No thread on underprivileged white boys.

Read the bloody papers, listen to the news, I have not brought race into this, it is an official report that has been released and is being openly discussed on radio and television. Wake up from your woke opinions, if it doesn't suit your agenda then just say nothing. Unbelievable.

I was looking for opinions from our teachers on here, not people up their own arseholes.
 
The question we have to ask ourselves is this:

Are white 'working class' boys affected disproportionately because they are:

white
working class or
boys.

And this needs to be in comparison to say, black, working class boys.

Are there issues because they are

black
working class or
boys.

Each of those characteristics play out in different ways.

I've italicised working class, because what we actually mean are workless class; kids growing up in homes reliant of state benefits.
 
From my own experience Asian families ,in particular,place great value on education and see it as the main vehicle for social mobility.
The report in question focuses on underprivileged white working class pupils and there has been problems for many years. Certainly when I left school in 1983 there were no expectations to go on to further or higher education .
Think we need to have good FE colleges and offer opportunities to train for te future .Sports studies is ok but we have a real lack of technicians in engineering ,health care ,electronics etc
Just my thoughts but I do have concerns white working class kids are too often dismissed as chavs and stupid .
 
Curryman said:
Read the bloody papers, listen to the news, I have not brought race into this, it is an official report that has been released and is being openly discussed on radio and television. Wake up from your woke opinions, if it doesn't suit your agenda then just say nothing. Unbelievable.

I was looking for opinions from our teachers on here, not people up their own arseholes.
Click to expand...
On this occasion, Curryman. You have brought race into the conversation, with the totally unnecessary comment, White Lives Matter.
I never thought I’d hear you using the “woke” word.😱
 
Curryman said:
Read the bloody papers, listen to the news, I have not brought race into this, it is an official report that has been released and is being openly discussed on radio and television. Wake up from your woke opinions, if it doesn't suit your agenda then just say nothing. Unbelievable.

I was looking for opinions from our teachers on here, not people up their own arseholes.
Click to expand...
Wind 'em up, watch them go...
 
Two points:

Have you ever heard anyone in this government (or any of its media shills) asking as to why working-class pupils don`t get as good an education as privately educated middle-class kids?

And are these the same white under privileged working-class kids that MPs recently voted to not feed through the pandemic, until Marcus Rashford put them right?

Talk about using them as political footballs...

And poor framing of the O/P by the way. Why not just ask a straightforward question than slyly imply something ...
 
Giro said:
On this occasion, Curryman. You have brought race into the conversation, with the totally unnecessary comment, White Lives Matter.
I never thought I’d hear you using the “woke” word.😱
Click to expand...
I suggest you re-read the post Giro. I said lads not lives, as the report is about white lads, not pupils which includes girls or any other race as they are not included in the report. It seems from the over reaction of some on here that unless it fits their agenda they ignore anything that goes against their bias in life.

There have been umpteen threads on the BLM movement, the removal of statues, taking the knee and so on, so why not about underprivileged white lads? The WLM was a take on BLM.
 
I don't like the term "White privilege". It implies that all white kids are in a much better position than their Black counterparts. I understand the concept though. The meaning, which I feel has never been properly explained in the media is that whilst recognising that there are a number of factors that negatively affect life chances of our young, for White children it will not be because of colour or racism, institutional or singular. However, in the last five years there have been 60000 reported alleged racal incidents in schools aimed at the Black, Asian and Roma community.
On the main point though. We have had a problem with underachievement of all pupils who are classified as FSM etc and fall into the PP category, regardless of colour. This isssue predates the current trend to bandy about words like "woke" in a perjorative sense. The bulk of PP kids are from white working class areas though so it's not a shock.
There are a number of factors that cause this. Poverty and deprivation is the main one. Motivation is another. Most parents try their best with their kids but sometimes the isssues of under achievement are multi generational.
Everyone is picking up on this next phase of what seems to me to be a deliberate attempt to instigate/ propagate some kind of culture war and the press are typically focusing on one part of the report whilst ignoring some of the real reasons highlighted by the same report.
The main findings are:
  • Poor local jobs market and lack of opportunity
  • Lack of community assets and social organisations, poor local services and transport
  • Families with "multi-generational poverty"
  • Disengaged parents with a poor experience of education.
I spend most of my working day with a mixture of vulnerable and disaffected pupils. Not once have they said to me "I'm underachieving, misbehaving in lessons and not completing work in school and at home because of the term white privilege."
This is a societal problem not a race one. It smacks of the usual attempt to divide and conquer, instigated by the very elite who are partly responsible for the problem in the first place.
 
Curryman said:
I suggest you re-read the post Giro. I said lads not lives, as the report is about white lads, not pupils which includes girls or any other race as they are not included in the report. It seems from the over reaction of some on here that unless it fits their agenda they ignore anything that goes against their bias in life.

There have been umpteen threads on the BLM movement, the removal of statues, taking the knee and so on, so why not about underprivileged white lads? The WLM was a take on BLM.
Click to expand...
Ignore Giro he is just a troll☹️ People read into things what they want . The likes of giro and that hospital toilet cleaner will have seen the headline this morning and hastily skipped past it cos it is not what they want to hear as it does not fit their left wing agenda.
 
Curryman said:
Read the bloody papers, listen to the news, I have not brought race into this, it is an official report that has been released and is being openly discussed on radio and television. Wake up from your woke opinions, if it doesn't suit your agenda then just say nothing. Unbelievable.

I was looking for opinions from our teachers on here, not people up their own arseholes.
Click to expand...
"Do white boys not garner the same interest as Black, Asian or Chinese boys?" No of course you didn't bring race into this. And are schools near you exclusively for male students? Oh, and I was a teacher. In 1980's I taught in Blackburn and the same thing was happening then. Pupils of Asian heritage would start their school career in the bottom bands/sets and by the fifth year, they had largely progressed to the top bands/sets. In fact, the bottom band history group I taught were exclusively white. Why? The Asian students were in the main aspirational with very supportive parents. The poorly-achieving white students were not interested in education as they saw no point in it, had little or no support from parents, and did not aspire to anything beyond the life they saw around them at home. The issue is not new, has been and is still being discussed ad nauseam. The attempt by some to bring the issue of Black/White privilege into this is an unnecessary distraction and turns the issue into just another feature of the culture wars in which you seem to be a willing and enthusiastic participant.
 
Thegoalmachine said:
Ignore Giro he is just a troll☹️ People read into things what they want . The likes of giro and that hospital toilet cleaner will have seen the headline this morning and hastily skipped past it cos it is not what they want to hear as it does not fit their left wing agenda.
Click to expand...
I’m left wing, really? What bought you to that totally incorrect conclusion?
 
Curryman said:
I suggest you re-read the post Giro. I said lads not lives, as the report is about white lads, not pupils which includes girls or any other race as they are not included in the report. It seems from the over reaction of some on here that unless it fits their agenda they ignore anything that goes against their bias in life.

There have been umpteen threads on the BLM movement, the removal of statues, taking the knee and so on, so why not about underprivileged white lads? The WLM was a take on BLM.
Click to expand...
Fair enough, Curryman👍
 
Bloody Hell...a thread where you really want to hear what CatInStAlbans has to say.

The flip side of this (discussion) is the state of education......
Poor kids have always struggled...I was going to say in every race....but (and being from Birmingham) that's not the case......I went to an ex-grammar school and you had to do an entrance exam to get in....we were 60% white, 40% black and asian.....

And here's my A level in Sociology kicking in.....poor equates to uneducated...FACT
Lower middle class kids achieve more than lower working class.....etc etc.
And as certain area's have a high concentration of 'poor', they will struggle with basic and further eduction.....no matter what colour.

You can flood schools in these poorer areas with all the bells and whistles education can offer.....still wont do anything to improve the levels of achievement...it's been proved time and time again.....

Here's one...49% of the UK have a degree....but that number has remained at that figure for 9 years+
There will always be the 51% who just dont go further....and that (more or less) equates to being poor
 
Not been to school for 45 years so don't know how motivated the teachers are as well as the pupils. The English Lit teacher told the class I was in at a secondary school "I don't know why you are bothering doing this subject as no one has passed O level for 8 years ! " There was a general aura of apathy about teachers. In those days as well 2 pupils had to share reading the same text book in lessons due to education cuts. Anyway I proved the teacher wrong by passing O level English Lit though no one else in the class did probably due to his lack of motivation skills and negativity.
 
B_Side_The_C_Side said:
Bloody Hell...a thread where you really want to hear what CatInStAlbans has to say.

The flip side of this (discussion) is the state of education......
Poor kids have always struggled...I was going to say in every race....but (and being from Birmingham) that's not the case......I went to an ex-grammar school and you had to do an entrance exam to get in....we were 60% white, 40% black and asian.....

And here's my A level in Sociology kicking in.....poor equates to uneducated...FACT
Lower middle class kids achieve more than lower working class.....etc etc.
And as certain area's have a high concentration of 'poor', they will struggle with basic and further eduction.....no matter what colour.

You can flood schools in these poorer areas with all the bells and whistles education can offer.....still wont do anything to improve the levels of achievement...it's been proved time and time again.....

Here's one...49% of the UK have a degree....but that number has remained at that figure for 9 years+
There will always be the 51% who just dont go further....and that (more or less) equates to being poor
Click to expand...
Poor does not always equate to uneducated.
 
Trammo said:
Not been to school for 45 years so don't know how motivated the teachers are as well as the pupils. The English Lit teacher told the class I was in at a secondary school "I don't know why you are bothering doing this subject as no one has passed O level for 8 years ! " There was a general aura of apathy about teachers. In those days as well 2 pupils had to share reading the same text book in lessons due to education cuts. Anyway I proved the teacher wrong by passing O level English Lit though no one else in the class did probably due to his lack of motivation skills and negativity.
Click to expand...
Things have moved on somewhat in that respect...thankfully.
 
southshorepool said:
I don't like the term "White privilege". It implies that all white kids are in a much better position than their Black counterparts. I understand the concept though. The meaning, which I feel has never been properly explained in the media is that whilst recognising that there are a number of factors that negatively affect life chances of our young, for White children it will not be because of colour or racism, institutional or singular. However, in the last five years there have been 60000 reported alleged racal incidents in schools aimed at the Black, Asian and Roma community.
On the main point though. We have had a problem with underachievement of all pupils who are classified as FSM etc and fall into the PP category, regardless of colour. This isssue predates the current trend to bandy about words like "woke" in a perjorative sense. The bulk of PP kids are from white working class areas though so it's not a shock.
There are a number of factors that cause this. Poverty and deprivation is the main one. Motivation is another. Most parents try their best with their kids but sometimes the isssues of under achievement are multi generational.
Everyone is picking up on this next phase of what seems to me to be a deliberate attempt to instigate/ propagate some kind of culture war and the press are typically focusing on one part of the report whilst ignoring some of the real reasons highlighted by the same report.
The main findings are:
  • Poor local jobs market and lack of opportunity
  • Lack of community assets and social organisations, poor local services and transport
  • Families with "multi-generational poverty"
  • Disengaged parents with a poor experience of education.
I spend most of my working day with a mixture of vulnerable and disaffected pupils. Not once have they said to me "I'm underachieving, misbehaving in lessons and not completing work in school and at home because of the term white privilege."
This is a societal problem not a race one. It smacks of the usual attempt to divide and conquer, instigated by the very elite who are partly responsible for the problem in the first place.
Click to expand...

I completely agree with your take on white privilege, but I'm not convinced it will ever be explained (and used) correctly or in the appropriate context; it simply feeds into the belief that poor, white communities have been irrelevant until the quite recent past.

The stats are interesting though and do shine a light on racial disparities.

Committee chairman Robert Halfon said it was a "major social injustice" that so little had been done to address this gap in attainment - and accused the government of "muddled thinking" in suggesting it could be explained by poverty.
"If you think it's about poverty, then it doesn't explain why most other ethnic groups do much better," he said.
Poorer white pupils are falling behind "every step of the way", he warned, and with almost a million young people being affected, it could not be "swept under the carpet".
  • At GCSE, in 2019, 18% of white British pupils on free meals achieved grade 5 in English and maths, compared with 23% for the average for pupils on free meals
  • For university entry, 16% of white British pupils on free meals get places, compared with 59% of black African pupils on free meals, 59% of Bangladeshi pupils on free meals and 32% of black Caribbean pupils on free meals.
I'm not convinced it's because they are white that our FSM kids achieve lower than non-white FSM kids, but we need to do something serious and target this cohort to give them the very best chance to further their education and potential career aspirations.

www.bbc.co.uk

Poorer white pupils let down and neglected - MPs

White pupils from low income families are falling behind "every step of the way", an education committee says.
www.bbc.co.uk
 
Thank you to those who have added to the debate and not gone for the jugular on race. I'm particularly interested in the comments of the teachers, past and present and their take on the subject.

I had a couple of pubs in Bradford on the 1980,s one of which was next to two large estates. There were some nice people who lived on both but also a greater number of older whites who had lost their jobs and due to poor education were now receivers of benefits. Crime in the area was high, and the kids who were being brought up in these conditions mimicked their elders, which finished up with the school next door being gutted by fire after one of the kids from such a family set it ablaze. I said at the time, what future do these kids have to look forward to.

The situation has not been resolved by successive governments and unless something is done quickly I believe the situation will deteriorate even further.

Unfortunately there is now a white underclass as well as young Asian youths forming gangs, which if not tackled will end up in more trouble between the communities.

I have two grandchildren of mixed race, who I love dearly, and both are doing well at school, but do have occasional problems with bullying from both whites and Asians. Fortunately they just walk away, as they have been told to do.

Action is needed now, to prevent another explosion of riots due to those affected being envious or are pure hateful of their opposites.

So, for your information that is how I see things.
 
Curryman said:
Do White boys not garner the same interest as Black, Asian or Chinese boys?

The report about the disadvantage at school of this group is not before time by the look of it, and I was expecting to see a thread on here, but no. Come on people WLM (White Lads Matter).
Click to expand...
Looks like you've started one Curryman.
 
B_Side_The_C_Side said:
Bloody Hell...a thread where you really want to hear what CatInStAlbans has to say.

The flip side of this (discussion) is the state of education......
Poor kids have always struggled...I was going to say in every race....but (and being from Birmingham) that's not the case......I went to an ex-grammar school and you had to do an entrance exam to get in....we were 60% white, 40% black and asian.....

And here's my A level in Sociology kicking in.....poor equates to uneducated...FACT
Lower middle class kids achieve more than lower working class.....etc etc.
And as certain area's have a high concentration of 'poor', they will struggle with basic and further eduction.....no matter what colour.

You can flood schools in these poorer areas with all the bells and whistles education can offer.....still wont do anything to improve the levels of achievement...it's been proved time and time again.....

Here's one...49% of the UK have a degree....but that number has remained at that figure for 9 years+
There will always be the 51% who just dont go further....and that (more or less) equates to being poor
Click to expand...
In education, you really can blame the parents. If the kids don't get the support they need at home, then they've lost before they start, and in the poorest households the parents have enough on their plate without helping with homework etc, plus many are simply unable to help because of their own poor education. Invariably the ones who then blame the school for the child being at the bottom of the class.

Education isn't just about the few hours a day spent in school. Being motivated to do the homework in a supportive environment is key.
 
Curryman said:
Thank you to those who have added to the debate and not gone for the jugular on race. I'm particularly interested in the comments of the teachers, past and present and their take on the subject.

I had a couple of pubs in Bradford on the 1980,s one of which was next to two large estates. There were some nice people who lived on both but also a greater number of older whites who had lost their jobs and due to poor education were now receivers of benefits. Crime in the area was high, and the kids who were being brought up in these conditions mimicked their elders, which finished up with the school next door being gutted by fire after one of the kids from such a family set it ablaze. I said at the time, what future do these kids have to look forward to.

The situation has not been resolved by successive governments and unless something is done quickly I believe the situation will deteriorate even further.

Unfortunately there is now a white underclass as well as young Asian youths forming gangs, which if not tackled will end up in more trouble between the communities.

I have two grandchildren of mixed race, who I love dearly, and both are doing well at school, but do have occasional problems with bullying from both whites and Asians. Fortunately they just walk away, as they have been told to do.

Action is needed now, to prevent another explosion of riots due to those affected being envious or are pure hateful of their opposites.

So, for your information that is how I see things.
Click to expand...
There's no quick fix to break these cycles of poverty, crime, drug abuse & general lawlessness. I feel many who are in these deprived areas have nothing to really look forward to or lose & therefore no accountability. On crime/gang culture & the consequences of being brought to task over these activities, if you were to feel you had nothing to lose whatever happened, you would be less likely to be deterred by threats arrest & jail etc. whereas if you had a job & some possessions you valued, would you still be as likely to make stupid decisions regarding your actions & risk losing everything. I doubt it.
The Trouble is to make inroads & start the process of healing takes time & generally speaking a political party's tenure rarely lasts 10 years (if they seriously made an effort to repair the damage) We could be 3 generations down the line & each one knows no different. Give people opportunities & gradually many will realise this surely is a better way forward & maybe in 25 years time the knock on effect will be new generations with something to strive for. Or just continue to have a society where we have no go areas full of forgotten no hopers, creating more of the same living in slums on the edge of town, with police helicopters circling.
 
"White privilege" is a really poor term imo. Many white people don't seem to understand its meaning and think that it just means that all white people lead a privileged lifestyle, plenty of money, nice house, good job etc.. The number of times this misinterpretation has cropped up in response to whenever 'white privilege' is mentioned are too many to mention. But in order to get people to understand what it means, you need to educate people, and to educate people you first need them to listen. You are not going to get low income white people (the majority of the population) to listen by calling them privileged when they're struggling to make ends meet.
 
One point I noted in the BBC report was that white working class boys in London were the exception to the rule about underachievement.

The amount of funding per pupil in London is well in excess of that in many other areas of the country. That has lead to much better education standards generally, and an impact on results generally. It will have also had an significant impact on this report, since the BAME population in London is significantly higher proportionately than in other parts of the country.

Forget all the stuff about race, what we should be asking is how can we raise the rest of the country’s education standards to those of London? And how can we provide job opportunities, which are a significant motivator to students, to somewhere in the same ball park as those in London?
 
Lack of parental aspirations for their children, ingrained attitudes towards learning and staying in education, poverty and low-paid jobs seen as inescapable etc etc. At primary school level, underprivileged children get extra funding through Pupil Premium support, along with the nurture and care. They also get targeted and dragged up to where their ability says they should be on the whole through good teaching and 1:1 interventions, despite little parents support for reading, spellings and homework. We give them cultural capital, funding visits, residential and events in school that parents can’t/ won’t pay for.
I think this then gets eroded away as they move through high school, and ultimately the wave of no ambition and no drive from the parents catches up along with a decrease in nurture etc.
 
Wizaard said:
In education, you really can blame the parents. If the kids don't get the support they need at home, then they've lost before they start, and in the poorest households the parents have enough on their plate without helping with homework etc, plus many are simply unable to help because of their own poor education. Invariably the ones who then blame the school for the child being at the bottom of the class.

Education isn't just about the few hours a day spent in school. Being motivated to do the homework in a supportive environment is key.
Click to expand...
I think that it is also about expectations Wiz, about encouraging children to aim high.


It is a self-fulfilling cycle though; parents did not do well at school so don't value it or shy away from learning because they think they just can't do it and they pass that attitude on to their children.


A few months ago there was a TV series which watched the lives of high flying working class kids and how their supportive teachers worked to engaged not just the children but their parents as well and as a team they won through. Each of the children won a place at university and each was the first in their family to do so.

The negative cycle can be broken but it takes a team of engaged people to do it.
 
hampshire_exile said:
One point I noted in the BBC report was that white working class boys in London were the exception to the rule about underachievement.

The amount of funding per pupil in London is well in excess of that in many other areas of the country. That has lead to much better education standards generally, and an impact on results generally. It will have also had an significant impact on this report, since the BAME population in London is significantly higher proportionately than in other parts of the country.

Forget all the stuff about race, what we should be asking is how can we raise the rest of the country’s education standards to those of London? And how can we provide job opportunities, which are a significant motivator to students, to somewhere in the same ball park as those in London?
Click to expand...
I would add that we need an education strategy that targets parents, to encourage them to encourage their kids. This will need an approach that helps the employment prospects of the parents, so that they see first hand how much better their lives could be with jobs and education. Penalising them will not work. Joined up thinking, safe places to study, cheap internet access, a decent computer, proper nutrition and time made for teachers to listen and tailor support.

Myself and many of my peers back in school days would be regarded as working class. We were lucky to have parents ( fathers, if I'm honest) with jobs who would encourage us to do our best, and their biggest joy was seeing us do better than they had.
 
Actually we’ve had a few threads about under privileged white kids recently.

They've been along the lines of “lazy; bone idle; don’t want to do menial work. Why is my local closed at lunchtime when I want a pint? Why are there so many job vacancies in the Lakes? Have you walked down Central Drive recently?”

So I agree we should certainly have a debate. And see what the connection is between the points raised in the op and comments like those above.
 
I’ve had many run ins with scum parents about the way they’ve been talking to/behaving in front of their children. They’ve all been white, believe me there are a lot of kids in Blackpool that have no chance in life simply because of their parents/parent. Some manage to break the cycle but it’s a Very sad situation ☹️
 
Curryman said:
Do White boys not garner the same interest as Black, Asian or Chinese boys?

The report about the disadvantage at school of this group is not before time by the look of it, and I was expecting to see a thread on here, but no. Come on people WLM (White Lads Matter).
Click to expand...
I've been saying it for years. White working class people are manipulated by politicians but hardly ever represented.
Look at the demographics of the House of Commons, how many people are from a white working class background?
Sad thing is we keep voting for over privileged white men so nothing will change for the better for the majority of people whatever colour they are!!
 
braymarina said:
I think that it is also about expectations Wiz, about encouraging children to aim high.


It is a self-fulfilling cycle though; parents did not do well at school so don't value it or shy away from learning because they think they just can't do it and they pass that attitude on to their children.


A few months ago there was a TV series which watched the lives of high flying working class kids and how their supportive teachers worked to engaged not just the children but their parents as well and as a team they won through. Each of the children won a place at university and each was the first in their family to do so.

The negative cycle can be broken but it takes a team of engaged people to do it.
Click to expand...
True enough.

The thing is, the likes of the Daily Mail currently wringing their hands over these kids will be slagging them off in two months time when the exam results come out, saying its far too easy to get A*s. Those that get those grades will have earned them through a lot of hard work in very difficult circumstances but there will be opinion pieces on 'it was much harder in my day'.

In the current climate it must be incredibly difficult to teach and to learn but no doubt we'll have threads slagging teachers for being on long holidays shortly...
 
First. This is little but an attempt by Conservative MPs to stir the race pot and encourage further division and hatred from their anti woke supporters. Where was the concern by these MPs when they were cutting the number of Sure Start centres, decimating school budgets meaning that many support staff working with the very children they now claim to be so concerned about lost their jobs, cutting free school meals (you can't expect a hungry child to learn effectively) and generally ensuring that poorer Northern towns were hit much harder by all the budget cuts than the Tory voting satellite towns of the South East.
Second. As pointed out this problem has always existed. Back at the beginning of my teaching career in Morecambe the most disaffected students were those in the poorest housing or those who saw no better future than following a similar life path to their parents. While it is true that parent's have the greatest influence on children's attitudes it can not be easy to keep ambitions high when your main priority is getting enough money to survive the week. Again the only time Tories care about these people is when there is blame to be scattered about, whether it the feckless workshy Benefit scroungers, never mind that most benefit claimants are employed by unscrupulous employers paying inadequate wages, offering no guarantee of income levels through the use of zero hour contracts.
Third. Even in a wealthy area where I now work there are still pockets of poverty. There are still drug and alcohol issues amongst parents which have a far bigger impact on the outcome of education than divisive slogans could ever have. Again, what has this government done about these issues in the last 10 years. Slashed every support service available.
Let's not pretend that this issue is out of concern for the children. As someone stated. The only effect of white privilege is that the white students who live in poverty (up 40 % under the Tories), have disfunctional families, live in substandard accommodation, often going hungry, do not have the added issue of racism to affect their day to day lives. It is not a phrase I have ever used in the classroom.
Teachers try to make a difference, and support students wherever possible. There is a student I teach at the moment- clearly intelligent, over the year has improved immensely in terms of achievement but is adamant he does not want to move to a higher ability group next year because he sees the higher sets as posh and he would be away from his friendship group. The challenge is to make him believe he can be successful. Whether we succeed depends on so many factors, but believe me, having him believe that white privilege is somehow hampering his progress is out there with Blackpool signing Phil Foden in the believability scale.
 
catinstalbans said:
First. This is little but an attempt by Conservative MPs to stir the race pot and encourage further division and hatred from their anti woke supporters. Where was the concern by these MPs when they were cutting the number of Sure Start centres, decimating school budgets meaning that many support staff working with the very children they now claim to be so concerned about lost their jobs, cutting free school meals (you can't expect a hungry child to learn effectively) and generally ensuring that poorer Northern towns were hit much harder by all the budget cuts than the Tory voting satellite towns of the South East.
Second. As pointed out this problem has always existed. Back at the beginning of my teaching career in Morecambe the most disaffected students were those in the poorest housing or those who saw no better future than following a similar life path to their parents. While it is true that parent's have the greatest influence on children's attitudes it can not be easy to keep ambitions high when your main priority is getting enough money to survive the week. Again the only time Tories care about these people is when there is blame to be scattered about, whether it the feckless workshy Benefit scroungers, never mind that most benefit claimants are employed by unscrupulous employers paying inadequate wages, offering no guarantee of income levels through the use of zero hour contracts.
Third. Even in a wealthy area where I now work there are still pockets of poverty. There are still drug and alcohol issues amongst parents which have a far bigger impact on the outcome of education than divisive slogans could ever have. Again, what has this government done about these issues in the last 10 years. Slashed every support service available.
Let's not pretend that this issue is out of concern for the children. As someone stated. The only effect of white privilege is that the white students who live in poverty (up 40 % under the Tories), have disfunctional families, live in substandard accommodation, often going hungry, do not have the added issue of racism to affect their day to day lives. It is not a phrase I have ever used in the classroom.
Teachers try to make a difference, and support students wherever possible. There is a student I teach at the moment- clearly intelligent, over the year has improved immensely in terms of achievement but is adamant he does not want to move to a higher ability group next year because he sees the higher sets as posh and he would be away from his friendship group. The challenge is to make him believe he can be successful. Whether we succeed depends on so many factors, but believe me, having him believe that white privilege is somehow hampering his progress is out there with Blackpool signing Phil Foden in the believability scale.
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There is a germ of truth in some of the things you say, but you view life through a very warped lens.

I think that the vast majority of people who go into politics do so because they want to make a difference to people's lives. It is in every Party's interests to raise educational standards, increase employment and maximise tax revenue. These Victorian Tories you see everywhere are a figment of your rather nasty imagination.

Even if they weren't - there is a real problem with parenting and with teaching in this country. Parents aren't getting their children ready for school, aren't giving them the right values and don't support hem as well as they should. And the teaching profession isn't getting the job done either, through a mixture of poor policies, a lack of leadership and people of indifferent quality coming into the role. I'd look a bit closer to home for some of the answers, if I were you.
 
So, how did, closing Sure start centres, slashing school budgets, redistributing what remained of the budgets to Tory Shires, making thousands of teaching support staff redundant, scrapping EMAs ( a policy actually designed to support the poorest to stay in education), making it more difficult to get free school meals do to maximise educational outcomes?
The Conservatives have been in power for 11 years. What have they done to make teaching a more attractive profession or to get a better quality of graduates entering the profession. They have actively reduced the standards needed to train as a teacher in that time? Yet they can't get enough people wanting to train. Why is that? Why do you think so few new teachers stick it out?
 
Curryman said:
Read the bloody papers, listen to the news, I have not brought race into this, it is an official report that has been released and is being openly discussed on radio and television. Wake up from your woke opinions, if it doesn't suit your agenda then just say nothing. Unbelievable.

I was looking for opinions from our teachers on here, not people up their own arseholes.
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😂 😂 😂 😂 😂 😂 😂 You don't really expect that to happen do you, Curry? 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
 
catinstalbans said:
So, how did, closing Sure start centres, slashing school budgets, redistributing what remained of the budgets to Tory Shires, making thousands of teaching support staff redundant, scrapping EMAs ( a policy actually designed to support the poorest to stay in education), making it more difficult to get free school meals do to maximise educational outcomes?
The Conservatives have been in power for 11 years. What have they done to make teaching a more attractive profession or to get a better quality of graduates entering the profession. They have actively reduced the standards needed to train as a teacher in that time? Yet they can't get enough people wanting to train. Why is that? Why do you think so few new teachers stick it out?
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Like I said, a warped lens. You could say much the same of any Government over the last 50 years, including Blair, who dumbed everything down.
 
TSSeasider said:
The question we have to ask ourselves is this:

Are white 'working class' boys affected disproportionately because they are:

white
working class or
boys.

And this needs to be in comparison to say, black, working class boys.

Are there issues because they are

black
working class or
boys.

Each of those characteristics play out in different ways.

I've italicised working class, because what we actually mean are workless class; kids growing up in homes reliant of state benefits.
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No we're not. Most working age benefit takers nowadays are in work. They are reliant on State benefits it's true but not because they're lazy or unwilling to work.
 
I don’t really get the problem here as GCSEs are incredibly easy and A levels are easily achievable with a modicum of revision. Therefore doesn’t really matter what the state education is like, absolutely crap by the way but that’s another debate, as you’ll be 18 by the time you’ve finished your A levels and able to think for yourself. It’s also pretty impossible not to get into a university if you want to, 3 Ds will do it, so there’s no excuses. Not like my day when barriers were put in your path if you wanted to carry on in education nowadays you’re wet nursed from day one.
 
Memphisboy said:
I don’t really get the problem here as GCSEs are incredibly easy and A levels are easily achievable with a modicum of revision. Therefore doesn’t really matter what the state education is like, absolutely crap by the way but that’s another debate, as you’ll be 18 by the time you’ve finished your A levels and able to think for yourself. It’s also pretty impossible not to get into a university if you want to, 3 Ds will do it, so there’s no excuses. Not like my day when barriers were put in your path if you wanted to carry on in education nowadays you’re wet nursed from day one.
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You really haven't got a grasp on the economic or sociological issues here have you? From an educated perspective it sounds easy enough. It isn't. When the family and peer groups are alien to education, when academic success doesn't appear in your conversation, when doing well in life means screwing the system or being good at fencing drugs for the local pusher....your 3 Ds might as well be on the Moon. When you have to look after your kid brothers and sisters because your mum's an alcoholic or your dad's in prison...you're not thinking of 3Ds. When you have a good family but you're in crap accommodation with a rip-off landlord, you're not thinking of your 3 Ds. When your parents are doing their best on zero hours contracts and are out most of the day and night working, you're not thinking of 3 Ds. Or, when you're in a stable environment, in a good house and your mum & dad's families never did much in education and your peer group have no educational expectations and your girlfriend doesn't and you dream of a house, good marriage and kids in good employment based on an apprenticeship, why the hell do you want to think of 3 Ds?
 
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Memphisboy said:
I don’t really get the problem here as GCSEs are incredibly easy and A levels are easily achievable with a modicum of revision. Therefore doesn’t really matter what the state education is like, absolutely crap by the way but that’s another debate, as you’ll be 18 by the time you’ve finished your A levels and able to think for yourself. It’s also pretty impossible not to get into a university if you want to, 3 Ds will do it, so there’s no excuses. Not like my day when barriers were put in your path if you wanted to carry on in education nowadays you’re wet nursed from day one.
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And so it begins. "Incredibly easy" "Modicum of revision ".

Just fuck off.
 
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