Fracking ban lifted

foggy said:
We don't have an abundance of it down below. Part of the issue here is this will do fuck all to help energy prices.
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I think you’ll find there’s millions and millions of cubic feet of it under the Fylde coast and the 2 other test areas Cuadrilla originally set up.
A guy just been on the BBC news saying exactly the same thing.
 
Not sure if the fracking companies will be in a rush to throw any more money at this. Certainly not unless the ‘earthquake threshold’ is raised first, and even then they may feel the “geology is too challenging” in most areas as the ex head of Cuadrilla has said.
It seems unlikely to add much to our energy mix, and certainly not quickly, could just be a “Government soundbite” as also commented upon by the same bloke.
 
There was a guy interviewed the other day saying there was no where near the amount that has been estimated and it had been proved. Didn’t catch where he said the proof was, but he was pretty confident
 
The situation we are in regarding our energy supply has come about because we have spent decades chasing cheap energy instead of investing in long term security of supply ,plus reduced nuclear capacity before sufficient and financially viable green energy sources are in place.
Fracking is simply a political sticking plaster.
We are on the brink of exactly the same scenario with security of our food supply.... 😡
 
Jaffa_The_Hut said:
I think you’ll find there’s millions and millions of cubic feet of it under the Fylde coast and the 2 other test areas Cuadrilla originally set up.
A guy just been on the BBC news saying exactly the same thing.
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Well if you are listening to a fracking company, you will probably come away thinking it's the greatest thing under the sun. But the British Geological Survey found there was 10-15x less of it than we previously thought. There is also absolutely no reason for this has extracted to be sold at less than market value, meaning nobody's bills get any cheaper.
 
Chris Cornelius - founder of Cuadrilla today states that fracking will never go ahead in the UK as the geology is far too complex. He summises nobody will invest in trying. Sorry to all you fracking fans.

www.theguardian.com

Fracking won’t work in UK says founder of fracking company Cuadrilla

Chris Cornelius says geology is too challenging and government’s support is merely ‘soundbites’
www.theguardian.com www.theguardian.com
 
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foggy said:
Well if you are listening to a fracking company, you will probably come away thinking it's the greatest thing under the sun. But the British Geological Survey found there was 10-15x less of it than we previously thought. There is also absolutely no reason for this has extracted to be sold at less than market value, meaning nobody's bills get any cheaper.
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Listening to a fracking company? 🤔

As said I was listening to a BBC reporter on the BBC breakfast news.

Apologies but I can’t make it any clearer than that. 🙄
 
Newholland said:
The situation we are in regarding our energy supply has come about because we have spent decades chasing cheap energy instead of investing in long term security of supply ,plus reduced nuclear capacity before sufficient and financially viable green energy sources are in place.
Fracking is simply a political sticking plaster.
We are on the brink of exactly the same scenario with security of our food supply.... 😡
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Yep, agree with all of that.

Food security will become a bigger problem if the government don`t get to grips with farming. Hopefully Ranil Jayawardena will prove to be a significant improvement on George Eustice, who was pitiful as a minister. The government seems to have no direction regarding farming policy and government missives are incoherent ...
 
Rees Mogg has just piped up that the limit on tremors is too low and will be raised to enable fracking to proceed. Great.
 
Jaffa_The_Hut said:
Listening to a fracking company? 🤔

As said I was listening to a BBC reporter on the BBC breakfast news.

Apologies but I can’t make it any clearer than that. 🙄
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Ok, when you said a guy had just been on I thought that's what you meant. So let's look at 'millions and millions of cubic feet'. Certainly sounds like a lot. Except the UK uses 78 billion cubic feet per year. Either you or this reporter weren't very specific about what 'millions and millions' means but let's say a 50 million. So this load in Lancashire would make up 0.06% of our gas demand. Brilliant that. Well worth causing earthquakes and destroying the local land and property values. And I'm no geological expert. But listening to the ones that are, the complexity of our country means fracking is highly inefficient, in some places impossible, and in all places dangerous.
 
foggy said:
Ok, when you said a guy had just been on I thought that's what you meant. So let's look at 'millions and millions of cubic feet'. Certainly sounds like a lot. Except the UK uses 78 billion cubic feet per year. Either you or this reporter weren't very specific about what 'millions and millions' means but let's say a 50 million. So this load in Lancashire would make up 0.06% of our gas demand. Brilliant that. Well worth causing earthquakes and destroying the local land and property values. And I'm no geological expert. But listening to the ones that are, the complexity of our country means fracking is highly inefficient, in some places impossible, and in all places dangerous.
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It’s also only practical / possible to extract a small percentage of the available gas.

I’m struggling to see where this policy decision is coming from tbh.

Maybe the government see an opportunity to raise a few quid from licensing again. Maybe it’s about appeasement or a geopolitical ‘statement’.

Whichever way you look at it, this definitely isn’t an answer to the long term energy security of the U.K.
 
BFC_BFC_BFC said:
It’s also only practical / possible to extract a small percentage of the available gas.

I’m struggling to see where this policy decision is coming from tbh.

Maybe the government see an opportunity to raise a few quid from licensing again. Maybe it’s about appeasement or a geopolitical ‘statement’.

Whichever way you look at it, this definitely isn’t an answer to the long term energy security of the U.K.
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My guess is they thought it would be an easy policy win. With the energy crisis and increase in support for securing our energy supply, Truss probably thought just announcing it even though it's practically useless would be an applause line. If so, she has badly miscalculated the mood of the British public, and many of her own MPs. While we are desperate for help, that doesn't mean people are stupid and can clearly see a dangerous, pointless and unpopular policy when they see one.
 
foggy said:
My guess is they thought it would be an easy policy win. With the energy crisis and increase in support for securing our energy supply, Truss probably thought just announcing it even though it's practically useless would be an applause line. If so, she has badly miscalculated the mood of the British public, and many of her own MPs. While we are desperate for help, that doesn't mean people are stupid and can clearly see a dangerous, pointless and unpopular policy when they see one.
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It’s a massive vote loser as a policy and backward at the same time. There’s a massive opportunity to really kick start a real push for alternative technology and she’s chosen to hang her hat on this.
 
foggy said:
Ok, when you said a guy had just been on I thought that's what you meant. So let's look at 'millions and millions of cubic feet'. Certainly sounds like a lot. Except the UK uses 78 billion cubic feet per year. Either you or this reporter weren't very specific about what 'millions and millions' means but let's say a 50 million. So this load in Lancashire would make up 0.06% of our gas demand. Brilliant that. Well worth causing earthquakes and destroying the local land and property values. And I'm no geological expert. But listening to the ones that are, the complexity of our country means fracking is highly inefficient, in some places impossible, and in all places dangerous.
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I’am not Pro fracking for one minute trust me but whatever quantities are down there and it’s beneficial to the U K to extract it then it needs to be looked at.
If these test sites were just outside London or some other place down south would we be as concerned as we are right now here on the Fylde coast?
Probably not I’d say.
 
Jaffa_The_Hut said:
I’am not Pro fracking for one minute trust me but whatever quantities are down there and it’s beneficial to the U K to extract it then it needs to be looked at.
If these test sites were just outside London or some other place down south would we be as concerned as we are right now here on the Fylde coast?
Probably not I’d say.
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Speak for yourself, I think causing earthquakes anywhere is a bad thing. I don't just worry about what's on my own doorstep. I also don't think causing ecological damage, causing public unrest, destroying land and property values, and wasting a load of money on a piddly amount of gas that will be sold at exactly the same price as imported gas, is beneficial at all. It's not as simple as 'well whatever is down there we should just take it cause anything is better than nothing'.
 
BFC_BFC_BFC said:
It’s a massive vote loser as a policy and backward at the same time. There’s a massive opportunity to really kick start a real push for alternative technology and she’s chosen to hang her hat on this.
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It's absolutely bizarre isn't it. Have you seen this news about also lifting bans on importing fur, foie gras and live animal exports? It's like she's playing Prime Minister on hard mode, trying to find the policies that are not only the most pointless, but also the most unpopular. I can't think of anything the public will hate more. I mean, I'm big on animal welfare and even I cringe a bit at how often Brits seem to care more and show more support for animals than their fellow human beings. It's like the fox hunting policy from the 2017 election which was part of May's disastrous campaign. It's an absolute gift for Labour all this.
 
foggy said:
Speak for yourself, I think causing earthquakes anywhere is a bad thing. I don't just worry about what's on my own doorstep. I also don't think causing ecological damage, causing public unrest, destroying land and property values, and wasting a load of money on a piddly amount of gas that will be sold at exactly the same price as imported gas, is beneficial at all. It's not as simple as 'well whatever is down there we should just take it cause anything is better than nothing'.
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That’s your view and you are entitled to them by all means but the people who count at the end of the day are the politicians/government who obviously think it is worth exploring further.
 
Interesting article on anti-gas propaganda: https://thecritic.co.uk/issues/december-2019/the-plot-against-fracking/

and for another source: https://www.theguardian.com/environ...ing-with-environmentalists-to-oppose-fracking

The head of one of the world’s leading groups of democratic nations has accused Russia of undermining projects using hydraulic fracturing technology in Europe.

Anders Fogh Rasmussen, secretary-general of the North Atlantic Treaty Organisation (Nato), and former premier of Denmark, told the Chatham House thinktank in London on Thursday that Vladimir Putin’s government was behind attempts to discredit fracking, according to reports.
 
Lost Seasider said:
Interesting article on anti-gas propaganda: https://thecritic.co.uk/issues/december-2019/the-plot-against-fracking/

and for another source: https://www.theguardian.com/environ...ing-with-environmentalists-to-oppose-fracking

The head of one of the world’s leading groups of democratic nations has accused Russia of undermining projects using hydraulic fracturing technology in Europe.

Anders Fogh Rasmussen, secretary-general of the North Atlantic Treaty Organisation (Nato), and former premier of Denmark, told the Chatham House thinktank in London on Thursday that Vladimir Putin’s government was behind attempts to discredit fracking, according to reports.
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A load of shite. Are earthquakes Russian propaganda?
 
foggy said:
It's absolutely bizarre isn't it. Have you seen this news about also lifting bans on importing fur, foie gras and live animal exports? It's like she's playing Prime Minister on hard mode, trying to find the policies that are not only the most pointless, but also the most unpopular. I can't think of anything the public will hate more. I mean, I'm big on animal welfare and even I cringe a bit at how often Brits seem to care more and show more support for animals than their fellow human beings. It's like the fox hunting policy from the 2017 election which was part of May's disastrous campaign. It's an absolute gift for Labour all this.
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She says she’s happy to be unpopular, I doubt many of her MPs in red wall seats will be happy
 
Jaffa_The_Hut said:
That’s your view and you are entitled to them by all means but the people who count at the end of the day are the politicians/government who obviously think it is worth exploring further.
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You should look up what our esteemed cabinet members were saying about fracking just a few months ago. Start off with the Chancellor.
 
fracking is a red herring, used by this new Government to bolster support in the shires. A great deal of the harm that will be caused by increased utility charges could have been avoided if David Cameron hadn't been so keen on cutting "this green crap". Onshore wind development was effectively banned by the Tories from 2015 when developers were banned from applying for green subsidies - it reduced activity by 94%. This ban was only lifted in 2020. If installations had continued at their previous trend, the UK would have around 5 gigawatts of additional wind energy supply, saving households £1.8bn a year, or £60 each. For comparison, scrapping VAT on energy bills (one of Truss's favoured options), would save around £1.9bn (£61 per household) while lowering revenues for the Treasury and delivering no reduction in greenhouse gas emissions.

Cameron's government also ended a successful emissions reduction target for domestic dwellings, replacing it with the less ambitious Green Deal and Energy Company Obligation. If it had continued at its previous pace, households would have saved an estimated £2bn on heating this year, at current prices.
 
foggy said:
You should look up what our esteemed cabinet members were saying about fracking just a few months ago. Start off with the Chancellor.
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Little point in reading it now the ban on fracking has been lifted wether we agree or disagree end of.
 
foggy said:
That's not how I see it. The public expressing their outrage and distrust is often how unpopular policies get overturned. So it's not 'end of'.
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It got overturned 12-18 months ago when fracking was banned.
That ban has now been lifted.
We can argue about it till the Cows come home but it won’t change the fact the fracking ban has been lifted.
So until the next time……….
 
Wizaard said:
Rees Mogg has just piped up that the limit on tremors is too low and will be raised to enable fracking to proceed. Great.
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This was always going to be the next step. They couldn’t provide enough return for investors, having to keep stop / start production. The so called traffic light system will be changed, but of course that also runs the risk of more severe earthquakes, damage to the well head and potential leak of radioactive waste.
Nice.


Re food production - our family owned farm land up near Bleasdale and DEFRA were always trying to encourage us to develop the hedges for wildlife, wildflower meadows, scrapes for wildlife diversification, etc. Very little help or commitment for general farming needs and/or food production. The priorities are all wrong. Think I saw recently, multi storey polytunnel production of tomatoes. For a country lacking the vast spaces of say, America, this should be something we are using and encouraging, to make output levels more economically viable for farmers’ without vast acres of land.
 
tangerine_neil said:
This was always going to be the next step. They couldn’t provide enough return for investors, having to keep stop / start production. The so called traffic light system will be changed, but of course that also runs the risk of more severe earthquakes, damage to the well head and potential leak of radioactive waste.
Nice.


Re food production - our family owned farm land up near Bleasdale and DEFRA were always trying to encourage us to develop the hedges for wildlife, wildflower meadows, scrapes for wildlife diversification, etc. Very little help or commitment for general farming needs and/or food production. The priorities are all wrong. Think I saw recently, multi storey polytunnel production of tomatoes. For a country lacking the vast spaces of say, America, this should be something we are using and encouraging, to make output levels more economically viable for farmers’ without vast acres of land.
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There used to be acres and acres of greenhouses around Blackpool growing tomatoes so I don't see a problem with your polytunnel proposal.
As for the wildlife and hedgerow stuff, cannot these ideas complement the growth in output levels?
 
foggy said:
It's absolutely bizarre isn't it. Have you seen this news about also lifting bans on importing fur, foie gras and live animal exports? It's like she's playing Prime Minister on hard mode, trying to find the policies that are not only the most pointless, but also the most unpopular. I can't think of anything the public will hate more. I mean, I'm big on animal welfare and even I cringe a bit at how often Brits seem to care more and show more support for animals than their fellow human beings. It's like the fox hunting policy from the 2017 election which was part of May's disastrous campaign. It's an absolute gift for Labour all this.
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It’s as though she doesn’t want or expect to win the next election and is using what time in power she has to make as much money as she can for her cronies and backers.
Either that or she’s agent Truss out to destroy the Tories. At this rate she’ll destroy the country.
 
tangerine_neil said:
This was always going to be the next step. They couldn’t provide enough return for investors, having to keep stop / start production. The so called traffic light system will be changed, but of course that also runs the risk of more severe earthquakes, damage to the well head and potential leak of radioactive waste.
Nice.
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Have you got a link to this threat of radioactive waste, because you've mentioned it a couple of times and it's the first I've heard of it.
 
Lost Seasider said:
Have you got a link to this threat of radioactive waste, because you've mentioned it a couple of times and it's the first I've heard of it.
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Anyway Lost you’ll be pleased to hear the fracking debate is being widely reported by the BBC 👍

Given, as you say, their unique position in broadcasting.
 
Jaffa_The_Hut said:
It got overturned 12-18 months ago when fracking was banned.
That ban has now been lifted.
We can argue about it till the Cows come home but it won’t change the fact the fracking ban has been lifted.
So until the next time……….
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It's been lifted but, as per the article I pinned above, there is nobody willing to invest as it's too difficult in the UK.
 
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