Money can’t buy you fans?!

BFCPaul

BFCPaul

Well-known member
Interesting insight and analysis of Saturday’s Champions League Final - City still a ‘meh’ club?

UK - BT Sport - 3.00m (xx.x%)
Italy - Canale 5 - 8.869m (45.6%) / up 45.6% on 2022 (6.090m)
France - TF1 - 3.392m (19.7%) / down 42.5% on 2022 (5.902m)
Spain - TVE 1 - 3.629m (31.6%) / down 53.0% on 2022 (7.716m)
Germany - ZDF - 5.56m (26.1%) / down on 33.7% on 2022 (8.39m)

With a split of 4 FTA and 1 Pay TV, we get a total of 24.450m across the big 5 European markets. Pay TV in Italy (1.334m / 6.7%) and Spain (0.572m / 5.0%) adds an extra 1.906m, for 26.356m

The 4 to 1 split is down 22.6% on 2022, when the same split and same channels scored 31.598m. This makes it the second least watched Champions League final on record, only behind 2021 (Man City v Chelsea), which scored 10.796m (across a split of 2 FTA and 3 Pay TV).

One thing we can deduct from that (and last week's FA Cup final) - Man City might be the most powerful club in world football right now, but they're still not much of a TV draw.
 
BFCPaul said:
Interesting insight and analysis of Saturday’s Champions League Final - City still a ‘meh’ club?

UK - BT Sport - 3.00m (xx.x%)
Italy - Canale 5 - 8.869m (45.6%) / up 45.6% on 2022 (6.090m)
France - TF1 - 3.392m (19.7%) / down 42.5% on 2022 (5.902m)
Spain - TVE 1 - 3.629m (31.6%) / down 53.0% on 2022 (7.716m)
Germany - ZDF - 5.56m (26.1%) / down on 33.7% on 2022 (8.39m)

With a split of 4 FTA and 1 Pay TV, we get a total of 24.450m across the big 5 European markets. Pay TV in Italy (1.334m / 6.7%) and Spain (0.572m / 5.0%) adds an extra 1.906m, for 26.356m

The 4 to 1 split is down 22.6% on 2022, when the same split and same channels scored 31.598m. This makes it the second least watched Champions League final on record, only behind 2021 (Man City v Chelsea), which scored 10.796m (across a split of 2 FTA and 3 Pay TV).

One thing we can deduct from that (and last week's FA Cup final) - Man City might be the most powerful club in world football right now, but they're still not much of a TV draw.
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Er it was free to watch on You Tube....
 
More than 150,000,000 people were predicted to watch the final on Saturday, the only final that eclipsed that was Real v Atleti (185M) a few years ago. That means more people watched it than the Utd v Bayern or Liverpool finals, I guess that makes them small meh clubs by the OPs logic. The amount of people taking pops at City is quite frankly ridiculous. No doubt most are closet reds/red devils.
 
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I was at the parade last night (well in a pub for most of it) and it did feel from the accents and people I spoke to that City are the 'Manchester' club. United are just an out of control global brand which am not sure even people in Manchester have a connection with. City need to be at this level for the next couple of decades and then they will undoubtedly gather momentum and interest. On an international level I suppose they are a bit of an Inter Milan at the moment.
 
Why do Liverpool and Man Utd harp on about attendances. Do you think City really care they have a bigger glory fan base. Most City fans were there in the darker times and have witnessed what the majority of Liverpool and Man Utd fans haven’t.

In Manchester it’s very split. Stockport area is City where as Salford is United. United just have a bigger National and Global reach because people decided to support them when they winning everything. Same with Liverpool. City are going through that period now where they have a hardcore fan base but gradually glory fans are clinging on. Even the hardcore City fans don’t like all this hype and success as they appreciate the thrill of winning promotions etc. Some of those fans don’t even go anymore.

I know this as my wife is a City fan and the in laws were in Istanbul.
 
I would say that there is more that can be deduced (rather than deducting anything) from all that....

And, following my comprehensive analysis, the 100% factual statistics are that not only are 98% of all statistics made up but in addition, there's also lies, damned lies and statistics.....

😎
 
City should be commended for having a loyal core fanbase that comes from the actual place the team is based. They had gates of 30 to 40k in the third tier during the 90s.

We slag off Liverpool and United for having a plastic fanbases, then slag off City when they don't have one.
 
A_Tense_Grin said:
United just have a bigger National and Global reach because people decided to support them when they winning everything.
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This isn't accurate either. United's spell of real dominance started in the early 90s. They were a global phenomenon long before that, mainly as a result of the Munich air disaster. They weren't an unsuccessful club during the period 1958-90, but most of their trophies were in Cups, and they certainly weren't serial winners and were relegated in 1974.
 
NewburyOne said:
More than 150,000,000 people were predicted to watch the final on Saturday, the only final that eclipsed that was Real v Atleti (185M) a few years ago. That means more people watched it than the Utd v Bayern or Liverpool finals, I guess that makes them small meh clubs by the OPs logic. The amount of people taking pops at City is quite frankly ridiculous. No doubt most are closet reds/red devils.
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AVFTT is flooded with them. They are easy to spot too.

You simply wouldn't go out of your way to investigate viewing statistics / number of supporters / constantly target the club ownership at Man City unless you supported a rival club. Blackpool supporters really couldn't care less about City.
 
basilrobbie3 said:
This isn't accurate either. United's spell of real dominance started in the early 90s. They were a global phenomenon long before that, mainly as a result of the Munich air disaster. They weren't an unsuccessful club during the period 1958-90, but most of their trophies were in Cups, and they certainly weren't serial winners and were relegated in 1974.
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yep, that's fair but my opinion is that it's a bit of both. The Munich disaster got them many more followers and then their successess of the following years.
 
Never win at home, we never win away, lost last week and we lost today, we don’t give a f*ck cos we’re f*cked up, MCFC OK

A good proportion of their fans were those who sang that regularly
 
In Bolton and Wigan. The pub tv's are watched by loads when United and Liverpool are on. Everton too in Wigan. When it comes to City, Hardly anyone. Unless it is against one of them 3 teams of course.
 
20togo said:
yep, that's fair but my opinion is that it's a bit of both. The Munich disaster got them many more followers and then their successess of the following years.
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I'm sure both elements are part of it. But there were over thirty years between the two.

Most of us weren't around back then, but it is probably hard to exaggerate the sense of loss throughout football when the disaster happened - they had an outstanding young side with a big future ahead of them. Our club were one of the first to help by loaning them a player - and arguably our best player, as well.

The later surge in popularity when they started to win trophies regularly was something quite different, I feel. That has more to do with the fact that there are some people who like to associate themselves with winners and we have seen it with Blackburn, Liverpool, Chelsea and City to varying degrees in recent years. The innate glamour that already existed with United didn't do any harm to that.
 
Macseasider said:
AVFTT is flooded with them. They are easy to spot too.

You simply wouldn't go out of your way to investigate viewing statistics / number of supporters / constantly target the club ownership at Man City unless you supported a rival club. Blackpool supporters really couldn't care less about City.
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I mean, I did Google viewing figures to dispell some of the bitter lies people spread. I just don't get it, I don't give 2 hoots about City other than I admire Pep as a coach and the way his team plays. Outside of that, I'm happy for the England players to be successful. I guess I do like the fact Liverpool and Manure fans hate their success but that's because I was brought up around a heap of plastic armchair reds.
 
basilrobbie3 said:
I'm sure both elements are part of it. But there were over thirty years between the two.

Most of us weren't around back then, but it is probably hard to exaggerate the sense of loss throughout football when the disaster happened - they had an outstanding young side with a big future ahead of them. Our club were one of the first to help by loaning them a player - and arguably our best player, as well.

The later surge in popularity when they started to win trophies regularly was something quite different, I feel. That has more to do with the fact that there are some people who like to associate themselves with winners and we have seen it with Blackburn, Liverpool, Chelsea and City to varying degrees in recent years. The innate glamour that already existed with United didn't do any harm to that.
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not 30 years for me. Munich happened late 50's and that helped their support. Then less than ten years later they were European Champions. That would have added to their fan base and then you have the Irish connection with George Best, And then consider this. Some-one starts following United after either of those events and then they have kids and they get their kids to support United too. Trust me, that happens. And it all builds from there. And yes you are right, people like to associate themselves with winners. And that is just as big a factor.
 
I imagine a lot of United supporting fathers are battling with their kids who now want to be City as they were and are now dominating last and this decade.

Kids always glory hunt, then either go with their parents team or continue to be plastics 😁

Sadly everyone on here either had influential parents or were just masochists!!
 
Chunkylad said:
I imagine a lot of United supporting fathers are battling with their kids who now want to be City as they were and are now dominating last and this decade.

Kids always glory hunt, then either go with their parents team or continue to be plastics 😁

Sadly everyone on here either had influential parents or were just
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Have that with my kid. Used to have a season ticket with me at Pool but after going to City with his mummy and Grandad, he now thinks Blackpool are rubbish and doesn’t want to go.
 
BFCPaul said:
Interesting insight and analysis of Saturday’s Champions League Final - City still a ‘meh’ club?

UK - BT Sport - 3.00m (xx.x%)
Italy - Canale 5 - 8.869m (45.6%) / up 45.6% on 2022 (6.090m)
France - TF1 - 3.392m (19.7%) / down 42.5% on 2022 (5.902m)
Spain - TVE 1 - 3.629m (31.6%) / down 53.0% on 2022 (7.716m)
Germany - ZDF - 5.56m (26.1%) / down on 33.7% on 2022 (8.39m)

With a split of 4 FTA and 1 Pay TV, we get a total of 24.450m across the big 5 European markets. Pay TV in Italy (1.334m / 6.7%) and Spain (0.572m / 5.0%) adds an extra 1.906m, for 26.356m

The 4 to 1 split is down 22.6% on 2022, when the same split and same channels scored 31.598m. This makes it the second least watched Champions League final on record, only behind 2021 (Man City v Chelsea), which scored 10.796m (across a split of 2 FTA and 3 Pay TV).

One thing we can deduct from that (and last week's FA Cup final) - Man City might be the most powerful club in world football right now, but they're still not much of a TV draw.
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Who cares…oh probably a closet Manure fan.
 
NewburyOne said:
I mean, I did Google viewing figures to dispell some of the bitter lies people spread. I just don't get it, I don't give 2 hoots about City other than I admire Pep as a coach and the way his team plays. Outside of that, I'm happy for the England players to be successful. I guess I do like the fact Liverpool and Manure fans hate their success but that's because I was brought up around a heap of plastic armchair reds.
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….and there are still plenty of them.
Dark_Side_of_the_Lune said:
Funnily, Stockport have benefitted massively from City becoming unaffordable to most locals who want a football hit.
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as someone who has lived in Stockport for the past 46 years all I can say is Tosh……having said that I am glad County have increased their support…..by the way the Borough Stockport has a population of nearly 300000 ….and 4 Parliamentary Constituencies…hardly surprising they get decent support given the potential numbers….but of course yes many also do City and United….and where I live City Seem to have the bigger following and surprisingly have well before their successful years.
 
basilrobbie3 said:
I'm sure both elements are part of it. But there were over thirty years between the two.

Most of us weren't around back then, but it is probably hard to exaggerate the sense of loss throughout football when the disaster happened - they had an outstanding young side with a big future ahead of them. Our club were one of the first to help by loaning them a player - and arguably our best player, as well.

The later surge in popularity when they started to win trophies regularly was something quite different, I feel. That has more to do with the fact that there are some people who like to associate themselves with winners and we have seen it with Blackburn, Liverpool, Chelsea and City to varying degrees in recent years. The innate glamour that already existed with United didn't do any harm to that.
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We weren't one of the first, we were THE first, something we should take some pride in.

I agree with you that football fandom has changed, and current success plays a big part in attracting a fanbase, whereas people chose a team early in life and stuck with it, regardless of the vagaries of results.
 
20togo said:
not 30 years for me. Munich happened late 50's and that helped their support. Then less than ten years later they were European Champions. That would have added to their fan base and then you have the Irish connection with George Best, And then consider this. Some-one starts following United after either of those events and then they have kids and they get their kids to support United too. Trust me, that happens. And it all builds from there. And yes you are right, people like to associate themselves with winners. And that is just as big a factor.
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United were also the best supported team in the country when they were shite, and this in the times when you actually had to attend a match to see your team. When they were last in the second tier (76/77?) they still had the highest average home attendance in the country. And every away match they played that season was the home teams biggest crowd of the season. They brought 17/18k to Bloomfield Road (before my time but I’m sure someone can confirm).
So whilst Munich, George Best, early prem years etc are a factor, their support has held up through thick and thin. Worth remembering they’ve been garbage for the last decade, but still the best supported team in the country. City only actually sell out at home when they play United
 
BFCPaul said:
Interesting insight and analysis of Saturday’s Champions League Final - City still a ‘meh’ club?

UK - BT Sport - 3.00m (xx.x%)
Italy - Canale 5 - 8.869m (45.6%) / up 45.6% on 2022 (6.090m)
France - TF1 - 3.392m (19.7%) / down 42.5% on 2022 (5.902m)
Spain - TVE 1 - 3.629m (31.6%) / down 53.0% on 2022 (7.716m)
Germany - ZDF - 5.56m (26.1%) / down on 33.7% on 2022 (8.39m)

With a split of 4 FTA and 1 Pay TV, we get a total of 24.450m across the big 5 European markets. Pay TV in Italy (1.334m / 6.7%) and Spain (0.572m / 5.0%) adds an extra 1.906m, for 26.356m

The 4 to 1 split is down 22.6% on 2022, when the same split and same channels scored 31.598m. This makes it the second least watched Champions League final on record, only behind 2021 (Man City v Chelsea), which scored 10.796m (across a split of 2 FTA and 3 Pay TV).

One thing we can deduct from that (and last week's FA Cup final) - Man City might be the most powerful club in world football right now, but they're still not much of a TV draw.
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Not even thinly veiled
 
A_Tense_Grin said:
Why do Liverpool and Man Utd harp on about attendances. Do you think City really care they have a bigger glory fan base. Most City fans were there in the darker times and have witnessed what the majority of Liverpool and Man Utd fans haven’t.

In Manchester it’s very split. Stockport area is City where as Salford is United. United just have a bigger National and Global reach because people decided to support them when they winning everything. Same with Liverpool. City are going through that period now where they have a hardcore fan base but gradually glory fans are clinging on. Even the hardcore City fans don’t like all this hype and success as they appreciate the thrill of winning promotions etc. Some of those fans don’t even go anymore.

I know this as my wife is a City fan and the in laws were in Istanbul. (Third tier)
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Correct.
CITY 3 BLACKPOOL 0

League Division 2 (Third tier)

8th August 1998

Attendance 32,134
I remember the home match that season where Bloomfield RD was a sea of sky blue (I lived on Bloomfield RD at that time). There were twice as many City fans outside the ground without tickets than inside. That's what I call loyal supporters. The only plastics at City are the seats.​
 
Blackpool_Gaz said:
Correct.
CITY 3 BLACKPOOL 0

League Division 2 (Third tier)

8th August 1998

Attendance 32,134
I remember the home match that season where Bloomfield RD was a sea of sky blue (I lived on Bloomfield RD at that time). There were twice as many City fans outside the ground without tickets than inside. That's what I call loyal supporters. The only plastics at City are the seats.​
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I was there too. Think went to Wigan the following week and lost 3-0 again at Springfield Park.
 
To be fair to the OP I think he is right in that Man City have always had a large and loyal support in Manchester (maybe more % than United, at least 50/50) and a decent following in the wider North West of England but up until the recent period where the Arab money has propelled City to the top of the game and they’re no longer a ‘yo-yo’ club, City had virtually no following in the wider UK and certainly no foreign interest. And they still suffer from this legacy on a global football scale, that’s why they were so desperate to win the European Cup (believe it’s called the Champions League now!), because until they had, and they only had a cupboard full of domestic trophies they were never going to be taken seriously by the European football royalty.
It will take time for them to grow and to be taken seriously and not just a phenomenon.
Manchester City could always fill a stadium in Manchester but could they fill a stadium in Rome or Madrid or Tokyo or Johannesburg or Los Angeles. No, but Manchester United would/will. (BTW in no United fan, can’t stand them, just stating facts as I see them!)
 
I have been watching Blackpool since the late 60's as a toddler and still am; so Ill get that one out of the way first.
However, I am also a fan of football; I can remember the last couple of seasons of Best, Charlton and Law as a kid.
Watched them as a 7 year old with no concept of United's following or reputation; even saw them relegated in 1974.
Even though they were well past their best by then, the football was still exciting and perhaps a factor in their popularity.
I also remember the 75/76 season when I think they had 60k+ in the second tier; way above anything in the old first division.
Fast forward to now. My son follows BFC but often goes to Etihad to watch champions league football for about £10.
Another observation; if in a pub when City are on Sky there are always blokes my age wearing City shirts when there are
empty seats in the stadium. It's an hour away, go and watch live !

References to 'kid' and 'best' above were not meant as puns 😄
 
Qblock said:
United were also the best supported team in the country when they were shite, and this in the times when you actually had to attend a match to see your team. When they were last in the second tier (76/77?) they still had the highest average home attendance in the country. And every away match they played that season was the home teams biggest crowd of the season. They brought 17/18k to Bloomfield Road (before my time but I’m sure someone can confirm).
So whilst Munich, George Best, early prem years etc are a factor, their support has held up through thick and thin. Worth remembering they’ve been garbage for the last decade, but still the best supported team in the country. City only actually sell out at home when they play United
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yeah, i don't disagree. United have always been the best supported team. I was just giving my opinions of why so many choose to follow them. Espeially so many from outside of the Manchester area.
 
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