Marvin

C

crunchtime

Well-known member
Much of the problem On Tuesday was down to Marvin's inability to play out from the back.
His nervousness and hesitancy put us on the back foot. The speed, or lack of, at which the ball moved forward into the midfield set the pace for all our play, particularly in the first half. High tempo we were not.

Now I like Marv. As a defender he's to good to lose but a ball playing centre back he is not.
To address this I wonder if he could switch to RCB and have Pennington in the middle taking the biggest responsibility for the majority of passes from Grimmy. I don't see why Pennington couldn't do a good job in the middle.
 
There's enough threads on Marv and being on the ball already. Have a read of them and you'll see the idea of him switching to RCB has been discussed too. Yep, think it's a decent option.
 
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crunchtime said:
Much of the problem On Tuesday was down to Marvin's inability to play out from the back.
His nervousness and hesitancy put us on the back foot. The speed, or lack of, at which the ball moved forward into the midfield set the pace for all our play, particularly in the first half. High tempo we were not.

Now I like Marv. As a defender he's to good to lose but a ball playing centre back he is not.
To address this I wonder if he could switch to RCB and have Pennington in the middle taking the biggest responsibility for the majority of passes from Grimmy. I don't see why Pennington couldn't do a good job in the middle.
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We had four central midfielders on the pitch, Norburn was dropping deep for the ball and the other 3, Carey, Morgan and Dougall were nowhere to be seen. Ekpiteta literally had no one to pass to several times, Carey and Dougall looked to be deliberately hiding from receiving the ball which gave him no option but to pass it to another centre back or play a long diagonal.
 
HighfieldSeasider said:
We had four central midfielders on the pitch, Norburn was dropping deep for the ball and the other 3, Carey, Morgan and Dougall were nowhere to be seen. Ekpiteta literally had no one to pass to several times, Carey and Dougall looked to be deliberately hiding from receiving the ball which gave him no option but to pass it to another centre back or play a long diagonal.
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If Critchley is intent on the central defenders maintaining their shape then it is right that the midfield link should come deep to collect the ball. We need to develop the play much quicker than we are doing at the moment.
 
It's not much of the problem though. How many touches did he have? It's an area to improve but it won't gloss over the fact we have no creativity in the final third or movement in front of him.
 
It was exactly the same last time with Critch, nobody in midfield finding space to move into so defenders can pass to them. It can’t be coincidence that it’s still a massive problem. Maybe they’re under orders to play like that, if they are, then the manager needs to sort himself out. If you watch the masters at this style of football; Man City, their midfielders and forwards, are constantly moving to find space, passing out from the back doesn’t work otherwise.
 
Too many players hiding is a huge factor. I mean I don't trust Marv on the ball in any circumstance, but what chance have you got when the only player willing to make themselves available for the ball is Norburn?

Not only are players like Carey and Morgan hiding. The rest of the team are far too static.

I like Marv. He's an exceptional defender. Our best defender. But his limitations on the ball are being highlighted by the lack of movement infront of him. I'd be very surprised if Weir isn't in the side come 2pm on saturday.
 
Jaffa_The_Hut said:
Simplest solution would be to drop the tactics of bringing the ball out from the back.

We don’t have good enough players to do that.

Only a matter of time before it backfires and we give a goal away we’ve been very lucky so far but our luck won’t keep lasting.
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We do, watch the Derby game, funnily enough Marv was not playing in that one.
 
Amazing that people want to solely focus on Marvs weakness rather than realise he's the best defender at the club. Why? Because he's the quickest, he's the best in the air, he reads the game very well allowing him to cover others. Of course he scares you when he's on the ball but you don't all applaud him when he basically gets 90% of his passes right do you? You just want to focus on his occasional blip, which sure he needs to work on and try and eliminate. How about giving him praise for everything he does well but I guess that doesn't suit some of you to do at the moment. Sad.
 
20togo said:
Amazing that people want to solely focus on Marvs weakness rather than realise he's the best defender at the club. Why? Because he's the quickest, he's the best in the air, he reads the game very well allowing him to cover others. Of course he scares you when he's on the ball but you don't all applaud him when he basically gets 90% of his passes right do you? You just want to focus on his occasional blip, which sure he needs to work on and try and eliminate. How about giving him praise for everything he does well but I guess that doesn't suit some of you to do at the moment. Sad.
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I appreciate all Marv's qualities but this aspect of his game IS causing a problem. It needs Critch to find a way to minimise this weakest elament of his game. Change his position, play it out differently whatever.
 
crunchtime said:
I appreciate all Marv's qualities but this aspect of his game IS causing a problem. It needs Critch to find a way to minimise this weakest elament of his game. Change his position, play it out differently whatever.
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Is that not for Critchley to sort out? If Marv is such a liability on the ball then ask why do all our back line, goalkeeper and midfield players even consider playing the ball to him? Just perhaps they have faith in him because they know he's a damn good player and imo the best defender at the club!.
 
Struggling to understand what Critch was hoping would happen with the 1st half tactics

Its like we were watching the same passage of play on repeat over and over, it was weird.

Marvin and the players didn't seem to know what they were doing, which is also weird when Critch gets all this praise for his organisation and helping them to understand their jobs in simple terms.

Second half was a big improvement.
 
20togo said:
Amazing that people want to solely focus on Marvs weakness rather than realise he's the best defender at the club. Why? Because he's the quickest, he's the best in the air, he reads the game very well allowing him to cover others. Of course he scares you when he's on the ball but you don't all applaud him when he basically gets 90% of his passes right do you? You just want to focus on his occasional blip, which sure he needs to work on and try and eliminate. How about giving him praise for everything he does well but I guess that doesn't suit some of you to do at the moment. Sad.
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20’s, the “occasional blip” has occurred in every game thus far.
I am not disputing his defensive abilities but so far this season he has looked nervous when trying to bring the ball out of defence. A suggestions earlier in this thread put the problem down to no-one to pass to then if that is the case I would rather him clear his lines and hoof it down the field rather than pass it about 5 yards to a teammate who is being closely marked. If this continues he will come unstuck and a team like Bolton will capitalise on it.
Maybe he is under instruction to bring it out of defence like that but surely Critch can see the problem.
As regards looking nervous and unsure I don’t understand because he is not a kid making his debut and when he’s played at a higher level I never noticed anything like that.
 
Eternaloptimist said:
20’s, the “occasional blip” has occurred in every game thus far.
I am not disputing his defensive abilities but so far this season he has looked nervous when trying to bring the ball out of defence. A suggestions earlier in this thread put the problem down to no-one to pass to then if that is the case I would rather him clear his lines and hoof it down the field rather than pass it about 5 yards to a teammate who is being closely marked. If this continues he will come unstuck and a team like Bolton will capitalise on it.
Maybe he is under instruction to bring it out of defence like that but surely Critch can see the problem.
As regards looking nervous and unsure I don’t understand because he is not a kid making his debut and when he’s played at a higher level I never noticed anything like that.
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yeah, i understand all that and of course he needs to take more care when on the ball for a variety of reasons. I did post this comment on anther thread which I feel is why he's coming under more scrutiny from fans. No matter though, he'd still always be in my team.



20togo said:
I'd suggest first and foremost Marv is picked because he's our best defender. But anyhow, consider this. Marv plays in the middle of a back five or back three. He's always the middle man in the most central area of the pitch. The ball is always more likely to be at his feet rather than any of the other four or two. Especially when we are starting to build up play again. The wider of the centre halves usually have the option to go back to Marv or out to the touchline. Marv doesn't really have that option. He usually only has the option to go to either of the other centre backs or go forward. Inevitable then that he'll be put under more pressure simply because he has possession of the ball more than the others. All that said, yep of course he scares the daylights out of you sometimes when he's on the ball.
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Marv is worth his place for his defensive skills, just don't expect him to be skillful on the ball.

And if we must play out from the back, don't give it him.
 
20togo said:
Amazing that people want to solely focus on Marvs weakness rather than realise he's the best defender at the club. Why? Because he's the quickest, he's the best in the air, he reads the game very well allowing him to cover others. Of course he scares you when he's on the ball but you don't all applaud him when he basically gets 90% of his passes right do you? You just want to focus on his occasional blip, which sure he needs to work on and try and eliminate. How about giving him praise for everything he does well but I guess that doesn't suit some of you to do at the moment. Sad.
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When you say 'occasional blip', I take it you're referring to those all-too-frequent occasions in which he commits some calamitous gaffe or other that invariably leads to a golden goal-scoring opportunity for the opposition. As you seemed to be attemping to play the whole issue down somewhat, I'm just trying to seek clarity ...
 
Halifax71 said:
Marv is worth his place for his defensive skills, just don't expect him to be skillful on the ball.

And if we must play out from the back, don't give it him.
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Anymore preconditions you wish to attach in the event of Marv being selected to play?

He's a professional footballer FFS. I really don't see where you're coming from ... I mean, during potentially 'stressful'
periods of play, are you suggesting that maybe we ought to think about sending someone supportive onto the pitch to try and boost his confidence?
 
From his 2nd half against Hibs, Oakley Booth looks like the one who can link defence to attack. I think he'll be the outlet we need but bringing Pennington back as well will give us that bit more urgency along the back line.
 
tarantula said:
When you say 'occasional blip', I take it you're referring to those all-too-frequent occasions in which he commits some calamitous gaffe or other that invariably leads to a golden goal-scoring opportunity for the opposition. As you seemed to be attemping to play the whole issue down somewhat, I'm just trying to seek clarity ...
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seek as much clarity as you want....... I just suggest you contact Critchley for it. And for your own clarity I suggest you read my posts on Marvin again.
 
onlyonepool said:
From his 2nd half against Hibs, Oakley Booth looks like the one who can link defence to attack. I think he'll be the outlet we need but bringing Pennington back as well will give us that bit more urgency along the back line.
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Yes I think Your right, Critchley knows he needs midfielders who can hold the ball better this is why Wier & Oakley Boothe have been brought in along with Norburn & Morgan .
 
Briggsysgonagetya said:
So drop Casey then ?? Casey deserves his place at the moment. Id rather have a back 3 of Casey, Penny and Husband with Marv on the bench
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I can imagine one or two scenarios without Marv stopping certain goals with his heading ability and giraffe like legs where Penny n co won’t mange to keep the ball out. I feel we’d miss Marv too much. I’d sooner see a back 4 with Penny by Marv’s side and Hubby left and Lyons or Casey right. If Casey picked there then Lyons on right midfield. A 4-3-3 go for it or a traditional 4-2-2 battle.
 
tarantula said:
Anymore preconditions you wish to attach in the event of Marv being selected to play?

He's a professional footballer FFS. I really don't see where you're coming from ... I mean, during potentially 'stressful'
periods of play, are you suggesting that maybe we ought to think about sending someone supportive onto the pitch to try and boost his confidence?
Click to expand...
You can’t do that ducky it’s 11 v 11
 
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