Akinfenwa claims "Fleetwood representative" made racially insensitive comments

SEASIDE2020 said:
Is that the best you can do ?

As far as I know, Akinfenwa doesn't have frizzy hair, not that I'd be bothered either way.
Click to expand...

I knew you'd deliberately miss the point. I think it says it all about you and your fellow-travellers on this thread that a man is subject to repeated derogatory comments by a member of the club's staff and all you can talk about is whether he should have a bit more of a stiff upper lip about it.
 
Wizaard said:
Fair enough. However, I still want to know why water buffalo? It's very low on my list of possibilities if I'm considering an insult. It's that that makes me think there's more to it than standard insulting, where surely you'd go for the straightforward fat **, or variant thereon. No issue with perception then.
Click to expand...
If you call someone a buffalo in parts of Asia it means you think they're thick/stupid, as the buffalo is seen as a very stupid animal. I don't know if it was meant as that in the remark about Akinfenwa. I would suspect it was made because of his size, as the buffalo is also a huge animal as well as being stupid.
It's certainly not an endearing term that's for sure and it's quite insulting. But racist? I'm not sure on that one.
Only the person who made the remark knows why they chose to describe him as a buffalo.
 
Would there be so many snowflakes up in arms on this non-issue, if it was an official from say clubs like Southend or Peterboro who had called him a water buffalo?
And some pretend that Fleetwood aren't real rivals?
6 pages already 🤣
 
He seems a nice fella. Decent player. Proper handful. I wouldn't like to mark him. That's about all I know about him so....
 
RUSTY_2_STANDS said:
If you call someone a buffalo in parts of Asia it means you think they're thick/stupid, as the buffalo is seen as a very stupid animal. I don't know if it was meant as that in the remark about Akinfenwa. I would suspect it was made because of his size, as the buffalo is also a huge animal as well as being stupid.
It's certainly not an endearing term that's for sure and it's quite insulting. But racist? I'm not sure on that one.
Only the person who made the remark knows why they chose to describe him as a buffalo.
Click to expand...

I'm amazed that someone on the Fleetwood bench even knew what a water buffalo is, never mind the nuances of it as an insult. Agree with you about the intent.
 
basilrobbie said:
I knew you'd deliberately miss the point. I think it says it all about you and your fellow-travellers on this thread that a man is subject to repeated derogatory comments by a member of the club's staff and all you can talk about is whether he should have a bit more of a stiff upper lip about it.
Click to expand...

I didn't miss any point, there wasn't any point.

As for your latest response regarding derogatory comments, derogatory comments have been made on the sporting pitches across our green and pleasant land forever and a day and they will continue to be made despite your outrage.

As many others have suggested on this thread, Akinfenwa seems a nice chap but it's questionable whether his reaction would have been the same if the same had happened six months ago.

Much ado about nothing but please don't let me spoil your fun.
 
basilrobbie said:
I wonder if it was any other club whether you would be racing at such speed to their defence.
Click to expand...
I thought being an educated man Bazbob you would have surely said replying at “such speed” would have meant me replying yesterday when the thread was posted not 24 hours on. 🙄
 
Last edited:
Bring Back Standing said:
Would there be so many snowflakes up in arms on this non-issue, if it was an official from say clubs like Southend or Peterboro who had called him a water buffalo?
And some pretend that Fleetwood aren't real rivals?
6 pages already 🤣
Click to expand...
Genuinely nothing to do with Fleetwood. There is a proportion of our readership who are desperate to challenge every aspect of black equality while denying they are doing it. That's why they will literally argue black is white.
 
Wizaard said:
I'm amazed that someone on the Fleetwood bench even knew what a water buffalo is, never mind the nuances of it as an insult. Agree with you about the intent.
Click to expand...

I imagine you spoke in jest but I am surprised that you appear to consider it fine to make an obvious inference about the lack of intelligence of those associated with Fleetwood Football Club yet at the same time you are annoyed at the comments made to Akinfenwa.

Surely prejudice is wrong full stop ?
 
SEASIDE2020 said:
I imagine you spoke in jest but I am surprised that you appear to consider it fine to make an obvious inference about the lack of intelligence of those associated with Fleetwood Football Club yet at the same time you are annoyed at the comments made to Akinfenwa.

Surely prejudice is wrong full stop ?
Click to expand...
And I'm the snowflake? 😉
 
Wizaard said:
Genuinely nothing to do with Fleetwood. There is a proportion of our readership who are desperate to challenge ever of black equality while denying they are doing it. That's why they will literally argue black is white.
Click to expand...
Over two hundred on the Wycombe v Cod’s match threads and a ton already in the bag on a water Buffalo thread.
And we’re not supposed to give a shit about a pub team up the road. 😂
 
SEASIDE2020 said:
I didn't miss any point, there wasn't any point.

As for your latest response regarding derogatory comments, derogatory comments have been made on the sporting pitches across our green and pleasant land forever and a day and they will continue to be made despite your outrage.

As many others have suggested on this thread, Akinfenwa seems a nice chap but it's questionable whether his reaction would have been the same if the same had happened six months ago.

Much ado about nothing but please don't let me spoil your fun.
Click to expand...

Just because derogatory comments have happened for ever and a day at sports fields across the land doesn't mean its ok. If things aren't challenged then they will never change and that's what he was doing, challenging behaviour that was wrong.
 
Wizaard said:
Genuinely nothing to do with Fleetwood. There is a proportion of our readership who are desperate to challenge every aspect of black equality while denying they are doing it. That's why they will literally argue black is white.
Click to expand...

Wiz

Perhaps a proportion of our readership black are just fed up at likes of yourself trying to introduce a racist angle to everything.
 
SEASIDE2020 said:
Wiz

Perhaps a proportion of our readership black are just fed up at likes of yourself trying to introduce a racist angle to everything.
Click to expand...
Let's be clear about this. I haven't I introduced anything. I made it clear it was an unusual line of attack and a surprising analogy. I also said that only the person saying it would know if it was meant as a racially offensive term.

I'm not surprised by those who suddenly have an in-depth knowledge of how the use of water buffalo is not a racist term. As always the depth of knowledge of the AVFTT readership knows no bounds.
 
Wizaard said:
Let's be clear about this. I haven't I introduced anything. I made it clear it was an unusual line of attack and a surprising analogy. I also said that only the person saying it would know if it was meant as a racially offensive term.

I'm not surprised by those who suddenly have an in-depth knowledge of how the use of water buffalo is not a racist term. As always the depth of knowledge of the AVFTT readership knows no bounds.
Click to expand...
Seriously Fleetwood or not this whole thing has massively been taken much too far, a water Buffalo FFS 🙄 hopefully the EFL/FA will just dismiss it.

There’s more important things to worry about like why 8 Formula one drivers didn’t take the knee in Austria and pissed Lewis Hamilton off. 🙄
 
Larryknows said:
Just because derogatory comments have happened for ever and a day at sports fields across the land doesn't mean its ok. If things aren't challenged then they will never change and that's what he was doing, challenging behaviour that was wrong.
Click to expand...

Larry

That's a fair point but personally I just feel that perhaps your reaction is over the top.

Compete against the opposition, try and get in their head if it will give you an edge, when the referee blows time up shake hands and congratulate the winner, maybe a have a drink after and forget anything that was said on the pitch.

I don't know exactly what the chap said to Akinfenwa or how he said it but I imagine he was trying to unsettle Akinfenwa and failed, it might have been an idea for Akinfenwa to have laughed at the other chap.

Akinfenwa has chosen to highlight the issue as is his right but I am not sure he'd have done the same six months ago.

That doesn't mean he is wrong, I just feel that we are perhaps making a mountain out of a molehill.

Carlton Palmer says that he used to love it when the opposition abused him during trial games in his youth because he knew that they only reason they were abusing him was because he was too good for them on the pitch.

Please don't get me wrong, I am not suggesting that Akinfenwa has to react exactly how Carlton Palmer did, I just don't feel that it is as black and white as others are suggesting.
 
Wizaard said:
Let's be clear about this. I haven't I introduced anything. I made it clear it was an unusual line of attack and a surprising analogy. I also said that only the person saying it would know if it was meant as a racially offensive term.

I'm not surprised by those who suddenly have an in-depth knowledge of how the use of water buffalo is not a racist term. As always the depth of knowledge of the AVFTT readership knows no bounds.
Click to expand...

Wiz

I can only speak for myself and personally I don't have a clue about water buffalos.

That is not to say that it is a racist term or not.

I know that the great Alfredo Morelos is known as El Buffalo.
 
Jaffa_The_Hut said:
Seriously Fleetwood or not this whole thing has massively been taken much too far, a water Buffalo FFS 🙄 hopefully the EFL/FA will just dismiss it.

There’s more important things to worry about like why 8 Formula one drivers didn’t take the knee in Austria and pissed Lewis Hamilton off. 🙄
Click to expand...

Jabba

Thanks for that.

While Robbie is blaming the EFL for this incident - and for starting the corona virus and his piles - he won't be bullying me.
 
Just seen someone point this out on twitter. He posted this to his twitter account in February

Surely regardless of stance we can all agree there is a certain level of hypocrisy to claim that likening a black man to a "dark skinned animal" such as a Buffalo is dehumanising, yet he likened himself to a buffalo a few months ago

https://twitter.com/x/status/1231596902002589703
 
Last edited:
I think he should have taken more responsibility by firstly addressing his concerns with both clubs rather than going very public. Its potentially very serious and does warrant investigation. It is important to understand the reason for these remarks. If it clearly is racial abuse or Akinfenwa is not happy with the outcome there are other avenues open, the obvious one being the football authorities.
 
Wizaard said:
It's not what you see, it's what he perceives. You don't seem to be able to get your head round that.
Click to expand...
Of course I can. If AA perceived being called a water buffalo as racist then I find that a bit sad. No mention of his colour there. People call other people all sorts of names and have done for centuries. Are we now so woke that we seem to have to perceive everything as a racist attack. If this is the case then we might as well be robots and not talk to each other. Bants is officially dead.
 
Scaramanga said:
Of course I can. If AA perceived being called a water buffalo as racist then I find that a bit sad. No mention of his colour there. People call other people all sorts of names and have done for centuries. Are we now so woke that we seem to have to perceive everything as a racist attack. If this is the case then we might as well be robots and not talk to each other. Bants is officially dead.
Click to expand...
Bants being officially dead is probably a good thing.
 
Wizzerboy said:
I'm so tired of reading middle aged white blokes decide what is and isn't hurtful. Just shut up and listen.

I'm sick and tired of young snowflakes that have to make an issue out of anything and everything at the drop of a hat, just shut up!!
Click to expand...

Very very clever and well reasoned response, touché.

‘at the drop of a hat’ = specifically when somebody I respect asks us as a community to reflect on an issue they say is hurting them solely because it goes unchecked. You are making heavy assumptions about my politics - it’s just that I was brought up to listen and be willing to change my behavior if somebody says I’ve hurt them. Akinfenwa is not on a witch hunt, he is leaving room to believe it was unintentional, all he is saying is that just because it is unintentional does not make it harmless and just think about your actions.

If a black person cannot politely ask a community not to use a derogatory term any more, and grants that they may not have previously known about the negative connotations, therein lies the nature of systemic racism. It’s not about making a big drama of it or calling for anybody’s head, it’s just asking people to educate themselves on the language used.

If anything seems over sensitive to me, it’s a group of fully grown men getting upset that they cannot use a word they claim they didn’t even know about until a day ago. What’s the big loss?

I understand and share concerns about throwing the baby out with the bath water when it comes to free speech in politics and broadcasting. This is the exact approach that circumvents that nonsense and allows us a chance to opt for reflection and self education instead of blanket censorship.
 
Alf is absolutely spot on with this. If it was me who had said this remark about Akinfenwa (innocent of knowing it was any racial slur) and I saw his post, I immediately would have wanted to speak to him and confess that I was ignorant in not knowing what the term meant for him whether or not for me it was a throwaway insult and apologise for it. You know what, I think he would accept that too and everybody has learnt a lesson.
 
Alf said:
Very very clever and well reasoned response, touché.

‘at the drop of a hat’ = specifically when somebody I respect asks us as a community to reflect on an issue they say is hurting them solely because it goes unchecked. You are making heavy assumptions about my politics - it’s just that I was brought up to listen and be willing to change my behavior if somebody says I’ve hurt them. Akinfenwa is not on a witch hunt, he is leaving room to believe it was unintentional, all he is saying is that just because it is unintentional does not make it harmless and just think about your actions.

If a black person cannot politely ask a community not to use a derogatory term any more, and grants that they may not have previously known about the negative connotations, therein lies the nature of systemic racism. It’s not about making a big drama of it or calling for anybody’s head, it’s just asking people to educate themselves on the language used.

If anything seems over sensitive to me, it’s a group of fully grown men getting upset that they cannot use a word they claim they didn’t even know about until a day ago. What’s the big loss?

I understand and share concerns about throwing the baby out with the bath water when it comes to free speech in politics and broadcasting. This is the exact approach that circumvents that nonsense and allows us a chance to opt for reflection and self education instead of blanket censorship.
Click to expand...
I fully appreciate what Akinfenwa was trying to get across and tbh it was put more reasonable and eloquently unlike other attempts.
The thing I'm sick and tired about is now that the communist group BLM is getting up a head of steam, all the do gooders who haven't looked closely at their statement and have jumped onto the bandwagon are not supporting the real cause, just like the Premier league and Sky in general, they think it's about racism but it isn't.
Until George Floyd was murdered there were 100,000's of black people who didn't give a toss about statues and sculptures then they're at demos pulling the statues down!!
It was very finely veiled as a blow against slavery and 1000's thought it was BLM know different.
Instead of the slogan Black lives matter why not use the slogan RACISM IS WRONG.
THAT is what the majority of people agree with but wouldn't fit in with the BLM mantra.

I think any type of racism is abhorrent, what I don't agree with is pulling out the race card when there is no need to use it whatsoever. I also don't agree with getting jobs because of the colour of your skin either, then again may I add sexuality, age, gender, etc a job should be given for said persons ability.

So there you go kid, a bit of a moan off an old white bloke. If you haven't got an open mind to accept what I've posted then we'll never get anywhere. I still think people need to read more into situations befor jumping on bandwagon though!
 
Where as I think the remark was a racial slur my condemnation of it is somewhat tempered by Akinfenwa's own portrayal of himself in his own tweet. Doesn't matter what sort of buffalo it is, the point is the same so there is a touch of hypocricy from him.
As 2020 points out, near enough six months ago Akinfenwa was ok to post that picture himself but his stance has changed and he is offended by being referred to as a buffalo.
His latest statement clearly highlighted a problem but I would like him to explain what was fine for him less than six months ago is not acceptable now.
 
Alf said:
Very very clever and well reasoned response, touché.

‘at the drop of a hat’ = specifically when somebody I respect asks us as a community to reflect on an issue they say is hurting them solely because it goes unchecked. You are making heavy assumptions about my politics - it’s just that I was brought up to listen and be willing to change my behavior if somebody says I’ve hurt them. Akinfenwa is not on a witch hunt, he is leaving room to believe it was unintentional, all he is saying is that just because it is unintentional does not make it harmless and just think about your actions.

If a black person cannot politely ask a community not to use a derogatory term any more, and grants that they may not have previously known about the negative connotations, therein lies the nature of systemic racism. It’s not about making a big drama of it or calling for anybody’s head, it’s just asking people to educate themselves on the language used.

If anything seems over sensitive to me, it’s a group of fully grown men getting upset that they cannot use a word they claim they didn’t even know about until a day ago. What’s the big loss?

I understand and share concerns about throwing the baby out with the bath water when it comes to free speech in politics and broadcasting. This is the exact approach that circumvents that nonsense and allows us a chance to opt for reflection and self education instead of blanket censorship.
Click to expand...
Beautifully put Alf........👍
 
What difference does six months make?

Who has gone back on his Twitter timeline and found a picture to use against him?

Why?
 
20togo said:
No I didn't. Someone from Fleetwood used a derogatory term, Akinfenwa himself used a derogatory picture to portray himself.
Click to expand...
Anyone can describe themselves as anything. That's self deprecating. Someone else saying it is derogatory and insulting. Big difference.
 
Wizaard said:
Anyone can describe themselves as anything. That's self deprecating. Someone else saying it is derogatory and insulting. Big difference.
Click to expand...
Yeah, I get that but he didn't help his cause by doing it did he? I'd like to hear what his thoughts were when he posted his first tweet. And just to re-iterate I initially thought it was racism and it still is.
 
So lets get this right, AA posts a photo on Twitter of a water buffalo and portrays himself as the said water buffalo, yet when someone calls him a water buffalo (clearly referring to AA tweet) he says its offensive and racist?

Utter bollocks. 🥴
 
Last edited:
Wizzerboy said:
I fully appreciate what Akinfenwa was trying to get across and tbh it was put more reasonable and eloquently unlike other attempts.
The thing I'm sick and tired about is now that the communist group BLM is getting up a head of steam, all the do gooders who haven't looked closely at their statement and have jumped onto the bandwagon are not supporting the real cause, just like the Premier league and Sky in general, they think it's about racism but it isn't.
Until George Floyd was murdered there were 100,000's of black people who didn't give a toss about statues and sculptures then they're at demos pulling the statues down!!
It was very finely veiled as a blow against slavery and 1000's thought it was BLM know different.
Instead of the slogan Black lives matter why not use the slogan RACISM IS WRONG.
THAT is what the majority of people agree with but wouldn't fit in with the BLM mantra.

I think any type of racism is abhorrent, what I don't agree with is pulling out the race card when there is no need to use it whatsoever. I also don't agree with getting jobs because of the colour of your skin either, then again may I add sexuality, age, gender, etc a job should be given for said persons ability.

So there you go kid, a bit of a moan off an old white bloke. If you haven't got an open mind to accept what I've posted then we'll never get anywhere. I still think people need to read more into situations befor jumping on bandwagon though!
Click to expand...

Sorry mate apart from the bit where you said you fully appreciate what Akinfenwa said, the rest of that is a massive tangent and nothing to do with what I said.

Don't call me kid please, thanks.
 
Unbelievable that some do not see a distinction between AA posting a picture of a buffalo and an opposition professional repeatedly using it to refer to him throughout the game. If he said "I'm strong as a gorilla" and the next day somebody called him a monkey, that person would still massively be in the wrong.

I imagine you are the same people who say 'well why can't I use the n-word if 50 cent does?'


20s 'he didn't help his cause by doing it did he?' when he posted the picture I'm sure he wasn't expecting to be referred to as a fat buffalo repeatedly in one of the biggest games of his life six months later. I respect your points most of the time mate, as I assume you mostly like to play devil's advocate given that you always take an extreme side in every single debate on here, but that is *weak*.
 
1966_and_all_that said:
Yes, I agree with that. A stupid remark. Possibly one spouted on the point of defeat but it doesn't mean it's defendable.
Click to expand...

In today's climate it is a stupid and unnecessary remark. I can't see a racial element to it personally, but people should learn to be kinder to one another, in an (overly perhaps?) sensitive world it's the only way to ensure that offence isn't taken.
 
Alf said:
Unbelievable that some do not see a distinction between AA posting a picture of a buffalo and an opposition professional repeatedly using it to refer to him throughout the game. If he said "I'm strong as a gorilla" and the next day somebody called him a monkey, that person would still massively be in the wrong.

I imagine you are the same people who say 'well why can't I use the n-word if 50 cent does?'


20s 'he didn't help his cause by doing it did he?' when he posted the picture I'm sure he wasn't expecting to be referred to as a fat buffalo repeatedly in one of the biggest games of his life six months later. I respect your points most of the time mate, as I assume you mostly like to play devil's advocate given that you always take an extreme side in every single debate on here, but that is *weak*.
Click to expand...

There is of course a distinction between referring to yourself as a water buffalo and someone calling you a "fat water buffalo". The distinction that is being debated is whether it is racist to call someone a water buffalo, Akinfenwa's point is that it dehumanises him as a black man to draw a comparison between him and a buffalo but months before he had done it himself. I believe there is a difference in being self deprecating and dehumanising yourself and that is why people are claiming hypocrisy.

The reason people are taking issue with it, is a claim that someone has been racially abusive can cause them to lose their job, be vilified by the press and people on social media, or even prison time. Which is rightly so if they have been, but this is where this situation is a delicate one as The FA are now investigating the claim and the person could face any of these repercussions over an insult that might not have had racial intent.

The difference between whether someone had called him a monkey or gorilla is that those comparisons have deep rooted racist connotations that go back to slavery. The same goes for the n-word. "Water Buffalo" does not, in fact there was a lawsuit in America where a Jewish student had shouted at a noisy sorority of mainly black, female students to be quiet and referred to them as Water Buffalo. When they complained to the University and the University in turn attempted to punish the student under terms of racial harassment, he took them to court on the grounds it isn't a racial epithet.

Water buffalo incident - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org

I remained open minded during this debate and a few posters on the side of Akinfenwa made some really good points which I still believe are true. I wish it didn't have to descend into chaos during every debate that happens on the internet. It's why I don't use the politics section of this forum
 
FY4MIKEH said:
What a joke! Getting ridiculous this now, we won't be able to look at a black person soon.
Click to expand...
I think you're allowed to look at them....I don't think there are any problems with doing that.
I think it's calling them names or being nasty towards them that they don't really like.......maybe just and just say 'hello'....shouldn't be any problems.

Here to help........😎
 
Alf said:
Unbelievable that some do not see a distinction between AA posting a picture of a buffalo and an opposition professional repeatedly using it to refer to him throughout the game. If he said "I'm strong as a gorilla" and the next day somebody called him a monkey, that person would still massively be in the wrong.

I imagine you are the same people who say 'well why can't I use the n-word if 50 cent does?'


20s 'he didn't help his cause by doing it did he?' when he posted the picture I'm sure he wasn't expecting to be referred to as a fat buffalo repeatedly in one of the biggest games of his life six months later. I respect your points most of the time mate, as I assume you mostly like to play devil's advocate given that you always take an extreme side in every single debate on here, but that is *weak*.
Click to expand...
Again, I think you are blatantly using obvious racist words to over emphasise your point. Stick to the words used eh. I tend to see it from Peels pov with regards to his first para. And as I say my initial thought was to think it racist and it still is. But like I said I don't believe he did his cause any good by his earlier tweet and so to a certain degree there is a bit of hypocrisy from him. Again, that said he has to be applauded for the way he has brought this to the medias attention and his aim of trying not to confront head on but openly discuss the matter in a calm manner.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top