Why so much negatively above the manager

Albert Ross said:
He reappointed him because it’s a mutual admiration society. At the interview he sat there making sheeps eyes at Critchley as though he was doing us a massive favour by agreeing to return. It was a lazy appointment.
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I didn't realise you were there. Can you tell us a bit more about what happened?
You are wrong btw, the lazy, weak decision would have been Dobbie, a quick fix that would please the fans.
 
ElBurroSinNombre said:
I didn't realise you were there. Can you tell us a bit more about what happened?
You are wrong btw, the lazy, weak decision would have been Dobbie, a quick fix that would please the fans.
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I didn’t need to be there smart arse the interview I was referring to was on TTV, if you had been interested you could have watched it too.🤡
 
Albert Ross said:
I didn’t need to be there smart arse the interview I was referring to was on TTV, if you had been interested you could have watched it too.🤡
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I did see it but unlike you I listened to what they both said about their plans. I didn't focus on some imaginary homoeroticism, that is weird if you don't mind me saying,
What a way to talk about the guy who saved the club and the last manager to achieve a promotion.
 
ElBurroSinNombre said:
I did see it but unlike you I listened to what they both said about their plans. I didn't focus on some imaginary homoeroticism, that is weird if you don't mind me saying,
What a way to talk about the guy who saved the club and the last manager to achieve a promotion.
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Of course he saved the club, that’s not under discussion, I have never heard anyone say otherwise. But that doesn’t mean everything he does is right, even if he does it with the best intentions. Buying a club and knowing how to run the football side of it are two entirely different things. He is very good at one and far less good at the other.
 
Albert Ross said:
Of course he saved the club, that’s not under discussion, I have never heard anyone say otherwise. But that doesn’t mean everything he does is right, even if he does it with the best intentions. Buying a club and knowing how to run the football side of it are two entirely different things. He is very good at one and far less good at the other.
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He may actually know better than you, you never know, after all it is his own money at stake.
 
ElBurroSinNombre said:
I did see it but unlike you I listened to what they both said about their plans. I didn't focus on some imaginary homoeroticism, that is weird if you don't mind me saying,
What a way to talk about the guy who saved the club and the last manager to achieve a promotion.
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I think you are getting over excited here I’ve not seen anyone shout Sadler out.

Yes Sadler saved the club no one is saying differently but that doesn’t mean he’s above any criticism he alone was responsible for several shocking managerial appointments in such a short period of time that’s got us in league one and the latest appointment looks like we might be here for some time.
 
ElBurroSinNombre said:
He may actually know better than you, you never know, after all it is his own money at stake.
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There have been , in recent history, many people with far more money than SS who have bought football clubs with no idea of how to run them. Thats one of the reasons for so many points deductions, which were almost unheard of a few years ago.
 
Fans are pissed off. Against Derby there were boos and groans just because we passed the ball backwards. That is a bit fucked up and not normal. Yes some positive results would change that but at the moment, the fan / manager relationship isn't healthy.
 
Jaffa_The_Hut said:
What has Fleetwood got to do with throwing 2 points away in the last 10 minutes of the Charlton v Pool game?

Sadler has made 3 shocking appointments in just over 12 months if you can’t see it then fair enough.
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Sadler made 2 shit appointments then played the spreadsheet approach to re hiring the person who left us unprepared after he left for more cash. I'm baffled at some of his line-ups subs & er err ing but he managed to get us promoted last time & SS has chosen him so we need to cut him a bit of slack. To do his tinkering for a while longer. Yeah I know we all could pick the team & maybe that's all it needs who knows.
 
Eh, you know. After the crushing disappointment of giving up our championship status like we felt like we didn't deserve it in the first place the only real hope fans could hold onto was the idea that we'd swagger into league one and put teams to the sword which is obviously not going to happen.

Obviously was an unrealistic expectation given our level of investment and the key attacking players we lost but we now have to come to terms with being an inconsistent mid-table league one team again for the time being, obviously there's going to be some groans. Doesn't help that the style of football is "pragmatic".

Personally, I think we'll be pushing for the playoffs in the end if we stick with Critchley, which we definitely will unless we lose 10 on the bounce or something.
 
A_Tense_Grin said:
Fans are pissed off. Against Derby there were boos and groans just because we passed the ball backwards. That is a bit fucked up and not normal. Yes some positive results would change that but at the moment, the fan / manager relationship isn't healthy.
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That says more about the fans than the Manager — unless we / he wins every game Lavery and CJ share M o t M then he never will get any peace !
 
Can we stop repeating something thinking like Goebbels if we say it often enough it will become the truth. He didn’t save the club. He bought the club for a nominal fee knowing full well that his risk was minimal and controllable and that the rewards could be immense. He should give the manager until Christmas at the latest and if things aren’t shaping up he should consider a change unless he wants to bleed money and settle for bottom of the barrel mediocrity. Anything less than the playoffs is failure.
 
Sadler appointed the guy who has already made him a shedload of cash;
Yates, Bowler and his own transfer fee are probably worth 10 million plus and now he is busy improving the players he has got in this spell.

Which players did Appleton improve? IMO he just wanted big ticket signings and consequently burned money on players like Trybull and Bridcutt. It was a shit show and that is before we mention the chaos of McCarthy. We cannot sign established pros very often, our route to success can only be through identifying and developing talent. We have one of the best in the business at that, we should cherish him.

Critchley has a plan, a method and the means to implement it. Grimshaw, Casey, Carey and the others will all improve further under Critch. He is a great coach. Give him the time he needs, we are 11 games in FFS.
 
ElBurroSinNombre said:
Sadler appointed the guy who has already made him a shedload of cash;
Yates, Bowler and his own transfer fee are probably worth 10 million plus and now he is busy improving the players he has got in this spell.

Which players did Appleton improve? IMO he just wanted big ticket signings and consequently burned money on players like Trybull and Bridcutt. It was a shit show and that is before we mention the chaos of McCarthy. We cannot sign established pros very often, our route to success can only be through identifying and developing talent. We have one of the best in the business at that, we should cherish him.

Critchley has a plan, a method and the means to implement it. Grimshaw, Casey, Carey and the others will all improve further under Critch. He is a great coach. Give him the time he needs, we are 11 games in FFS.
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So his plan involved playing Connolly at left wing back? Great plan that.
 
ElBurroSinNombre said:
He improves players because he is a fantastic coach.
Kenny Dougall is getting back to his best, he is getting a tune out of CJ Hamilton. Some of the signings we have made have got potential. And Casey who he signed last time looks like quality.The coaches we had last season were a joke, he is far superior to any of them.
Give the guy a chance, he is 11 games in to o this spell. He will need a bit of time to find his best 11 but we have improved already and if it is anything like last time improvements will continue.
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Agree with a lot of that but it's the team selections that have you scratching your head.
 
ElBurroSinNombre said:
Which players did Appleton improve? IMO he just wanted big ticket signings and consequently burned money on players like Trybull and Bridcutt.
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You mention Yates? Appleton improved him and his start to the season got him his move, as under NC he wasn’t even playing.

Bridcutt? He was a desperate free transfer signing as we’d failed to secure other signings, who weren’t “big ticket”… surprise you didn’t mention Grant Ward… that was the guy MA said wasn’t required here and we had to re-sign as cover due to flopping recruitment wise.

You don’t have to like Appleton and you can support Critchley, but don’t chat complete nonsense to do it 👌🏼
 
Adams Kebab said:
You mention Yates? Appleton improved him and his start to the season got him his move, as under NC he wasn’t even playing.

Bridcutt? He was a desperate free transfer signing as we’d failed to secure other signings, who weren’t “big ticket”… surprise you didn’t mention Grant Ward… that was the guy MA said wasn’t required here and we had to re-sign as cover due to flopping recruitment wise.

You don’t have to like Appleton and you can support Critchley, but don’t chat complete nonsense to do it 👌🏼
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Critchley identified Yates and we signed him for next to nothing. Later on we sold him for circa 4 million. He scored plenty under Critchley and he continued scoring under Appleton because Critchley identified and blooded a goal scorer.

Which player did Appleton identify that we will receive a future pay day from? Lyons maybe, but I think we were pursuing him before Appleton arrived.
 
ElBurroSinNombre said:
Critchley identified Yates and we signed him for next to nothing. Later on we sold him for circa 4 million. He scored plenty under Critchley and he continued scoring under Appleton because Critchley identified and blooded a goal scorer.

Which player did Appleton identify that we will receive a future pay day from? Lyons maybe, but I think we were pursuing him before Appleton arrived.
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I’ll explain it again.

Critchley didn’t play Yates very much in the Championship.

It won’t be hard for you to just admit, go on you can, that Appleton improved Yates by playing him and giving him confidence but also by deploying him wide where he scored a number of goals from… Sheff Utd, Watford, Preston x 2.

This is just basic stuff.
 
Adams Kebab said:
I’ll explain it again.

Critchley didn’t play Yates very much in the Championship.

It won’t be hard for you to just admit, go on you can, that Appleton improved Yates by playing him and giving him confidence but also by deploying him wide where he scored a number of goals from… Sheff Utd, Watford, Preston x 2.

This is just basic stuff.
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Yates was rumoured to be wanted by other clubs when Critchley was manager, that is also a fact. So Yates getting sold wasn't all down to Appleton as he was on the radar for at least 12 months before he went.
Critchley identified potential and signed him for almost nothing. We subsequently got around 4 million.
You didn't answer the question, which players from the Appleton regime will we sell for big money. One marquee Appleton signing, Thompson, who was relatively expensive was one where it can be argued that good money was wasted,
Anyway I'm out I can't be arsed anymore,
Critchley is the manager, he is the chairman's choice and they clearly have a good rapport. As supporters we have to accept this decision and support the team and manager. It feels like some will be pleased if Critchley fails this time.
 
ElBurroSinNombre said:
Yates was rumoured to be wanted by other clubs when Critchley was manager, that is also a fact. So Yates getting sold wasn't all down to Appleton as he was on the radar for at least 12 months before he went.
Critchley identified potential and signed him for almost nothing. We subsequently got around 4 million.
You didn't answer the question, which players from the Appleton regime will we sell for big money. One marquee Appleton signing, Thompson, who was relatively expensive for ys was one where it can be argued that good money was wasted,
Anyway I'm out I can't be arsed anymore,
Critchley is the manager, he is the chairman's choice and they clearly have a good rapport. As supporters we have to accept this decision and support the team and manager. It feels like some will be pleased if Critchley fails this time.
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We only made one permanent signing under MA and he was only here for 4.5 months.

So to answer your question nobody 🤗
 
Jaffa_The_Hut said:
So he’s had 11 league games I’m guessing another 3-4 EFL/League cup games so 14/15 games in total and yet he still doesn’t know his best 11? 🤷‍♂️

As for improving players what the hell has he done to the likes of Carey, Ekpiteta and Lavery as a shadow of what they were last season.
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The 3 players you have named were shite last season so I don’t see your point. Maybe they just aren’t good enough/confidence has been absolutely shattered.
 
Jaffa_The_Hut said:
If that’s the case then crowds will be falling people just won’t except his style of play.

I’ve already said on another thread although I wasn’t there today I’ve never missed watching an away game match live yet on IPTV until today that is I just couldn’t get any enthusiasm up for it and if he’s going to be here 18 months as you say they’ll be many more games I’ll be missing.
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well At least you didn’t do an illegal stream Yesterday 😂
 
ElBurroSinNombre said:
Sadler appointed the guy who has already made him a shedload of cash;
Yates, Bowler and his own transfer fee are probably worth 10 million plus and now he is busy improving the players he has got in this spell.

Which players did Appleton improve? IMO he just wanted big ticket signings and consequently burned money on players like Trybull and Bridcutt. It was a shit show and that is before we mention the chaos of McCarthy. We cannot sign established pros very often, our route to success can only be through identifying and developing talent. We have one of the best in the business at that, we should cherish him.

Critchley has a plan, a method and the means to implement it. Grimshaw, Casey, Carey and the others will all improve further under Critch. He is a great coach. Give him the time he needs, we are 11 games in FFS.
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Make your mind up, in post#55 you said his money was at stake. You are now saying he’s made a shedload of cash, which is it? Or are you arguing just for the sake of it?
 
Albert Ross said:
Make your mind up, in post#55 you said his money was at stake. You are now saying he’s made a shedload of cash, which is it? Or are you arguing just for the sake of it?
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It's both, they're not mutually exclusive.

I would imagine promotion to the Championship cost Sadler more money anyway.
 
Lytham_fy8 said:
It's both, they're not mutually exclusive.

I would imagine promotion to the Championship cost Sadler more money anyway.
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It will have, virtually all promoted teams lose money. He has also lost more by being relegated than he’s made from player sales. I was just pointing out the inconsistencies in El burrows posts.
 
Albert Ross said:
It will have, virtually all promoted teams lose money. He has also lost more by being relegated than he’s made from player sales. I was just pointing out the inconsistencies in El burrows posts.
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The only way we can realistically progress with a solid base is to gradually trade up the quality of our squad. To do this we will sell talent and we wil buy untapped talent. We will sell our best players from time to time like Yates and Bowler [interestingly Bowler has gone back to being mediocre ever since he stopped working with Critchley]. Hopefully the quality will gradually improve as we rise. To do this successfully we need somebody who can identify young players with potential and who is also able to improve them.That man is Neil Critchley. This is the model that I believe that Sadler is trying to follow. We should back him as it is our best chance of a sustainable future at a higher level.
If you look at a team like Brentford, they have gradually improved the quality of their staff by prudent buying and selling. The talent selection is backed by rigourous statistical analysis of individual players and how they would fit into the system of play. By following this method they are now comfortable in the EPL on small gates and have on their books a player who is worth around 50 million [Toney], who I believe was bought with the proceeds of selling Watkins. This is trading up, improve the player, sell on, buy someone with more untapped potential and is the model we are trying to follow IMO. It is the most realistic choice for a club of our size and Critchley is central to it.
 
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Albert Ross said:
There have been , in recent history, many people with far more money than SS who have bought football clubs with no idea of how to run them. Thats one of the reasons for so many points deductions, which were almost unheard of a few years ago.
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I don’t think we need to worry about over spending and points deduction’s with SS at the helm….😎
 
Theoneandonly said:
Can we stop repeating something thinking like Goebbels if we say it often enough it will become the truth. He didn’t save the club. He bought the club for a nominal fee knowing full well that his risk was minimal and controllable and that the rewards could be immense. He should give the manager until Christmas at the latest and if things aren’t shaping up he should consider a change unless he wants to bleed money and settle for bottom of the barrel mediocrity. Anything less than the playoffs is failure.
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£9,000,000 was a "nominal" fee? And what about all the rest he's put in?

Are you Bill Gates in disguise?
 
ElBurroSinNombre said:
The only way we can realistically progress with a solid base is to gradually trade up the quality of our squad. To do this we will sell talent and we wil buy untapped talent. Hopefully the quality will gradually improve as we rise. To do this successfully we need somebody who can identify young players with potential and who is also able to improve them.That man is Neil Critchley. This is the model that I believe that Sadler is trying to follow. We should back him as it is our best chance of a sustainable future at a higher level.
If you look at a team like Brentford, they have gradually improved the quality of their staff by prudent buying and selling. The talent selection is backed by rigourous statistical analysis of individual players and how they would fit into the system of play. By following this method they are now comfortable in the EPL on small gates and gave on their books a player who is worth around 50 million [Toney], who I believe was bought with the proceeds of selling Watkins. This is trading up, improve the player, sell on and is the model we are trying to follow IMO. It is the most realistic for a club of our size.
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I agree entirely with the philosophy, that however is a long term project. In the meantime we need to grow the fanbase, improve the ground and make progress on our training facilities for both the first team squad and the development of young players. We also need the money available in the Championship, that is a short term objective. I didn’t like Critchley first time around, nothing to do with how he left. I thought his football was , in the main, boring then just as it is now. A good coach he may be, a manager he isn’t. His cause isn’t strengthened by having Brunskill and Garrity alongside. As for SS he has made 3 very poor appointments out of 4 which is one of the reasons why I said his decisions on the football side are poor. As I said earlier we need to grow the fanbase which won’t be achieved by Critchley’s permanent tinkering and unfathomable team selection nor his use of substitutes.
 
Albert Ross said:
I agree entirely with the philosophy, that however is a long term project. In the meantime we need to grow the fanbase, improve the ground and make progress on our training facilities for both the first team squad and the development of young players. We also need the money available in the Championship, that is a short term objective. I didn’t like Critchley first time around, nothing to do with how he left. I thought his football was , in the main, boring then just as it is now. A good coach he may be, a manager he isn’t. His cause isn’t strengthened by having Brunskill and Garrity alongside. As for SS he has made 3 very poor appointments out of 4 which is one of the reasons why I said his decisions on the football side are poor. As I said earlier we need to grow the fanbase which won’t be achieved by Critchley’s permanent tinkering and unfathomable team selection nor his use of substitutes.
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The notion that you buy cheap raw talent, nurture it and sell it on good profits and invest it back in (less an amount for running costs) is something that's very basic. I don't however believe NC is the bloke to do this. One, he's brought in some average players and two, no player is going to develop a settled 'style' under him.

I honestly can't for the life of me see what SS sees in him to trust him to fly solo.
 
Albert Ross said:
I agree entirely with the philosophy, that however is a long term project. In the meantime we need to grow the fanbase, improve the ground and make progress on our training facilities for both the first team squad and the development of young players. We also need the money available in the Championship, that is a short term objective. I didn’t like Critchley first time around, nothing to do with how he left. I thought his football was , in the main, boring then just as it is now. A good coach he may be, a manager he isn’t. His cause isn’t strengthened by having Brunskill and Garrity alongside. As for SS he has made 3 very poor appointments out of 4 which is one of the reasons why I said his decisions on the football side are poor. As I said earlier we need to grow the fanbase which won’t be achieved by Critchley’s permanent tinkering and unfathomable team selection nor his use of substitutes.
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As pointed out before Sadler has reappointed the one coach that you grudgingly admit was a good appointment. But you are still moaning. The off the pitch stuff is progressing and it is yet to be seen if Critchley can repeat his previous promotion from this league. But some are moaning and demanding sackings after every small set back. Thank god these people have no input into decision making. We cannot sack the manager every other week, that is madness. You say you agree with the approach but you seem to be actively undermining it at the same time.

It doesn't matter whether fans understand what Critchley is trying to do. It is completely irrelevant whether it is unfathomable to you or anybody else who is watching. He will be judged ultimately on results. He will make mistakes but what is important is how he adapts to them. Yesterday was a harsh lesson, but one that will no doubt influence future decisions and what needs to be worked on in training.
Onwards and upwards, it was a draw away from home, not a 5-0 thrashing.
UTP
 
fcblackpool said:
The notion that you buy cheap raw talent, nurture it and sell it on good profits and invest it back in (less an amount for running costs) is something that's very basic. I don't however believe NC is the bloke to do this. One, he's brought in some average players and two, no player is going to develop a settled 'style' under him.

I honestly can't for the life of me see what SS sees in him to trust him to fly solo.
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He has done it before with Yates and Bowler - when was the last time before Critchley that we bought someone very cheaply and then sold him for a significant sum?
 
ElBurroSinNombre said:
As pointed out before Sadler has reappointed the one coach that you grudgingly admit was a good appointment. But you are still moaning. The off the pitch stuff is progressing and it is yet to be seen if Critchley can repeat his previous promotion from this league. But some are moaning and demanding sackings after every small set back. Thank god these people have no input into decision making. We cannot sack the manager every other week, that is madness. You say you agree with the approach but you seem to be actively undermining it at the same time.

It doesn't matter whether fans understand what Critchley is trying to do. It is completely irrelevant whether it is unfathomable to you or anybody else who is watching. He will be judged ultimately on results. He will make mistakes but what is important is how he adapts to them. Yesterday was a harsh lesson, but one that will no doubt influence future decisions and what needs to be worked on in training.
Onwards and upwards, it was a draw away from home, not a 5-0 thrashing.
UTP
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A agree with the approach, but not the person ( Critchley) entrusted with carrying it out. Apart from that as you say onwards and upwards.🍊 I would love, by the way for Critchley to prove me wrong, but I won’t hold my breath.😁
 
ElBurroSinNombre said:
He has done it before with Yates and Bowler - when was the last time before Critchley that we bought someone very cheaply and then sold him for a significant sum?
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I'll give you Bowler, not Yates. He was bought for a significant fee and with a track record in the division. Then again Bowler had a bit of a reputation as a very good player...didn't Everton pay £2,3m? He just lost his way. Very different to the likes of Toney, Wilson and their ilk who were bought to develop on.
 
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