Who’s going to blink?

M

Matesrates

Well-known member
Putin has said that unless western countries pay for gas in roubles, he will cut of supplies at midnight tonight. Austria, Germany and France as well as several other European countries buy huge amounts from Russia and if they don’t agree and he carries out his threat, they will have to ration gas. That would mean something like a four day week, which would have a devastating impact on the economy.

if they do agree, they’re propping up the rouble and helping Putin to fund the war, if they don’t, then Russia will suffer hugely as well.
 
Hope no blinkers but if guessing I would go for Italy as they are very reliant on Russian gas and have a weaker economy than France and Germany.
 
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Mad Vlad and his Generals have f2cked up since day 1 of the Russian invasion this could another to add to their miscalculations.

A couple of weeks before Vlad started the war the US/Biden organized tanker ships with LPG to be delivered to various European countries so they have extra stock. Every country will also strategic reserves of oil and gas .... that's standard.

Yesterday Biden announced he was releasing 1 million barrels of oil per day for the next 6 months and other countries are expected to do the same to control the price and the stocks.
 
It looks like the west are going to stand their ground on this one too. Germany for example preferring to potentially put gas on rations rather than be blackmailed.

Another self-sabotaging move by Putin.

Reports now state that he has put some of his advisors under house arrest due to the strategic failure of his war.

It really has been a abject failure in terms of achieving objectives with most of them backfiring on him in the short and probably long term.
 
tangerine_neil said:
Shocking that these so-called economic powerhouses of Europe are so overly reliant on Russia. That must change.
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It was a deliberate policy of interdependence by Germany, they thought trade with Russia would make war less likely or impossible (hence the pipeline construction that has since been cancelled). Clearly this policy has failed. I am glad that they are standing up to Putin and he has chosen exactly the wrong time of year to make this threat, it would have been far more effective in September or October.
 
OMV Austrian energy company rumoured to be blinking according to Sky News today though not confirmed.
 
“Moscow receives up to €800m from EU customers each day for its gas. Wave goodbye to that, and Mr Putin's war effort is even more severely hobbled.”

Per day!
 
ElBurroSinNombre said:
It was a deliberate policy of interdependence by Germany, they thought trade with Russia would make war less likely or impossible (hence the pipeline construction that has since been cancelled). Clearly this policy has failed. I am glad that they are standing up to Putin and he has chosen exactly the wrong time of year to make this threat, it would have been far more effective in September or October.
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The Germans have been naive in hindsight. After World War Two, they have bent over backwards to promote peace, keeping concentration camps as reminders of never to be repeated horrors etc. having had their country devastated so badly and knowing the full horrors of war. After 75 years of peace they must have believed that atrocities in Europe were consigned to history.

I remember 25 years ago at University, a young German teacher, who had been teaching modules on Jewish History and the subsequent admission of the horrors that took place, asked the class if the Holocaust could ever happen again? She had grown up in Post-War Germany where they were taught how bad things had been and that it would never be allowed to happen again. I was the only one in the class that said yes, eventually it would happen again, maybe not in our lifetime but somewhere, sometime in future after our generations had come and gone when economically people were suffering and a scapegoat would then be sought, it could happen again. She had tears in her eyes and her voice went all wobbly and she couldn't accept what I was saying.
 
BigHandsOliverKahn said:
The Germans have been naive in hindsight. After World War Two, they have bent over backwards to promote peace, keeping concentration camps as reminders of never to be repeated horrors etc. having had their country devastated so badly and knowing the full horrors of war. After 75 years of peace they must have believed that atrocities in Europe were consigned to history.

I remember 25 years ago at University, a young German teacher, who had been teaching modules on Jewish History and the subsequent admission of the horrors that took place, asked the class if the Holocaust could ever happen again? She had grown up in Post-War Germany where they were taught how bad things had been and that it would never be allowed to happen again. I was the only one in the class that said yes, eventually it would happen again, maybe not in our lifetime but somewhere, sometime in future after our generations had come and gone when economically people were suffering and a scapegoat would then be sought, it could happen again. She had tears in her eyes and her voice went all wobbly and she couldn't accept what I was saying.
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You made her cry! 🥲
 
Davepick said:
I bet Putin doesn't go out without being surrounded by his minions.
He'll be a target as soon as he steps outside, that is if he ever does.
Someone will be waiting to bump him off.
We can only hope.
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I would think he’s more difficult to bring down than Boris.
 
Scaramanga said:
Which bit ? The bit where the mentalists have forced us into this green madness or the bit it’s cheaper to import the stuff ?
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Both to some extent. To literally throw away 200 years of fuel due to political expediency was stupid, as there must be ways of filtering the stuff to make it acceptable.
 
BigHandsOliverKahn said:
The Germans have been naive in hindsight. After World War Two, they have bent over backwards to promote peace, keeping concentration camps as reminders of never to be repeated horrors etc. having had their country devastated so badly and knowing the full horrors of war. After 75 years of peace they must have believed that atrocities in Europe were consigned to history.

I remember 25 years ago at University, a young German teacher, who had been teaching modules on Jewish History and the subsequent admission of the horrors that took place, asked the class if the Holocaust could ever happen again? She had grown up in Post-War Germany where they were taught how bad things had been and that it would never be allowed to happen again. I was the only one in the class that said yes, eventually it would happen again, maybe not in our lifetime but somewhere, sometime in future after our generations had come and gone when economically people were suffering and a scapegoat would then be sought, it could happen again. She had tears in her eyes and her voice went all wobbly and she couldn't accept what I was saying.
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Which was a weird question as 25 years ago the Rwandan and Bosnian genocides had literally just happened and the Khmer Rouge was still recent memory.

Shit class.
 
Open up more coal mines.Build more nuclear power stations. A defensive wall of satellite defenders can block out enough sun rays to halt global warming. Crikey even Blue Peter presenters know that. Simples.☃⛄️
 
Matesrates said:
Putin has said that unless western countries pay for gas in roubles, he will cut of supplies at midnight tonight. Austria, Germany and France as well as several other European countries buy huge amounts from Russia and if they don’t agree and he carries out his threat, they will have to ration gas. That would mean something like a four day week, which would have a devastating impact on the economy.

if they do agree, they’re propping up the rouble and helping Putin to fund the war, if they don’t, then Russia will suffer hugely as well.
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They should’ve thought about this years ago. So many ways to create energy to fuel everyday items etc etc but we rely on gas. Get building more wind turbines, solar, et al and we’ll be fine. They need to wake up and smell the vodka.
 
Tangerine-Not-Clementine said:
They should’ve thought about this years ago. So many ways to create energy to fuel everyday items etc etc but we rely on gas. Get building more wind turbines, solar, et al and we’ll be fine. They need to wake up and smell the vodka.
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Still do not understand why wave energy is not being looked at when we have some of the biggest tidal ranges. If anyone has visited Carew Castle wave energy was used to power flour Mills well over 100 years ago
 
Tangerine-Not-Clementine said:
Get building more wind turbines, solar, et al and we’ll be fine. They need to wake up and smell the vodka.
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What happens when the wind isn't blowing and the sun isn't shining? Also, beyond a certain level of installed capacity renewable begin to destroy their own economic case.

My 2p, we should be looking at coal and nuclear.
 
Lost Seasider said:
What happens when the wind isn't blowing and the sun isn't shining? Also, beyond a certain level of installed capacity renewable begin to destroy their own economic case.

My 2p, we should be looking at coal and nuclear.
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The wind and solar have lithium ion battery storage for when the sun isn’t shining etc
The battery storage systems are being upgraded and developed all the time.

A nuclear power plant can take 10 to 20 years to build and will always go OVER budget with Boris and the Tories involved 🙄
 
Lost Seasider said:
What happens when the wind isn't blowing and the sun isn't shining? Also, beyond a certain level of installed capacity renewable begin to destroy their own economic case.

My 2p, we should be looking at coal and nuclear.
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For what it's worth.

Coal in the short term, but Nuclear long term.

Also, build more wind farms and look at tidal.

If you made every new build have solar as well - that would be a massive help.
 
seasideone said:
For what it's worth.

Coal in the short term, but Nuclear long term.

Also, build more wind farms and look at tidal.

If you made every new build have solar as well - that would be a massive help.
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You need a mix, nuclear for your base load, coal/gas to manage demand, run your nuclear plants 24/7 at next to zero operating cost, only burn fossil fuels when you need it.

Wind is problematic, it shares much the same economic model as nuclear, high capital cost, low operating cost, and it only makes sense if you can sell all the electricity it generates. By promoting wind power, if you end up displacing nuclear, you end up burning more fossil fuels than you otherwise would thanks to the intermittent nature of wind.

Tidal, after 20+ years of pushing for green energy, if it was viable I'm sure we'd have it by now.

Solar, as far as the UK is concerned, is madness IMO. It generates electricity when you least need it and none when you most need it.

If hydrogen takes off then that could become in effect a way of storing electricity, but until that happens our push for renewable energy has been questionable at best.
 
Lots of big solar fields in the UK now as well.
On the way to Wembley for the play off final last year I saw an awful lot between Peterborough and London near the East Coast Line.
 
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