CJ

rememberlesshannon said:
How many full games has he played in that period ? If Keshi is out, he may get a run of games that will see him return to the player he was. Who knows ?
Maybe give him a chance other than a few minutes, in a handful of games off the bench and not get on his back when he makes a mistake.
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It’s very hard when you travel to Hartlepool and watch him miss control every ball into him and never get past a league 2 full back then drag a shot 6 yards wide from 10 yards out then miss in the middle off the goal from 3 yards out to think he’s going to turn around and become a championship player he’s 26 years old and not a kid, he’s never played above league 2 standard until he came to us and right now that’s looking like the standard he should be playing at.
 
Adams Kebab said:
He started our first two games & was totally ineffective in both. Literally did nothing. Just a body on the pitch.
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You're right but he was clearly injured at the start of this season. I'd start him often and give him until the end of this season to prove that he can be a threat at this level.
 
SeasideKurt said:
Almost everyone has called for him to go out on loan.

Send him to Gillingham or wherever and if he tears it up and gets back to match fitness, fantastic.

But he really isn't what we need right now and he's getting eaten alive by Championship standard players because he's 1 dimensional. He makes us one dimensional too at times.
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Kurt, he’s played a bit part in 5 games in the Championship, after a long absence. How is he supposed to be up to speed - of course he’ll look rusty, but eaten alive??
 
Northstandsinger said:
It’s very hard when you travel to Hartlepool and watch him miss control every ball into him and never get past a league 2 full back then drag a shot 6 yards wide from 10 yards out then miss in the middle off the goal from 3 yards out to think he’s going to turn around and become a championship player he’s 26 years old and not a kid, he’s never played above league 2 standard until he came to us and right now that’s looking like the standard he should be playing at.
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Why have fans forgotten that Lavery cost us the match. Let’s just blame CJ, despite the fact he created clear chances and got in good positions.

Is it so outrageous that he’s not 100% after so long out?

I see many have written off Dale after 4 games, when he turned the game at Reading and has played in a new team (after a long injury) when said team was performing very poorly.

Fans need to get a grip on reality, but after 40+ years of supporting Pool, I know we have some of the most fickle fans around.
 
TimperleyTangerine said:
Why have fans forgotten that Lavery cost us the match. Let’s just blame CJ, despite the fact he created clear chances and got in good positions.

Is it so outrageous that he’s not 100% after so long out?

I see many have written off Dale after 4 games, when he turned the game at Reading and has played in a new team (after a long injury) when said team was performing very poorly.

Fans need to get a grip on reality, but after 40+ years of supporting Pool, I know we have some of the most fickle fans around.
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Lavery had a mare at Hartlepool and should have had 2 goals same as cj.
I haven’t written dale off at all but he certainly didn’t turn the game at all we battered reading from the first minute until the last minute in that game fact.
 
Northstandsinger said:
Lavery had a mare at Hartlepool and should have had 2 goals same as cj.
I haven’t written dale off at all but he certainly didn’t turn the game at all we battered reading from the first minute until the last minute in that game fact.
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But you focussed on your trip to Hartlepool (great effort by the way) and focussed on CJ, not the player who cost us. I wonder just how much good it would have done CJ, had Lavery scored at least 1. His confidence would have been high and he may have been better thereafter. He needs to feel part of this squad after so long out, and he needs our support.
 
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TimperleyTangerine said:
Kurt, he’s played a bit part in 5 games in the Championship, after a long absence. How is he supposed to be up to speed - of course he’ll look rusty, but eaten alive??
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He's looked as out of depth as I would if I put a Blackpool kit on and tried to play.

We can support him by sending him out on loan to get up to speed. It's what most clubs do and works well.
 
Stony Hill said:
This is the kind of post that appeals to me.
A long time ago I was given this advice: “If you want to give a work colleague bad news, tear a strip off them or discipline them, do it in private. On the other hand, if it’s good news, tell every one.”
How would CJ be feeling after Saturday. No better than the rest of the team, I think. Eleven players to blame? Coaching? Seen it all before?
At worst, I don’t think CJ is up to pre-injury speed yet. But, Hartlepool defenders weren’t stopping him. If Keshi is out long term, we may need a focussed CJ.

If they’re wearing tangerine, support them.
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Well said Stony 👍
 
SeasideKurt said:
He's looked as out of depth as I would if I put a Blackpool kit on and tried to play.

We can support him by sending him out on loan to get up to speed. It's what most clubs do and works well.
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Your first sentence is laughable.

Your second is strange, given that Keshi is out for a long time, Bowler may be going and we’ve not completed on Dale. Who are you picking out wide after you’ve sent out CJ on loan?
 
Northstandsinger said:
It’s very hard when you travel to Hartlepool and watch him miss control every ball into him and never get past a league 2 full back then drag a shot 6 yards wide from 10 yards out then miss in the middle off the goal from 3 yards out to think he’s going to turn around and become a championship player he’s 26 years old and not a kid, he’s never played above league 2 standard until he came to us and right now that’s looking like the standard he should be playing at.
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Do you think the same about Lavery after travelling all the way to Hartlepool ?

Edit: just seen the above, CJ is absolutely useless, Lavery had an off day.
 
TimperleyTangerine said:
Your first sentence is laughable.

Your second is strange, given that Keshi is out for a long time, Bowler may be going and we’ve not completed on Dale. Who are you picking out wide after you’ve sent out CJ on loan?
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My first sentence isn't laughable. He's looked absolutely ** terrible. You just don't agree with it.

He has ONE move, knock and run. That doesn't work at this level and makes us as a team worse because that's all we end up doing is hitting it into a channel for him to run onto. No first touch. He needs sending away to a lower level to get fitness and get his game back.
 
SeasideKurt said:
My first sentence isn't laughable. He's looked absolutely ** terrible. You just don't agree with it.

He has ONE move, knock and run. That doesn't work at this level and makes us as a team worse because that's all we end up doing is hitting it into a channel for him to run onto. No first touch. He needs sending away to a lower level to get fitness and get his game back.
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No it is laughable - comparing yourself to a pro at that level.

You’re entitled to the rest of your opinion.
 
TimperleyTangerine said:
Not digging him out, really?

CJ has played less than 200 minutes this season, Bowler has appeared in 26 league games and has improved his all round game.

It’s clearly obvious that CJ will benefit from playing regularly. It’s clearly unfair for fans to rubbish him, after a major injury and so little game time. It’s madness to suggest otherwise.
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A very good point TT. CJ has hardly played after coming back from his operation. Anybody with even the smallest knowledge of the game would understand that he, like any other player needs game time to achieve match fitness. I wish him well!
 
I’m still scratching my head how he missed that glorious chance against West Brom that could of won us the game
 
CJ will continue to struggle at championship level due to the standard of player he plays against.

His undoubtable, raw, electrifying pace got him into good positions in league 1 and rightfully got him a few goals.

You need more than just pace in the championship, it’s fact. The jump in players-class from league One to the Championship is arguably the biggest jump in football.

CJ will continue to struggle and I imagine will be loaned out at the end of the season for the following campaign.
 
ItsGrimUpNorth said:
CJ will continue to struggle at championship level due to the standard of player he plays against.

His undoubtable, raw, electrifying pace got him into good positions in league 1 and rightfully got him a few goals.

You need more than just pace in the championship, it’s fact. The jump in players-class from league One to the Championship is arguably the biggest jump in football.

CJ will continue to struggle and I imagine will be loaned out at the end of the season for the following campaign.
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Examples of players comfortably bridging the gap to the Championship, just from our present squad. If you want to look back further to 2009 almost the entire squad bridged the gap and then onto the PL.

Marv
Hubby
Wintle
Keshi
Yates
Ward

Give CJ a chance, he’s our player, don’t write him off after 5 Championship games.
 
I'm in the middle. I can see both sides of the argument. I'm not convinced CJ can bridge the gap to the Championship but he needs to be given a chance and I'm not sure he has even started a game at this level yet? He might be a weapon off the bench, on the counter attack. I think a run of games would help back to fitness and form and they will probably need to happen at another club, on loan. His injury has hugely impacted on his Blackpool career.
 
HighfieldSeasider said:
At the start of last season he was our main outlet with his pace, technically he was never a great footballer but his pace made him a threat.

I've said the same on the board a few times, since his injury problems, which for a sprinter are a big problem, he seems to have lost that blistering pace. He either can't run as fast anymore or he's scared to hit top speed and slows down as he's worried about injuring himself again, in my opinion it's the latter.

Let's be honest, technically as a footballer he's never been the best, ala Theo Walcott, especially since his injuries his first touch and control have been absolutely abysmal, that's nothing to do with confidence unfortunately, without that frightening speed he's a L2/Conference level footballer.

Edited to add: I don't agree with the level of reaction and writing off a player.
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He hasnt lost any pace at all what his problem now is everybody at this level in those areas have pace and he needs more than that. Fans had every right to be on his back last week he had a point to prove and his effort was shocking as was the team 2nd half and when you spend small fortunes week in week out travelling and watching putting in the effort off the pitch, you expect to see it reflected on it by paid proffesionals. I can take players having a bad game but what I cant take is a lack of effort. He just isn’t good enough along with a lot of others.
 
TimperleyTangerine said:
Examples of players comfortably bridging the gap to the Championship, just from our present squad. If you want to look back further to 2009 almost the entire squad bridged the gap and then onto the PL.

Marv
Hubby
Wintle
Keshi
Yates
Ward

Give CJ a chance, he’s our player, don’t write him off after 5 Championship games.
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Oh - I now understand your logic. You shouldn’t have broken it down like this from the start.

So what you’re saying, is because 6 of our players have bridged the gap from League One to the Championship that means every single player will be able to?

Right, I’ve got you. Understood. 🥴
 
UltraNorthStand said:
He hasnt lost any pace at all what his problem now is everybody at this level in those areas have pace and he needs more than that. Fans had every right to be on his back last week he had a point to prove and his effort was shocking as was the team 2nd half and when you spend small fortunes week in week out travelling and watching putting in the effort off the pitch, you expect to see it reflected on it by paid proffesionals. I can take players having a bad game but what I cant take is a lack of effort. He just isn’t good enough along with a lot of others.
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This Is aimed at the whole abject team performance in the second 45 minutes right ? Or are you saying the guy who created chances, missed chances and has had hardly any game time over the last 18 months, was the root cause of one of the worst second half performances I have ever seen. That he wasn't trying and this bad blood he had running through his veins, affected the rest of the players so badly they all ended up being shit. Or as you have intimated, some had a bad day CJ is just absolutely garbage. Short term memory syndrome some fans, everyone was crying in their beer first time he got injured.
Like I say he's neither Maradonna or Whitworth ( for those old enough to remember the worst debut in history)
There must be something in the middle and I will reserve judgement on his ability to be a Championship player until he has a run of games.
Bowler has gone from useless to God in half a season, maybe just maybe CJ can do the same.
 
rememberlesshannon said:
This Is aimed at the whole abject team performance in the second 45 minutes right ? Or are you saying the guy who created chances, missed chances and has had hardly any game time over the last 18 months, was the root cause of one of the worst second half performances I have ever seen. That he wasn't trying and this bad blood he had running through his veins, affected the rest of the players so badly they all ended up being shit. Or as you have intimated, some had a bad day CJ is just absolutely garbage. Short term memory syndrome some fans, everyone was crying in their beer first time he got injured.
Like I say he's neither Maradonna or Whitworth ( for those old enough to remember the worst debut in history)
There must be something in the middle and I will reserve judgement on his ability to be a Championship player until he has a run of games.
Bowler has gone from useless to God in half a season, maybe just maybe CJ can do the same.
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When do you expect this “run of games,” that you go on about, to come?

He’s been back in full training for a substantial period of time now and still hasn’t done anything on the training ground to warrant a starting place. Does that not speak wonders? Or is NC wrong?
 
CJ is the perfect example of a player who needs to go out and get a his confidence back, he isn’t useless but he’s looked so out of his depth since he’s come back, I’ve felt a bit sorry for him tbh.

Until now I’d have said a loan to play himself into form and maybe find a new club, now it looks like we might need him to play for us which isn’t ideal but I still think an in form CJ could be a weapon with his pace, it’s just whether he can find that form here.

He certainly looks like he’s holding something back and worried about another injury.
 
ItsGrimUpNorth said:
When do you expect this “run of games,” that you go on about, to come?

He’s been back in full training for a substantial period of time now and still hasn’t done anything on the training ground to warrant a starting place. Does that not speak wonders? Or is NC wrong?
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Anderson out, Dale gone back, better than Mitchell, Apter on loan. Maybe starting Saturday fingers crossed, be nice to have a goal threat on the left instead of tried, tested and not delivered Mitchell.
 
ItsGrimUpNorth said:
Oh - I now understand your logic. You shouldn’t have broken it down like this from the start.

So what you’re saying, is because 6 of our players have bridged the gap from League One to the Championship that means every single player will be able to?

Right, I’ve got you. Understood. 🥴
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No, I’m saying any player needs more than bit parts in 5 games. Not a difficult concept to understand.
 
TimperleyTangerine said:
Examples of players comfortably bridging the gap to the Championship, just from our present squad. If you want to look back further to 2009 almost the entire squad bridged the gap and then onto the PL.

Marv
Hubby
Wintle
Keshi
Yates
Ward

Give CJ a chance, he’s our player, don’t write him off after 5 Championship games.
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So baring in mind we aren't safe yet, you want to keep persisting with someone who hasn't shown an ounce of Championship class yet.

Dale has been sent back and he achieved more in one game. He looked League One quality to me.

I personally think Critch will know this and we'll be looking at numbers but we are outrageously short everywhere right now.
 
TimperleyTangerine said:
But you focussed on your trip to Hartlepool (great effort by the way) and focussed on CJ, not the player who cost us. I wonder just how much good it would have done CJ, had Lavery scored at least 1. His confidence would have been high and he may have been better thereafter. He needs to feel part of this squad after so long out, and he needs our support.
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I didn’t focus on cj
Lavery
Marv
Sterling
Garbutt
Ect all had poor games but this thread is about cj
 
when a player gets a bad injury ,it effects each individual differently ,i think this is part of his problem plus lack of confidence after coming on avftt , ,give the guy a break ffs he is a good player it beats me that people on this board (probably 90 percent or more )have never played semi professional football at best, let alone had a bad injury he,s one of ours let critch decide if he is good enough or not (and just get behind whatever team he puts out) some of you lot need to get a life 😫.
 
SeasideKurt said:
So baring in mind we aren't safe yet, you want to keep persisting with someone who hasn't shown an ounce of Championship class yet.

Dale has been sent back and he achieved more in one game. He looked League One quality to me.

I personally think Critch will know this and we'll be looking at numbers but we are outrageously short everywhere right now.
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I’m saying 5 games isn’t enough to judge a player.
 
Now Dale has gone back let's not give up on CJ or Demi but they ain't gonna improve when they are low on confidence and struggling for game time, I'd start both the wingers against Millwall and make a decision at half time regarding work rate and the effect they are having.
 
SeasideKurt said:
Seems to be the case for Dale and Gretarrson (less than 5 games). I clearly don't see what you see in CJ.

Loan in League One is the best all round option.
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Dale I think is due to the injury and game time, and the club not being able to commit to try previously agreed fee.

Let’s see re CJ, but I’m sure we all want him to succeed in the Championship.
 
SeasideKurt said:
Seems to be the case for Dale and Gretarrson (less than 5 games). I clearly don't see what you see in CJ.

Loan in League One is the best all round option.
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It's best all round except for us with Anderson out for however many weeks. Never mind we've got the tried and tested Demi to step in.....ffs
 
Jakeyr said:
Now Dale has gone back let's not give up on CJ or Demi but they ain't gonna improve when they are low on confidence and struggling for game time, I'd start both the wingers against Millwall and make a decision at half time regarding work rate and the effect they are having.
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So we’re going to drop Bowler to give the others confidence and then decide at half-time how it’s going??

This is the Championship not Soccer Aid.
 
rememberlesshannon said:
Anderson out, Dale gone back, better than Mitchell, Apter on loan. Maybe starting Saturday fingers crossed, be nice to have a goal threat on the left instead of tried, tested and not delivered Mitchell.
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Ah, because CJ has showed proven class at this level hasn’t he.

If he was up to much in training, he’d have forced his way into the team already. Instead, he’s made 5 appearances, scored 0 and assisted 0.
 
Its all about opinions

The OP obviously rates CJ Hamilton

I don't, i think he's an awful footballer who's a bit of a one trick pony

He has pace but nothing else

His touch is horrendous, and his final ball extremely poor, he also hasn't got much composure and seems to just swing at the ball aimlessly

The biggest problem for me is his body language when he loses the ball, instead of chasing back he just stands there shrugging his shoulders and pouting his lips

Would probably do really well for someone like Fylde in their league where he could just run at journey men pros

All opinions of course...
 
UltraNorthStand said:
He hasnt lost any pace at all what his problem now is everybody at this level in those areas have pace and he needs more than that. Fans had every right to be on his back last week he had a point to prove and his effort was shocking as was the team 2nd half and when you spend small fortunes week in week out travelling and watching putting in the effort off the pitch, you expect to see it reflected on it by paid proffesionals. I can take players having a bad game but what I cant take is a lack of effort. He just isn’t good enough along with a lot of others.
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I disagree.
I think he’s ‘lost’ his sixth gear. (@ the mo) I can’t prove it but his body language does not look like he’s busting a gut on some of his runs. Maybe, his muscles are not fully loosened? Maybe he’s worried about another injury?
On the other hand, if he gets his confidence back and he hears the crowd roaring him on, might he put in that extra effort? Wouldn’t you?
If it doesn’t happen, then I’ll conform but give him a (last) chance.
 
Phil_bfc deux said:
Its all about opinions

The OP obviously rates CJ Hamilton

I don't, i think he's an awful footballer who's a bit of a one trick pony

He has pace but nothing else

His touch is horrendous, and his final ball extremely poor, he also hasn't got much composure and seems to just swing at the ball aimlessly

The biggest problem for me is his body language when he loses the ball, instead of chasing back he just stands there shrugging his shoulders and pouting his lips

Would probably do really well for someone like Fylde in their league where he could just run at journey men pros

All opinions of course...
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I might ultimately agree with you but not yet!
 
Phil_bfc deux said:
Its all about opinions

The OP obviously rates CJ Hamilton

I don't, i think he's an awful footballer who's a bit of a one trick pony

He has pace but nothing else

His touch is horrendous, and his final ball extremely poor, he also hasn't got much composure and seems to just swing at the ball aimlessly

The biggest problem for me is his body language when he loses the ball, instead of chasing back he just stands there shrugging his shoulders and pouting his lips

Would probably do really well for someone like Fylde in their league where he could just run at journey men pros

All opinions of course...
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As you say Phil it’s all about opinions. Did you watch the highlights I posted, hardly one trick, left and right foot, finishing and assists. Bit harsh, but respect you have your view.

I wonder with us missing a lot of live matches last season, and with his injury, if we’ve not fully appreciated what CJ brings.
 
ItsGrimUpNorth said:
You’re ignoring the training remark.

If he was as good as you’re all promising, he would be showing it in training. Why hasn’t he forced his way into the starting XI?
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Because Anderson and Bowler have been outstanding ?
Because Dale was here when CJ was injured ?
Not sure what training CJ has had, if he's had Covid ?
So Anderson is out, Mitchell or CJ our only alternative. Presumably you go for the tried and trusted never let us down, guaranteed a top performance Mitchell. It's why we have a squad, when players get injured, loans end, covid hits, we have players to come in.
Then it's up to the player to perform and keep his place......unless you're Grimshaw of course.
 
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