Begum again

This thread subject keeps popping up every few years.
I’ll repeat what I’ve said a few times -

I hate terrorists with a vengeance, I’m happy to be the one that hangs them. But, I have a nasty taste with her case, I feel like I hate her for being a member of ISIS, but struggle to get past the fact she was only 15 when she got recruited.
I get everyone else’s animosity, I’ll never try to belittle their thoughts on that, I get it more than most.
But…. We believe , in this country, that 15 means you’re a kid. And our laws take into account if your a kid or not.
Rules are rules (as Al Murray would say).
If she was a kid, treat her as such. Otherwise disown her, demonise her, but rub out all our laws that rely on the belief that kids are thick as pig shit.

And groomable (if that’s a word).
 
Seasider1887 said:
She agreed with the Manchester bombing of little children. And you want her back? Have a word with yourself.
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🙄

‘The 19-year-old, who is pleading to be repatriated from a detention camp in Syria, told the BBC it was “wrong that innocent people did get killed” in the 2017 atrocity.’

No surprise that Jaffa the hunt and toot toot support your ill-informed claims
 
20togo said:
Being economical with the facts, spud. Back in 2019 she said the attack was justified, Wonder if her change in stance is due to her trying to come back to this country. No surprise that you support the terrorists against this country! Are you still supporting the IRA following their shooting of the off duty policeman in NI? Words you can't take back are they, spud?
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My quote was from 2019

Now, why did she say that the attack was justified ?🤔

… and in what way was Begum a terrorist ? 🤔

p.s. The I.R.A. were not responsible for the shooting of
John Caldwell

p.p.s. The goal of the IRA will ultimately prevail in Northern Ireland through peaceful means - does that stick in your craw
 
TSSeasider said:
It could equally be argued that she was made stateless by Bangladesh by refusing her right to citizenship before she turned 21.
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That is not correct. She has never been a Bangladeshi citizen nor did she have the opportunity to apply. She was in Syria at age 16 and still is. So the window for application as an adult was not available to her. My point is that Javid knew all that and took advantage in spuriously claiming the Bangladesh opportunity was there, to justify his decision (which may prove to be illegal).

The Bangladesh claim by Javid is simply a red herring, a smokescreen to act as a distraction from him. As I said, I carry no moral position on her, Javid or Bangladesh in saying this; it’s simply the legal position that needs to be considered.

Begum WAS a citizen of the UK, she never was of Bangladesh. And it was perfectly reasonable for Bangladesh to say that any application would be considered but probably declined. That’s standard for any country such as the USA, UK, France etc etc. So she was made stateless.
 
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Terrorist is a confusing word. It never applies to the western govts indiscriminately bombing the middle East, it didn't apply to the mujahideen when they where attacking the Soviets but then it did when they attacked the US. The British terrorised Ireland through the ages but when the indigenous population fought back they became the terrorist. Ditto Keyna and Malaya.
The Begum issue is a classic example of playing to the gallery, other taliban fighters have returned. What an easy target to deflect and impress the rwnj's. She's our problem and if she is found to have broken our law then she should be punished accordingly.
She may very well have changed her mind, three dead babies certainly would concentrate it. If so she'd be a valuable asset to talk to young Muslims about the perils of radicalisation.
People who have done far worse are walking the streets, everyone deserves to be served justice and turn their life around.
 
Archibald Knox said:
That is not correct. She has never been a Bangladeshi citizen nor did she have the opportunity to apply. She was in Syria at age 16 and still is. So the window for application as an adult was not available to her. My point is that Javid knew all that and took advantage in spuriously claiming the Bangladesh opportunity was there, to justify his decision (which may prove to be illegal).

The Bangladesh claim by Javid is simply a red herring, a smokescreen to act as a distraction from him. As I said, I carry no moral position on her, Javid or Bangladesh in saying this; it’s simply the legal position that needs to be considered.

Begum WAS a citizen of the UK, she never was of Bangladesh. And it was perfectly reasonable for Bangladesh to say that any application would be considered but probably declined. That’s standard for any country such as the USA, UK, France etc etc. So she was made stateless.
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I don't know the timeline well enough to be honest; but if she was stripped of her UK Citizenship before she turned 21, the only reason she couldn't apply was because she was in Syria and then we get into the circular discussion about when you're old enough to make your own mind up etc etc.

She has never helped her case by celebrating the murders in the name of Allah; a little contrition might have helped her win over some of the people who just see a traitor and terrorist rather than a girl who was groomed and got in way too deep too soon.
 
TSSeasider said:
I don't know the timeline well enough to be honest; but if she was stripped of her UK Citizenship before she turned 21, the only reason she couldn't apply was because she was in Syria and then we get into the circular discussion about when you're old enough to make your own mind up etc etc.

She has never helped her case by celebrating the murders in the name of Allah; a little contrition might have helped her win over some of the people who just see a traitor and terrorist rather than a girl who was groomed and got in way too deep too soon.
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Yes, that is so. The root cause of all her problems was her own behaviour. Which continued for several years after she left and into adulthood. But it should be fair to properly assess whether she was groomed or trafficked as 15 year old though, as mitigation, before making her stateless.

We also know that her smuggling from Turkey into Syria was organised by an Arab acting as an intelligence agent for Canada which rather confuses the picture, with the agent of an ally supposedly carrying out illegal activities on naive children. I do not think Javid considered that.

www.bbc.co.uk

Shamima Begum: Spy for Canada smuggled schoolgirl to Syria

Mohammed Al Rasheed says he shared her passport details with Canada as UK police hunted for her.
www.bbc.co.uk
 
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United Ireland, here we come 😘

… and a litttle less United Kingdom
 
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🙄 you haven’t really understood the Belfast Agreement, have you toot toot

you will probably still be alive when it happens

P.s. i set my alarm for 2 a.m. especially to tell you this
 
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