OT - Mason Greenwood

Lost Seasider said:
Well to be honest I've no idea what point you're trying to make, and since you think anyone who disagrees with you is a clown who can f*** off I really don't think it's worth the effort trying to work it out.
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That's been pretty apparent from the outset..... Why don't you just make up what I'm saying and then have a two day long debate with yourself about it?👍
 
Completely disheartened reading this thread. No wonder women are so scared to come out when they are victims. Some shameful attitudes in here, bit those is up there with the worst of them.

King Billy said:
Also Greenwood saying “stop talking to me” and “stop pushing me” probably means she was trying to get a reaction on record from him.
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Quite aside from the awful misquoting, it's a pretty horrible of how we blame victims.

It equates to, " she was talking" or "she was pushing him" so she deserved what she got.

How anyone can listen to that recording and, without being his solicitor, look to defend Greenwood awful
 
Tango1953 said:
Completely disheartened reading this thread. No wonder women are so scared to come out when they are victims. Some shameful attitudes in here, bit those is up there with the worst of them.



Quite aside from the awful misquoting, it's a pretty horrible of how we blame victims.

It equates to, " she was talking" or "she was pushing him" so she deserved what she got.

How anyone can listen to that recording and, without being his solicitor, look to defend Greenwood awful
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I feel the same.

We have all seen the same things, it’s troubling when people are more concerned with questioning HER motives.

Worst thread on here for a while and we do have some crackers from time to time.
 
Tango1953 said:
Completely disheartened reading this thread. No wonder women are so scared to come out when they are victims. Some shameful attitudes in here, bit those is up there with the worst of them.



Quite aside from the awful misquoting, it's a pretty horrible of how we blame victims.

It equates to, " she was talking" or "she was pushing him" so she deserved what she got.

How anyone can listen to that recording and, without being his solicitor, look to defend Greenwood awful
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Yeah because that’s what I said isn’t it.
Either read it properly or don’t respond but don’t start talking a load of shit taking my comments the wrong way.
 
As is so often the case on this board the experts have all had their say. Nobody has the first clue yet. Let’s all take a chill pill and wait and see what comes Out. I’ll bet you it won’t be quick.
 
Scaramanga said:
As is so often the case on this board the experts have all had their say. Nobody has the first clue yet. Let’s all take a chill pill and wait and see what comes Out. I’ll bet you it won’t be quick.
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In fairness, we have far more than the first clue, we have photographic evidence of an injury and an audio recording.
 
Tango1953 said:
Completely disheartened reading this thread. No wonder women are so scared to come out when they are victims. Some shameful attitudes in here, bit those is up there with the worst of them.



Quite aside from the awful misquoting, it's a pretty horrible of how we blame victims.

It equates to, " she was talking" or "she was pushing him" so she deserved what she got.

How anyone can listen to that recording and, without being his solicitor, look to defend Greenwood awful
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By the same token, let's not convict the accused in the court of public opinion until he's had a trial, I don't think at this stage he's even been charged yet.
 
TwelveAngryMen said:
That's a bit rich when compared to your attitude towards Virginia Guiffre which would have seen her ' tarred and feathered ' by now by the Court of Lost Seasider
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I'm trying to keep an open mind in both cases, that means looking at both sides of the picture and not assuming that everything that VG says is true.

Far too many closed minds on some of these threads for my liking.
 
Sh
Lost Seasider said:
I've highlighted the key word for you.

Is it beyond the bounds of possibility that somebody might attempt to entrap a multi-millionaire footballer for the purpose of extortion? Is it possible that the entrapment might entail allegations of sexual violence?

A simple yes/no will suffice.
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She didn’t report it to the police. And blackmail or extortion is hardly feasible when you’ve already outed them on social media.
 
Lala said:
She didn’t report it to the police. And blackmail or extortion is hardly feasible when you’ve already outed them on social media.
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I'm not saying it's likely, let's make that clear, but it is a small possibility and that's the reason why we shouldn't rush to judgement before he's even charged.

It's possible that such a person might think they can sue for damages and maybe thinks the player will settle for £1,000,000+ just to get rid of them. It might not be the brightest idea ever, but then the sort of person who might try such a thing probably isn't the sharpest tool in the box to start with.

To repeat, I'm not saying I think this is what happened, but there are reasons why we have courts and trials rather than the mob justice that some seem to favour.
 
Lost Seasider said:
I'm not saying it's likely, let's make that clear, but it is a small possibility and that's the reason why we shouldn't rush to judgement before he's even charged.

It's possible that such a person might think they can sue for damages and maybe thinks the player will settle for £1,000,000+ just to get rid of them. It might not be the brightest idea ever, but then the sort of person who might try such a thing probably isn't the sharpest tool in the box to start with.

To repeat, I'm not saying I think this is what happened, but there are reasons why we have courts and trials rather than the mob justice that some seem to favour.
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I don’t think money is a motive however this pans out.

From the opposite perspective I think it’s unbelievably hard to understand the shame and guilt a victim would feel in revealing this kind of thing. It’s not the kind of thing she would have a ‘managed approach ‘ to, and she will probably be aware it makes some people feel uncomfortable. So, if the means and mode of the exposure appeared more chaotic and impulsive that’s possibly why.

And as Bifster says people rarely want to know or believe this kind of stuff which would add to her reticence and very misplaced shame.
 
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Lala said:
I don’t think money is a motive however this pans out.

From the opposite perspective I think it’s unbelievably hard to understand the shame and guilt a victim would feel in revealing this kind of thing. It’s not the kind of thing she would have a ‘managed approach ‘ to, and she will probably be aware it makes some people feel uncomfortable. So, if the means and mode of the exposure appeared more chaotic and impulsive that’s possibly why.

And as Bifster says people rarely want to know or believe this kind of stuff which would add to her reticence and very misplaced shame.
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I'm not saying I think it's at all likely in this case, I rather suspect Mr Greenwood has played his last game as a professional footballer, at least in this country.

But.

When you see the sums of money being bandied around in the PA case, and the amounts being paid to and for PL footballers, it's not out of the realms of possibility that someone might hit on the idea.

To repeat I'm not saying I think this is what happened, I am just questioning the certainty that some posters have over his guilt.
 
Lost Seasider said:
I'm not saying I think it's at all likely in this case, I rather suspect Mr Greenwood has played his last game as a professional footballer, at least in this country.

But.

When you see the sums of money being bandied around in the PA case, and the amounts being paid to and for PL footballers, it's not out of the realms of possibility that someone might hit on the idea.

To repeat I'm not saying I think this is what happened, I am just questioning the certainty that some posters have over his guilt.
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She‘s been with him 3 years or so. I still don’t for one minute think she’s just realised now she could make a bob or two.

For all those who have assumed some level of gullt there appears to be an almost equal number prepared to assume some level of guilt at her.
 
BFC_BFC_BFC said:
In fairness, we have far more than the first clue, we have photographic evidence of an injury and an audio recording.
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Yes i know, but in fairness until the actual facts are revealed its all a bit he said she said isn't it.
 
Lala said:
She‘s been with him 3 years or so. I still don’t for one minute think she’s just realised now she could make a bob or two.
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That certainly makes things look worse for him, but who knows for sure.


Lala said:
For all those who have assumed some level of gullt there appears to be an almost equal number prepared to assume some level of guilt at her.
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Doubt is not the same as guilt, and I'm assuming nothing, I simply want to wait until we've seen all of the evidence before reaching a conclusion.

The problem is that since I've been responding to people who are certain that Greenwood is guilty, and who are certain that everything VG is true, it is very difficult to try to encourage them to keep an open mind without appearing to attack the victim or claimants (it being for the courts to decide which they are).
 
Lost Seasider said:
That certainly makes things look worse for him, but who knows for sure.




Doubt is not the same as guilt, and I'm assuming nothing, I simply want to wait until we've seen all of the evidence before reaching a conclusion.

The problem is that since I've been responding to people who are certain that Greenwood is guilty, and who are certain that everything VG is true, it is very difficult to try to encourage them to keep an open mind without appearing to attack the victim or claimants (it being for the courts to decide which they are).
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Doubt is putlting guilt on her though lost. It assumes she has lied and has made false allegations of a crime.

We all have our own stand point I think, and whichever party we appear to be standing with we are putting the other one in the guilty and disbelieved corner.
 
BFC_BFC_BFC said:
No it’s not “he said she said” at all… There’s rather damning evidence to support the allegation… That’s the point…
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Yes, I've seen the pictures of her bleeding, and heard the audio. As far as i know i haven't seen footage of him attacking her or actual footage of him forcing himself on her that matches the audio. I agree the evidence is pretty damming if true and if proven to be the case the guy should feel the full force of the law. But lets just see.
 
Lost Seasider said:
That certainly makes things look worse for him, but who knows for sure.




Doubt is not the same as guilt, and I'm assuming nothing, I simply want to wait until we've seen all of the evidence before reaching a conclusion.

The problem is that since I've been responding to people who are certain that Greenwood is guilty, and who are certain that everything VG is true, it is very difficult to try to encourage them to keep an open mind without appearing to attack the victim or claimants (it being for the courts to decide which they are).
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Your complete and utter lack of self-awareness is astonishing😂
 
Tango1953 said:
Completely disheartened reading this thread. No wonder women are so scared to come out when they are victims. Some shameful attitudes in here, bit those is up there with the worst of them.



Quite aside from the awful misquoting, it's a pretty horrible of how we blame victims.

It equates to, " she was talking" or "she was pushing him" so she deserved what she got.

How anyone can listen to that recording and, without being his solicitor, look to defend Greenwood awful
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Some of the comments bud are proper disgusting. Shameful and embarrassing.
 
Scaramanga said:
Yes, I've seen the pictures of her bleeding, and heard the audio. As far as i know i haven't seen footage of him attacking her or actual footage of him forcing himself on her that matches the audio. I agree the evidence is pretty damming if true and if proven to be the case the guy should feel the full force of the law. But lets just see.
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Why do we have to see?

Why can’t we form an opinion based upon what we’ve already seen and heard? We’re not sentencing him and this is not a court of law.

My view is that on the balance of probability I think he’s likely to be guilty. I prefer to give the victim (in these instances) the benefit of the doubt.

If that is demonstrated otherwise, then I can change my view, it’s not set in stone, it’s just an opinion.

I don’t get why people get so hung up about these things..
 
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BFC_BFC_BFC said:
Why do we have to see?

Why can’t we form an opinion based upon what we’ve already seen and heard? We’re not sentencing him and this is not a court of law.

My view is that on the balance of probability I think he’s likely to be guilty. I prefer to give the victim (in these instances) the benefit of the doubt.

If that is demonstrated otherwise, then I can change my view, it’s not set in stone, it’s just an opinion.

I don’t get why people get so hung up about these things..
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I’m not hung up on it, i have formed a Personel opinion on it. As usual everyone is an expert without the actual facts.
 
Scaramanga said:
I’m not hung up on it, i have formed a Personel opinion on it. As usual everyone is an expert without the actual facts.
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I’m not sure anyone needs to be an expert really. It’s just a discussion on a football forum and different people have different opinions.
 
todayistheday said:
Wouldnt say it was damning evidence but evidence to be investigated. Do you believe everything on the internet, I hope not.
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I’m struggling to grasp the relationship between “believing everything on the Internet” and the comments I made.

Could you explain ?
 
Wait till they gather all the evidence, if some turns out to be damning and a guilty verdict is reached, you can then avftt hang him.
 
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