Secret cross party talks held about Brexit issues

G

glasshalffull

Well-known member
Good idea. We might be in a better place nowadays if this had been made a cross party issue straight after the referendum.
Michael Gove present so presumably there is full Government support going into the start of this.
 
I was in a Tesco Extra yesterday and it had no tomatoes whosoever. A staff member explained they used to get them from Spain before Brexit but now try to get them from Egypt but hit issues from there.

It's the UK's biggest supermarket and has no tomatoes!

Screenshot_20230212-090344-062.png

Just one small story but it is replicated billions of times across the country and means people spend less and the economy suffers. That's why we are damaging ourselves. It needs sorting out. It cannot continue.
 
Rumours they met and had a ploughman’s lunch washed down with English ale and sang “ Brexit is Forever” and agreed the minor problem is a few Remoaners on avftt broken hearted because they cannot get tomatoes from Spain in Tesco.” Let them shop in Booths or Waitrose” was the unaminous reply.😜🇬🇧
 
BigHandsOliverKahn said:
I was in a Tesco Extra yesterday and it had no tomatoes whosoever. A staff member explained they used to get them from Spain before Brexit but now try to get them from Egypt but hit issues from there.

It's the UK's biggest supermarket and has no tomatoes!

View attachment 14457

Just one small story but it is replicated billions of times across the country and means people spend less and the economy suffers. That's why we are damaging ourselves. It needs sorting out. It cannot continue.
Click to expand...
Either you're lying or the staff member you supposedly asked is lying.
 
From memory it was the Spanish and particularly the Canary Islands Tomatoes that was the cause of the demise of the Fylde Tomatoes. When I worked at the St Annes Hotel (now gone) in the kitchen circa 1964/5 we used to get boxes of them, more often than not covered in mould due to them being boxed when green. They were about half the price of locally grown tomatoes so a bit of wastage was accepted.
BigHandsOliverKahn said:
I was in a Tesco Extra yesterday and it had no tomatoes whosoever. A staff member explained they used to get them from Spain before Brexit but now try to get them from Egypt but hit issues from there.

It's the UK's biggest supermarket and has no tomatoes!

View attachment 14457

Just one small story but it is replicated billions of times across the country and means people spend less and the economy suffers. That's why we are damaging o
Click to expand...
 
RUSTY_2_STANDS said:
Either you're lying or the staff member you supposedly asked is lying.
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BigHandsOliverKahn said:
I was in a Tesco Extra yesterday and it had no tomatoes whosoever. A staff member explained they used to get them from Spain before Brexit but now try to get them from Egypt but hit issues from there.

It's the UK's biggest supermarket and has no tomatoes!

View attachment 14457

Just one small story but it is replicated billions of times across the country and means people spend less and the economy suffers. That's why we are damaging ourselves. It needs sorting out. It cannot continue.
Click to expand...
Strange, not sure that’s true, I’ve had no problems in Asda, Aldi, M & S or Sainsbury’s.
 
BigHandsOliverKahn said:
I was in a Tesco Extra yesterday and it had no tomatoes whosoever. A staff member explained they used to get them from Spain before Brexit but now try to get them from Egypt but hit issues from there.

It's the UK's biggest supermarket and has no tomatoes!

View attachment 14457

Just one small story but it is replicated billions of times across the country and means people spend less and the economy suffers. That's why we are damaging ourselves. It needs sorting out. It cannot continue.
Click to expand...


Chill out and have sandwich BHOK for feck sake.

Make sure it's not cheese and tomato mind.
 
glasshalffull said:
Good idea. We might be in a better place nowadays if this had been made a cross party issue straight after the referendum.
Michael Gove present so presumably there is full Government support going into the start of this.
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I expect successive governments to undo the most damaging aspects of Brexit by stealth, empowered by the growing Bre-gret within the country
 
RUSTY_2_STANDS said:
Either you're lying or the staff member you supposedly asked is lying.
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Take a look yourself on Tesco's online site (already provided a screenshot). Even their countrywide online stock is showing about 12 out of 15 Tomato lines out of stock. There wasn't a single tomato to be seen in the one I visited. Brexit is strangling the supply chains.
 
BigHandsOliverKahn said:
Take a look yourself on Tesco's online site (already provided a screenshot). Even their countrywide online stock is showing about 12 out of 15 Tomato lines out of stock. There wasn't a single tomato to be seen in the one I visited. Brexit is strangling the supply chains.
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Or maybe Tesco's suppliers are shite. But doesn't that doesn't fit in with your agenda of
blaming everything on Brexit.
Like Matesrates has said, I've had no problems getting tomatoes in Morisons, Asda or Aldi.
 
No tomatoes in Tesco Extra on Friday afternoon but they'd barely any eggs either which ain't imported.
The company are bunch of gets always trying to squeeze suppliers for profit it wasn't that long ago they'd fell out with Heinz and you couldn't get their Ketchup or soups which is insane.

Tesco at fault here fuck all to do with Brexit but that doesn't suit the o/p's one trick agenda.
 
poolseasider said:
No tomatoes in Tesco Extra on Friday afternoon but they'd barely any eggs either which ain't imported.
The company are bunch of gets always trying to squeeze suppliers for profit it wasn't that long ago they'd fell out with Heinz and you couldn't get their Ketchup or soups which is insane.

Tesco at fault here fuck all to do with Brexit but that doesn't suit the o/p's one trick agenda.
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Tesco's problems are just one example.

If not Brexit then what is causing Britain to have the worst economic growth prediction this coming year out of all advanced nations?
 
poolseasider said:
No tomatoes in Tesco Extra on Friday afternoon but they'd barely any eggs either which ain't imported.
The company are bunch of gets always trying to squeeze suppliers for profit it wasn't that long ago they'd fell out with Heinz and you couldn't get their Ketchup or soups which is insane.

Tesco at fault here fuck all to do with Brexit but that doesn't suit the o/p's one trick agenda.
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The eggs are down to the bird flu outbreak and they've had plenty when I've been in but expensive.

I bought some toms in Tesco last week and they are of inferior quality compared to normal, so supplier issue?

I agree that the companies that stitch suppliers up are twats, but they aren't the pioneers of that. M&S got so big by finding a supplier, giving them a great price, upping the % they took until the supplier became reliant on M&S. Then M&S would drop the price to very low levels, supplier struggles, M&S takes over company. They did that a lot.
 
RUSTY_2_STANDS said:
I understand the screenshot perfectly
I just can’t find anywhere on the screenshot where it says they are out of tomatoes due to brexit
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Are you familiar with the phrase, elephant in the room? You have never seen any problem associated with Brexit, although at the same time, you've never been able to give one tangible benefit.

Nothing can be attributed to Brexit, despite the overwhelming evidence. Its almost like those who voted for it can't admit it to themselves that they dropped a bollock.
 
BigHandsOliverKahn said:
Tesco's problems are just one example.

If not Brexit then what is causing Britain to have the worst economic growth prediction this coming year out of all advanced nations?
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Lending money to to all and sundry with out any checks or comeback open to fraud an over generous wage payment for sitting at home(Ireland for example was less than £200), printing money like it's going out of style.

Welcome to the cost of pointless Lockdowns and you wonder where all the money has gone and why we are in the shit we owe so much I'd be surprised if we have any growth for the next few years.

Anyway saw Hoggy in Aldi earlier and they had plenty of tomatoes.😁
 
poolseasider said:
No tomatoes in Tesco Extra on Friday afternoon but they'd barely any eggs either which ain't imported.
The company are bunch of gets always trying to squeeze suppliers for profit it wasn't that long ago they'd fell out with Heinz and you couldn't get their Ketchup or soups which is insane.

Tesco at fault here fuck all to do with Brexit but that doesn't suit the o/p's one trick agenda.
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I wasn’t attacking Brexit, I was just pointing out that there has finally been some constructive discussion about trying to sort out some of the outstanding issues with input from all sides including business.
Maybe it will help.
 
I know someone who is a Ditchley participant (not at this meeting); everything they say is usually locked down and doesn't get shared.

Now, the question I want answering is who has shared it and why have they done it.

The people involved in this have done very deliberately; why?

Loads to speculate on and it's more interesting than Tesco tomatoes.

I'm not sure who had most to gain from it getting into the public.

Are they softening us up ready to try and do something within the EU?

Are they trying to tell the EU we are more united and are ready to do some proper 'grown up' negotiating?

Is it to do with helping Labour get to grips with it ready for when they form the next government and have to work with it?

Is it to light the blue touch paper in the Conservative Party to pour more fuel on to the self-created internal fire fight.

There are loads more questions but sharing that this meeting took place with the Guardian/Observer is a very specific tactic.
 
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TSSeasider said:
I know someone who is a Ditchley participant (not at this meeting); everything they say is usually locked down and doesn't get shared.

Now, the question I want answering is who has shared it and why have they done it.

The people involved in this have done very deliberately; why?

Loads to speculate on and it's more interesting than Tesco tomatoes.

I'm not sure who had most to gain from it getting into the public.

Are they softening us up ready to try and do something within the EU?

Are they trying to tell the EU we are more united and are ready to do some proper 'grown up' negotiating?

Is it to do with helping Labour get to grips with it ready for when they form the next government and have to work with it?

Is it to light the blue touch paper in the Conservative Party to pour more fuel on to the self-created internal fire fight.

There are loads more questions but sharing that this meeting took place with the Guardian/Observer is a very specific tactic.
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Have the talks been running for very long do you know TS?

My thoughts are that they now know the EU are probably only going to take any negotiations seriously if both the main parties are singing from the same.song sheet as that way any settlement is likely to be long-term?

Why leak it? One of your reasons given will probably be right!
 
Wizaard said:
Are you familiar with the phrase, elephant in the room? You have never seen any problem associated with Brexit, although at the same time, you've never been able to give one tangible benefit.

Nothing can be attributed to Brexit, despite the overwhelming evidence. Its almost like those who voted for it can't admit it to themselves that they dropped a bollock.
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I don’t blame the brexiteers though, that’s what happens when you have a campaign based on fear and demonstrable lies and a toxic public debate. Everybody feels personally attached to their side of the story and it just perpetuates division and confusion.

The truth is whether you thought Brexit could work out well or not, it’s been completely ballsed up by successive conservative governments due to it coming at an inconvenient time for them politically. They’ve been more concerned with remaining in power than actually creating a legacy.

I was in favour of remain but I naively thought if we did vote to leave we would end up with some sort of a sensible compromise. Instead we got fuck all for years. In the end our government couldn’t even leave, we essentially got kicked out.

If only we could all unite in the knowledge that we’ve all been squarely fucked over through this entire debacle whether you voted in, out or shake it all about. The remainers could focus their energies on advocating a brexit path that actually works. The leavers could stand up and hold those who sold them down the river to account.

But, in the end, we’d all rather hang on to our pride than fight for the common good. Brexit has solidified that fact.
 
Alf said:
I don’t blame the brexiteers though, that’s what happens when you have a campaign based on fear and demonstrable lies and a toxic public debate. Everybody feels personally attached to their side of the story and it just perpetuates division and confusion.

The truth is whether you thought Brexit could work out well or not, it’s been completely ballsed up by successive conservative governments due to it coming at an inconvenient time for them politically. They’ve been more concerned with remaining in power than actually creating a legacy.

I was in favour of remain but I naively thought if we did vote to leave we would end up with some sort of a sensible compromise. Instead we got fuck all for years. In the end our government couldn’t even leave, we essentially got kicked out.

If only we could all unite in the knowledge that we’ve all been squarely fucked over through this entire debacle whether you voted in, out or shake it all about. The remainers could focus their energies on advocating a brexit path that actually works. The leavers could stand up and hold those who sold them down the river to account.

But, in the end, we’d all rather hang on to our pride than fight for the common good. Brexit has solidified that fact.
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Why should it fall to the remainers to sort it? It really is a self inflicted balls up and those who wanted it need to resolve it. I'm talking those who are now in Government with the power to do something about it.
 
glasshalffull said:
Have the talks been running for very long do you know TS?

My thoughts are that they now know the EU are probably only going to take any negotiations seriously if both the main parties are singing from the same.song sheet as that way any settlement is likely to be long-term?

Why leak it? One of your reasons given will probably be right!
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I've no idea.

The guy I know (I'm the Chair of the organisation he is CEO) has been involved in some interesting discussions but, as it's pretty much behind closed doors, he doesn't go into loads of details. He's shared some of the people who attended with him and it's a diverse group.

My favourite story he shared was having a conversation with a vicar.

"where's your parish?" he asks
"Oh I'm the Queen's personal chaplain"

absolutely hilarious!

Ditchley and places like it are the centres of hidden power; and are where the big ideas can be discussed without being attributed - which generally allows for better discussions. I think leaking this will cause quite a bit of consternation in those circles.

But the fact that they are taking place is really good and gives me hope that we can have a bit of consensus for the good of the country.
 
BigHandsOliverKahn said:
I was in a Tesco Extra yesterday and it had no tomatoes whosoever. A staff member explained they used to get them from Spain before Brexit but now try to get them from Egypt but hit issues from there.

It's the UK's biggest supermarket and has no tomatoes!

View attachment 14457

Just one small story but it is replicated billions of times across the country and means people spend less and the economy suffers. That's why we are damaging ourselves. It needs sorting out. It cannot continue.
Click to expand...
Well I had no issue and never have getting them at our Local Tesco…and yes they come from Spain,Morocco,Holland,Egypt and even yes the Uk( which I buy in preference) …and our nearby,Lidl,Waitrose ,Aldi and Morrisons too…and best of all our local greengrocer.
Stop clutching at Straws remoaners…oh and I voted ( a marginal decision) to stay but the majority didn’t and let’s get on with the reality of that.
 
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fcblackpool said:
The eggs are down to the bird flu outbreak and they've had plenty when I've been in but expensive.
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No it's not. Feed and energy has gone up, production costs have gone up, price paid to farmers by Supermarkets has not even vaguely kept up, despite them ramping selling price. So they are reducing production to limit losses. Plenty of stuff in the press about this a month ago, including a breakdown of figures.
 
Tangerinemoss said:
No it's not. Feed and energy has gone up, production costs have gone up, price paid to farmers by Supermarkets has not even vaguely kept up, despite them ramping selling price. So they are reducing production to limit losses. Plenty of stuff in the press about this a month ago, including a breakdown of figures.
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OK. Probable a number of reasons. Bird flu saw a decline in the number of chickens/farm birds. We saw this pre Christmas with the numbers of Turkey's. I think 140m globally culled. That obviously leads to a shortage in the number of eggs and a delay to new production/supply. Also the increase in price is basic supply and demand.
 
Wizaard said:
Why should it fall to the remainers to sort it? It really is a self inflicted balls up and those who wanted it need to resolve it. I'm talking those who are now in Government with the power to do something about it.
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The job of sorting it is with the government of the day, plain and simple. If that’s a government that voted remain, I’d hope they endeavor to solve the problem rather than using ‘well they started it’ as a justification for failure.

The job of ensuring general political discourse is respectful, constructive, and conducive to the public good is however shared by everybody. I just do not see any value in continuing to point fingers and say I told you so all these years later, but I stand to be corrected if anybody can come up with a reason.

Long before I could walk and talk I gather there were several moments of general unity amongst the British people. It seems it was often during such times that a lot of shit got done and the national mood improved. All of the most effective political revolutions came from mobilisation, rather than division, of the people. And my word the UK needs political change ASAP.
 
Alf said:
The job of sorting it is with the government of the day, plain and simple. If that’s a government that voted remain, I’d hope they endeavor to solve the problem rather than using ‘well they started it’ as a justification for failure.

The job of ensuring general political discourse is respectful, constructive, and conducive to the public good is however shared by everybody. I just do not see any value in continuing to point fingers and say I told you so all these years later, but I stand to be corrected if anybody can come up with a reason.

Long before I could walk and talk I gather there were several moments of general unity amongst the British people. It seems it was often during such times that a lot of shit got done and the national mood improved. All of the most effective political revolutions came from mobilisation, rather than division, of the people. And my word the UK needs political change ASAP.
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This Government is made up of Brexiteers who talk of establishment Remainers blocking them.

This is the Government FFS, peddling conspiracist nonsense to avoid justifying their abject failure to deliver on their promises.
 
Wizaard said:
This Government is made up of Brexiteers who talk of establishment Remainers blocking them.

This is the Government FFS, peddling conspiracist nonsense to avoid justifying their abject failure to deliver on their promises.
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I’m not disagreeing with you on that. I was responding only to your comment about Brexit voters not being able to admit they were wrong. Just bothers me that during the campaign people said ‘you don’t know what Brexit you are even voting for’ and after the campaign started saying ‘well you voted for this chaos’ - it’s contradictory. Nobody voted for this shower of shit.
 
Wizaard said:
Are you familiar with the phrase, elephant in the room? You have never seen any problem associated with Brexit, although at the same time, you've never been able to give one tangible benefit.

Nothing can be attributed to Brexit, despite the overwhelming evidence. It’s almost like those who voted for it can't admit it to themselves that they dropped a bollock.
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And likewise you’re totally obsessed with Brexit and blame everything on it. I’ve stated the reasons I voted for Brexit numerous times and I’d vote the same way if there were another referendum tomorrow.
And yes I’m aware of that phrase you pompous git
 
Alf said:
I don’t blame the brexiteers though, that’s what happens when you have a campaign based on fear and demonstrable lies and a toxic public debate. Everybody feels personally attached to their side of the story and it just perpetuates division and confusion.

The truth is whether you thought Brexit could work out well or not, it’s been completely ballsed up by successive conservative governments due to it coming at an inconvenient time for them politically. They’ve been more concerned with remaining in power than actually creating a legacy.

I was in favour of remain but I naively thought if we did vote to leave we would end up with some sort of a sensible compromise. Instead we got fuck all for years. In the end our government couldn’t even leave, we essentially got kicked out.

If only we could all unite in the knowledge that we’ve all been squarely fucked over through this entire debacle whether you voted in, out or shake it all about. The remainers could focus their energies on advocating a brexit path that actually works. The leavers could stand up and hold those who sold them down the river to account.

But, in the end, we’d all rather hang on to our pride than fight for the common good. Brexit has solidified that fact.
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Excellent post.

Wizaard said:
Why should it fall to the remainers to sort it? It really is a self inflicted balls up and those who wanted it need to resolve it.
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Simply because everyone needs to put on their big boy trousers if we are going to find a better way forward....
 
Brexit cannot and will never work. Yes I voted remain but when Brexit was voted for I am pragmatic enough to say let’s get on with it and see what happens…..and it is failing for many reasons but these are the main three….

One

Any trade agreement has to have standards of product and the EU are much bigger than us and they set the standards. These standards form part of every trade agreement the EU has and you cannot import to them without agreeing them.

We used to be part of this decision making process, but now we are not and some politicians will never agree to the EU setting the standards - Mogg etc.


Two

My wife and I voted yesterday (a full majority in our household) that Simon Sadler should give me a million pound.

However, he wasn’t up for giving me a million pound as he said it was detrimental to his family.

I asked him to give it a chance as that’s only fair, but he couldn’t work out why I thought he should do something massively detrimental to him for no reason.

He decided to keep his money, I did stamp my feet a bit and threaten to not renew my season ticket - but he still wanted to protect his family and not give in to my petulance for his detriment.

How dare he!!!!

Three

Irish border - whatever trick they come up with to solve the problem will still have the same problem - NI will be treated different to the UK and many do not want that.

I genuinely think nobody thought this through at the time!!!!

So my question is ‘What does Brexit failure look like?’ - for me it’s here with the current situation.

But what does it look like for you????

….and then what!
 
Brexit is not working (and cannot work in its current form) and that is beginning to dawn on the rational amongst the political class. I think the effects of this Brexit are actually worse than predicted.
In the medium term we will have to re-join a European trading area of some sort, however we need to get on with this as the damage caused by Brexit gets worse every day. Hopefully we will act while the situation is somewhat retrievable in sectors like science and banking.
 
Achtung ! Achtung! German labour shortage of 1.74 million vacancies despite freedom of movement. So Remoaners how has that happened....?😜
 
Trammo said:
Achtung ! Achtung! German labour shortage of 1.74 million vacancies despite freedom of movement. So Remoaners how has that happened....?😜
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Maybe 1.74 million Germans in their 50s and 60s have taken early retirement and moved to Portugal, Spain, France, Italy or Greece. Who could blame them, we used to be able to do the same, we can definitely blame the loss of that freedom on Brexit.
Of course if you are a millionaire Brexiteer like Andrew Neill or Jim Ratcliffe you can still do it but for most of us that opportunity has now gone.
 
BigHandsOliverKahn said:
I was in a Tesco Extra yesterday and it had no tomatoes whosoever. A staff member explained they used to get them from Spain before Brexit but now try to get them from Egypt but hit issues from there.

It's the UK's biggest supermarket and has no tomatoes!

View attachment 14457

Just one small story but it is replicated billions of times across the country and means people spend less and the economy suffers. That's why we are damaging ourselves. It needs sorting out. It cannot continue.
Click to expand...

My girlfriend tried to buy something from our local Tesco's last night and was told Brexit was a major problem for them affecting their supply chains. Tesco have started putting expected delivery dates next to item descriptions in this store as the supply is unreliable. Peppers were mentioned as an example of food that they cannot get atm which was freely available before.
 
ElBurroSinNombre said:
My girlfriend tried to buy something from our local Tesco's last night and was told Brexit was a major problem for them affecting their supply chains. Tesco have started putting expected delivery dates next to item descriptions in this store as the supply is unreliable. Peppers were mentioned as an example of food that they cannot get atm which was freely available before.
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Yes, zero peppers on the same day last week for me too. It's odd having lived in a country that used to tick along quite smoothly to see these problems.
 
BigHandsOliverKahn said:
Yes, zero peppers on the same day last week for me too. It's odd having lived in a country that used to tick along quite smoothly to see these problems.
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Think of the contribution to the reduction in CO2 by getting back to home grown, seasonal goods.

Massive upside to reducing the amount of 'exotic' food imports.
 
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