Food bank exploiters

[Malced]

We keep hearing about how record numbers are ‘having to’ use them. And how that’s such a shameful indictment on our country.

However I’m not prepared to accept that at face value. I’m sure the figures are inflated by many who exploit them without real need. They’re taking advantage so they can use their income on other things such as a social life and non-essentials.

This is a problem because the food bank donations are on the decrease when demand is getting higher and higher. So these chancers are taking food which then means there’s less for the genuine.

The issue has arisen partly cos the media and unions have helped normalise the idea and take away any stigma there might have been. Stigma isn’t a good thing, but we are seeing the polar opposite where the foodbanks are becoming a badge of honour for those that want to moan about the cost of living.

The media and unions are forever saying that teachers, nhs workers and train workers etc are using foodbanks. So over time that’s become more and more of a thing. People with significant incomes are taking food and are happy to tell others about it and thus it becomes more and more normalised.

I have a mate who goes. He is on various benefits but has lots of disposable income. He goes to the pub regularly. He eats at weatherspoons regularly. Yet he all too willingly goes to a foodbank. He has absolutely no need to.

I had a couple of ladies in my cab last week. They were glammed up for a night out in Poulton. They were teachers or some sort of school workers. On the way to poulton they were talking about the cost of electric and gas. I picked them up at lovely expensive looking houses. One said she’d initially refused to pay her gas and electric and joined in with the campaign to refuse to pay. However she went on to say she’d thought better of it and after a while paid the arrears of £500 or so. She then said ‘everything is so expensive. I’ve had to use the foodbank.’ Then followed a conversion about the foodbank and what she got as part of a typical food goody bag.
Anyways, they arrived in poulton, paid the £13 fare, and headed off for their night out. I found it shocking.

Now don’t get me wrong, there’s a need for foodbanks BUT they should only be for the genuine who have no other means to feed themselves and their families.

I very much doubt there’s any checks done by the foodbanks to weed out the chancers. There was a person on sky seen using the foodbank and then getting in their 4x4 vehicle and driving away. Poor thing. Well I suppose the cost of their car lease and fuel etc has made them so desperate.

I think there need to be eligibility checks. Far too many will be taking the food yet have plenty of money in their accounts. They’re abusing the system. It’s immoral and disgusting yet all we get fed at this time of year is stories of hardship.

Let’s be clear. Foodbanks should be for the unfortunate desperate hungry people. They shouldn’t be a lifestyle option for folk who live relatively comfortable lives but want to free up their food shop money so they can carry on with socialising etc.

 

[Mexboroseasider]

We keep hearing about how record numbers are ‘having to’ use them. And how that’s such a shameful indictment on our country.

However I’m not prepared to accept that at face value. I’m sure the figures are inflated by many who exploit them without real need. They’re taking advantage so they can use their income on other things such as a social life and non-essentials.

This is a problem because the food bank donations are on the decrease when demand is getting higher and higher. So these chancers are taking food which then means there’s less for the genuine.

The issue has arisen partly cos the media and unions have helped normalise the idea and take away any stigma there might have been. Stigma isn’t a good thing, but we are seeing the polar opposite where the foodbanks are becoming a badge of honour for those that want to moan about the cost of living.

The media and unions are forever saying that teachers, nhs workers and train workers etc are using foodbanks. So over time that’s become more and more of a thing. People with significant incomes are taking food and are happy to tell others about it and thus it becomes more and more normalised.

I have a mate who goes. He is on various benefits but has lots of disposable income. He goes to the pub regularly. He eats at weatherspoons regularly. Yet he all too willingly goes to a foodbank. He has absolutely no need to.

I had a couple of ladies in my cab last week. They were glammed up for a night out in Poulton. They were teachers or some sort of school workers. On the way to poulton they were talking about the cost of electric and gas. I picked them up at lovely expensive looking houses. One said she’d initially refused to pay her gas and electric and joined in with the campaign to refuse to pay. However she went on to say she’d thought better of it and after a while paid the arrears of £500 or so. She then said ‘everything is so expensive. I’ve had to use the foodbank.’ Then followed a conversion about the foodbank and what she got as part of a typical food goody bag.
Anyways, they arrived in poulton, paid the £13 fare, and headed off for their night out. I found it shocking.

Now don’t get me wrong, there’s a need for foodbanks BUT they should only be for the genuine who have no other means to feed themselves and their families.

I very much doubt there’s any checks done by the foodbanks to weed out the chancers. There was a person on sky seen using the foodbank and then getting in their 4x4 vehicle and driving away. Poor thing. Well I suppose the cost of their car lease and fuel etc has made them so desperate.

I think there need to be eligibility checks. Far too many will be taking the food yet have plenty of money in their accounts. They’re abusing the system. It’s immoral and disgusting yet all we get fed at this time of year is stories of hardship.

Let’s be clear. Foodbanks should be for the unfortunate desperate hungry people. They shouldn’t be a lifestyle option for folk who live relatively comfortable lives but want to free up their food shop money so they can carry on with socialising etc.

So I suppose you’ve donated the £13 fare to a food bank then?

 

[20togo]

So I suppose you’ve donated the £13 fare to a food bank then?

What's that got to do with it? And why should he, he's just trying to earn a living. Your problem is that you attack everyone at the top for their dishonesty but seem to think it doesn't happen at the bottom where there are plenty of people abusing the system. Why don't you try addressing the poinrs the o/p mentions?

 

[Mexboroseasider]

What's that got to do with it? And why should he, he's just trying to earn a living. Your problem is that you attack everyone at the top for their dishonesty but seem to think it doesn't happen at the bottom where there are plenty of people abusing the system. Why don't you try addressing the poinrs the o/p mentions?

He obviously feels strongly about it so I was just testing to see how strongly he actually feels. He seems to think these ladies have effectively “stolen” from the food bank in which case he could make amends by donating the money he made from them. Rather than profiting from “the proceeds of crime”.

As for your other point, you’re right. People can be dishonest whether they’re from the “bottom” or the “top” although I suspect those at the top snaffle the most - see Michelle Mone - which is why they’re the most obvious target for criticism.

My other issues about the op are first that it seems to be in the same vein as lots of other stories that try to demonise “the poor”. Let’s cast a bit of doubt about some of the people using food banks and then it’s easier to cast all users in the same light.

And then secondly it sort of misses the point. Which is, why is there any need for food banks at all?

 

[Costero Poderoso]

We keep hearing about how record numbers are ‘having to’ use them. And how that’s such a shameful indictment on our country.

However I’m not prepared to accept that at face value. I’m sure the figures are inflated by many who exploit them without real need. They’re taking advantage so they can use their income on other things such as a social life and non-essentials.

This is a problem because the food bank donations are on the decrease when demand is getting higher and higher. So these chancers are taking food which then means there’s less for the genuine.

The issue has arisen partly cos the media and unions have helped normalise the idea and take away any stigma there might have been. Stigma isn’t a good thing, but we are seeing the polar opposite where the foodbanks are becoming a badge of honour for those that want to moan about the cost of living.

The media and unions are forever saying that teachers, nhs workers and train workers etc are using foodbanks. So over time that’s become more and more of a thing. People with significant incomes are taking food and are happy to tell others about it and thus it becomes more and more normalised.

I have a mate who goes. He is on various benefits but has lots of disposable income. He goes to the pub regularly. He eats at weatherspoons regularly. Yet he all too willingly goes to a foodbank. He has absolutely no need to.

I had a couple of ladies in my cab last week. They were glammed up for a night out in Poulton. They were teachers or some sort of school workers. On the way to poulton they were talking about the cost of electric and gas. I picked them up at lovely expensive looking houses. One said she’d initially refused to pay her gas and electric and joined in with the campaign to refuse to pay. However she went on to say she’d thought better of it and after a while paid the arrears of £500 or so. She then said ‘everything is so expensive. I’ve had to use the foodbank.’ Then followed a conversion about the foodbank and what she got as part of a typical food goody bag.
Anyways, they arrived in poulton, paid the £13 fare, and headed off for their night out. I found it shocking.

Now don’t get me wrong, there’s a need for foodbanks BUT they should only be for the genuine who have no other means to feed themselves and their families.

I very much doubt there’s any checks done by the foodbanks to weed out the chancers. There was a person on sky seen using the foodbank and then getting in their 4x4 vehicle and driving away. Poor thing. Well I suppose the cost of their car lease and fuel etc has made them so desperate.

I think there need to be eligibility checks. Far too many will be taking the food yet have plenty of money in their accounts. They’re abusing the system. It’s immoral and disgusting yet all we get fed at this time of year is stories of hardship.

Let’s be clear. Foodbanks should be for the unfortunate desperate hungry people. They shouldn’t be a lifestyle option for folk who live relatively comfortable lives but want to free up their food shop money so they can carry on with socialising etc.

Do you not think you should talk to your "mate" and explain that he's taking the piss, and that people with genuine need will have to do without.

Many full time workers cannot meet the cost of housing, energy and food (and often debt from student days (teachers and nurses a good example)) from their full time suposedly living wages, which is ridiculous. A full time job shouldnt leave people in need and they are, over 60% of the uk population is living paycheck to paycheck. if it wasnt foodbanks it would loan sharks and / or payday lending or something else equally problematic that those people would subject to.

There should not need to be a need for foodbanks, we are not living in the Victorian era or we shouldnt be. the fact that the conservatives are now saying that increasing the number of foodbanks in a conservative controlled region is a positive thing - is a good indication of where we are as a society.

 

[20togo]

He obviously feels strongly about it so I was just testing to see how strongly he actually feels. He seems to think these ladies have effectively “stolen” from the food bank in which case he could make amends by donating the money he made from them. Rather than pocketing the proceeds of crime.

As for your other point, you’re right. People can be dishonest whether they’re from the “bottom” or the “top” although I suspect those at the top snaffle the most - see Michelle Mone - which is why they’re the most obvious target for criticism.

My other issues about the op are first that it seems to be in the same vein as lots of other stories that try to demonise “the poor”. Let’s cast a bit of doubt about some of the people using food banks and then it’s easier to cast all users in the same light.

And then secondly it sort of misses the point. Which is, why is there any need for food banks at all?

"lets cast a bit of doubt" ? What doubt is there? It's blatantly obvious that some are abusing the 'system' and people have been abusing every system as long as systems have been in place. As for misses the point, well of course there shouldn't be any need for food banks at all. But that applies across the whole of the world! It's not unlike you to make it political and solely about this country is it?!

 

[Mexboroseasider]

"lets cast a bit of doubt" ? What doubt is there? It's blatantly obvious that some are abusing the 'system' and people have been abusing every system as long as systems have been in place. As for misses the point, well of course there shouldn't be any need for food banks at all. But that applies across the whole of the world! It's not unlike you to make it political and solely about this country is it?!

I’ve got no doubt some people are abusing food banks. But how many?

Is it 1%? 10%? 90%?

Do you have any idea? Because I don’t.

Which makes it very easy to infer that the vast majority of people who use food banks are chancers. As some on the right will no doubt be very happy to do.

 

[rockontommy]

We keep hearing about how record numbers are ‘having to’ use them. And how that’s such a shameful indictment on our country.

However I’m not prepared to accept that at face value. I’m sure the figures are inflated by many who exploit them without real need. They’re taking advantage so they can use their income on other things such as a social life and non-essentials.

This is a problem because the food bank donations are on the decrease when demand is getting higher and higher. So these chancers are taking food which then means there’s less for the genuine.

The issue has arisen partly cos the media and unions have helped normalise the idea and take away any stigma there might have been. Stigma isn’t a good thing, but we are seeing the polar opposite where the foodbanks are becoming a badge of honour for those that want to moan about the cost of living.

The media and unions are forever saying that teachers, nhs workers and train workers etc are using foodbanks. So over time that’s become more and more of a thing. People with significant incomes are taking food and are happy to tell others about it and thus it becomes more and more normalised.

I have a mate who goes. He is on various benefits but has lots of disposable income. He goes to the pub regularly. He eats at weatherspoons regularly. Yet he all too willingly goes to a foodbank. He has absolutely no need to.

I had a couple of ladies in my cab last week. They were glammed up for a night out in Poulton. They were teachers or some sort of school workers. On the way to poulton they were talking about the cost of electric and gas. I picked them up at lovely expensive looking houses. One said she’d initially refused to pay her gas and electric and joined in with the campaign to refuse to pay. However she went on to say she’d thought better of it and after a while paid the arrears of £500 or so. She then said ‘everything is so expensive. I’ve had to use the foodbank.’ Then followed a conversion about the foodbank and what she got as part of a typical food goody bag.
Anyways, they arrived in poulton, paid the £13 fare, and headed off for their night out. I found it shocking.

Now don’t get me wrong, there’s a need for foodbanks BUT they should only be for the genuine who have no other means to feed themselves and their families.

I very much doubt there’s any checks done by the foodbanks to weed out the chancers. There was a person on sky seen using the foodbank and then getting in their 4x4 vehicle and driving away. Poor thing. Well I suppose the cost of their car lease and fuel etc has made them so desperate.

I think there need to be eligibility checks. Far too many will be taking the food yet have plenty of money in their accounts. They’re abusing the system. It’s immoral and disgusting yet all we get fed at this time of year is stories of hardship.

Let’s be clear. Foodbanks should be for the unfortunate desperate hungry people. They shouldn’t be a lifestyle option for folk who live relatively comfortable lives but want to free up their food shop money so they can carry on with socialising etc.

Walked past a supermarket food bank collection point the other day. It only had Covid tests and dry rub for steak in it.

Personally, I've handed out hundreds of food parcels including to shielded individuals through the first lockdown. So many (up to a fifth) weren't in and needed chasing around town to give them their free food when they clearly could've just been doing their own shopping if they didn't want to isolate. That obviously diverted resources away from the vulnerable.

In more normal times, I've seen enough to understand that the whole enterprise might as well just be set up to buy the collector some weed or smack. Of course, the well intentioned donators and hard working volunteers are mostly unaware of this or are good enough souls to overlook it.

Me personally, I've had times where I've been on the bones of my arse and cut my cloth accordingly. Pride wouldn't allow me to go to a food bank; I'd get a job, any job, before it came to that. Others are different.

As 20s posts and the OP states, there are individuals at all levels of society gaming the system in one way or another. I sit in the pub and drink with tradesmen who don't pay tax which is not much different. It's hard to get too vexed about these things.

 

[Malced]

So I suppose you’ve donated the £13 fare to a food bank then?

Why would I do that when they’re being exploited? Perhaps I could have let them off the fare as they were so needy?

 

[Mexboroseasider]

Why would I do that when they’re being exploited? Perhaps I could have let them off the fare as they were so needy?

Well if you’re worried about food banks being exploited you could have donated the fare to a charity of your choice.

 

[TheRealKingKenny]

I volunteered at an East London foodbank for a while.

Everyone who used it went through an application process and had to fit specific criteria. It wasn’t just the food, there were advisors that would help people with get back into employment or help them with their benefits.

During Covid we did a lot of deliveries, it was mainly single mums, old people, some disabled people. We also used to deliver to the women’s refuge. Personally, I never doubted anyone’s credentials and I took everyone on face value.

I saw my fair share of squalor, sometimes in estates that still exists within the City not far from the financial centre, that was a bit surreal to see it so close to all that wealth. I don’t foresee those estates being there for too long, it’s a matter of time. We delivered to some new apartment blocks too, they tended to be a bit younger, normally mums with a few kids from memory.

The food they got was basic tinned produce, pasta and rice, and some bread. It was nothing special but enough to get through a week. They don’t know what they’re going to get it was a semi-random selection but they’d get three to five bags depending on the size of their family.

I’m not sure if every foodbank is the same, I’ve only worked for the one but it’s first hand experience so perhaps worth sharing whilst on the subject.

 

[Malced]

I’ve got no doubt some people are abusing food banks. But how many?

Is it 1%? 10%? 90%?

Do you have any idea? Because I don’t.

Which makes it very easy to infer that the vast majority of people who use food banks are chancers. As some on the right will no doubt be very happy to do.

No I don’t have any idea. But nor do I know of anyone, or have seen anyone suggest the vast majority of food bank users are chancers. That’s just playing the usual rwnj card when it’s not appropriate to. Predictable though.

 

[Wizaard]

What's that got to do with it? And why should he, he's just trying to earn a living. Your problem is that you attack everyone at the top for their dishonesty but seem to think it doesn't happen at the bottom where there are plenty of people abusing the system. Why don't you try addressing the poinrs the o/p mentions?

There is absolutely no evidence of people widely abusing the system, and this anecdote doesn't prove a thing. 'Expensive looking house'. What does that mean?

Once again, deflect from the real issue and get the public blaming each other rather than the real bogeymen.

 

[TangerineSeasider]

Only thing is, how do you determine who the genuine cases are.?

On a slight different topic, when we ( and several thousand others were flooded in Carlisle ) various donation points were quickly arranged.
Everything and anything was donated, from kids toys, clothes, basic houseware needs, you name it, it was donated.
We eventually got an unfurnished terraced house, in pretty much the worst area of Carlisle, with pretty much not a pot to piss in.

I know for a fact that people taking from the pop up donation areas hadn’t been affected and were there taking for takings sake.

 

[Malced]

Well if you’re worried about food banks being exploited you could have donated the fare to a charity of your choice.

Why should I? Whether I give to charity or not, and if so what charity I give to is nothing to do with the post. It’s a silly deflective comment.

If food banks are being abused, as it very much seems, it makes it less likely that well meaning folk would donate.

So instead of silly deflective comments why don’t you share your opinions about whether there should be a tightening up, and whether you agree abuse means there’s a risk to the genuine cos the food isn’t going to go to the most needy.

 

[20togo]

I’ve got no doubt some people are abusing food banks. But how many?

Is it 1%? 10%? 90%?

Do you have any idea? Because I don’t.

Which makes it very easy to infer that the vast majority of people who use food banks are chancers. As some on the right will no doubt be very happy to do.

I've no idea and from what I've read on this thread nobody has implied that the vast majority of people using food banks are chancers. All i see is you trying to turn it into a political left v right issue!

 

[Malced]

There is absolutely no evidence of people widely abusing the system, and this anecdote doesn't prove a thing. 'Expensive looking house'. What does that mean?

Once again, deflect from the real issue and get the public blaming each other rather than the real bogeymen.

No evidence.
I’ve stated anecdotal examples. I didn’t say there was widespread abuse but there is enough information and news to indicate their use is much more common. If you don’t know what expensive looking house means then that’s your educational issue.

 

[20togo]

There is absolutely no evidence of people widely abusing the system, and this anecdote doesn't prove a thing. 'Expensive looking house'. What does that mean?

Once again, deflect from the real issue and get the public blaming each other rather than the real bogeymen.

so who are the real bogeymen then? Like Mex, you can't help but rush to make it a UK political issue when clearly it's a social issue that is happening all around the world.

 

[Mexboroseasider]

so who are the real bogeymen then? Like Mex, you can't help but rush to make it a UK political issue when clearly it's a social issue that is happening all around the world.

Where have I made it a U.K. issue? Point me to the relevant post please. I think you’ve made that up.

 

[Mexboroseasider]

Why should I? Whether I give to charity or not, and if so what charity I give to is nothing to do with the post. It’s a silly deflective comment.

If food banks are being abused, as it very much seems, it makes it less likely that well meaning folk would donate.

So instead of silly deflective comments why don’t you share your opinions about whether there should be a tightening up, and whether you agree abuse means there’s a risk to the genuine cos the food isn’t going to go to the most needy.

Well you obviously feel very strongly about what you believe are people “stealing” from food banks. So when offered the proceeds of crime it seems to me you had three moral choices.

1. Shout “No!! Keep your filthy lucre. I’ll not allow it to taint my hands”.
2. Say “Thank you very much. Have a nice evening”. And donate the fare to a charity of your choice.
3. Say “Thank you very much. Have a nice evening”. And trouser the filthy lucre.

As for your other points. Well yes I agree that if people hear lots of scare stories about food banks being massively exploited then they may stop donating. Which would be a shame.

I’m not sure what eligibility tests could be introduced? A statement of income and expenditure before the parcel is handed over? What’s to stop people lying? A pledge not to go out and waste money on taxi fares? How would you enforce it. Fining taxi drivers who are profiting might be a possibility I suppose.

 

[20togo]

Where have I made it a U.K. issue? Point me to the relevant post please. I think you’ve made that up.

Your reference to Mone and abusing the system. Your reference to the "right".

I'm out now. Made my point and that is for you it's all about the politics.

 

[Wizaard]

Why would I do that when they’re being exploited? Perhaps I could have let them off the fare as they were so needy?

Cash fare? Declared it in full?

Asking for a friend...

 

[seasideone]

Well you obviously feel very strongly about what you believe are people “stealing” from food banks. So when offered the proceeds of crime it seems to me you had three moral choices.

1. Shout “No!! Keep your filthy lucre. I’ll not allow it to taint my hands”.
2. Say “Thank you very much. Have a nice evening”. And donate the fare to a charity of your choice.
3. Say “Thank you very much. Have a nice evening”. And trouser the filthy lucre.

As for your other points. Well yes I agree that if people hear lots of scare stories about food banks being massively exploited then they may stop donating. Which would be a shame.

I’m not sure what eligibility tests could be introduced? A statement of income and expenditure before the parcel is handed over? What’s to stop people lying? A pledge not to go out and waste money on taxi fares? How would you enforce it. Fining taxi drivers who are profiting might be a possibility I suppose.

What high and mighty bollox you speak!

 

[Mexboroseasider]

What high and mighty bollox you speak!

A little known side effect of Covid is that not only do you lose your sense of taste. You also lose your sense of humour.

 

[Wizaard]

As I said elsewhere, these Tories won't be putting bird feeders out in winter. It makes the birds dependent, plus some will be taking the food when they dont need it. Keep them self reliant.

 

[seasideone]

A little known side effect of Covid is that not only do you lose your sense of taste. You also lose your sense of humour.

It’s a hilarious subject!

 

[Malced]

so who are the real bogeymen then? Like Mex, you can't help but rush to make it a UK political issue when clearly it's a social issue that is happening all around the world.

Not sure why we need to find a bogeyman. There’s no doubt food banks have been needed more due to cost of living. More are falling into poverty. The food banks aren’t keeping up with demand as supermarkets etc are reducing their waste and becoming more efficient with stock levels.

But if we need to find a bogeyman, one candidate is those who use a foodbank then jump in a taxi to go out and get drunk and have a meal in poulton.

 

[20togo]

Not sure why we need to find a bogeyman. There’s no doubt food banks have been needed more due to cost of living. More are falling into poverty. The food banks aren’t keeping up with demand as supermarkets etc are reducing their waste and becoming more efficient with stock levels.

But if we need to find a bogeyman, one candidate is those who use a foodbank then jump in a taxi to go out and get drunk and have a meal in poulton.

t'was Wiz who first referenced bogeymen.

 

[Malced]

Cash fare? Declared it in full?

Asking for a friend...

I love this typical rush to shoot the messenger and deflect away from the uncomfortable truths of the thread topic. But carry on. It’s all revealing.

 

[1966_and_all_that]

It's so uplifting at this time of festive cheer and goodwill to all, that we have a thread undermining the very worthy charitable work of food banks, those who run them and those who donate to them. The deliberate and cynical gaslighting of the media and trades unions on this issue is also most refreshing. Well done. I couldn't think of a better time of year to share these well considered thoughts.

 

[seasideone]

It's so uplifting at this time of festive cheer and goodwill to all, that we have a thread undermining the very worthy charitable work of food banks, those who run them and those who donate to them. The deliberate and cynical gaslighting of the media and trades unions on this issue is also most refreshing. Well done. I couldn't think of a better time of year to share these well considered thoughts.

So it is morally ok to use a food bank and then nip into town in a taxi for a night out?

 

[1966_and_all_that]

So it is morally ok to use a food bank and then nip into town in a taxi for a night out?

Gaslighting is what I wrote and gaslighting is what I meant.

 

[seasiderjohn]

Walked past a supermarket food bank collection point the other day. It only had Covid tests and dry rub for steak in it.

Personally, I've handed out hundreds of food parcels including to shielded individuals through the first lockdown. So many (up to a fifth) weren't in and needed chasing around town to give them their free food when they clearly could've just been doing their own shopping if they didn't want to isolate. That obviously diverted resources away from the vulnerable.

In more normal times, I've seen enough to understand that the whole enterprise might as well just be set up to buy the collector some weed or smack. Of course, the well intentioned donators and hard working volunteers are mostly unaware of this or are good enough souls to overlook it.

Me personally, I've had times where I've been on the bones of my arse and cut my cloth accordingly. Pride wouldn't allow me to go to a food bank; I'd get a job, any job, before it came to that. Others are different.

As 20s posts and the OP states, there are individuals at all levels of society gaming the system in one way or another. I sit in the pub and drink with tradesmen who don't pay tax which is not much different. It's hard to get too vexed about these things.

very true on the tax front
remeber in covid one person I know was whingong that he couldnt get any money from covid payouts to self employed when i asked him why he said because i dont pay tax so my answer was SERVES YOU F__KIN WELL RIGHT.

 

[seasideone]

Gaslighting is what I wrote and gaslighting is what I meant.

Stop avoiding the question!

 

[1966_and_all_that]

Stop avoiding the question!

Circumstance is everything. Your generalised cynicism dressed up as morality is not worthy of a response.

 

[TSSeasider]

The charity I work at in Hartlepool chose back in 2013 to join the FareShare movement to ensure that 'no good food goes to waste' - simply put you intercept food that was destined for landfill or pig swill and distribute it to people - either through giving it away as food in its existing state or alternatively making meals out of it and making a small charge - or free is someone else is paying.

At that time is was only about stopping food going to waste - nothing to do with food poverty or insecurity.

Now FareShare have had mission drift because members are using it to address 'food poverty' and not food waste.

We pick up food which would otherwise go in the bin from Tesco 3 nights per week on a Sunday, Tuesday and Thursday - and either share it for free or alternatively allow people to make meals with it in our place - provided they cook for everyone. We don't police it particularly as we're of the opinion - if you want yesterday's lettuce/carrots etc - take it BUT we always ask people to be considerate of everyone else who may want some - so please only take what you're going to use. There are times when people squabble and some take far more than they will ever eat, but it's uncommon.

Our approach hasn't altered and it's mostly effective.

Other places have a core mission to address food poverty; that is they believe people cannot afford to eat. This does happen but it's pretty rare. I have a great relationship with the actual Food Bank, and there are groups of people who can't afford to eat - from those who are dependent on drugs and alcohol, to those who have had benefits stopped, to people who have just lost their work and so on. Access is generally when people have a crisis in their lives.

That said, I know there are a small number people who take our food who are 'food tourists' and go to every free food outlet (give something away and there is unlimited demand) but so what? I also see people who are working on insecure hours who don't get paid as much as they need, I see people who have lost their jobs, I see people who have been at hospital appointments and have been sanctioned by DWP, I see people trying to stretch their budgets so the kids can have a few treats, and I see those people who would rather take the food than it go in the bin.

There is still a problem of food waste but it's diminishing because the private sector are monetising it - the "too good to waste" from Morrisons, the more sophisticated use of yellow stickers, apps such as Olio etc, buyers being more careful about ordering etc is having an impact - now from our philosophical perspective, that's great - but for those who's mission is food poverty - it's more of an issue.

The problem as I see it.

We think of poverty as destitution - it's not - it's about being unable to live a life which as a minimum is safe, warm, fed and fulfilling - anything below that line is an issue. We actually need to destigmatise people accessing food, so that those who don't see themselves as destitute are able to access the support that's there, when they need it. Rather that than seeing good food go in the bin.

 

[glasshalffull]

We keep hearing about how record numbers are ‘having to’ use them. And how that’s such a shameful indictment on our country.

However I’m not prepared to accept that at face value. I’m sure the figures are inflated by many who exploit them without real need. They’re taking advantage so they can use their income on other things such as a social life and non-essentials.

This is a problem because the food bank donations are on the decrease when demand is getting higher and higher. So these chancers are taking food which then means there’s less for the genuine.

The issue has arisen partly cos the media and unions have helped normalise the idea and take away any stigma there might have been. Stigma isn’t a good thing, but we are seeing the polar opposite where the foodbanks are becoming a badge of honour for those that want to moan about the cost of living.

The media and unions are forever saying that teachers, nhs workers and train workers etc are using foodbanks. So over time that’s become more and more of a thing. People with significant incomes are taking food and are happy to tell others about it and thus it becomes more and more normalised.

I have a mate who goes. He is on various benefits but has lots of disposable income. He goes to the pub regularly. He eats at weatherspoons regularly. Yet he all too willingly goes to a foodbank. He has absolutely no need to.

I had a couple of ladies in my cab last week. They were glammed up for a night out in Poulton. They were teachers or some sort of school workers. On the way to poulton they were talking about the cost of electric and gas. I picked them up at lovely expensive looking houses. One said she’d initially refused to pay her gas and electric and joined in with the campaign to refuse to pay. However she went on to say she’d thought better of it and after a while paid the arrears of £500 or so. She then said ‘everything is so expensive. I’ve had to use the foodbank.’ Then followed a conversion about the foodbank and what she got as part of a typical food goody bag.
Anyways, they arrived in poulton, paid the £13 fare, and headed off for their night out. I found it shocking.

Now don’t get me wrong, there’s a need for foodbanks BUT they should only be for the genuine who have no other means to feed themselves and their families.

I very much doubt there’s any checks done by the foodbanks to weed out the chancers. There was a person on sky seen using the foodbank and then getting in their 4x4 vehicle and driving away. Poor thing. Well I suppose the cost of their car lease and fuel etc has made them so desperate.

I think there need to be eligibility checks. Far too many will be taking the food yet have plenty of money in their accounts. They’re abusing the system. It’s immoral and disgusting yet all we get fed at this time of year is stories of hardship.

Let’s be clear. Foodbanks should be for the unfortunate desperate hungry people. They shouldn’t be a lifestyle option for folk who live relatively comfortable lives but want to free up their food shop money so they can carry on with socialising etc.

Sorry Malced not intending to dispute your experiences, but I find this post dispiriting and at best very unhelpful in the current climate.

I am sure we all know that schemes like this are open to abuse, despite most using a referral process, and will therefore to some extent suffer that abuse.

So many people are struggling nowadays both on benefits and in employment, and many more will have lost their disposable income and more in the last few months.

Food banks are unfortunately necessary and depend on volunteers and donations.

Posts like this, following on no doubt from tabloid articles, could seriously threaten the supply of donations and volunteers.
All hands on deck this winter.

 

[Malced]

Well you obviously feel very strongly about what you believe are people “stealing” from food banks. So when offered the proceeds of crime it seems to me you had three moral choices.

1. Shout “No!! Keep your filthy lucre. I’ll not allow it to taint my hands”.
2. Say “Thank you very much. Have a nice evening”. And donate the fare to a charity of your choice.
3. Say “Thank you very much. Have a nice evening”. And trouser the filthy lucre.

As for your other points. Well yes I agree that if people hear lots of scare stories about food banks being massively exploited then they may stop donating. Which would be a shame.

I’m not sure what eligibility tests could be introduced? A statement of income and expenditure before the parcel is handed over? What’s to stop people lying? A pledge not to go out and waste money on taxi fares? How would you enforce it. Fining taxi drivers who are profiting might be a possibility I suppose.

Their disposable income isn’t proceeds of crime. Nor is using a foodbank unnecessarily a crime. It’s a moral issue. And as I say, it puts the real needy in more risk of not getting what they desperately need.

 

[seasideone]

Circumstance is everything. Your generalised cynicism dressed up as morality is not worthy of a response.

Answer the question

 

[Mexboroseasider]

Their disposable income isn’t proceeds of crime. Nor is using a foodbank unnecessarily a crime. It’s a moral issue. And as I say, it puts the real needy in more risk of not getting what they desperately need.

So how do you suggest food banks assess eligibility? Personally I can’t see that as being feasible without creating masses of red tape and delaying distribution.

 

[Wizaard]

I love this typical rush to shoot the messenger and deflect away from the uncomfortable truths of the thread topic. But carry on. It’s all revealing.

Whoosh.

 

[tangerine_neil]

As I said elsewhere, these Tories won't be putting bird feeders out in winter. It makes the birds dependent, plus some will be taking the food when they dont need it. Keep them self reliant.

Whilst the genuine small garden birds of the world just basically starve to death.

I’ll continue to feed the little things, knowing full well at some point a greedy seagull will swoop in a scoff the remainder. But I suppose even they have to eat, so I try not to get too wound up.

 

[Lytham_fy8]

We keep hearing about how record numbers are ‘having to’ use them. And how that’s such a shameful indictment on our country.

However I’m not prepared to accept that at face value. I’m sure the figures are inflated by many who exploit them without real need. They’re taking advantage so they can use their income on other things such as a social life and non-essentials.

This is a problem because the food bank donations are on the decrease when demand is getting higher and higher. So these chancers are taking food which then means there’s less for the genuine.

The issue has arisen partly cos the media and unions have helped normalise the idea and take away any stigma there might have been. Stigma isn’t a good thing, but we are seeing the polar opposite where the foodbanks are becoming a badge of honour for those that want to moan about the cost of living.

The media and unions are forever saying that teachers, nhs workers and train workers etc are using foodbanks. So over time that’s become more and more of a thing. People with significant incomes are taking food and are happy to tell others about it and thus it becomes more and more normalised.

I have a mate who goes. He is on various benefits but has lots of disposable income. He goes to the pub regularly. He eats at weatherspoons regularly. Yet he all too willingly goes to a foodbank. He has absolutely no need to.

I had a couple of ladies in my cab last week. They were glammed up for a night out in Poulton. They were teachers or some sort of school workers. On the way to poulton they were talking about the cost of electric and gas. I picked them up at lovely expensive looking houses. One said she’d initially refused to pay her gas and electric and joined in with the campaign to refuse to pay. However she went on to say she’d thought better of it and after a while paid the arrears of £500 or so. She then said ‘everything is so expensive. I’ve had to use the foodbank.’ Then followed a conversion about the foodbank and what she got as part of a typical food goody bag.
Anyways, they arrived in poulton, paid the £13 fare, and headed off for their night out. I found it shocking.

Now don’t get me wrong, there’s a need for foodbanks BUT they should only be for the genuine who have no other means to feed themselves and their families.

I very much doubt there’s any checks done by the foodbanks to weed out the chancers. There was a person on sky seen using the foodbank and then getting in their 4x4 vehicle and driving away. Poor thing. Well I suppose the cost of their car lease and fuel etc has made them so desperate.

I think there need to be eligibility checks. Far too many will be taking the food yet have plenty of money in their accounts. They’re abusing the system. It’s immoral and disgusting yet all we get fed at this time of year is stories of hardship.

Let’s be clear. Foodbanks should be for the unfortunate desperate hungry people. They shouldn’t be a lifestyle option for folk who live relatively comfortable lives but want to free up their food shop money so they can carry on with socialising etc.

So what eligibility checks do you recommend?

 

[Malced]

So what eligibility checks do you recommend?

I don’t think there are any to be honest. It was a comment made which at the time of making I knew was impractical. It was a comment made from frustration.

 

[Malced]

Sorry Malced not intending to dispute your experiences, but I find this post dispiriting and at best very unhelpful in the current climate.

I am sure we all know that schemes like this are open to abuse, despite most using a referral process, and will therefore to some extent will suffer that abuse.

So many people are struggling nowadays both on benefits and in employment, and many more have will lost their disposable income and more in the last few months.

Food banks are unfortunately necessary and depend on volunteers and donations.

Posts like this, following on no doubt from tabloid articles, could seriously threaten the supply of donations and volunteers.
All hands on deck this winter.

This post doesn’t follow on from any tabloid article that I’ve seen. I’ve never seen any article about such abuse. Have you?

So my post to be seen by what a few hundred is hardly gonna put donations at risk.
Of those few hundred, how many donate? Maybe one or two? And of those one or two how many will stop donating because of my words? None. So come on, let’s not attribute my words as a credible risk to donations. That’s unfair.

 

[1966_and_all_that]

Answer the question

For the sake of the hard of reading, see mine at #35.

 

[Old_Laytonian]

21 councils to drop the food voucher scheme this Christmas. I imagine a few more people will be using food banks

 

[Malced]

It's so uplifting at this time of festive cheer and goodwill to all, that we have a thread undermining the very worthy charitable work of food banks, those who run them and those who donate to them. The deliberate and cynical gaslighting of the media and trades unions on this issue is also most refreshing. Well done. I couldn't think of a better time of year to share these well considered thoughts.

As I’ve explained in a separate reply, the thread is in no way undermining food banks. But if you are adamant otherwise then please back that up with facts or ‘evidence’. Just by you saying it doesn’t mean it’s so.

Whilst I love Christmas, I don’t buy this sentimental view of yours that would mean we shouldn’t discuss sensitive topics.

The worlds media are reporting on wars, Nazi criminals, climate catastrophe, cost of living crisis etc etc.
But little old me can’t put on a thread about food banks.

 

[1966_and_all_that]

The charity I work at in Hartlepool chose back in 2013 to join the FareShare movement to ensure that 'no good food goes to waste' - simply put you intercept food that was destined for landfill or pig swill and distribute it to people - either through giving it away as food in its existing state or alternatively making meals out of it and making a small charge - or free is someone else is paying.

At that time is was only about stopping food going to waste - nothing to do with food poverty or insecurity.

Now FareShare have had mission drift because members are using it to address 'food poverty' and not food waste.

We pick up food which would otherwise go in the bin from Tesco 3 nights per week on a Sunday, Tuesday and Thursday - and either share it for free or alternatively allow people to make meals with it in our place - provided they cook for everyone. We don't police it particularly as we're of the opinion - if you want yesterday's lettuce/carrots etc - take it BUT we always ask people to be considerate of everyone else who may want some - so please only take what you're going to use. There are times when people squabble and some take far more than they will ever eat, but it's uncommon.

Our approach hasn't altered and it's mostly effective.

Other places have a core mission to address food poverty; that is they believe people cannot afford to eat. This does happen but it's pretty rare. I have a great relationship with the actual Food Bank, and there are groups of people who can't afford to eat - from those who are dependent on drugs and alcohol, to those who have had benefits stopped, to people who have just lost their work and so on. Access is generally when people have a crisis in their lives.

That said, I know there are a small number people who take our food who are 'food tourists' and go to every free food outlet (give something away and there is unlimited demand) but so what? I also see people who are working on insecure hours who don't get paid as much as they need, I see people who have lost their jobs, I see people who have been at hospital appointments and have been sanctioned by DWP, I see people trying to stretch their budgets so the kids can have a few treats, and I see those people who would rather take the food than it go in the bin.

There is still a problem of food waste but it's diminishing because the private sector are monetising it - the "too good to waste" from Morrisons, the more sophisticated use of yellow stickers, apps such as Olio etc, buyers being more careful about ordering etc is having an impact - now from our philosophical perspective, that's great - but for those who's mission is food poverty - it's more of an issue.

The problem as I see it.

We think of poverty as destitution - it's not - it's about being unable to live a life which as a minimum is safe, warm, fed and fulfilling - anything below that line is an issue. We actually need to destigmatise people accessing food, so that those who don't see themselves as destitute are able to access the support that's there, when they need it. Rather that than seeing good food go in the bin.

I know that sometimes people will post without having looked back at earlier posts - I've done it myself. So for those who are sympathetic to the OP's views and who may have missed TSS's post at #36 (copied above), then I suggest you do so before continuing to post. For those who have read TSS's post yet persist in posting cynically negative views about food banks and their users - why? What is to be gained from it?

 

[Lala]

Walked past a supermarket food bank collection point the other day. It only had Covid tests and dry rub for steak in it.

Personally, I've handed out hundreds of food parcels including to shielded individuals through the first lockdown. So many (up to a fifth) weren't in and needed chasing around town to give them their free food when they clearly could've just been doing their own shopping if they didn't want to isolate. That obviously diverted resources away from the vulnerable.

In more normal times, I've seen enough to understand that the whole enterprise might as well just be set up to buy the collector some weed or smack. Of course, the well intentioned donators and hard working volunteers are mostly unaware of this or are good enough souls to overlook it.

Me personally, I've had times where I've been on the bones of my arse and cut my cloth accordingly. Pride wouldn't allow me to go to a food bank; I'd get a job, any job, before it came to that. Others are different.

As 20s posts and the OP states, there are individuals at all levels of society gaming the system in one way or another. I sit in the pub and drink with tradesmen who don't pay tax which is not much different. It's hard to get too vexed about these things.

My neighbours who don’t work got food parcels all through lockdown, particularly for the kids.
Anything that needed scraping,chopping, washing or actually cooking they tried to palm off on me, their full time working neighbour.