Boris Johnson

Wizaard

Wizaard

Well-known member
Finally he's learning from the multitude of mistakes. Not promising a fixed date for the end of lockdown is a tiny step in the right direction.

Having said that, saying it was will cautious but irreversible is an odd thing to say. Painting himself into a corner once the restrictions are starting to be lifted.
 
Wizaard said:
Finally he's learning from the multitude of mistakes. Not promising a fixed date for the end of lockdown is a tiny step in the right direction.

Having said that, saying it was will cautious but irreversible is an odd thing to say. Painting himself into a corner once the restrictions are starting to be lifted.
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Damned if he does ,damned if he doesn't, there's always some-one ready to stick the knife in.
 
Or you could look at it the other way.
Defended if he does, defended if he doesn't. No matter how many have died due to his incompetence, there are plenty who will bend over backwards to support him. Why they want to support such a corrupt, dishonourable liar I have no idea!
 
Boris is still the fraud he’s always been, now basking in the glow of the successful vaccine breakthrough. It was interesting to note in the 5 o’clock address to the nation, that Sir Simon Stevens thanked everyone involved in the amazing fight against this virus, quite rightly omitting any mention of Boris!
 
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1966_and_all_that said:
True....so are we expecting Johnson to become good at something anytime soon? Or, are you suggesting he might even become a bit statesman-like?!
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Boris has made mistakes (don’t we all)
Regardless of what person or indeed party that was in power during this pandemic, would be presiding over deaths of thousands of people, unfortunately.

Boris is one part (albeit) at the top of a huge organisation that runs this Country.
Boris, and the organisation he’s the fall guy for - is performing exceptionally well with the roll out of the vaccine, when the negative naysayers were predicting disaster!

So, I disagree with your claim “will Boris become good at something, anytime soon” - because he already is good at something now.
 
catinstalbans said:
Or you could look at it the other way.
Defended if he does, defended if he doesn't. No matter how many have died due to his incompetence, there are plenty who will bend over backwards to support him. Why they want to support such a corrupt, dishonourable liar I have no idea!
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Accusing The Prime Minister of corruption is quite a slanderous accusation.
I’ve not seen any of the Press run this story - What do you know for absolute fact, that they don’t?
 
Certitude said:
Accusing The Prime Minister of corruption is quite a slanderous accusation.
I’ve not seen any of the Press run this story - What do you know for absolute fact, that they don’t?
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They have, contracts for cronies, bypassing the normal checks that are done before government money is spent.
Obviously the situation demanded that quick decisions were made, were they legitimate?
Johnson has said now is not the time for enquiries, and I say he is innocent until proven guilty.
 
I’m looking for irrefutable evidence to confirm Catinstalbans claim that Boris Johnson is corrupt.
I think this posters claims are slanderous and they are using this unfounded claim to question why people would support Mr Johnson.

The wider ranging corruption in huge Government organisations is an entirely different point and topic as to which Catinstalbans was speaking about.

For the record, I’m aware there’s been many proven cases of corruption within Government organisations before, and likely, given the history, will continue.
 
I wouldn't support Johnson for many documented reasons, deceit, questionable morals, laziness, arrogance, the things he has written about Liverpool and working class people, antiquated racial slurs, his lack of a wider knowledge of the lives of the people of the UK.
But I maintain that he is innocent of corruption until an enquiry can prove otherwise.
 
Levi501 said:
Boris is still the fraud he’s always been, now basking in the glow of the successful vaccine breakthrough. It was interesting to note in the 5 o’clock address to the nation, that Sir Simon Stevens thanked everyone involved in the amazing fight against this virus, quite rightly omitting any mention of Boris!
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Yet 4 points ahead of Labour in the opinion polls you'd have thought how bad Boris has done in this pandemic Starmer would be walking it.
 
poolseasider said:
Yet 4 points ahead of Labour in the opinion polls you'd have thought how bad Boris has done in this pandemic Starmer would be walking it.
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Not in this country, 40% vote Conservative always, Johnson could appear on TV eating babies and the vote wouldn't waiver, and a lot of us are disinterested in all the main parties.
 
gjr69 said:
Not in this country, 40% vote Conservative always, Johnson could appear on TV eating babies and the vote wouldn't waiver, and a lot of us are disinterested in all the main parties.
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I think theres a title more to it than that.
 


By certitude's standards Vladimir Putin would be an upstanding and democratic champion with no evidence of corruption whatsoever!


www.transparency.org.uk

Transparency International UK statement on allegations in The Sunday Times concerning the then Mayor of London, Boris Johnson.

22rd September 2019, London – In response to a story by The Sunday Times regarding the relationship between the then Mayor of London, Boris Johnson and businessperson Jennifer Arcuri, Steve Goodrich, Research Manager at Transparency International UK, said:“Businesses expect equal treatment from...
www.transparency.org.uk www.transparency.org.uk
www.politics.co.uk

Channel Four allegations reveal a darker side to Boris Johnson

London mayor lashes out at opponents during meeting at City Hall
www.politics.co.uk www.politics.co.uk
 
Wizaard said:
Finally he's learning from the multitude of mistakes. Not promising a fixed date for the end of lockdown is a tiny step in the right direction.

Having said that, saying it was will cautious but irreversible is an odd thing to say. Painting himself into a corner once the restrictions are starting to be lifted.
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I think he realises this has to be the very last lockdown. The appetite and patience of the public is just about exhausted and, more importantly, he’d get a load of grief from his back benchers particularly the CRG if he had to introduce another lockdown in a few months time. So his policy seems to be to grind the virus down as far as he can before relaxing restrictions, and then hope that the vaccinations and improving weather are enough to prevent another flare up.
 
gjr69 said:
Not in this country, 40% vote Conservative always, Johnson could appear on TV eating babies and the vote wouldn't waiver, and a lot of us are disinterested in all the main parties.
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It’s a good point to be fair and valid for England, around 40% of the electorate lean towards the centre right based on a general agreement towards policy choices (wealth creation, immigration policy with a nationalist tone). As long as a likeable lender heads the ship they will always vote this way and Johnson for all his faults is personable.

30% will vote centre left again for policy / cultural reasons (always have voted labour etc).

The remaining sector will vote fringe parties or not at all.

For Labour to even consider returning to power they will have to combine having a likeable lender with a shift towards the centre to capture some of the blue voters in the north. This is even before you factor in Scotland...

Poor Starmer, to be fair he’s got a tough gig
 
Recidivist3 said:
Nothing that Cat has written is ‘slanderous’ - but please carry on
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Well there’s a shock. 🙄

What about the thousands of deaths he’s said he’s responsible for? ‘death on his hands’ another one?

You may not have read his previous comments but I most certainly have all accusing him of of tens of thousands of Covid deaths.

If the comments were aimed at Owen Oyston he’d already be in court.

Not slanderous. 😂
 
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Jaffa, look up the definition of slander, and then look up the definition of libel, and perhaps you will understand the original point 👍
 
Jaffa_The_Hut said:
Well there’s a shock. 🙄

What about the thousands of deaths he’s said he’s responsible for? ‘death on his hands’ another one?

You may not have read his previous comments but I most certainly have all accusing him of of tens of thousands of Covid deaths.

If the comments were aimed at Owen Oyston he’d already be in court.

Not slanderous. 😂
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I suspect Recidivist was referring to the misuse of the word `slanderous`; you do not slander someone in writing - you `libel` them.

He was probably just poking a little fun at Certitude`s ignorance...

Edit to add: you must be able to type faster than me TM!😉
 
Jaffa_The_Hut said:
Well there’s a shock. 🙄

What about the thousands of deaths he’s said he’s responsible for? ‘death on his hands’ another one?

You may not have read his previous comments but I most certainly have all accusing him of of tens of thousands of Covid deaths.

If the comments were aimed at Owen Oyston he’d already be in court.

Not slanderous. 😂
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Is he wrong? Thousands have died unnecessarily. That's a fact. By delaying the implementation of containment measures, thousands have died. By moving elderly people out of hospitals into care homes, thousands have died. As PM, he's accountable.
 
Wizaard said:
Is he wrong? Thousands have died unnecessarily. That's a fact. By delaying the implementation of containment measures, thousands have died. By moving elderly people out of hospitals into care homes, thousands have died. As PM, he's accountable.
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If that was the case equally Scotland & Wales leaders are accountable.
Mistakes from all sides and the only accountability is the ballot box.
 
poolseasider said:
If that was the case equally Scotland & Wales leaders are accountable.
Mistakes from all sides and the only accountability is the ballot box.
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Scottish and Welsh policies are mostly driven by the wider UK Government policy but they do carry some responsibility. Of course, the numbers are much smaller.
 
Wizaard said:
Scottish and Welsh policies are mostly driven by the wider UK Government policy but they do carry some responsibility. Of course, the numbers are much smaller.
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Care home cases in Scotland have been a mess and don't start me on the bloke from Wales where you could buy fags but not sanitary products and kids clothes opened pubs up with no booze and restaurants to shut at 6 with a circuit breaker and cases shot up!
 
Wizaard said:
Finally he's learning from the multitude of mistakes. Not promising a fixed date for the end of lockdown is a tiny step in the right direction.

Having said that, saying it was will cautious but irreversible is an odd thing to say. Painting himself into a corner once the restrictions are starting to be lifted.
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He’ll be delighted with your feedback Wiz
 
poolseasider said:
Care home cases in Scotland have been a mess and don't start me on the bloke from Wales where you could buy fags but not sanitary products and kids clothes opened pubs up with no booze and restaurants to shut at 6 with a circuit breaker and cases shot up!
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But as a percentage of the overall population, Scotland and Wales are decidedly minor. Equally responsible is clearly not the case.

Many want us to be a world leader but seem to think that it's ok to paint the leader of one of the richest economies in the world as seemingly powerless to prevent anything. That's not the case.
 
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I think half the problem is his florid use of language. A lot of what he says doesn't really bear up to close scrutiny, but people get the impression that they understood what he was saying at the time they hear it. In that respect he's a bit like John Prescott, leavened with a bit of Latin.

If he really wanted to impress people, he would tell the ERG to fuck off, stay fucked off, and then invite them to fuck off into fuck off land all over again. People like Baker, Francois and Redwood truly are The Enemy Within, as far as the country's future is concerned.
 
Wizaard said:
Is he wrong? Thousands have died unnecessarily. That's a fact. By delaying the implementation of containment measures, thousands have died. By moving elderly people out of hospitals into care homes, thousands have died. As PM, he's accountable.
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Of course he/you are wrong you can’t say he’s personally responsible for thousands of deaths.
Of course things could have been done differently and yes things done sooner but no one could foresee what the future held.
If you feel Boris is accountable for thousands of deaths then every world leader in every country in the world has deaths on their hands and that’s just plain daft to even think that.
You and others will be blaming Boris next for all the cancer deaths which Covid has put treatments on the back burner.
What about the thousands of lives he’s saving right now in the rapid vaccine programs the Government are rolling out right now over 15m people vaccinated? Or does that not count being positive news?
Seriously When does the blame culture end?
 
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Towerpower99 said:
If Boris is to held accountable for UK deaths because of errors then will our European counterparts face the same charges for the Vaccine procurement fiasco that will ultimately cost many lives in the coming months?
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Exactly my point should we hang every world leader because of deaths do to with a global pandemic?
 
Any leader would have made fk ups in the face of a pandemic
Boris dies come across as a blagger and nobody would deny his opportunism.
However I do not believe he is part of the right wing looney ring of the conservatives who Robbie identifies. Taking these on will enhance his reputation with the electorate and business
My guess is he is a liberal when it comes to social and cultural matters
I suspect when this is over his response to the economic strife will not be hard austerity.
He is popular with the public and suspect he may try and deliver on his levelling up agenda
All goes to ensure Starmers task is massive
 
20togo said:
Of course, but as I said, damned if does damned if he doesn't. So what's your point?
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What do you mean what's my point? 'Damned if he does, damned if he doesn't' means nothing at all in the context of the discussion, you need to express yourself beyond a cliché to explain your defence of government Covid policy instead of trying to just turn it back on to those questioning decisions, which you do far too much.
 
Lytham_fy8 said:
What do you mean what's my point? 'Damned if he does, damned if he doesn't' means nothing at all in the context of the discussion, you need to express yourself beyond a cliché to explain your defence of government Covid policy instead of trying to just turn it back on to those questioning decisions, which you do far too much.
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If he announced a date for coming out of lockdown and he/we didn't achieve it people like yourself would be all over it like a rash. But then Wiz in his o/p criticises him for saying what he did. So in other words damned if he does and damned if he doesn't. Pretty simple really. It helps if you perhaps had read the o/p first.
 
Certitude said:
Accusing The Prime Minister of corruption is quite a slanderous accusation.
I’ve not seen any of the Press run this story - What do you know for absolute fact, that they don’t?
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This is the National Audit Office Investigation into government procurement during the COVID-19 pandemic, it clears the government, ministers etc of corruption.

I've posted it a number of times, the usual suspects know what it says, so they just ignore it and keep repeating their claims anyway.
 
20togo said:
Of course, but as I said, damned if does damned if he doesn't. So what's your point?
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I'd have a lot more respect for you shrugging your shoulders if you actually then went on to make an interesting, alternative point.

We can all pour scorn on the opinions of others. I'm well known for it. But if you don't have a counter-opinion, it tends to strangle debate at birth.
 
20togo said:
If he announced a date for coming out of lockdown and he/we didn't achieve it people like yourself would be all over it like a rash. But then Wiz in his o/p criticises him for saying what he did. So in other words damned if he does and damned if he doesn't. Pretty simple really. It helps if you perhaps had read the o/p first.
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Have you read the OP? I've given him credit for not announcing a date. At this point, despite pressure from the media, he's not tried to go the populist route for the first time ever.
 
gjr69 said:
Not much. See North Stands post lower down.
Or higher up from this post🙄
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Pretty much close to what I was alluding to. Labour have moved too far Left and deserted their core working class voters IMO. You only have to look at the seats the Tories won for the first time ever in the last election. Labour put their faith in a lunatic that wouldn’t tell anyone what his plans for Brexit were. People got fed up and voted for Boris as he promised he would deliver Brexit. And he did. Labour really need to move more centrist and stop pandering to the Liberal elites or they may well be doomed.
 
Scaramanga said:
Pretty much close to what I was alluding to. Labour have moved too far Left and deserted their core working class voters IMO. You only have to look at the seats the Tories won for the first time ever in the last election. Labour put their faith in a lunatic that wouldn’t tell anyone what his plans for Brexit were. People got fed up and voted for Boris as he promised he would deliver Brexit. And he did. Labour really need to move more centrist and stop pandering to the Liberal elites or they may well be doomed.
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The vast majority of the Tory cabinet are men who went to Eton and Oxbridge, and you talk about elites?
 
20's sums up a view which is very common - conservative ,cod patriotic and sense that people in power are somehow better and people who question this are naysayers.

If Boris came out tomorrow and said we are going to privatise the NHS he would say stop moaning,let's see how it works out its necessary etc etc

Not a criticism 20's and have family members with very similar views and your vote counts the same as anybody else's.

My worry is that some right wing populist loon ,akin to a British Trump could appeal to that very large constituency.
NB I do not believe Boris fits this role btw
Farage is another matter - give him a platform ,with union Jack's,chants if God Save the queen and stirring blasts of Jerusalem or Land if Hope and Glory and I'm afraid many would lap it up. MBGA
The Express and Mail readership would be all over it.
 
Wizaard said:
Have you read the OP? I've given him credit for not announcing a date. At this point, despite pressure from the media, he's not tried to go the populist route for the first time ever.
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Yes, you give him credit in your first para and then have a dig in your second.
 
Bisphamtang said:
20's sums up a view which is very common - conservative ,cod patriotic and sense that people in power are somehow better and people who question this are naysayers.

If Boris came out tomorrow and said we are going to privatise the NHS he would say stop moaning,let's see how it works out its necessary etc etc

Not a criticism 20's and have family members with very similar views and your vote counts the same as anybody else's.

My worry is that some right wing populist loon ,akin to a British Trump could appeal to that very large constituency.
NB I do not believe Boris fits this role btw
Farage is another matter - give him a platform ,with union Jack's,chants if God Save the queen and stirring blasts of Jerusalem or Land if Hope and Glory and I'm afraid many would lap it up. MBGA
The Express and Mail readership would be all over it.
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No problem with your post even if I disagree with a lot of of your assessment. I don't look up or down on anybody. Nobody is better than me and nobody is worse than me. No matter what position they hold. Those thoughts just aren't in my pysche at all. And again, the NHS should never be privatised.Massively against that. The problem is imo that the NHS Is pretty much unfixable. Billions and billions of pounds could be thrown at it and it still wouldn't necessarily fix it. I also think, there's plenty of industries that should never have been privatised.

It's just that I'm not gonna make a song and dance about it. I'll just get on with my life. And I think it's that point you recognise in me.
 
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