The new rules

TwelveAngryMen said:
From the horses mouth

It’s all very depressing 😞

apple.news

Coronavirus: Boris Johnson reveals new COVID-19 rules on face masks, fines, pubs and working from home — Sky News

Face masks will become compulsory for bar staff, shop workers, waiters and taxi passengers in an effort to combat the rise in coronavirus cases in England, the prime minister has announced.
apple.news apple.news
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Not sure how much effect any of that's going to have either, AFAICS there's very little transmission through any of those routes.
 
It was always odd that you had to wear a mask going into a bar, but the staff didn't. Ditto taxis.
 
Wizaard said:
It was always odd that you had to wear a mask going into a bar, but the staff didn't. Ditto taxis.
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Unless I’ve drastically missed something, there’s never been a rule about wearing masks in taxis in England.
I drive a bomber, and wear one if someone gets in the front with me, and make them wear one too, but don’t bother if all passengers are in the back.
My Perspex screen must be better than any mask?
 
TwelveAngryMen said:
I must admit I never got that one

I think it's about time they clamped down of the plethora of new asthmatics who claim to be medically exempt from wearing masks
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Agree entirely. I was in Asda in Fleetwood in May, and challenged 2 young women with children in tow who weren't wearing masks. They claimed they had asthma, and I said so do I but I'M wearing a mask.

I spotted them outside later puffing on their cigarettes. Couldn't have done their asthma much good!
 
Johnno said:
Unless I’ve drastically missed something, there’s never been a rule about wearing masks in taxis in England.
I drive a bomber, and wear one if someone gets in the front with me, and make them wear one too, but don’t bother if all passengers are in the back.
My Perspex screen must be better than any mask?
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Agree if there's a screen. Nearly all the taxis round our way are standaŕd saloons though. As a bit of a dog whistle they're also driven in the main by Asians.
 
Wizaard said:
Agree if there's a screen. Nearly all the taxis round our way are standaŕd saloons though. As a bit of a dog whistle they're also driven in the main by Asians.
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All our saloons have had temporary screens fitted at owners cost. I hope these new rules take things like this into consideration.
 
It saddens me reading many comments on here and seeing how easily people will turn on each other and point the finger of blame. Funny how it’s always other people rarely focus on their own misgivings.

I watched an interview on the news with a middle aged bloke the other night who was gobbing off about ‘young people’ who were apparently not social distancing in the street, whilst he was queuing up to go to the ** theatre.... !!

Maybe the best idea would be for individuals to focus on themselves and stop concerning themselves with what others are doing or not doing.
 
Wizaard said:
Perhaps they could wear an identifier on their clothes. Maybe a badge or something?
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Cat suggested the same thing the other day. Well, they do say it was the teachers, the nurses etc that were the worst .....
⭐
 
BFC_BFC_BFC said:
It saddens me reading many comments on here and seeing how easily people will turn on each other and point the finger of blame. Funny how it’s always other people rarely focus on their own misgivings.

I watched an interview on the news with a middle aged bloke the other night who was gobbing off about ‘young people’ who were apparently not social distancing in the street, whilst he was queuing up to go to the ** theatre.... !!

Maybe the best idea would be for individuals to focus on themselves and stop concerning themselves with what others are doing or not doing.
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I know what you mean. When I posted on the Eat Out to Help Out thread that maybe that scheme had added to the increase in infections, some people got quite cross at the suggestion they might have contributed to the problem.

I’m certainly not suggesting that we should all wrap ourselves in cotton wool and never leave the front door. Just accept that whenever we do go out, shopping, to a pub or restaurant, to the gym (all of which I’ve done) or the office, that we’re potentially adding to the problem. So maybe, as you say, pay a little more attention to our behaviour, and less to others.
 
TwelveAngryMen said:
I must admit I never got that one

I think it's about time they clamped down of the plethora of new asthmatics who claim to be medically exempt from wearing masks
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Couldn’t agree more, I se seemingly fit, healthy young men coming in claiming to have asthma and were not allowed to challenge or ask for medical evidence
 
To be honest I think everyone is ' overly precious ' about this identification thing
If you have an underlying medical condition that exempts you from what is otherwise a legal requirement to mask up in certain scenarios why shouldn't you be required to prove it ?
If as a disabled person you want to park on double yellow lines you display a badge and thereby don't get a parking ticket That seems to work fine
The problem is right now the system is wide open to abuse
You are only ever going to tackle that ( putting aside arguments as to what it achieves ) by
1/ Making shops legally responsible for those visiting their stores - ie they get fined as well if they allow anyone to enter without a mask ( or a valid exemption )
2/ Requiring individuals to produce a valid exemption issued by a medical practitioner
If you aren't going to do that knowing these rules are going to be in for 6 months or more then frankly it's going to descend into chaos with increased levels of non-compliance
 
Why get so hung up about a tiny minority of people who can’t wear face masks?

Requiring them to carry some kind of medical exemption? Seriously?

Maybe we could line them up and send the ones without a medical exemption to the gas chambers?

It’s a none issue
 
I'm not hung up about anything other than the absurdity of a rule that is unpoliceable in it's current format
And to be honest it does wind me up ( and I know many others ) if I enter a shop where there are people not complying
Don't bother with the big supermarkets since the pandemic started however I can't remember the last time I went into one of the smaller Tesco's when there wasn't someone in there unmasked
 
The new rules don't actually deviate that much from what's already in place. A phony remedy for a confected crisis. Pure theatre.
 
It’s odd how quickly attitudes can change.

Mask wearing has been the norm in the Far East for a long time. But if anyone had said 12 months ago, that not wearing a mask in the U.K. would potentially make you a pariah; well we’d all have just laughed.

Similarly the debate whether to inform on a neighbour who doesn’t observe The Rule of Six. And yet not that long ago we scratched our heads and wondered how the Stasi got such a hold on East Germany.

When people (from both left and right) bang on about how scarily easy it is to control behaviour, you sort of think; well they have a point.

And I’m not siding with the libertarian tendency, let’s just crack on, advocates when I say this. Just a slightly worrying observation really.
 
TwelveAngryMen said:
To be honest I think everyone is ' overly precious ' about this identification thing
If you have an underlying medical condition that exempts you from what is otherwise a legal requirement to mask up in certain scenarios why shouldn't you be required to prove it ?
If as a disabled person you want to park on double yellow lines you display a badge and thereby don't get a parking ticket That seems to work fine
The problem is right now the system is wide open to abuse
You are only ever going to tackle that ( putting aside arguments as to what it achieves ) by
1/ Making shops legally responsible for those visiting their stores - ie they get fined as well if they allow anyone to enter without a mask ( or a valid exemption )
2/ Requiring individuals to produce a valid exemption issued by a medical practitioner
If you aren't going to do that knowing these rules are going to be in for 6 months or more then frankly it's going to descend into chaos with increased levels of non-compliance
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👍
 
So masks and social distancing hasn’t worked ( hence the quadrupled cases) so we’re going to have more masks and more social distancing
 
Mexboroseasider said:
It’s odd how quickly attitudes can change.

Mask wearing has been the norm in the Far East for a long time. But if anyone had said 12 months ago, that not wearing a mask in the U.K. would potentially make you a pariah; well we’d all have just laughed.

Similarly the debate whether to inform on a neighbour who doesn’t observe The Rule of Six. And yet not that long ago we scratched our heads and wondered how the Stasi got such a hold on East Germany.

When people (from both left and right) bang on about how scarily easy it is to control behaviour, you sort of think; well they have a point.

And I’m not siding with the libertarian tendency, let’s just crack on, advocates when I say this. Just a slightly worrying observation really.
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It is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society (Jiddu Krishnamurti). And yet, some have taken to authoritarianism like a duck to water.
 
If you go into the main Tesco in Blackpool you will likely see a handful of people without masks at most. It’s really not worth bothering about...In fact they are most likely people who have genuine reason not to wear one.

There really is no need to make those who can’t wear one for medical reasons feel any worse than they already do by hassling them when they are simply buying their bloody groceries.

Like I say, if we all focus on our selves, rather than worrying about whether the bloke at checkout 3 is having everyone over by pretending really have asthma, then we’ll be just fine.

The idea of wasting Police or anyone else’s time on an issue of zero significance is just too ridiculous for words.
 
Mexboroseasider said:
It’s odd how quickly attitudes can change.

Mask wearing has been the norm in the Far East for a long time. But if anyone had said 12 months ago, that not wearing a mask in the U.K. would potentially make you a pariah; well we’d all have just laughed.

Similarly the debate whether to inform on a neighbour who doesn’t observe The Rule of Six. And yet not that long ago we scratched our heads and wondered how the Stasi got such a hold on East Germany.

When people (from both left and right) bang on about how scarily easy it is to control behaviour, you sort of think; well they have a point.

And I’m not siding with the libertarian tendency, let’s just crack on, advocates when I say this. Just a slightly worrying observation really.
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It’s a very worrying observation and we should all just check ourselves occasionally to ensure we’re not slipping into dangerous territory.

I remember in the early days when we had people on here who had been snooping in other people’s shopping trolleys to check whether or not they were purchasing “essential items” only😔

It can all become extremely divisive if you’re not careful and we all start to forget ourselves and focus on these insignificant irritants, instead of the bigger picture.

 
BFC_BFC_BFC said:
It’s a very worrying observation and we should all just check ourselves occasionally to ensure we’re not slipping into dangerous territory.

I remember in the early days when we had people on here who had been snooping in other people’s shopping trolleys to check whether or not they were purchasing “essential items” only😔

It can all become extremely divisive if you’re not careful and we all start to forget ourselves and focus on these insignificant irritants, instead of the bigger picture.

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If people can’t wear a mask there is no reason why they can’t wear one of those head shields
 
premierdream2010 said:
If people can’t wear a mask there is no reason why they can’t wear one of those head shields
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There’s plenty of reasons why people might not be able to wear any type of face covering. As I’ve said above it’s best to focus on yourself and keep your personal ignorance, prejudice and whatever other emotions that are triggered in check.
 
BFC_BFC_BFC said:
There’s plenty of reasons why people might not be able to wear any type of face covering. As I’ve said above it’s best to focus on yourself and keep your personal ignorance, prejudice and whatever other emotions that are triggered in check.
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If their health is such that they can't have anything within a foot of their face what the fuck are they doing out?
 
Wizaard said:
If their health is such that they can't have anything within a foot of their face what the fuck are they doing out?
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That’s a remarkably ignorant and pretty bigoted thing to say Wiz, I’m surprised tbh.

I’d maybe just have a think about the type of illnesses and disabilities (many which are commonplace) and reevaluate what you’ve said there.
 
We can make all the excuses for non-compliance we want The fact remains the vast majority are non-compliant out of choice and not because of underlying health conditions They use the health card as a convenient get out knowing that no one can challenge them - even the police

I’d be surprised if 10% of those you see not masking up shouldn’t for genuine health reasons

The obvious bi-product of that is that those who genuinely can’t wear a mask get tarred with the same brush as the default assumption is that they are breaking the rules

The additional problem that brings with it is the snowball effect - more and more will think ‘ fcuk it no one else is complying so why should I ? ‘

I was personally highly skeptical about the benefits of masks until quite recently however I’m aware of a scenario that convinced me it’s a step well worth taking

Whether you accept the benefits or not in the absence of collective compliance we inevitably face yet further restrictions on our liberties - as football fans we’ve already seen the setbacks to our hopes for return to games

Our ability to meet up with family members has also been compromised to a significant degree as a result of the recent spike

For me it’s time to stop accepting non-compliance with whatever rules are introduced ( whether we agree they are sensible ) - starting with mask wearing where required
 
TwelveAngryMen said:
We can make all the excuses for non-compliance we want The fact remains the vast majority are non-compliant out of choice and not because of underlying health conditions They use the health card as a convenient get out knowing that no one can challenge them - even the police

I’d be surprised if 10% of those you see not masking up shouldn’t for genuine health reasons

The obvious bi-product of that is that those who genuinely can’t wear a mask get tarred with the same brush as the default assumption is that they are breaking the rules

The additional problem that brings with it is the snowball effect - more and more will think ‘ fcuk it no one else is complying so why should I ? ‘

I was personally highly skeptical about the benefits of masks until quite recently however I’m aware of a scenario that convinced me it’s a step well worth taking

Whether you accept the benefits or not in the absence of collective compliance we inevitably face yet further restrictions on our liberties - as football fans we’ve already seen the setbacks to our hopes for return to games

Our ability to meet up with family members has also been compromised to a significant degree as a result of the recent spike

For me it’s time to stop accepting non-compliance with whatever rules are introduced ( whether we agree they are sensible ) - starting with mask wearing where required
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I think you've nailed the issue of non compliance. There are obviously people out there who are playing the exempt card and using it so they don't have to wear a mask..for whatever reason...embarrassment or political views. How you solve that is a whole different ball game. Staff are told not to challenge. Do we want to go to a "No Mask; No entry" policy? Plenty of door staff not working at the moment. Should they be employed at the entrances of major supermarkets etc.? Tongueincheeksmiley.
Looking at social media, there's a few RWNJ's complaining about infringements etc. These are the same types that evoke the trenches and use ridiculous phrases like "snowflake society" when it suits. Perhaps they need to look in the mirror.
 
TwelveAngryMen said:
We can make all the excuses for non-compliance we want The fact remains the vast majority are non-compliant out of choice and not because of underlying health conditions They use the health card as a convenient get out knowing that no one can challenge them - even the police

I’d be surprised if 10% of those you see not masking up shouldn’t for genuine health reasons

The obvious bi-product of that is that those who genuinely can’t wear a mask get tarred with the same brush as the default assumption is that they are breaking the rules

The additional problem that brings with it is the snowball effect - more and more will think ‘ fcuk it no one else is complying so why should I ? ‘

I was personally highly skeptical about the benefits of masks until quite recently however I’m aware of a scenario that convinced me it’s a step well worth taking

Whether you accept the benefits or not in the absence of collective compliance we inevitably face yet further restrictions on our liberties - as football fans we’ve already seen the setbacks to our hopes for return to games

Our ability to meet up with family members has also been compromised to a significant degree as a result of the recent spike

For me it’s time to stop accepting non-compliance with whatever rules are introduced ( whether we agree they are sensible ) - starting with mask wearing where required
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Well you certainly win “Sweeping statement of the week” award TAM.

Let’s face it mate, you have no idea whatsoever whether the tiny minority (I’d say less than 5% based on my experience) of people not wearing masks, have a relevant medical condition or not.

12% of the British publish suffer with asthma for starters. Some of them feeling the pressure to wear masks, due to this kind of nit picking. I’ve witnessed one poor lady collapse in Tesco, due to a mask induced asthma attack.

There’s also a whole range of other mental and physical conditions (many not immediately obvious) that might mean someone might not be able to wear a mask.

Your assumption (another wild one) that the infinitesimally small number of individuals who do not comply out of defiance will increase is also not borne out by my experience. In fact, I’d say that the opposite is true and, in fact, as Masks become more commonplace and acceptable, more people are dropping their initial resistance and willingly falling in line (much like your own personal experience). Is also add that in my view getting heavy handed and especially expecting shopkeepers to challenge individuals is likely to be counterproductive and simply reinforce their intent to kick against the system.

What we need instead is clear, unequivocal scientific advice on the benefits of mask wearing and to encourage everyone to wear a mask where possible.

In terms of dealing with non-compliance generally, I would say that there are far bigger fish to fry, than focusing on a very minor issue that is unlikely to have any significant effect on transmission overall.

In the longer term I would hope that more widespread testing will result in physical quarantining (hospitalisation) of people with the virus (as would have historically been the norm with an highly infectious disease) in order that healthy people are not subject to these ridiculously oppressive rules and the type of judgemental finger pointing in this thread.
 
southshorepool said:
I think you've nailed the issue of non compliance. There are obviously people out there who are playing the exempt card and using it so they don't have to wear a mask..for whatever reason...embarrassment or political views. How you solve that is a whole different ball game. Staff are told not to challenge. Do we want to go to a "No Mask; No entry" policy? Plenty of door staff not working at the moment. Should they be employed at the entrances of major supermarkets etc.? Tongueincheeksmiley.
Looking at social media, there's a few RWNJ's complaining about infringements etc. These are the same types that evoke the trenches and use ridiculous phrases like "snowflake society" when it suits. Perhaps they need to look in the mirror.
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So you would force people to choose between wearing a mask or buying groceries?

How about maybe we introduce a system whereby if you vote for labour you’re electricity is switched off or if you take part in a protest you are not allowed to use the NHS?
 
BFC_BFC_BFC said:
So you would force people to choose between wearing a mask or buying groceries?

How about maybe we introduce a system whereby if you vote for labour you’re electricity is switched off or if you take part in a protest you are not allowed to use the NHS?
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You can get groceries delivered in 2020. I do back your overriding stance of worrying about yourself mind.
 
BFC_BFC_BFC said:
Well you certainly win “Sweeping statement of the week” award TAM.

Let’s face it mate, you have no idea whatsoever whether the tiny minority (I’d say less than 5% based on my experience) of people not wearing masks, have a relevant medical condition or not. (1)

12% of the British publish suffer with asthma for starters. Some of them feeling the pressure to wear masks, due to this kind of nit picking. I’ve witnessed one poor lady collapse in Tesco, due to a mask induced asthma attack. (2)

There’s also a whole range of other mental and physical conditions (many not immediately obvious) that might mean someone might not be able to wear a mask. (3)

Your assumption (another wild one) that the infinitesimally small number of individuals who do not comply out of defiance will increase is also not borne out by my experience. In fact, I’d say that the opposite is true and, in fact, as Masks become more commonplace and acceptable, more people are dropping their initial resistance and willingly falling in line (much like your own personal experience). Is also add that in my view getting heavy handed and especially expecting shopkeepers to challenge individuals is likely to be counterproductive and simply reinforce their intent to kick against the system. (4)

What we need instead is clear, unequivocal scientific advice on the benefits of mask wearing and to encourage everyone to wear a mask where possible. (5)

In terms of dealing with non-compliance generally, I would say that there are far bigger fish to fry, than focusing on a very minor issue that is unlikely to have any significant effect on transmission overall. (6)

In the longer term I would hope that more widespread testing will result in physical quarantining (hospitalisation) of people with the virus (as would have historically been the norm with an highly infectious disease) in order that healthy people are not subject to these ridiculously oppressive rules and the type of judgemental finger pointing in this thread. (7)
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Numbers as inserted above :

(1) Your experience is no more valid than anyone else's though, is it? You've just plucked a number out of the air to fit your argument albeit you've expressed it so imprecisely I'm not sure what point you are actually making.

(2) How did you come by this diagnosis? You can't have gone with her to hospital, surely?

(3) I agree. But you didn't name any.

(4) It may seem "heavy-handed" and "counter-productive" to challenge people. But it is the people being challenged whose behaviour is at issue, isn't it? Asking someone a couple of pertinent questions doesn't pose a continuing health risk, after all.

(5) There is plenty of advice about the benefits of mask-wearing and how it is primarily for the protection of others. It is part of what convinced me I should wear one more often. I'm surprised you say you think there isn't any.

(6) You may think it is a minor issue. There are plenty of senior scientists who think that our reduction in the death rate from May until recently was in part because people were wearing masks in far greater numbers. With respect, you have no more idea of what the balance of factors affecting transmission is than any other layman.

(7) This is the crux of it, isn't it? You want to do your own thing, you don't like advice that cuts across it, and anyone who says different is bullying you. Being a contrarian is usually quite entertaining, but in this instance people who think and behave in this way are a bit of a public health liability, and I don't think it is unreasonable to point that out.

I think - for what my thoughts are worth - that this crackdown has been coming for a while. Far too many people just don't seem to be taking it seriously, or don't care about any greater good above and beyond their own. It doesn't surprise me, to be honest. The die was cast in the first week when a lot of people descended on the shops like locusts to strip them of everything they thought was of value, and to hell with anyone else.
 
basilrobbie said:
Numbers as inserted above :

(1) Your experience is no more valid than anyone else's though, is it? You've just plucked a number out of the air to fit your argument albeit you've expressed it so imprecisely I'm not sure what point you are actually making.
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It’s a fairly straightforward sentence to be fair.

I’ve not plucked a number out of the air either.

The point is, that TAM has no idea whether or not the small number of people not wearing facemasks have a medical condition or not. He’s simply assuming most of them don’t...

basilrobbie said:
Numbers as inserted above :

(2) How did you come by this diagnosis? You can't have gone with her to hospital, surely?
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No I didn’t... She apologised to the person behind the counter for taking off her mask. “It makes it hard for me to breathe” she said. Then removed the mask continued to struggle, before falling into the counter and needing help to a nearby seat.

I made an assumption, based on what she had said, that the mask had contributed to the problem. Do you think that assumption was unreasonable under the circumstances?

basilrobbie said:
Numbers as inserted above :

(3) I agree. But you didn't name any.
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Why would I need to?

Autism (In an member of the party)
Anxiety
OCD
Skin Problems
Asthma
Other respiratory illness
Epilepsy
Hearing Loss

Do you want a complete list?

basilrobbie said:
Numbers as inserted above :

(4) It may seem "heavy-handed" and "counter-productive" to challenge people. But it is the people being challenged whose behaviour is at issue, isn't it? Asking someone a couple of pertinent questions doesn't pose a continuing health risk, after all.
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No it’s not necessarily those people’s behaviour that is an issue. See medical reasons above.

The implications are that those people with conditions are placed under regular and undue stress and harassment.

And maybe there is a health risk. I’m not sure people respond to well to being challenged...There’s a real risk of escalation.

basilrobbie said:
Numbers as inserted above :

(5) There is plenty of advice about the benefits of mask-wearing and how it is primarily for the protection of others. It is part of what convinced me I should wear one more often. I'm surprised you say you think there isn't any.
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I didn’t say that I don’t think there is any did I? I simply think that ongoing education of the benefits and scientific consensus is more important than enforcement.

There is, of course, conflicting scientific advice.

basilrobbie said:
Numbers as inserted above :

(6) You may think it is a minor issue. There are plenty of senior scientists who think that our reduction in the death rate from May until recently was in part because people were wearing masks in far greater numbers. With respect, you have no more idea of what the balance of factors affecting transmission is than any other layman.
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Crikey Robbie, there’s more strawmanning in this post than a Piers Morgan interview. Have you actually read my post?

I am well aware of the number of people who are wearing masks vs not wearing masks. The number is insignificant. As I said above it’s less than 5%

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/08/07/face-coverings-becoming-new-normal-almost-everyone-wearing-one/amp/

basilrobbie said:
Numbers as inserted above :

(7) This is the crux of it, isn't it? You want to do your own thing, you don't like advice that cuts across it, and anyone who says different is bullying you. Being a contrarian is usually quite entertaining, but in this instance people who think and behave in this way are a bit of a public health liability, and I don't think it is unreasonable to point that out.
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More Strawmanning!!

Surely “The Crux of It” is the same for all of us... I.e. that we want to get back to normal as soon as possible. As things stand, I have absolutely no problem at all in complying with the government guidelines...Needs must.

The fact I think that there is a more appropriate way of managing infectious diseases over the long term has no bearing on the above.... It’s not unreasonable is it? We essentially cut back on our existing quarantine facilities... Perhaps this is a, not to gentle, reminder that wasn’t a good idea.

basilrobbie said:
Numbers as inserted above :

I think - for what my thoughts are worth - that this crackdown has been coming for a while. Far too many people just don't seem to be taking it seriously, or don't care about any greater good above and beyond their own. It doesn't surprise me, to be honest. The die was cast in the first week when a lot of people descended on the shops like locusts to strip them of everything they thought was of value, and to hell with anyone else.
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I think you’re expressing a pretty cynical and narrow minded perspective against a backdrop of an extremely complex set of circumstances.

The “Crackdown” as you call it... has perhaps become necessary, due to a regular stream of poorly framed and often contradictory messaging from a government that has failed to get a grip of the situation.

The public were demonstrated to have been highly compliant during lockdown. The problem since has essentially been that large swathes of the population haven’t had a clue what the guidance has been.

From a simplistic perspective, the messaging for many in our population has boiled down to:

1 - We’re in lockdown - Rules Apply
2 - Lockdown has ended - Back to Normal

The rest of it had been so inconsistent or changeable that it has just become background noise.
 
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Having asthma doesn't mean you shouldn't wear a mask though does it ?

More often than not it's just the usual excuse those who don't want to wear them trot out when challenged

I wasn't even trying to be scientific with my 10 % - equally I bet it's not far off
 
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BFC_BFC_BFC said:
So you would force people to choose between wearing a mask or buying groceries?

How about maybe we introduce a system whereby if you vote for labour you’re electricity is switched off or if you take part in a protest you are not allowed to use the NHS?
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I posited a question. No more; no less. It's a difficult issue to police without ostracising people. The phrase tongueincheeksmiley was a clue.
TAM is right though in that a number of people are shitting all over the rules.
 
The actual wording states anyone who is distressed by putting a mask on or is unable to do so for any reason, doesn't have to. That covers a lot of people so the problem (if there is one) lies in the legislation. No point getting humpty with people for doing whatever they want within the law.
 
Supermarkets introduced special hours for NHS and Key Workers to do their shopping. Perhaps they could introduce an hour or two whilst those who are exempt or don’t want to wear a mask could go in and do their shopping, plus anyone who can or is happy to wear a mask can do do if they choose but will be aware that non mask wearers will be around them. Then at all other times mask wearing would be mandatory.

I would suggest 22:00 till 05:59 because the virus goes to bed at 10pm and the rule of six doesn’t apply yet and of course any staff who felt uncomfortable working in an unmasked environment wouldn’t have to work at those times.

And please please remember the Golden Rule - A stitch in time saves nine.
 
rockontommy said:
The actual wording states anyone who is distressed by putting a mask on or is unable to do so for any reason, doesn't have to. That covers a lot of people so the problem (if there is one) lies in the legislation. No point getting humpty with people for doing whatever they want within the law.
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True which is why I was suggesting that if the masking rules are to be applied they need tightening up but as they stand they are unenforceable
As we all face fines for having the temerity to covertly meet up with our own families I fail to understand why the rules on masking are so lax
 
Wizaard said:
Agree if there's a screen. Nearly all the taxis round our way are standaŕd saloons though. As a bit of a dog whistle they're also driven in the main by Asians.
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I think Bomber drivers with screens are fine. Interesting a friend of mine drives a Saloon. He has just changed Company. The New Company has screens fitted in all saloons. His previous one did not. The Majority of drivers & owners here are not Asian. I think its down to the Company to fit screens of course its an additional expense and some companies will not do so Asian run or otherwise.

But i know which taxi company i would use right now, the one who has fitted screens.
Business owners have a responsibility (Be they shops, Taxi proprietors etc) Its about making people feel more secure about using your business & getting into your vehicles right now.

Some will probably bleat that the Gov should pick up the tab for screens for every taxi in the land but in reality business must take responsibility.
 
TwelveAngryMen said:
Having asthma doesn't mean you shouldn't wear a mask though does it ?

More often than not it's just the usual excuse those who don't want to wear them trot out when challenged

I wasn't even trying to be scientific with my 10 % - equally I bet it's not far off
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It’s actually less than 5% and falling (as detailed in the article that quotes the ONS stats). It’s also pretty obvious when you go into the supermarket and only one or two people out of hundreds are not wearing face coverings.

Clearly not all asthmatics are not wearing face-coverings, likewise people with a whole range of medical reasons.

As I have said repeatedly, the percentage not wearing them is now so small it’s a complete non-issue.
 
TwelveAngryMen said:
True which is why I was suggesting that if the masking rules are to be applied they need tightening up but as they stand they are unenforceable
As we all face fines for having the temerity to covertly meet up with our own families I fail to understand why the rules on masking are so lax
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You can be fined up to £200 for not wearing a mask!!
 
Bottom line is none of us want to wear masks by choice but realise our responsibilities.
Pisses me off how many people still don't whilst shopping & I can't believe all of the are 'legally' exempt. Surely the list BFCx3 provides would suggest they fall into the vulnerable group & therefore should be shielding themselves especially since this latest spike. As others have said online shopping, it's 2020. Yes bang on about the potential mental health issues with shielding/lockdown but things need to be black & white now with far less greys whereby people take the piss.
 
BFC_BFC_BFC said:
You can be fined up to £200 for not wearing a mask!!
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You can be fined for dropping litter or a cigarette butt in the street. So fkin what!
It doesnt stop selfish idiots with little regard for their environment doing it.🤪
Some folk just dont give a fuck.
 
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