Is taking the knee still relevant or "silly and pointless"

Tangojoe

Well-known member
There seems to have been a marked increase in social media racist abuse in recent weeks and a similar increase in unrest over players 'taking the knee' before televised football matches. Both players and viewers are speaking out about where we go from here.

Palace star Wilfred Zaha stated his intention to no longer kneel before games. He said "We’re trying to say that we’re equal but we’re isolating ourselves with these things that aren’t even working anyway. I feel like we should stand tall and now I don’t really tend to speak on racism and stuff like that because I’m not here just to tick boxes.”

Several clubs chose to not take the knee in the past week, led by Brentford, whose striker Ivan Toney believes players are being used as puppets. He said "the gesture is allowing people at the top to rest on the subject and nothing has changed as a result. We have had a long discussion about that; why we are not taking a knee. Everyone has had their say, and everyone agrees that we have been taking the knee for however long now and still nothing has changed. We are kind of being used as puppets. It is pretty silly and pretty pointless. Nothing is changing. The punishments need to be stronger."

Whichever side of the fence you sit, it looks increasingly like the gesture has now run its course. In my opinion, players should be permitted to express themselves however they wish. Now that high profile players have made their position clear no doubt others will feel free to kneel or stand as they see fit without pressure and just get on with the football.
 
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Loco

Well-known member
It's a bit like the minutes applause at games for people with no connection to football. Once it's done for a few it seems it has to carry on and eventually loses its gravitas.
 

TSSeasider

Well-known member
I said at the time Colin Kaepernick, kneeling during the American national anthem was a particularly powerful gesture. Others joining him in solidarity was a powerful gesture.

Kneeling before kick off, kneeling in your office, kneeling as a police force during protests was empty.

That's not to say people don't have the right to kneel; course they do - in the same way I have the right not to.

There's no place for racism anywhere; kneeling was never going to stop it and was gesture politics at its finest.
 

Fatboy

Well-known member
I don’t normally get involved in politics, religion, or racial discussion, but I do often wonder about why the racism finger is only pointed at white people. I know for certain that there are plenty of black racists , and as for taking the knee, I neither approve nor disapprove, for me it is each to their own .
 

rockontommy

Well-known member
I don’t normally get involved in politics, religion, or racial discussion, but I do often wonder about why the racism finger is only pointed at white people. I know for certain that there are plenty of black racists , and as for taking the knee, I neither approve nor disapprove, for me it is each to their own .
Calvin Robinson wrote today about receiving racial abuse from fellow black men and women. For not playing the game.
 

Dollar Thief

Well-known member
I don’t normally get involved in politics, religion, or racial discussion, but I do often wonder about why the racism finger is only pointed at white people. I know for certain that there are plenty of black racists , and as for taking the knee, I neither approve nor disapprove, for me it is each to their own .
It does make me laugh when Sky have a feature on kicking racism out of football and all you see is it being about black people, as though they are the only ones to suffer.
 

BigHandsOliverKahn

Well-known member
All races have a small minority of narrow minded people amongst them who are racist. I got called a white bastard once in Africa so know what it's like to receive direct racism but I know it's only a small minority of people who are like that wherever you go.

Most people realise all humans are fundamentally the same deep down. These campaigns mean well but unfortunately shine such a spotlight on the subject of division that they possibly worsen the situation.
 

Scaramanga

Well-known member
Yes, here we go again. The fact we keep talking about this tells you it’s an absolute load of bollox. Move on ffs. There’s better ways to fight racism other than taking a knee before a football game. Total shite.
 

Mexboroseasider

Well-known member
It was never down to the players. Otherwise there would have been more than... err... none standing up.
So you’re saying they were ordered to do it?

Who by? The Club Owners? The Managers and Coaches? Who all conspired together? Or bullied into it by the media? And were too weak to resist?

Doesn’t sound plausible to me. What’s more plausible is that a lot of players believed in the message. And they were supported by their team mates. And that, eventually like all tactics, it’d run its course.
 

Scaramanga

Well-known member
So you’re saying they were ordered to do it?

Who by? The Club Owners? The Managers and Coaches? Who all conspired together? Or bullied into it by the media? And were too weak to resist?

Doesn’t sound plausible to me. What’s more plausible is that a lot of players believed in the message. And they were supported by their team mates. And that, eventually like all tactics, it’d run its course.
For about 5 minutes. I would suggest there’s more than Wilfred Zaha thinking sod this shite.
 

Tangojoe

Well-known member
So you’re saying they were ordered to do it? Who by? The Club Owners? The Managers and Coaches? Who all conspired together? Or bullied into it by the media? And were too weak to resist?
Doesn’t sound plausible to me. What’s more plausible is that a lot of players believed in the message. And they were supported by their team mates. And that, eventually like all tactics, it’d run its course.

That's right. Every single player was intimidated by the media. Not one player stood up because they were terrified to do so. How do I know? You watch how many don't kneel now that someone has had the guts to stay standing.

And there's not one single gay player in the whole of football for the same reason.
 

Chunkylad

Well-known member
No gesture will change the minds of adult people. Bigots, racists, homophobic idiots do not see the light. They don’t have a damascene moment.
All education has to start young and be able to overpower the crap the kids hear at home.
Northern Ireland is a good example of the work of bringing kids together across the divide early so they grow up as friends. it might take a generation, even two maybe to change the past but it’s worth it.

You are not going to change the mind of a 50 year old racist (white, black or Asian) they’re already lost no matter how many adverts you run or nice slogans you adopt.

Start young, make it a real campaign and sustained and look to where there a blocks of communities where they are predominantly one culture and try to learn from the Northern Ireland model. Living in an area that is all black, all Asian or all white only seems to be the breeding ground for racism.
 

RUSTY_2_STANDS

Well-known member
I don't think it's pointless and silly at all. I think when it first started it sent quite a powerful message. Maybe it's just run it's course now. And I totally understand how some players feel they're being used. Whilst those in charge, the people who have it within their power to actually do something, sit back and use the taking the knee gesture as a sign that something is being done.
It is just a gesture, but a gesture that should be backed up with actual action.
 

Thelaneends1

Well-known member
There seems to have been a marked increase in social media racist abuse in recent weeks and a similar increase in unrest over players 'taking the knee' before televised football matches. Both players and viewers are speaking out about where we go from here.

Palace star Wilfred Zaha stated his intention to no longer kneel before games. He said "We’re trying to say that we’re equal but we’re isolating ourselves with these things that aren’t even working anyway. I feel like we should stand tall and now I don’t really tend to speak on racism and stuff like that because I’m not here just to tick boxes.”

Several clubs chose to not take the knee in the past week, led by Brentford, whose striker Ivan Toney believes players are being used as puppets. He said "the gesture is allowing people at the top to rest on the subject and nothing has changed as a result. We have had a long discussion about that; why we are not taking a knee. Everyone has had their say, and everyone agrees that we have been taking the knee for however long now and still nothing has changed. We are kind of being used as puppets. It is pretty silly and pretty pointless. Nothing is changing. The punishments need to be stronger."

Whichever side of the fence you sit, it looks increasingly like the gesture has now run its course. In my opinion, players should be permitted to express themselves however they wish. Now that high profile players have made their position clear no doubt others will feel free to kneel or stand as they see fit without pressure and just get on with the football.
Pointless.
 

rockontommy

Well-known member
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