Uk Is a Facist State

C

Camberwell1

Well-known member
Discuss - the evidence

Leaves the EU (no-one really understood/understands why
Exports any undesirables randomly to Rawanda
Elects a liar PM
Has a police force now with created powers than its Moscow equivalents and arrests lawyers (after threatening them first) for holding up blank pieces of paper (and he was a lawyer!)

So our visit to London in our Tangerine Crowns on Sat should be rather I terestibg - I will be taking my BASIL Legal Advisors with me naturally
 
Camberwell1 said:
Discuss - the evidence

Leaves the EU (no-one really understood/understands why
Exports any undesirables randomly to Rawanda
Elects a liar PM
Has a police force now with created powers than its Moscow equivalents and arrests lawyers (after threatening them first) for holding up blank pieces of paper (and he was a lawyer!)

So our visit to London in our Tangerine Crowns on Sat should be rather I terestibg - I will be taking my BASIL Legal Advisors with me naturally
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Not far off, some people love to be controlled. It's becoming a little bit like zombie nation Russia.
 
Camberwell1 said:
Discuss - the evidence

Leaves the EU (no-one really understood/understands why
Exports any undesirables randomly to Rawanda
Elects a liar PM
Has a police force now with created powers than its Moscow equivalents and arrests lawyers (after threatening them first) for holding up blank pieces of paper (and he was a lawyer!)

So our visit to London in our Tangerine Crowns on Sat should be rather I terestibg - I will be taking my BASIL Legal Advisors with me naturally
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Arrested for holding up blank paper is all a bit thought police, on the basis you might write or think something abusive.
 
April13th1970 said:
If people hate this country so much, why don't they bugger off to North Korea and live in that worker's paradise
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Part of living here is the freedom to say what you want, within the bounds of common decency.

People have died for these freedoms, and don't have to go elsewhere.

It's because people love the country they want to retain their hard won freedoms.

If they hated the country they might go elsewhere.
 
Wizaard said:
Part of living here is the freedom to say what you want, within the bounds of common decency.

People have died for these freedoms, and don't have to go elsewhere.

It's because people love the country they want to retain their hard won freedoms.

If they hated the country they might go elsewhere.
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Wizard - Don’t be so patronising, read the latest police powers, YOU have few/no democratic rights to demonstrate, speak your mind etc etc or even hold up a blank piece of paper in case it upsets Royalists ! What a joke ! What’s wrong with being a Republican - that’s free speech in any part of the Highlands or Isle of Wight

They do leave the UK in their droves, emigration is a third higher since Brexit and the feet voting with the poorest is rising even higher. I doubt they go to North Korea or even N Fylde, but the disenchantment with our countries is changing (for the worst) because of mostly it’s politics, general unfairness and total lack of optimism and opportunity.
 
Wizaard said:
Part of living here is the freedom to say what you want, within the bounds of common decency.

People have died for these freedoms, and don't have to go elsewhere.

It's because people love the country they want to retain their hard won freedoms.

If they hated the country they might go elsewhere.
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agreed. We just don’t all agree on the definition of common decency.
 
Camberwell1 said:
Discuss - the evidence

Leaves the EU (no-one really understood/understands why
Exports any undesirables randomly to Rawanda
Elects a liar PM
Has a police force now with created powers than its Moscow equivalents and arrests lawyers (after threatening them first) for holding up blank pieces of paper (and he was a lawyer!)

So our visit to London in our Tangerine Crowns on Sat should be rather I terestibg - I will be taking my BASIL Legal Advisors with me naturally
Click to expand...
Discuss - the evidence

Leaves the EU (no-one really understood/understands why (We had a referendum and voted to leave)
Exports any undesirables randomly to Rawanda (They are illegal economic migrants and have no right to be here, Denmark also takes this stance)
Elects a liar PM (All MPs are liars, wake up)
Has a police force now with created powers than its Moscow equivalents and arrests lawyers (after threatening them first) for holding up blank pieces of paper (and he was a lawyer!) (I agree, this is weird and wrong, but there's a time and place for it and now is not it, have some respect)

So our visit to London in our Tangerine Crowns on Sat should be rather I terestibg - I will be taking my BASIL Legal Advisors with me naturally (I don't understand this sentance)
 
Scaramanga said:
Discuss - the evidence

Leaves the EU (no-one really understood/understands why (We had a referendum and voted to leave)
Exports any undesirables randomly to Rawanda (They are illegal economic migrants and have no right to be here, Denmark also takes this stance)
Elects a liar PM (All MPs are liars, wake up)
Has a police force now with created powers than its Moscow equivalents and arrests lawyers (after threatening them first) for holding up blank pieces of paper (and he was a lawyer!) (I agree, this is weird and wrong, but there's a time and place for it and now is not it, have some respect)

So our visit to London in our Tangerine Crowns on Sat should be rather I terestibg - I will be taking my BASIL Legal Advisors with me naturally (I don't understand this sentance)
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Too early... think the op might still be sleeping off his .. far left utopian dream binge...😉
 
Maybe ask all the people that come here on dinghy's why they have opted to risk there lives to move to a Fascist country, the replies would be interesting.
 
Scaramanga said:
Maybe ask all the people that come here on dinghy's why they have opted to risk there lives to move to a Fascist country, the replies would be interesting.
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I’d think you’d have to be pretty desperate to make those journeys.

It makes me wonder what they’ve gone through to put their lives at risk.

But they’re just economic migrants though right?
 
In answer to the O/P, it isn't yet but there are some very worrying signs.

The proliferation of people, including many on here, who have little concept of democracy. Our General Elections give one party or another the chance to Govern for 5 years. The mandate for this, due to FPTP, is nearly always from a minority of voters, never mind the population. Governments in a democracy are not entitled to enact legislation which prevents a change at the next GE, something called Gerrymandering (Remember Shirley Porter?)

The right to peaceful protest is almost the very essence of a democracy. As soon as it is curtailed because someone might be offended, it is another step on the slippery slope. People from a minority, of whatever political persuasion, who think that their view is so right that anyone who disagrees should leave the country is only a couple of steps away from saying they should be locked up. Basic workers rights to association, paid holidays, withdrawn of labour, days off, should not even be up for discussion, yet they are and not just by Rees Mogg. Nazi Germany in the 30's enacted exactly this, it basically turns workers into slaves. In this case, Big Business is the ultimate arbiter, not an elected politician. The nonsense of Freeports where a business runs everything from business through Police, healthcare and the judiciary, if that doesn't scare the carp out of you, you are not concentrating.

Intolerance by all sides of Politics is facilitating this change, there has to be right and wrong rather than constructive discussion and compromise.
 
Tangerinemoss said:
In answer to the O/P, it isn't yet but there are some very worrying signs.

The proliferation of people, including many on here, who have little concept of democracy. Our General Elections give one party or another the chance to Govern for 5 years. The mandate for this, due to FPTP, is nearly always from a minority of voters, never mind the population. Governments in a democracy are not entitled to enact legislation which prevents a change at the next GE, something called Gerrymandering (Remember Shirley Porter?)

The right to peaceful protest is almost the very essence of a democracy. As soon as it is curtailed because someone might be offended, it is another step on the slippery slope. People from a minority, of whatever political persuasion, who think that their view is so right that anyone who disagrees should leave the country is only a couple of steps away from saying they should be locked up. Basic workers rights to association, paid holidays, withdrawn of labour, days off, should not even be up for discussion, yet they are and not just by Rees Mogg. Nazi Germany in the 30's enacted exactly this, it basically turns workers into slaves. In this case, Big Business is the ultimate arbiter, not an elected politician. The nonsense of Freeports where a business runs everything from business through Police, healthcare and the judiciary, if that doesn't scare the carp out of you, you are not concentrating.

Intolerance by all sides of Politics is facilitating this change, there has to be right and wrong rather than constructive discussion and compromise.
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Completely agree with this.
The recent policing bill has curtailed the right to peaceful protest and is now being used against protesters, it's not really what I would consider to be British.

Here is a view on events from the US;
 
TheRealKingKenny said:
I’d think you’d have to be pretty desperate to make those journeys.

It makes me wonder what they’ve gone through to put their lives at risk.

But they’re just economic migrants though right?
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The majority are apparently from Albania, which AFAIK isn't in the middle of a war or anything: https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/priti-patel-channel-isu-albania-border-force-b2151836.html

The majority of a record-breaking number of migrants who arrived in the UK were from Albania, according to reports from Border Force officers.

The ISU union, which represents staff working for the Home Office’s law enforcement body, said its members had seen an increase in people from the south-eastern European country making the Channel crossing in the last few months.

Government officials believe around 60% of migrants making the crossing each day now are Albanian,
 
Lost Seasider said:
The majority are apparently from Albania, which AFAIK isn't in the middle of a war or anything: https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/priti-patel-channel-isu-albania-border-force-b2151836.html

The majority of a record-breaking number of migrants who arrived in the UK were from Albania, according to reports from Border Force officers.

The ISU union, which represents staff working for the Home Office’s law enforcement body, said its members had seen an increase in people from the south-eastern European country making the Channel crossing in the last few months.

Government officials believe around 60% of migrants making the crossing each day now are Albanian,
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These people are unfortunate victims of criminality. They’ll get sent back or die crossing the channel so there’s nothing for you to worry about.
 
Scaramanga said:
They might die trying, but they wont get sent back to France.
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The UK is working with Albania to return any Albanian nationals who are here illegally. There’s a government statement out there somewhere.
 
Trammo said:
No free movement exists between the UK and one EU member country aka Republic Of Ireland.
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I stand corrected, I’m not aware of the rules around the ROI as it’s not on my radar to move there whereas I am in the process of looking to move to continental Europe as my fiancé is Swedish. She can move anywhere in Europe, must be nice.
 
I'm not surprised she doesn't want to live in Sweden. Isn't the hard right on the verge of getting in due to horrific immigration issues.
 
Scaramanga said:
I'm not surprised she doesn't want to live in Sweden. Isn't the hard right on the verge of getting in due to horrific immigration issues.
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She’s worried about the election, we’re not going there right now for a few different reasons.

Although despite issues around immigration they have two years paid maternity leave, free childcare, great public services, free higher education and a very high standard of living.

We intend to settle there eventually as we’d rather bring our kids up there than here, that’s for sure.
 
Lost Seasider said:
How are they victims of criminality?
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Our government have said they are being sold lies by the criminal gangs. Who knows what they’re being told but I can’t imagine it’s a high chance of death and immediate deportation but it sounds like exploitation.

Anyway, UTP tonight.
 
TheRealKingKenny said:
Our government have said they are being sold lies by the criminal gangs. Who knows what they’re being told but I can’t imagine it’s a high chance of death and immediate deportation but it sounds like exploitation.

Anyway, UTP tonight.
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So they're victims of criminality, in the sense that they're paying criminals to smuggle them into the UK, were they victims of criminality before they left Albania?

Do you have any evidence for your claims?
 
Lost Seasider said:
So they're victims of criminality, in the sense that they're paying criminals to smuggle them into the UK, were they victims of criminality before they left Albania?

Do you have any evidence for your claims?
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Only what the British Government has said in a statement regarding the people arriving from Albania where they said Albanians are being sold lies by criminal gangs.

What those lies are, no idea. I think being sold lies by a criminal gang makes them victims of said criminal gangs, especially with the risks involved.

If someone dies in the channel and has been lied to and exploited by a criminal gang then I would blame the gang and consider the deceased the victim.

I hope that is a sufficient explanation of the words I used. Not sure why you have such a problem with it to be honest.
 
TheRealKingKenny said:
Only what the British Government has said in a statement regarding the people arriving from Albania where they said Albanians are being sold lies by criminal gangs.

What those lies are, no idea. I think being sold lies by a criminal gang makes them victims of said criminal gangs, especially with the risks involved.

If someone dies in the channel and has been lied to and exploited by a criminal gang then I would blame the gang and consider the deceased the victim.

I hope that is a sufficient explanation of the words I used. Not sure why you have such a problem with it to be honest.
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I'm not sure that a half-remembered statement by someone in HMG qualifies as reliable evidence, they're not likely to come out and say "the people-traffickers are doing a great job" are they?
 
The
Lost Seasider said:
I'm not sure that a half-remembered statement by someone in HMG qualifies as reliable evidence, they're not likely to come out and say "the people-traffickers are doing a great job" are they?
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Stop trying to rewrite history.

The former Home Secretary was forever banging on about the “evil” and “ruthless” criminal gangs that were exploiting immigrants.
 
Lost Seasider said:
I'm not sure that a half-remembered statement by someone in HMG qualifies as reliable evidence, they're not likely to come out and say "the people-traffickers are doing a great job" are they?
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It isn’t half remembered, I read it today. It’s from a government statement. It could be complete bollocks but all I’ve tried to do is explain why I said what I said. Hopefully I have and that can be the end of this exchange 👍🏻
 
TheRealKingKenny said:
It isn’t half remembered, I read it today. It’s from a government statement. It could be complete bollocks but all I’ve tried to do is explain why I said what I said. Hopefully I have and that can be the end of this exchange 👍🏻
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Okay, but your original post was:

I’d think you’d have to be pretty desperate to make those journeys.

It makes me wonder what they’ve gone through to put their lives at risk.

But they’re just economic migrants though right?

When I pointed out that 60% were from Albania your reply was:

These people are unfortunate victims of criminality;

which to me sounded like you thought that put them on a par with refugees from war zones or similar.

So can we both agree that these people are not genuine refugees and are instead economic migrants.
 
Mexboroseasider said:
The

Stop trying to rewrite history.

The former Home Secretary was forever banging on about the “evil” and “ruthless” criminal gangs that were exploiting immigrants.
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I'm just asking for posters to be clear and accurate in what they're saying.

As to what the former HS said, I don't generally watch broadcast media, so you have me at a disadvantage on that one, but having searched it appears to me that she is implying that the exploitation is they are being fed lies about us being a soft touch where the streets are paved with gold, and using that to entice them to pay for transit to the UK.

Fair enough, the above may apply to some, a less charitable version is that a significant number of the migrants seem to be members of the crime gangs, who can't get here legally, and are here for criminal purposes: https://www.spectator.co.uk/article...sings-are-making-our-borders-look-like-a-joke

While some may be legitimately claiming asylum, there are strong grounds for believing that the Albanian criminals who have recently muscled in on the cross-Channel migrant racket are shipping in reinforcements for organised drugs gangs in big British cities where they now have 'considerable control' of the cocaine market.

Lucy Moreton of the Immigration Service Union, representing Border Force officers, says: ‘We are getting an increasing amount of violence. That tends to go with the nationalities. There are a lot of young males. A lot of prison tattoos and prison haircuts. I have had two staff attacked in the last week.’

Unless ministers have identified violent criminality as an economic sector suffering from acute labour shortages and meriting its own seasonal worker scheme, it is very hard to put a positive spin on this.


So things are clearly more complicated than a simple narrative of "victims of criminal gangs", and I think it is right to challenge claims that it is.
 
Lost Seasider said:
Okay, but your original post was:

I’d think you’d have to be pretty desperate to make those journeys.

It makes me wonder what they’ve gone through to put their lives at risk.

But they’re just economic migrants though right?

When I pointed out that 60% were from Albania your reply was:

These people are unfortunate victims of criminality;

which to me sounded like you thought that put them on a par with refugees from war zones or similar.

So can we both agree that these people are not genuine refugees and are instead economic migrants.
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Enjoy the game.
 
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