Seriously, would you rather Marvin and Thorniley or Marvin and Michael Nottingham? Marvin and Thorniley or Marvin and Ollie Turton? Critch made the decisions he did.

That's not a reason to castigate Critch, it's just, in my view, one of the inevitable errors he has made. As all managers do.

Thorniley has just got on with it. Every credit to him for that.
Click to expand...
Agree with most of that but would add he is/was one of the highest earners and that played a factor in Critch's thinking. I think the freezing out was to prompt a move, when that didn't happen Critch trusted him enough to play him regularly.
 
Hazi said:
Agree with most of that but would add he is/was one of the highest earners and that played a factor in Critch's thinking.
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I don't really understand that. Ok, the loan to Oxford is wages, fair enough but last year we sat him on the bench and didn't use him, using obvious makeshift stopgaps instead and played him with kids in the tinpot cup.

If we wanted him shifted, play him instead of obviously weaker options then flog him.
 
td53 said:
I don't really understand that. Ok, the loan to Oxford is wages, fair enough but last year we sat him on the bench and didn't use him, using obvious makeshift stopgaps instead and played him with kids in the tinpot cup.

If we wanted him shifted, play him instead of obviously weaker options then flog him.
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Critch thought he could get better on the same money if he moved on so made him available, but teams were offering to take him on loan for a fraction of his wage, the same with Madine the top earner. He could not replace either anywhere close so made sense to keep them.
 
When he came from Wednesday he got a lot of positives from their fans many of whom were surprised to see him go. Loved also by Oxford fans. Made a poor start when joined us but gradually we have seen a good player emerge. Sound championship squad member for me
 
Karl Robinson "It’s frustrating, because he’s probably my player of the year up to that point."
Only 25 - arguably if we'd just signed him we'd be drooling over this appointment!
 
Greennutmegsmoore said:
When he came from Wednesday he got a lot of positives from their fans many of whom were surprised to see him go. Loved also by Oxford fans. Made a poor start when joined us but gradually we have seen a good player emerge. Sound championship squad member for me
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My son works a lot of the time in South Yorkshire, Wednesday supporters are still fuming at letting him go!
 
TangerineBayern said:
Good post td53 and l'm a big fan of Thorniley, but in his earlier games he was prone to getting caught on the blind side with balls over the top. He certainly became a much improved player when given regular games.
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and thats why i think he was sent to oxford for. Regular game time that he wouldn't get here because of Marv, Keogh, and Viking all ahead of him, and the probability of playing with 3 at the back not being as high as last season (because you cant leave Bowler out)
 
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