War again

Matesrates said:
Hamas fired hundreds of rockets into Israel with hundreds of casualties. Reports of Hamas fighters paragliding into Israel. State of war declared by Israel. Religion and politics should be banned.
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5,000 rockets according to reports but reports say one one civilian Killed so far but it’s going to be many many more as although most rockets were shot down by defence systems many found there targets due to the shear numbers fired.

It’s going to be a bloodbath this the Israelis will strike back with one hell of a reprisal and show no mercy at all and seriously who can blame them?

And no doubt the Arab countries will all be calling Israel out for launching such an attack but none have so far condemned Hamas for such a brutal attack on the Israeli civilians.
 
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Maybe if Israel stopped its settlers occupying someone else's homes and land, bulldozing their houses, schools, and hospitals, the whole area could take a deep breath and allow negotiators to stand a chance. Both sides are responsible for this violence.
 
April13th1970 said:
It's nothing to do with religion or politics, it's about 76 years of attempted ethnic cleansing by the Arabs. Hopefully this time America and the west will let the Israelis do the job properly and not interfere
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... and there was I thinking it was ethnic cleansing, and land grabbing by the Israelis.

This land was Palestinian long before the State of Israel was created.

It's Britains fault, and particularly Arthur Balfour who in 1917 pandered to Lord Rothschild so he could get more votes in Parliament.

At one time there was serious consideration given to having a Jewish homeland in the USA or Australia.

Pity that wasn't followed up. It could have saved hundreds of thousands of lives.
 
Matesrates said:
At least 22 people killed and hundreds injured, does the world really need another war.
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As long as you have people like Putin around and fanatical Islamist groups hell bent on eradicating the Jews and the western world then yes you are.
 
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kuriousoranj said:
I think you'll find it the other way round.
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The Arabs were moved peacefully some forcibly granted but no one lost their lives over it this is pure genocide and civilians are the targets.
Joe Biden has said today America is 100% firmly behind Israel in any retaliation it does.
It was interesting to hear (but not surprising) the PLO leader condemned the Israeli reprisals but he didn't condemn the initial attacks on Israel surprise surprise.
 
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Feels like the World is going to hell in a handcart at times these days what with Ukraine, coups and civil wars in the Sahel region, and now this.
What Hamas thinks they will gain from this I have no idea? A desperate act by desperate people I should think?
 
glasshalffull said:
Feels like the World is going to hell in a handcart at times these days what with Ukraine, coups and civil wars in the Sahel region, and now this.
What Hamas thinks they will gain from this I have no idea? A desperate act by desperate people I should think?
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It shifts attention in the US from Ukraine to Israel, which is very helpful to their immediate backers Iran, and their ultimate backers Russia/China.

Ukraine, Israel, Africa, these are all just different fronts in the same war between China and the west.
 
If you go way back to the Old Testament the Israelites invaded Palestine across the River Jordan. Then after the second war a good idea was to give The Jews an uninhabited area of Africa to build a new state given lots of money to develop but presume that was turned down and they took Palestine by force. It was totally evil what happened to the Jews during the Second World War but in no way the Palestinians fault. No American president will push the Israelis to a two state solution as without the Jewish vote he/she wouldn’t get elected. What’s the answer 🤷🏽‍♂️
 
Lytham_fy8 said:
Again, just completely untrue. Do some research before posting and stop making things up.
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If you’re talking about people protesting and throwing petrol bombs and rioting with security forces then yes granted but many were moved without any trouble at all some who even had businesses were compensated and given land in other areas.
Had these Palestinians accepted the Jews they could have lived with them in peace but instead a Great wall of divide was erected and right from day one the Arab locals backed by Hamas started firing rockets at the Jewish settlers it became a daily ritual a way of life.

It’s no different than what Putin did in Crimea back in 2014 he drove the Ukrainians out by force and it became part of Russia and the rest of the world stood and watched and did absolutely nothing at all.

And for the record I’m not saying it’s right by the way after land grabbing but Israel has every right to defend itself now from invading terrorists and that’s what they are doing here they didn’t start this latest conflict it was Hamas remember and what’s the alternative let these terrorist overrun Israel? If that’s the case might as well go back to 1947 and start all over again in finding a country for all the Jews.
 
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Lost Seasider said:
It shifts attention in the US from Ukraine to Israel, which is very helpful to their immediate backers Iran, and their ultimate backers Russia/China.

Ukraine, Israel, Africa, these are all just different fronts in the same war between China and the west.
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Yes no doubt. You would think they will just get a prolonged, ferocious and monumental battering of their people and lands for no perceivable gain in their cause though.
 
It looks to me that there’s no chance of a negotiated settlement, if there was, it would have been done before now. The only hope is that this latest conflict settles down quickly and they go back to the status quo. The worry is that it will escalate with Hezbollah entering the conflict.
 
Jaffa_The_Hut said:
If you’re talking about people protesting and throwing petrol bombs and rioting with security forces then yes granted but many were moved without any trouble at all some who even had businesses were compensated and given land in other areas.
Had these Palestinians accepted the Jews they could have lived with them in peace but instead a Great wall of divide was erected and right from day one the Arab locals backed by Hamas started firing rockets at the Jewish settlers it became a daily ritual a way of life.

It’s no different than what Putin did in Crimea back in 2014 he drove the Ukrainians out by force and it became part of Russia and the rest of the world stood and watched and did absolutely nothing at all.

And for the record I’m not saying it’s right by the way after land grabbing but Israel has every right to defend itself now from invading terrorists and that’s what they are doing here they didn’t start this latest conflict it was Hamas remember and what’s the alternative let these terrorist overrun Israel? If that’s the case might as well go back to 1947 and start all over again in finding a country for all the Jews.
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Deir Yassin Massacre to name one?
 
Matesrates said:
It looks to me that there’s no chance of a negotiated settlement, if there was, it would have been done before now. The only hope is that this latest conflict settles down quickly and they go back to the status quo. The worry is that it will escalate with Hezbollah entering the conflict.
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Unfortunately Mates, the status quo is Israel ignoring countless UN mandates and doing exactly what they want against the Palestinian people.
 
Lytham_fy8 said:
Deir Yassin Massacre to name one?
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The Irgun were bastards, organised terrorists long before any Arab groups came into being. 👍
I know you’ll be aware of this, but for anyone else interested in the history of Israel, who might be unaware, the Irgun were blowing up Brits as a means to force through the formation of Israel.
 
Lost Seasider said:
Don't you feel a bit embarrassed supporting a group that murders women then drives their bodies through the streets as a trophy?
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I don’t feel embarrassed at all, but then I don’t support or agree with barbaric acts like that either.
But I do have sympathise with a people that have suffered under an occupying force for 75 years, a force that has committed atrocities against them during that whole time, breaking countless UN resolutions against themselves, and only getting away with it because they are supported by the USA on the grounds that the Jewish vote in America is huge, and that America likes having a pro-American nation in that region.
Do you feel embarrassed to support a country that only came into being by committing atrocities against British soldiers, and British civilians, men, women and children?
 
A plague on both their houses I say but surely no-one can condone this current action. The terrorists have no intention of negotiating and Israel thinks this gives them carte blache to act as they wish. You can't have a two state solution when there's only one functioning state.
 
This isn’t going to end anytime soon, 600 reported killed in Israel, and they’ll respond with force. That means other countries which support the Palestinians my well enter the conflict.

Zelenskyy must be tearing his hair out.
 
Johnno said:
I don’t feel embarrassed at all, but then I don’t support or agree with barbaric acts like that either.
But I do have sympathise with a people that have suffered under an occupying force for 75 years, a force that has committed atrocities against them during that whole time, breaking countless UN resolutions against themselves, and only getting away with it because they are supported by the USA on the grounds that the Jewish vote in America is huge, and that America likes having a pro-American nation in that region.
Do you feel embarrassed to support a country that only came into being by committing atrocities against British soldiers, and British civilians, men, women and children?
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You claim you don't support acts like that, then proceed to justify the acts anyway.

Sounds to me like you do support these acts, you're just not willing to admit it.
 
bill40 said:
A plague on both their houses I say but surely no-one can condone this current action. The terrorists have no intention of negotiating and Israel thinks this gives them carte blache to act as they wish. You can't have a two state solution when there's only one functioning state.
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Summed up well.

Quite a few mentions of ethnic cleansing on this thread, well we're all about to witness it.
 
Lost Seasider said:
You claim you don't support acts like that, then proceed to justify the acts anyway.

Sounds to me like you do support these acts, you're just not willing to admit it.
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I haven’t tried to justify those kind of acts at all, you’re making that up.
 
Lost Seasider said:
So why all the references to Israel's foundation, or their "atrocities", then?
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‘Cos I think it’s relevant when talking about Palestinian’s actions against Israel. A lot of people see the Arab-Israeli conflict through the lens of a surrounded Jewish country under threat from nasty Arabs, without knowing anything of why the Arabs are being nasty. I think it fair to look at the full history.
I can assure you, I’m against ALL barbaric atrocities during any conflict, even if my sympathies lie with one side or the other.
 
Johnno said:
‘Cos I think it’s relevant when talking about Palestinian’s actions against Israel. A lot of people see the Arab-Israeli conflict through the lens of a surrounded Jewish country under threat from nasty Arabs, without knowing anything of why the Arabs are being nasty. I think it fair to look at the full history.
I can assure you, I’m against ALL barbaric atrocities during any conflict, even if my sympathies lie with one side or the other.
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That sounds an awful lot like justification to me.
 
Lost Seasider said:
That sounds an awful lot like justification to me.
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Then I can’t defend myself any more. You've ignored each time I’ve said “I’m against barbaric atrocities by either side”.
I make no apologies for supporting the Palestinian cause, though.
 
Lost Seasider said:
It's the word he used.

Is it wrong to use it in hyphens? Show me the pictures of the Israelis parading naked dead Palestinian women through the streets, please.
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Plenty of evidence of Israeli's shooting kids but you've kept quiet about that, I wonder why...

www.hrw.org

West Bank: Spike in Israeli Killings of Palestinian Children

The Israeli military and border police forces are killing Palestinian children with virtually no recourse for accountability.
www.hrw.org www.hrw.org

Sick and tired of people like you using the last few days to try and claim some sort of moral high ground. Both sides have acted atrociously for years.
 
Lost Seasider said:
That's never been a problem for them in the past.
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Well I am sure it has, but they certainly soak it up.
Anyway this feels likely to be a much deeper and wider reaching conflict already. Very dangerous point in time for the Middle East, and the rest of the World too probably.
 
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glasshalffull said:
Well I am sure it has, but they certainly soak it up.
Anyway this feels likely to be a much deeper and wider reaching conflict already. Very dangerous point in time for the Middle East, and the rest of the World too probably.
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I see this as a last ditch attempt to get everyone else involved. It’s all or nothing time for Palestine. If they can’t force other Arab states, and then the super powers by extension, to get involved, they’re doomed anyway.
There’s no chance of there ever being a peaceful solution. Too much recent history between two totally opposed goals. Unfortunately,
 
Johnno said:
I see this as a last ditch attempt to get everyone else involved. It’s all or nothing time for Palestine. If they can’t force other Arab states, and then the super powers by extension, to get involved, they’re doomed anyway.
There’s no chance of there ever being a peaceful solution. Too much recent history between two totally opposed goals. Unfortunately,
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Agree, it looks hopeless now and worrying. This could escalate badly.
 
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