IF we win tomorrow

Adams Kebab said:
What do other teams do in semi-finals? Just knob it off as they’ve got a big game days after?

If they do let us know as it’s a new one on me.

Whether it’s a pound shop cup or not, I’m sure the players all wanted to get to Wembley… the team selection drastically reduced that.
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Look at it from Critchley's point of view. Would winning the Snacksters Microwaveable Double Cheeseburger Cup have made any difference to his a)job security or b)standing with the fans?

His remit will be to get the club promoted.
 
To be honest, I’m surprised anyone on here is still seriously dreaming of the play-offs with our current set-up, let alone what may lie beyond.

Chances of making the play-offs are absolutely minimal. Chances of winning the play-offs, much less so.

Chances of surviving in the C/ship - you’re ‘avin a 🦒
 
Lytham_fy8 said:
Look at it from Critchley's point of view. Would winning the Snacksters Microwaveable Double Cheeseburger Cup have made any difference to his a)job security or b)standing with the fans?

His remit will be to get the club promoted.
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If we finish outside the play-offs but had won the Cookson Street Trophy, I think it would only help A & B. Granted B is a tougher one but it would still pacify a few more 💯

If we finish outside the play-offs and exit at the semi-final stage without picking our better players I don’t think it does him any favours with A or B.

If we make the play-offs then it won’t matter.

The point is, there’s no point getting to a semi-final if you don’t try your best to get the final. That cup is tinpot till we drew Bolton and it then gets serious and we’ve severely reduced our chances by giving Matty Virtue 90 mins and playing Connolly and Beesley.

You can think all the above and not be wanting the Manager out, being dramatic and just saying it as it is. Tuesday night has heaped more pressure on him from a fanbase who aren’t already on board. Find it strange.

I hope it turns out right, but realistically I don’t think we’ve got the balls for it on the pitch and crucially in the dugout. Hope I’m wrong 🙏🏼
 
Adams Kebab said:
If we finish outside the play-offs but had won the Cookson Street Trophy, I think it would only help A & B. Granted B is a tougher one but it would still pacify a few more 💯

If we finish outside the play-offs and exit at the semi-final stage without picking our better players I don’t think it does him any favours with A or B.

If we make the play-offs then it won’t matter.

The point is, there’s no point getting to a semi-final if you don’t try your best to get the final. That cup is tinpot till we drew Bolton and it then gets serious and we’ve severely reduced our chances by giving Matty Virtue 90 mins and playing Connolly and Beesley.

You can think all the above and not be wanting the Manager out, being dramatic and just saying it as it is. Tuesday night has heaped more pressure on him from a fanbase who aren’t already on board. Find it strange.

I hope it turns out right, but realistically I don’t think we’ve got the balls for it on the pitch and crucially in the dugout. Hope I’m wrong 🙏🏼
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The Dickinsons Real Deal Trophy offers a Club like ours a great opportunity to give our fringe and semi-fit players some competitive football.

I’m not really sure that situation needs to change at the Semi-Final stage….

Critchley will sink or swim based on his record… Simple as that…

Let’s face it, the same DickHeads who were basically slating the competition and saying (Pre Peterborough League Game) that ‘getting to a tinpot cup final would be no consolation for failing to reach the Play Offs’ are now slating him for supposedly failing to take the cup seriously enough.
 
Adams Kebab said:
If we finish outside the play-offs but had won the Cookson Street Trophy, I think it would only help A & B. Granted B is a tougher one but it would still pacify a few more 💯

If we finish outside the play-offs and exit at the semi-final stage without picking our better players I don’t think it does him any favours with A or B.

If we make the play-offs then it won’t matter.

The point is, there’s no point getting to a semi-final if you don’t try your best to get the final. That cup is tinpot till we drew Bolton and it then gets serious and we’ve severely reduced our chances by giving Matty Virtue 90 mins and playing Connolly and Beesley.

You can think all the above and not be wanting the Manager out, being dramatic and just saying it as it is. Tuesday night has heaped more pressure on him from a fanbase who aren’t already on board. Find it strange.

I hope it turns out right, but realistically I don’t think we’ve got the balls for it on the pitch and crucially in the dugout. Hope I’m wrong 🙏🏼
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Aye, fair enough, good post.

I suppose I just don't really care about the Lidl Middle Aisle Shield.
 
straightatthewall said:
Wasn't evasive. I just didn't realise it was THAT important that you needed chapter and verse...

In my view, it's a game that wasn't as important as the league game against P'boro or the next league game v Bolton. Of the 3 games, it's the one that needed to be used to rest players IF the coach felt that players needed resting, because it should be the lowest in terms or priority. We have a squad of players who (in theory) can all play a role. The players that started and finished the game are all bone fide first team squad members. And with the exception of Virtue and O'Donnell, most have started plenty of games this season too. Now I'm not suggesting for a second that I think it was our best starting X1, but it WAS a competitive starting X1 and one that allowed others to recover ahead of a more important game in the bigger scheme of things.

That P'Boro chose to play a strong/unchanged team is P'Boro's choice. Not a lot we can do about it so it's pretty irrelevant to our situation. Same as if the roles were reversed.

Am I confident the 'gamble' will pay off? Or risking a Wembley appearance will be worth it as we drive up the league? Not really.
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i refer you to gjr's post.
 
Eternaloptimist said:
.............and when he announces his starting XI tomorrow some people will be against it regardless.
As for 6,000 not having belief in the selection on Tuesday night, was that at the final whistle?
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i never comment before a game on the managers team selection because i have to have faith in that he knows what he's doing. So that said, why shouldn't he be prone to criticism when it so often seems he's got it wrong. he's the manager, we are the fans and we judge him on what we see happen on the pitch. That's the way it's always been.
 
Lytham_fy8 said:
Look at it from Critchley's point of view. Would winning the Snacksters Microwaveable Double Cheeseburger Cup have made any difference to his a)job security or b)standing with the fans?

His remit will be to get the club promoted.
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Hang on a mo, defenders of critchley haven't been saying that. they've been saying it's a rebuilding job this season. At least you are now acknowledging that if his remit is to get us promoted and he doesn't achieve that then he's failed.
 
fcblackpool said:
Then really they should have sacked the BSM off early on. No point playing extra games.
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I think it worked well in terms of blooding younger players, fringe 1st team players and those coming back from injury. The main problem I have with this development team/squad thing is that it doesn't appear that they play many meaningful games! You could also argue that in the group stage BSM matches it would be better if Dobbie is the Head Coach with Critchley with a watching brief.
 
20togo said:
Hang on a mo, defenders of critchley haven't been saying that. they've been saying it's a rebuilding job this season. At least you are now acknowledging that if his remit is to get us promoted and he doesn't achieve that then he's failed.
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It's both 20s. Don't start taking it apart. It's a short and a long term job.
 
20togo said:
Hang on a mo, defenders of critchley haven't been saying that. they've been saying it's a rebuilding job this season. At least you are now acknowledging that if his remit is to get us promoted and he doesn't achieve that then he's failed.
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I didn't say how long he had.

I would imagine that at no point in the recruitment Sadler insisted that we had to win the Discarded Down a Back Street Heron Foods Bag Trophy.
 
1966_and_all_that said:
It's both 20s. Don't start taking it apart. It's a short and a long term job.
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why not? i've provided evidence to suggest that after 32 games this season we have not improved. He's brought plenty of his own players in but we aren't seeing any improvement in results or performance. On the whole there is no cohesion to how we play. So what progress are we making towards this long term objective?
 
Lytham_fy8 said:
I didn't say how long he had.

I would imagine that at no point in the recruitment Sadler insisted that we had to win the Discarded Down a Back Street Heron Foods Bag Trophy.
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your second line is deflection but the point is that we pretty much got to the semi=final and then he threw the opportunity away to get to a Wembley final. If you so devalue the competition and back the managers decision then why the hell did we not just concede games at the group stage? Would have saved all this debate and you and mary trying to justify the managers woeful team selection last tuesday! After all, the players and manager couldn't give a shit about playing a game at Wembley in your eyes!

As for how long he has, well if you think that he's achieved his objectives for this season and that Sadler and the fans should be happy with what they've seen then I'd say you are setting the bar very low.
 
20togo said:
why not? i've provided evidence to suggest that after 32 games this season we have not improved. He's brought plenty of his own players in but we aren't seeing any improvement in results or performance. On the whole there is no cohesion to how we play. So what progress are we making towards this long term objective?
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No, no. I'm not having a go at your position on this. I'm just saying that Critchley's job encompasses both requirements. As things stand, I'm heading in your direction.
 
20togo said:
your second line is deflection but the point is that we pretty much got to the semi=final and then he threw the opportunity away to get to a Wembley final. If you so devalue the competition and back the managers decision then why the hell did we not just concede games at the group stage? Would have saved all this debate and you and mary trying to justify the managers woeful team selection last tuesday! After all, the players and manager couldn't give a shit about playing a game at Wembley in your eyes!

As for how long he has, well if you think that he's achieved his objectives for this season and that Sadler and the fans should be happy with what they've seen then I'd say you are setting the bar very low.
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1. Where did I say he'd achieved his objectives, you're using my conjecture as a factual argument, which is silly.

2. Doesn't matter if I don't care about the Unlabelled Massive Bag of Fish Fingers From Iceland Cup, it seemed that that the manager did from his post match interview, you're projecting my apathy to the team, for arguments sake, which obviously isn't like you at all.
 
1966_and_all_that said:
No, no. I'm not having a go at your position on this. I'm just saying that Critchley's job encompasses both requirements. As things stand, I'm heading in your direction.
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yes, i realise that fro many of your previous posts. But the long term is not achievable if you don't start to make progress on the short term.
 
Lytham_fy8 said:
1. Where did I say he'd achieved his objectives, you're using my conjecture as a factual argument, which is silly.

2. Doesn't matter if I don't care about the Unlabelled Massive Bag of Fish Fingers From Iceland Cup, it seemed that that the manager did from his post match interview, you're projecting my apathy to the team, for arguments sake, which obviously isn't like you at all.
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re point 2 i've never known a manager not come out with the line that he's selected a team to win the game when the truth really is far from that.

You said his remit was promotion. i'm pretty sure that there won't be an open ended time scale to that.
 
Seainsea said:
I think it worked well in terms of blooding younger players, fringe 1st team players and those coming back from injury. The main problem I have with this development team/squad thing is that it doesn't appear that they play many meaningful games! You could also argue that in the group stage BSM matches it would be better if Dobbie is the Head Coach with Critchley with a watching brief.
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I think the Dobbie idea would have been a fantastic one.

Perhaps a dangerous one from some viewpoints.
 
20togo said:
re point 2 i've never known a manager not come out with the line that he's selected a team to win the game when the truth really is far from that.

You said his remit was promotion. i'm pretty sure that there won't be an open ended time scale to that.
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No one said open ended, I'm not sure Sadler is the one season or bust type either though.
 
Lytham_fy8 said:
No one said open ended, I'm not sure Sadler is the one season or bust type either though.
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but you were non committal and think people on here wrong to judge based on what we've seen to date. And mmm... let me think about this. Sadler is not the one season or bust type either. Two of the last three managers didn't last a season and that's excluding McCarthy! That said, i do think you're right in that he wouldn't like to be but the evidence suggests if he feels the need to make a change he's not afraid to do it.
 
This season isn't about bouncing back to the Championship if you are being realistic, clubs with much bigger fanbases and probably budgets have shown that you can be stuck in League 1 for years.
But the target for this season must've been to stop the rot, then start moving forward. This season my guess is that we probably fall short of the play offs but there is marginal progress.
My worry is that the same tactics are employed with a high turnover of players starting games and we don't look much better now than we did in September.
A lot of players are out of contract, most shouldn’t be kept on, the loan players obviously go back.
Probably need 10 players to come in for next season, getting to the Salters Wharf Too Good To Go final would've been progress in a consilidation/transition season.
I'm not sure the fanbase has the patience for a slow burn project under Critchley with little obvious progress and minimal communication from the club as to what the targets are.
 
Ok, if the BDSM Trophy was never our priority then why did we even bother getting out of the group stage ?
We could have just used it to trial out our fringe players / youngsters. It would certainly have helped to have not played that night game against Bolton for a start.
 
gjr said:
This season isn't about bouncing back to the Championship if you are being realistic, clubs with much bigger fanbases and probably budgets have shown that you can be stuck in League 1 for years.
But the target for this season must've been to stop the rot, then start moving forward. This season my guess is that we probably fall short of the play offs but there is marginal progress.
My worry is that the same tactics are employed with a high turnover of players starting games and we don't look much better now than we did in September.
A lot of players are out of contract, most shouldn’t be kept on, the loan players obviously go back.
Probably need 10 players to come in for next season, getting to the Salters Wharf Too Good To Go final would've been progress in a consilidation/transition season.
I'm not sure the fanbase has the patience for a slow burn project under Critchley with little obvious progress and minimal communication from the club as to what the targets are.
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tell me what marginal progress there has been. i've pretty mucb twice now provided evidence that there has been no progress made whatsoever.
and jeez if you want to say this has been a season to stop the rot and start moving forward, we'll we've not moved forwards at all. Yep, you may say we've had a high turn over of new players coming in and that takes time to bed them in. But now here you are saying we probably need another ten players to come in for next season. Do they need time to bed and settle in as well?
 
The amount of different names and therefore sponsors the cup has had in this thread alone must make it a very valuable cup to be in and win.

The Johnstones paint, Papa Johns, BSM, we buy any car, select car leasing, Dickinsons real deal, Iceland fish fingers, toughsheet, Andrex special wipe, used-condoms.com trophy.

One hell of a competition.
 
20togo said:
tell me what marginal progress there has been. i've pretty mucb twice now provided evidence that there has been no progress made whatsoever.
and jeez if you want to say this has been a season to stop the rot and start moving forward, we'll we've not moved forwards at all. Yep, you may say we've had a high turn over of new players coming in and that takes time to bed them in. But now here you are saying we probably need another ten players to come in for next season. Do they need time to bed and settle in as well?
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I'm saying there has been marginal progress and I mean that literally. It's barely noticeable but it's there. I'm not in the Critchley in camp or the Critchley out camp. I just want our team to do well with or without Critchley.
High manager turnover rarely gets good long term results but the clock is ticking in my opinion.
I'd score Critchley no more than 5 out of 10 for this season, for what it's worth I think he should stay for the duration of the season and assuming we don't go up serious consideration has to be given as to him starting next season with us.
As for 10 players coming in it has to be that way, look at the out of contracts and the loan players going back.
 
gjr said:
I'm saying there has been marginal progress and I mean that literally. It's barely noticeable but it's there. I'm not in the Critchley in camp or the Critchley out camp. I just want our team to do well with or without Critchley.
High manager turnover rarely gets good long term results but the clock is ticking in my opinion.
I'd score Critchley no more than 5 out of 10 for this season, for what it's worth I think he should stay for the duration of the season and assuming we don't go up serious consideration has to be given as to him starting next season with us.
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yep, pretty much agree with that apart from i'm not sure you could give me an example of this barely noticeable progress, Maybe some players have progressed like Casey.
 
20togo said:
yep, pretty much agree with that apart from i'm not sure you could give me an example of this barely noticeable progress, Maybe some players have progressed like Casey.
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You've got to really look for it!!
 
20togo said:
but you were non committal and think people on here wrong to judge based on what we've seen to date. And mmm... let me think about this. Sadler is not the one season or bust type either. Two of the last three managers didn't last a season and that's excluding McCarthy! That said, i do think you're right in that he wouldn't like to be but the evidence suggests if he feels the need to make a change he's not afraid to do it.
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Which probably means he sees progress.
 
Didn't care about going out and was delighted he played the team he did. I wonder if he thought Ferguson's side would be more second string.
Daft thing is we played shite but wasn't the worst I've seen us play and the subs did lift us but the pen killed us - another day and it might have worked.
For so many reasons, would love to stuff the Nobbers today.
 
20togo said:
i never comment before a game on the managers team selection because i have to have faith in that he knows what he's doing. So that said, why shouldn't he be prone to criticism when it so often seems he's got it wrong. he's the manager, we are the fans and we judge him on what we see happen on the pitch. That's the way it's always been.
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What I meant 20s was that quite a few will probably welcome the team selection but AFTER the event (if things do go pear shaped) they will suddenly say “I knew it was the wrong side as soon as ai saw it.”
In other words there are some on here who are very wise after the event.
It was aimed at the inane comment that 6,000 fans were unhappy with the team selection on Tuesday night.
 
BFC_BFC_BFC said:
The Dickinsons Real Deal Trophy offers a Club like ours a great opportunity to give our fringe and semi-fit players some competitive football.

I’m not really sure that situation needs to change at the Semi-Final stage….

Critchley will sink or swim based on his record… Simple as that…

Let’s face it, the same DickHeads who were basically slating the competition and saying (Pre Peterborough League Game) that ‘getting to a tinpot cup final would be no consolation for failing to reach the Play Offs’ are now slating him for supposedly failing to take the cup seriously enough.
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Spot on x3
If you remember I asked the question on Monday that if supporters had just one option then would they take a trip yep Wembley or sacrifice that to reach the play offs.
The vast majority voted play offs and yet now we are out of the comp those same people are moaning.
 
20togo said:
i'll look for it tomorrow and get back to you when I've hopefully seen some.
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Good evening, we turned it around after going behind. Subs made at half time for whatever reason, players playing where they are at their best. Definitely an improvement in my opinion but can we look good away at Orient on a Tuesday night. That really would be progress!
 
gjr said:
Good evening, we turned it around after going behind. Subs made at half time for whatever reason, players playing where they are at their best. Definitely an improvement in my opinion but can we look good away at Orient on a Tuesday night. That really would be progress!
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I'll get back to you tomorrow, Been out celebrating.
 
The cup was disappointing, Peterborough were at it, we pressed but not as effectively as we might have done.

We'd have been better off sitting back a little and inviting them forward then pressing maybe, until we had CJ and Lavery on later in the game maybe.

It's a squad game and to keep a good spirit, fresh legs etc for important league games NC mixed it up a little midweek.

It wasn't our night and we didn't setup quite right or adjust to them until later on.

Maybe he could have gone with a stronger side from the off and all who played would have been fine for today and just as much energy etc, but also maybe not.

The manager has to make calls like that based off seeing the squad and all the data.

If he didn't change it and we went out anyway, then maybe lost today with a tired team, I'm pretty sure he'd be getting pelters.
 
gjr said:
I'm saying there has been marginal progress and I mean that literally. It's barely noticeable but it's there. I'm not in the Critchley in camp or the Critchley out camp. I just want our team to do well with or without Critchley.
High manager turnover rarely gets good long term results but the clock is ticking in my opinion.
I'd score Critchley no more than 5 out of 10 for this season, for what it's worth I think he should stay for the duration of the season and assuming we don't go up serious consideration has to be given as to him starting next season with us.
As for 10 players coming in it has to be that way, look at the out of contracts and the loan players going back.
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go on then, I said i'd get back to you, so here goes.

Yesterday, was as good and as entertaining a game as I've seen from us for at least two seasons if not longer. But it takes two teams to make a great game and Bolton certainly played their part. To give Bolton credit I'd say as a team, they looked more structured and composed as a team than us and each player knew their role. They scared me to death in that first half with the number of quality balls they were putting into our box and it took some great defending from especially Marv to keep them out. On the other hand we weren't as free flowing as they were but what we did was produce outstanding moments of brilliance which took them apart and that wasn't just for our goals either. As I've said a few times, i never comment on team Ielection before a game because it can make you look foolish but if I had then no doubt like many others I'd have been left with egg on my face.

But going on to the bigger picture, sure it would be great if we could replicate that performance regularly but that ain't gonna happen. But what we have to do is get somewhere near it. we have to be much better on a regular basis and that starts on tuesday. As it stands we've produced two good league performances on a trot, that's all. Let's not get carried away too much yet.
 
20togo said:
go on then, I said i'd get back to you, so here goes.

Yesterday, was as good and as entertaining a game as I've seen from us for at least two seasons if not longer. But it takes two teams to make a great game and Bolton certainly played their part. To give Bolton credit I'd say as a team, they looked more structured and composed as a team than us and each player knew their role. They scared me to death in that first half with the number of quality balls they were putting into our box and it took some great defending from especially Marv to keep them out. On the other hand we weren't as free flowing as they were but what we did was produce outstanding moments of brilliance which took them apart and that wasn't just for our goals either. As I've said a few times, i never comment on team Ielection before a game because it can make you look foolish but if I had then no doubt like many others I'd have been left with egg on my face.

But going on to the bigger picture, sure it would be great if we could replicate that performance regularly but that ain't gonna happen. But what we have to do is get somewhere near it. we have to be much better on a regular basis and that starts on tuesday. As it stands we've produced two good league performances on a trot, that's all. Let's not get carried away too much yet.
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Agree with that and Grimshaw deserves some credit as well as Ekpiteta for keeping us in it. What the last couple of games has told me is that we don't have the players to dominate possession which is what Critchley said he wanted us to do this season. However we do have the players to be a very effective counter attacking side.
Maybe this is partly the reason why we have struggled against the teams perceived as being weaker. Chances to hit them on the counter attack are few and far between, and if they score first and shut up shop we are nullified.
It's up to Critchley to come up with solutions and I don't think he has helped himself by consistently picking players who aren't good enough and his very conservative use of substitutes.
Back to back wins against two of the stronger teams in the league is definitely the beginnings of signs of further progress. I'll be more convinced if we can pick up at least 4 points out of the next two games.
 
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gjr said:
Agree with that. What the last couple of games has told me is that we don't have the players to dominate possession which is what Critchley said he wanted us to do this season. However we do have the players to be a very effective counter attacking side.
Maybe this is partly the reason why we have struggled against the teams perceived as being weaker. Chances to hit them on the counter attack are few and far between, and if they score first and shut up shop we are nullified.
It's up to Critchley to come up with solutions and I don't think he has helped himself by consistently picking players who aren't good enough and his very conservative use of substitutes.
Back to back wins against two of the stronger teams in the league is definitely the beginnings of signs of further progress. I'll be more convinced if we can pick up at least 4 points out of the next two games.
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yep agree. Two very difficult games coming up against the form team in our division in orient and then Shrewsbury away where we rarely get anything.
 
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