Are we skint?

I was absolutely fine with the strategy of not paying x million (fees plus daft wages) for certain players who weren't sold on what we had to offer - pushing themselves and putting themselves in the window for bigger clubs. But the gamble of trusting youth and youth loans isn't working so far and we clearly aren't as attractive a move as we thought we were (financially or in terms of players wanting to be here).

I fully appreciate the club is in safe hands and I guess that is the main thing when all is said and done, but admit I feel really flat with regards the on field ambition of the club at the moment.
 
Martonmosser said:
Yes I remember that one, thanks 👍🏼
I thought I had heard something about this land as well 🤔
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There are ponds around the land which will be home to some wildlife and my left trainer from circa 1976.

Not quite relevant, but a true story. The Roman road from Somewhere in Leeds to Ribchester was well plotted until it got lost over the Pennines. Bloke I knew showed me a farm he had and the new barn conversion- nice- and said when they were preparing the site they came across the roman road. Faced with years of digs with teaspoons and combs halting his build, he dug the road up at night so nobody got wind.

Don't think he would tell me that story now.

Point is anything historical or environmental can halt progress.
 
RP North Stand said:
Mate they get premiership money what are you on about?
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They didn’t get premiership money until they got into the premiership. In other words when they were in the championship they were in the same financial position as us. How plain can I make it, if you want another Luton had a smaller budget than us last season yet reached the playoffs. The point is it’s not how much you spend that matters, it’s how you spend it.
 
Philbfctrois said:
He bought it cheap 7.5 million wasn't it?
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A bit rich of you or anyone to be calling it cheap. What was Blackpool FC truly worth as a loss making league 1 club with a reputation lower than a snakes belly and a crumbling infrastructure ?
£7.5 million bought a failing business and as lot of headaches. I imagine a further £10 million + has since been pumped into the club and it’s only really due to some decent luck that we’re already a Championship club and have secured the money we have for Bowler and Critchley.
Sadler could have quite easily spent the same money and more and we could be a League 1 club even still.
 
LA1 Seasider said:
A bit rich of you or anyone to be calling it cheap. What was Blackpool FC truly worth as a loss making league 1 club with a reputation lower than a snakes belly and a crumbling infrastructure ?
£7.5 million bought a failing business and as lot of headaches. I imagine a further £10 million + has since been pumped into the club and it’s only really due to some decent luck that we’re already a Championship club and have secured the money we have for Bowler and Critchley.
Sadler could have quite easily spent the same money and more and we could be a League 1 club even still.
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It was cheap and it will be worth more now

Them the facts
 
Philbfctrois said:
It was cheap and it will be worth more now

Them the facts
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But it’s only worth more due to the investment put in and the luck that went along with it. There wasn’t exactly a queue of potential owners that I remember ?

Had SS bought the club and spent zero since day 1 and we still found ourselves in League 1 with 6000/7000 home crowds on average and a model of living strictly within our means… would £7.5 million be cheap ? Especially with the money that HAD to be spent on basics and essentials just to keep the doors open.

For example the East stand is literally non negotiable. Whoever bought the club has to factor in its replacement as it won’t be allowed to remain beyond its safety certificate. Someone has to either accept a 40% capacity reduction or has to spend a minimum of £8 million to replace like for like (literally just seats no facilities above and beyond what currently exists)
 
LA1 Seasider said:
But it’s only worth more due to the investment put in and the luck that went along with it. There wasn’t exactly a queue of potential owners that I remember ?

Had SS bought the club and spent zero since day 1 and we still found ourselves in League 1 with 6000/7000 home crowds on average and a model of living strictly within our means… would £7.5 million be cheap ? Especially with the money that HAD to be spent on basics and essentials just to keep the doors open.

For example the East stand is literally non negotiable. Whoever bought the club has to factor in its replacement as it won’t be allowed to remain beyond its safety certificate. Someone has to either accept a 40% capacity reduction or has to spend a minimum of £8 million to replace like for like (literally just seats no facilities above and beyond what currently exists)
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Yeah i know all that

I'm just saying he bought it cheap and he did
 
Philbfctrois said:
Yeah i know all that

I'm just saying he bought it cheap and he did
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I’m not so sure.

I think it was more like buying a derelict house. You know it’s a lot cheaper than a newbuild (a sustainable well managed club) but you’re aware you’re gonna have to pump time and money in to it the moment you complete. There’s a decent chance that if you’re sensible that time and money could be rewarded at the other end though when that renovation is complete - however there’s no garuantee.

You don’t say ‘you only spent £160k!’ when someone buys a house then spends the same again on building work before selling it. You say they spent £320k.

Sadler bought the club for £7.5 million but it’s the tip of the iceberg. It’s only ‘cheap’ if he makes the right decisions, spends a shit tonne of money on top of the £7.5 million and then also gets some luck to go with it. We’re no way near the end of the renovations yet though.

Saying he got the club on the cheap really does him a disservice.
 
LA1 Seasider said:
I’m not so sure.

I think it was more like buying a derelict house. You know it’s a lot cheaper than a newbuild (a sustainable well managed club) but you’re aware you’re gonna have to pump time and money in to it the moment you complete. There’s a decent chance that if you’re sensible that time and money could be rewarded at the other end though when that renovation is complete - however there’s no garuantee.

You don’t say ‘you only spent £160k!’ when someone buys a house then spends the same again on building work before selling it. You say they spent £320k.

Sadler bought the club for £7.5 million but it’s the tip of the iceberg. It’s only ‘cheap’ if he makes the right decisions, spends a shit tonne of money on top of the £7.5 million and then also gets some luck to go with it. We’re no way near the end of the renovations yet though.

Saying he got the club on the cheap really does him a disservice.
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He bought the club for X.

He's done things to increase value.

The Club is worth far more now than the purchase price. Not being funny, but that was Base 1 for SS.
 
TwelveAngryMen said:
Think it was £9m and he’ll have spent the same again if not more
Don’t see anyone writing a cheque for £20m plus OG
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Plenty more to come too. The East stand is a massive factor. It has to be replaced within the next 5 years. The council have made it clear they won’t renew the safety certificate as the structure is at the end of its lifespan.

Lose the East and BR’s capacity is approx 12,700. Only 11,500 is likely useable (if that) after segregation. That means only 10,000 available home end tickets which when you take into account natural wastage (as almost no ground ever operates at capacity) is 9500 and therefore pretty much where we’re currently at for smaller games and no where near what we need for the larger games.

For the business to operate at current levels and to have even a chance to grow then the East has to be replaced.

The most basic like for like replacement, essentially a bank of 4500 seats and no facilities will cost between £1300 and £1800 per seat. Given the current market it’s likely to be the top end so £8 million.

£8 million to stand still. That’s pretty much doubled the cost of buying BFC straight away. And that’s on top of everything else.

*In order to build an East stand and structure that has the potential to actually generate an income outside of the 23 matches of football each year the cost per seat is likely to be £3-4000 (£15 million+) The club are also likely going to look into future proofing the capacity of the stadium by increasing it, as an example bringing BR’s capacity to the 20,000 mark would likely set SS back approx £22 million+ but would likely open up revenue streams which can generate income to pay off the expense sooner than building the basic structure and relying on ticket sales alone.

So whether the East costs £8 million or £25 million it’s still an investment that can’t really be avoided and has to be factored into the purchase cost. It certainly doesn’t look a ‘cheap’ deal
 
LA1 Seasider said:
Plenty more to come too. The East stand is a massive factor. It has to be replaced within the next 5 years. The council have made it clear they won’t renew the safety certificate as the structure is at the end of its lifespan.

Lose the East and BR’s capacity is approx 12,700. Only 11,500 is likely useable (if that) after segregation. That means only 10,000 available home end tickets which when you take into account natural wastage (as almost no ground ever operates at capacity) is 9500 and therefore pretty much where we’re currently at for smaller games and no where near what we need for the larger games.

For the business to operate at current levels and to have even a chance to grow then the East has to be replaced.

The most basic like for like replacement, essentially a bank of 4500 seats and no facilities will cost between £1300 and £1800 per seat. Given the current market it’s likely to be the top end so £8 million.

£8 million to stand still. That’s pretty much doubled the cost of buying BFC straight away. And that’s on top of everything else.

*In order to build an East stand and structure that has the potential to actually generate an income outside of the 23 matches of football each year the cost per seat is likely to be £3-4000 (£15 million+) The club are also likely going to look into future proofing the capacity of the stadium by increasing it, as an example bringing BR’s capacity to the 20,000 mark would likely set SS back approx £22 million+ but would likely open up revenue streams which can generate income to pay off the expense sooner than building the basic structure and relying on ticket sales alone.

So whether the East costs £8 million or £25 million it’s still an investment that can’t really be avoided and has to be factored into the purchase cost. It certainly doesn’t look a ‘cheap’ deal
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I'm not doubting he has invested money into the club, I'm just saying he got it cheap at the time

Training ground, Hotel, Stadium and Playing Squad for less than 9 million i believe.

It was also free of any debts

For example Chalton Athletic was valued at £50 million for the stadium alone and Derby was bought for 30 million with a shit load of debts and not including Pride Park

I think Hull City was also around £30 million
 
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Philbfctrois said:
I'm not doubting he has invested money into the club, I'm just saying he got it cheap at the time

Training ground, Hotel, Stadium and Playing Squad for less than 9 million i believe.

It was also free of any debts

For example Chalton Athletic was valued at £50 million for the stadium alone and Derby was bought for 30 million with a shit load of debts and not including Pride Park

I think Hull City was also around £30 million
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The previous owner bought the club for £1 in 1987, taking into account inflation that's about £3.60 in todays money

So i would say he's paid well over the odd's for the club.
 
Philbfctrois said:
I'm not doubting he has invested money into the club, I'm just saying he got it cheap at the time

Training ground, Hotel, Stadium and Playing Squad for less than 9 million i believe.

It was also free of any debts

For example Chalton Athletic was valued at £50 million for the stadium alone and Derby was bought for 30 million with a shit load of debts and not including Pride Park

I think Hull City was also around £30 million
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I’m not surprised at the valuation for the Valley given its location. As a piece of real estate BR must be on one of the cheapest plots of land of all football grounds in the country. The fan base is also probably considered League 1 at best. When BFC sold BR was essentially derelict too given the lack of investment or even basic maintenance.

All the other clubs you’ve given as examples are functioning and operating on a day to day basis without any need for significant investment. Essentially all that was needed was a willing owner happy to make the difficult (and potentially unpopular) decisions necessary to trim inflated budgets and get the clubs operating within their respective means.

Blackpool we’re a bit different in that we already were comfortably operating within our means (albeit for the boycott) but buying the club came with an instant need to splash cash before even being able to tread water.

I don’t deny we were cheaper to buy than Derby, Hull or whoever, I just don’t think the purchase price (be it £7.5 or £9 million) can be considered cheap given what you were buying and the financial black hole that purchase was.
 
LA1 Seasider said:
I’m not surprised at the valuation for the Valley given its location. As a piece of real estate BR must be on one of the cheapest plots of land of all football grounds in the country. The fan base is also probably considered League 1 at best. When BFC sold BR was essentially derelict too given the lack of investment or even basic maintenance.

All the other clubs you’ve given as examples are functioning and operating on a day to day basis without any need for significant investment. Essentially all that was needed was a willing owner happy to make the difficult (and potentially unpopular) decisions necessary to trim inflated budgets and get the clubs operating within their respective means.

Blackpool we’re a bit different in that we already were comfortably operating within our means (albeit for the boycott) but buying the club came with an instant need to splash cash before even being able to tread water.

I don’t deny we were cheaper to buy than Derby, Hull or whoever, I just don’t think the purchase price (be it £7.5 or £9 million) can be considered cheap given what you were buying and the financial black hole that purchase was.
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Yeah maybe but i think you can counter some of that with the fact Blackpool is a holiday destination and attracts hundreds of thousand of people every year

Certainly more than Hull ever will

What is the going rate for a hotel?

Didn't the Imperial get sold for about 13 million last year?
 
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Goforgoal said:
They didn’t get premiership money until they got into the premiership. In other words when they were in the championship they were in the same financial position as us. How plain can I make it, if you want another Luton had a smaller budget than us last season yet reached the playoffs. The point is it’s not how much you spend that matters, it’s how you spend it.
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It doesn’t bake over night mate your moaning your tits off because we haven’t spent millions and are not top of the championship. Joker.
 
Goforgoal said:
It took you long enough to think about it. Show me where I have complained about not spending millions or not being top of the league, there’s only one joker in this pack.
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It's a lazy argument

If you are critical of the board for failing to land the players the manager wants then all of a sudden you want to 'do a Man City' or you are rising the clubs future by 'doing a Derby'

To be honest it's ** painful this site
 
LA1 Seasider said:
I’m not so sure.

I think it was more like buying a derelict house. You know it’s a lot cheaper than a newbuild (a sustainable well managed club) but you’re aware you’re gonna have to pump time and money in to it the moment you complete. There’s a decent chance that if you’re sensible that time and money could be rewarded at the other end though when that renovation is complete - however there’s no garuantee.

You don’t say ‘you only spent £160k!’ when someone buys a house then spends the same again on building work before selling it. You say they spent £320k.

Sadler bought the club for £7.5 million but it’s the tip of the iceberg. It’s only ‘cheap’ if he makes the right decisions, spends a shit tonne of money on top of the £7.5 million and then also gets some luck to go with it. We’re no way near the end of the renovations yet though.

Saying he got the club on the cheap really does him a disservice.
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Agree 100%

He may also find out that there's a nightmare family in the area that'll drive him out of the house.
 
Philbfctrois said:
It's a lazy argument

If you are critical of the board for failing to land the players the manager wants then all of a sudden you want to 'do a Man City' or you are rising the clubs future by 'doing a Derby'

To be honest it's ** painful this site
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It's not just this site! It's opinions on nearly everything nearly everywhere. People looking for realistic compromise are in short supply.
We need the spine of the team to consist of better players and we have to do it in an affordable way is probably where we are.
That might mean having 3 or 4 more Connolly/Husband/Lavery type players in the squad that have good character and versatility but limited ability, if you can spend more on 3 players in the best 11.
 
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Philbfctrois said:
It's a lazy argument

If you are critical of the board for failing to land the players the manager wants then all of a sudden you want to 'do a Man City' or you are rising the clubs future by 'doing a Derby'

To be honest it's ** painful this site
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Correct, SS bought us out of the nightmare of the Os but that doesn’t give him a free pass. If things aren’t being done in what fans consider the correct way we are entitled to criticise. That’s not to say he or the board need to accept the criticism, but we are entitled to voice it. Some on here think just because we were rescued we have to be eternally grateful for whatever they do and accept it with mute admiration.
 
There's a lot of well worn arguments on this thread.
Looking at both ends of the spectrum.
Do I wish we had Man City's money? NO.
Do I want us to win every game? YES.
Did I want us to end up like Bury? NO.
Am I happy that we got rid of the Oystons? YES.
Am I happy that Simon Sadler bought the Oystons out? YES.
I have no idea how much money Simon has got to spend on our/his football club but if we could place him in a financial league with other owners he would probably be in League 1.
So the fact that our/his football team is in the Championship shows we are possibly slightly over-achieving.
Could things be be going better?
From a fans point of view they nearly always could and that's certainly the case at this specific point in time.
Does Simon Sadler think things could be going better?
I'm almost certain he does. He has built up a successful business in his day job and I'm certain he will want his custodianship of Blackpool but just as successful.
Simon clearly keeps his business very close to his chest which is very frustrating as a fan.
So we aren't likely to find things out until they have happened.
There's always speculation on here as to why this, that and the other didn't happen with posters posting facts that have no substance to them and this just adds to the uncertainty.
Do I trust Simon to get things right?
There isn't a one word answer to that one.
I do think he will do his best for BFC but he does remain inexperienced as Football Club Chairman, still has to earn a living, and consequently relies on others, primarily Ben Mansford.
Is Ben Mansford the right man for the job?
I can only trust Simon on that one and without knowing the facts of what has apparently gone wrong in this transfer window, I'll have to.
If the messageboard is a representative cross section of Blackpool fans we are certainly an impatient bunch. We've lost two games, we've played very badly in one and not quite so badly in the other.
We still have a fairly long and unhealthy injury list which hopefully will improve.
We have a manager that currently seems betwixt and between what system to play and which players to pick which is very similar to how Quitch was when he first arrived.
I have been told (from a horse's mouth) that Appy was the unanimous choice so I'm sure he'll be around for a good while longer yet.
So I think we do need to be a little bit more patient, until at least Christmas, and not press the panic button until then.
 
Goforgoal said:
They didn’t get premiership money until they got into the premiership. In other words when they were in the championship they were in the same financial position as us. How plain can I make it, if you want another Luton had a smaller budget than us last season yet reached the playoffs. The point is it’s not how much you spend that matters, it’s how you spend it.
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when we were chasing Campbell, the midfielder from Scotland, last season, Luton beat us to it. Can only thi k they offered better money, but the get less gates than us!
 
HodderSeasider said:
when we were chasing Campbell, the midfielder from Scotland, last season, Luton beat us to it. Can only thi k they offered better money, but the get less gates than us!
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How many we get through the gate is not the be all and end all, it’s a factor of course, but not everything.
 
Insider said:
There's a lot of well worn arguments on this thread.
Looking at both ends of the spectrum.
Do I wish we had Man City's money? NO.
Do I want us to win every game? YES.
Did I want us to end up like Bury? NO.
Am I happy that we got rid of the Oystons? YES.
Am I happy that Simon Sadler bought the Oystons out? YES.
I have no idea how much money Simon has got to spend on our/his football club but if we could place him in a financial league with other owners he would probably be in League 1.
So the fact that our/his football team is in the Championship shows we are possibly slightly over-achieving.
Could things be be going better?
From a fans point of view they nearly always could and that's certainly the case at this specific point in time.
Does Simon Sadler think things could be going better?
I'm almost certain he does. He has built up a successful business in his day job and I'm certain he will want his custodianship of Blackpool but just as successful.
Simon clearly keeps his business very close to his chest which is very frustrating as a fan.
So we aren't likely to find things out until they have happened.
There's always speculation on here as to why this, that and the other didn't happen with posters posting facts that have no substance to them and this just adds to the uncertainty.
Do I trust Simon to get things right?
There isn't a one word answer to that one.
I do think he will do his best for BFC but he does remain inexperienced as Football Club Chairman, still has to earn a living, and consequently relies on others, primarily Ben Mansford.
Is Ben Mansford the right man for the job?
I can only trust Simon on that one and without knowing the facts of what has apparently gone wrong in this transfer window, I'll have to.
If the messageboard is a representative cross section of Blackpool fans we are certainly an impatient bunch. We've lost two games, we've played very badly in one and not quite so badly in the other.
We still have a fairly long and unhealthy injury list which hopefully will improve.
We have a manager that currently seems betwixt and between what system to play and which players to pick which is very similar to how Quitch was when he first arrived.
I have been told (from a horse's mouth) that Appy was the unanimous choice so I'm sure he'll be around for a good while longer yet.
So I think we do need to be a little bit more patient, until at least Christmas, and not press the panic button until then.
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Sorry got bored after sentence 2
 
Now you know how we all feel with 99% of your posts...... 🤣

I'm sure you just don't understand the big words and cant handle a well thought out post that makes sense....
 
Philbfctrois said:
Sorry got bored after sentence 2
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Just trying to help your run chase. 😉
I'm sorry I'm not as intelligent as you and that my posts aren't as engrossing, stimulating and absorbing as your's are.
I really must try harder.
You really are the Sam Allardyce of posters (with just a hint of Simon Grayson). 😂
PS.
"Stopped reading after sentence two" is a bit of a frequently used catchphrase of yours.
I must try and get one of my own so I can be like you.
 
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Insider said:
I'm hearing cold showers and 1pm kick offs to save on energy bills.
All IMO of cour
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Philbfctrois said:
Or is SS not wanting to spend his money

Apparently loads of offers for players have been made ....and refused and even in the rare case they had been accepted its been hard to agree terms with our league one budget

Missed out on Drinkwater, looking like a pay as you play deal for Bridcutt is on the table instead, they aren’t even close in terms of ability

Couldn't agree terms with several contracted players even when fees had been agreed , Or players like the Rotherham midfielder just not fancying it preferring to stay at fcuking Rotherham

Had to make do with paying a wage percentages for young loan players instead, that goes against the policy that Bullshit was banging on about signing young players with sell on values whilst having a defined transfer policy and structure

Lets not forget it doesn't matter if a manager leaves the strategy remains the same

Bullshit ......

Struggling to agree terms with players who don't even have clubs now

Meanwhile its looking like Fabian Delph is signing for Wigan on a free, whilst we are scratching around with Dougall and Connolly in midfield struggling to pass the ball to players in the same colour shirt

Maybe a call to Riga should be on the cards, be nice to have some of that 30 odd million that left the club available again, I'm sure uncle Val would help out the club he loves ❤

Maybe its the Hong Kong problems or the banking issues but however you dress it up its a bit weird buying a football club then not wanting to properly invest in it, especially as we are now a Championship club just one promotion away from the riches of the Premier league.

Where is the ambition? What is the ambition?

It really wouldn't have taken much to get us competing at the top end this season, i honestly don't think the league is all that, but the transfer window has kiboshed that ambition.

The Bowler deal is looking worse and worse everytime we take the pitch without him. We should have really just kept him for the season instead of selling him for a pittance.

Even clubs like the Nobbers, Coventry and Rovers have managed to keep their better players, Brereton Diaz also only has a year left btw.

The club is being run like a league one club in terms of finance on the pitch whilst every effort is made in trying to rinse every last penny out of our loyal fanbase off it.

There is only so much 8,000 people can spend

We still have an untapped potential support but the ticket price rises have seen to that, very few fans now buy match day tickets, less than a hundred according to the bloke in the ticket office when i asked at the Bristol City game.

Thats poor however you dress it up given we have thousands of empty seats in a relatively small stadium.

Ahhhh the East stand and Training ground you say? ....Never in a month of Sundays will 40 million be spent on that and its still unclear how that would be financed even if it did miraculously happen.

All my opinion btw whilst our new head coach is getting slaughtered from every corner for losing 2 away games on the bounce with a patched up side

Utp ....

The fcuking mighty
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I find it a very rare occasion that i agree with your thoughts and this is another one i think your talking rubbish.
 
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