When can we attend matches again

Goforgoal

Well-known member
What those with outstanding health problems where as 99% won't have been vaccinated next time BR is open massive swerve but hey your bowing out. 👍
Outstanding health problems notwithstanding you made an incorrect statement about u18s. Sorry and all that, I have enjoyed it though and I hope we will metaphorically cross swords again.🙂
 

Atletico_Seasider

Well-known member
The problem is, as we have seen with numerous comments on here, is that the government's messaging on all of this has been appalling from the word go. I think we can all agree on that. Remember Blow Jo's opening..."just wash your hands"....bollox. They need to be honest with people. The facts are...

1. Having the vaccine will NOT stop you getting Covid or not stop you spreading it. It is a form of flu and behaves in a similar way. Studies out of the US on the effectiveness of the flu vaccine over the years suggest efficacy ranging from as low as 10% in some years to as high as 60% in others [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Influenza_vaccine]. That's why elderly people and vulnerable people still unfortunately die of flu every winter, even when they have had the flu jab. The reason is that the flu virus constantly mutates to survive which is why they have to keep tweaking the vaccine to combat it.
2. If you disbelieve what I'm saying on point 1, why should you believe that any healthy person under 50 should have the vaccine, because surely the vulnerable will now be safe because they have had the vaccine?
3. The real reason for lockdown I believe is that the NHS is running dangerously low on staff as a result of a number of factors. This is why all other operations in most areas of the country are postponed and the waiting lists are growing exponentially. If we had capacity to deal with Covid then we wouldn't be locked down. We don't lockdown for the flu every year even though thousands of vulnerable people die from it. Remember Hancock promised us 50K new nurses. I wonder how that's going 🤔. If we get the capacity in place by next winter and hammer home the message that if you have symptoms to stay at home then it becomes far more manageable. If you don't feel great but have to go out say to shop, wear a mask like they do in Asia to contain the spread and respect/protect others.
4. Forcing people to have a vaccine or having vaccine passport discrimination is certainly not the answer unless we have given up completely on human rights and the lunatics are in charge of the asylum. Hmmm, may be I've shot myself in the foot on this one 😀
5. If you think the government has done a good job, think again. The UK is amongst the top 3 worst in the world in terms of official Covid deaths adjusted for population size. For example, the UK has had 120K Covid deaths vs less than 70K in Germany. And remember the German population is 16 million bigger than the UKs and it hasn't had the advantage of being an island. New Zealand has had just 26 deaths and Japan just 7, 200! The government's response has been a catalogue of failure from start to finish.
6. We have learn't to live with the flu and we will learn to live with Covid. Investment in NHS capacity, education on personal hygene and social behaviour/responsibility is the way out of this....
 

Bispham_Seasider

Well-known member
And what’s your thoughts on relaxing of restrictions if some people refuse the vaccine ? Do you feel we should all be kept locked up for several more months or longer depending on those that refuse to have it ?
huh? I wasn't offering an opinion one way or the other, just pointing out what appears to be what might happen.
 

Macseasider

Well-known member
I just don't trust what's in the vaccine. I'll take my chance with the virus.
I would attend BR if they would let me in without taking the vaccine.

Yeah it's full of little camera implants and things that will control you.

Seeing as you will not be infected with the governments special implants you better get prepped for when you have to go "underground"........
 

Threepeaksphil

Well-known member
Atletico raises some interesting points but I would point out:
1, Results from Israel show that the jabs are stopping people getting covid and spreading it( See John Campbells Blog,) which is wonderful news!
2. Spain and France are said to have the best funded health services in Europe, if not the world, and even they were overwhelmed. Mistakes were made in UK and lessons must be noted for the future but early ordering of jabs and delaying second one for 12 weeks masterstrokes as was funding the Oxford people to produce a vaccine in record time, Whilst I didn't vote Brexit, thank goodness we are not tied to the EU vaccine ordering system.
I do agree that nobody should be forced to have the injection but hope most people will, I had mine three weeks ago. Being a glass half full person I hope we can enjoy summer 2021 and who knows perhaps get to Wembley again. UTMP
 

Loco

Well-known member
The problem is, as we have seen with numerous comments on here, is that the government's messaging on all of this has been appalling from the word go. I think we can all agree on that. Remember Blow Jo's opening..."just wash your hands"....bollox. They need to be honest with people. The facts are...

1. Having the vaccine will NOT stop you getting Covid or not stop you spreading it. It is a form of flu and behaves in a similar way. Studies out of the US on the effectiveness of the flu vaccine over the years suggest efficacy ranging from as low as 10% in some years to as high as 60% in others [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Influenza_vaccine]. That's why elderly people and vulnerable people still unfortunately die of flu every winter, even when they have had the flu jab. The reason is that the flu virus constantly mutates to survive which is why they have to keep tweaking the vaccine to combat it.
2. If you disbelieve what I'm saying on point 1, why should you believe that any healthy person under 50 should have the vaccine, because surely the vulnerable will now be safe because they have had the vaccine?
3. The real reason for lockdown I believe is that the NHS is running dangerously low on staff as a result of a number of factors. This is why all other operations in most areas of the country are postponed and the waiting lists are growing exponentially. If we had capacity to deal with Covid then we wouldn't be locked down. We don't lockdown for the flu every year even though thousands of vulnerable people die from it. Remember Hancock promised us 50K new nurses. I wonder how that's going 🤔. If we get the capacity in place by next winter and hammer home the message that if you have symptoms to stay at home then it becomes far more manageable. If you don't feel great but have to go out say to shop, wear a mask like they do in Asia to contain the spread and respect/protect others.
4. Forcing people to have a vaccine or having vaccine passport discrimination is certainly not the answer unless we have given up completely on human rights and the lunatics are in charge of the asylum. Hmmm, may be I've shot myself in the foot on this one 😀
5. If you think the government has done a good job, think again. The UK is amongst the top 3 worst in the world in terms of official Covid deaths adjusted for population size. For example, the UK has had 120K Covid deaths vs less than 70K in Germany. And remember the German population is 16 million bigger than the UKs and it hasn't had the advantage of being an island. New Zealand has had just 26 deaths and Japan just 7, 200! The government's response has been a catalogue of failure from start to finish.
6. We have learn't to live with the flu and we will learn to live with Covid. Investment in NHS capacity, education on personal hygene and social behaviour/responsibility is the way out of this...

Atletico raises some interesting points but I would point out:
1, Results from Israel show that the jabs are stopping people getting covid and spreading it( See John Campbells Blog,) which is wonderful news!
2. Spain and France are said to have the best funded health services in Europe, if not the world, and even they were overwhelmed. Mistakes were made in UK and lessons must be noted for the future but early ordering of jabs and delaying second one for 12 weeks masterstrokes as was funding the Oxford people to produce a vaccine in record time, Whilst I didn't vote Brexit, thank goodness we are not tied to the EU vaccine ordering system.
I do agree that nobody should be forced to have the injection but hope most people will, I had mine three weeks ago. Being a glass half full person I hope we can enjoy summer 2021 and who knows perhaps get to Wembley again. UTMP

The problem is, as we have seen with numerous comments on here, is that the government's messaging on all of this has been appalling from the word go. I think we can all agree on that. Remember Blow Jo's opening..."just wash your hands"....bollox. They need to be honest with people. The facts are...

1. Having the vaccine will NOT stop you getting Covid or not stop you spreading it. It is a form of flu and behaves in a similar way. Studies out of the US on the effectiveness of the flu vaccine over the years suggest efficacy ranging from as low as 10% in some years to as high as 60% in others [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Influenza_vaccine]. That's why elderly people and vulnerable people still unfortunately die of flu every winter, even when they have had the flu jab. The reason is that the flu virus constantly mutates to survive which is why they have to keep tweaking the vaccine to combat it.
2. If you disbelieve what I'm saying on point 1, why should you believe that any healthy person under 50 should have the vaccine, because surely the vulnerable will now be safe because they have had the vaccine?
3. The real reason for lockdown I believe is that the NHS is running dangerously low on staff as a result of a number of factors. This is why all other operations in most areas of the country are postponed and the waiting lists are growing exponentially. If we had capacity to deal with Covid then we wouldn't be locked down. We don't lockdown for the flu every year even though thousands of vulnerable people die from it. Remember Hancock promised us 50K new nurses. I wonder how that's going 🤔. If we get the capacity in place by next winter and hammer home the message that if you have symptoms to stay at home then it becomes far more manageable. If you don't feel great but have to go out say to shop, wear a mask like they do in Asia to contain the spread and respect/protect others.
4. Forcing people to have a vaccine or having vaccine passport discrimination is certainly not the answer unless we have given up completely on human rights and the lunatics are in charge of the asylum. Hmmm, may be I've shot myself in the foot on this one 😀
5. If you think the government has done a good job, think again. The UK is amongst the top 3 worst in the world in terms of official Covid deaths adjusted for population size. For example, the UK has had 120K Covid deaths vs less than 70K in Germany. And remember the German population is 16 million bigger than the UKs and it hasn't had the advantage of being an island. New Zealand has had just 26 deaths and Japan just 7, 200! The government's response has been a catalogue of failure from start to finish.
6. We have learn't to live with the flu and we will learn to live with Covid. Investment in NHS capacity, education on personal hygene and social behaviour/responsibility is the way out of this....
I agree with some of what you write.

However, this statement is incorrect "It is a form of flu and behaves in a similar way".
The influenza viruses and coronaviruses are different types of RNA virus.
 

gjr69

Well-known member
You may be prepared to take your chance, but I don’t want you to take a chance with my life. Your attendance in the past has no doubt been welcome so thank you and good bye.
I'd stand by him in the stadium, I've been to work pretty much 6 days a week since the whole thing started with about 50 others and then been all over FY8 on a daily basis, so far we have all managed to stay alive!
Maybe some of the people who have been working from home or furloughed are just getting a bit too paranoid.
In my opinion the people who think of this like it's bubonic plague or ebola are just as detached from reality as the ones who think Bill Gates is implanting them with a tracking device!
 

Thelaneends1

Well-known member
The results published today based on just the first jabs are very encouraging both in stopping spreading and catching covid and it appears all over 40's will be done by end of March. There is talk about foreign hols with a cert so we should be able to attend soon showing a Vac Cert? Are the clubs going to push this with the EFL? What will in feel like to go into Bloomfield and away grounds again🙂
Hope when we finally get home we can sellout.
 

Goforgoal

Well-known member
I'd stand by him in the stadium, I've been to work pretty much 6 days a week since the whole thing started with about 50 others and then been all over FY8 on a daily basis, so far we have all managed to stay alive!
Maybe some of the people who have been working from home or furloughed are just getting a bit too paranoid.
In my opinion the people who think of this like it's bubonic plague or ebola are just as detached from reality as the ones who think Bill Gates is implanting them with a tracking device!
I am not getting obsessed by the virus, nor do I think it’s as bad as some are making out. However the people who are, still, most liable to be extremely unwell or even die still want to support their team. The point I’m making is it’s not only yourself and your own health you have to think about. You also have to have a certain amount of consideration for others, if not, what kind of society do we live in?
 

gjr69

Well-known member
I am not getting obsessed by the virus, nor do I think it’s as bad as some are making out. However the people who are, still, most liable to be extremely unwell or even die still want to support their team. The point I’m making is it’s not only yourself and your own health you have to think about. You also have to have a certain amount of consideration for others, if not, what kind of society do we live in?
There are so many areas of life where people do not think of the welfare of others so if this is the main motivation for having it, (it would be for me) then let's do it and hope it makes many of us more considerate in other ways.
 

Atletico_Seasider

Well-known member
17.5m vaccines administered, how many deaths have been reported?
Do you think they would report it Cruzzer if there were deaths? The answer is no. Just like they haven't been reporting suicides and indirect covid deaths because of cancelled operations/treatments. Both of these are through the roof unfortunately. This government treats the public like gullible vegetables and they keep feeding us horse sh*it. I for one, do not trust a word they say or for that matter their puppet 'scientists' that say what the government want them to say. Blow Jo is a serial liar and a narcisist. For example, just check out his 'over my dead body' comment when asked about an Irish Sea border post Brexit. And guess what we have now got? That was the reason he gave for not voting for Teressa May's deal but we all know the real reason - self-interest as it was a route to him becoming PM...
 

cruzzer

Well-known member
Do you think they would report it Cruzzer if there were deaths? The answer is no. Just like they haven't been reporting suicides and indirect covid deaths because of cancelled operations/treatments. Both of these are through the roof unfortunately. This government treats the public like gullible vegetables and they keep feeding us horse sh*it. I for one, do not trust a word they say or for that matter their puppet 'scientists' that say what the government want them to say. Blow Jo is a serial liar and a narcisist. For example, just check out his 'over my dead body' comment when asked about an Irish Sea border post Brexit. And guess what we have now got? That was the reason he gave for not voting for Teressa May's deal but we all know the real reason - self-interest as it was a route to him becoming PM...
Our bad news loving press (BBC) would be all over a vaccine related death. Surely even your scepticism has to accept getting a third of the adult population vaccinated is a fantastic effort.
 

Atletico_Seasider

Well-known member
Our bad news loving press (BBC) would be all over a vaccine related death. Surely even your scepticism has to accept getting a third of the adult population vaccinated is a fantastic effort.
I have to disagree on this one Cruzzer for a number of reason. The vast majority of the written press is Tory, the only exceptions being The Mirror (Labour), The Guardian and The Independent (both more independent in terms of politics). As for the BBC, I think the opposite to you. Under Cammeron's government we started to see 'political' friendly appointments to the BBC in very senior positions. Fran Unsworth - director of content, being a case in point. The new Chairman is a Tory party donor. Three examples of Tory bias during the last General Election coverage:
1. Remember in the Question Time leaders’ debate, there was mocking laughter at the response of Johnson to a question about trustworthiness. This was later edited out of footage for a lunchtime news bulletin.
2. Coverage of the cenotaph remembrance service where Johnson made a mistake laying a wreath and he looked like he had been dragged through a hedge in terms of his appearance. Surprise, surprise it was replaced by archive footage of him at the 2016 service on BBC Breakfast.
3. And the no show on the Andrew Neil leader's interviews before the election.
All three favoured Johnson, and were put down to 'editorial' mistakes and scheduling issues. To claim this is an insult to the public's intelligence. There are many more examples, ranging from manipulated headlines on the website that I could highlight, but life is too short. In my view, the BBC is simply just a mouthpiece of the Tory government. It's the UK version of Pravda!
 
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