Taking the knee...

basilrobbie said:
Saying it's been "hijacked" is just an opinion, isn't it? It's certainly not a provable fact.

I think it is noticeable that the posters pushing back against this anti-BLM agenda include three of us who live in London, Manchester and near Leeds. I've said this before, but if you've never lived in a major city you don't really understand what multiculturalism is. Perhaps that explains why so many people seem to feel so threatened by it. And that includes feeling threatened by the notion that people who don't look like you, or lives their lives just like you, might just be entitled to some of the basic rights that you take for granted.
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I’ve stayed off here of late but this post is just too ridiculous to ignore. You are the most pompous silly old man on this board. The ignorance and self pontificating shite you have spouted here is breathtaking. Remind me again where the booing happened this weekend ? It’s ok I’ll remind you, Millwall, West ham and Colchester united. I assume these fans have no idea about multiculturalism then ?
your urgency to tell everyone your cleverer than everyone else as you live in the smoke is utterly pathetic and condescending. But of course the poor people of ickle Ickle Blackpool are afraid and have no idea what goes on the big cities around the country, we’re so ignorant and thick. Absolute 🛎 end.
 
Johnno said:
The organisation that is promoting ‘taking the knee’ (the one supported by footballers) is Black Lives Matter UK.
The one that the Spectator references were using a similar name until recently, as well as @ukblm and #ukblm.

From the peaceful groups web page -

“Disclaimer: We are NEITHER associated or affiliated with @ukblm, recently registered (Sep 2020) with FCA under the name 'Black Liberation Movement UK' nor are will affiliated to BLM USA and or any other political group, party here in the UK or abroad.”

Confusing, but only because the extreme group wants it so.

More publicity about the difference should be given, imo.
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Guardian: ''Activists from the Black Lives Matter UK campaign group have placed their organisation on an official footing, marking it with a change of name. The group, which received £1.2m in donations following widespread protests in June, has registered as a community benefit society under the name Black Liberation Movement UK.

The registration of the group, hitherto a loose collection of activists, was required before it could receive the donations, which had been collected via a GoFundMe appeal. The society was registered on 14 September by Adam Elliott Cooper, an academic, Alexandra Wanjiku Kelbert, a PhD student, and Lisa Robinson, a director of a Nottingham-based social enterprise. All have been involved with the UK group since it was established in 2016.

Elliott Cooper confirmed to the Guardian that Black Liberation Movement UK was the group’s new official name, but said it would continue to organise under the name Black Lives Matter and in collaboration with the wider BLM movement....''

The website of the organisation Johno referred to is particularly opaque in that it is not possible to tell who the people are who are resonsible for it. There are no 'People' or 'About Us' ,links.

Confused? I am.

BLM UK gains legal status and renames as Black Liberation Movement UK | Black Lives Matter movement | The Guardian
 
Recidivist3 said:
Loving the fact that QPR players, who stopped taking the knee back in September, have decided to take the knee against Millwall tomorrow

a big fuck you to Millwall’s boo boys if ever there was one
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Explains a lot this post.

Perhaps it's more about " a big feck you to Millwall's boo boys" than any protest against perceived discrimination ?
 
Johnno said:
The organisation that is promoting ‘taking the knee’ (the one supported by footballers) is Black Lives Matter UK.
The one that the Spectator references were using a similar name until recently, as well as @ukblm and #ukblm.
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This is the website for the group I presume you are referring to: https://blacklivesmatter.uk/

It's very hard to tell who is who, or indeed if they are as different as they claim.

The Spectator seems to link to BLM UK, @/#UKBLM seems to have arrived in September, and I've no idea what "registered with the FCA"means, but the Spectator article is from June, and references posts as far back as 2016, my suspicion is that the group linked are indeed one and the same as the one in the Spectator.

The website is of course completely new, no doubt funded out of donations to BLM, I think they're just keen to hide their Marxist, anti-capitalist origins.
 
Scaramanga said:
I’ve stayed off here of late but this post is just too ridiculous to ignore. You are the most pompous silly old man on this board. The ignorance and self pontificating shite you have spouted here is breathtaking. Remind me again where the booing happened this weekend ? It’s ok I’ll remind you, Millwall, West ham and Colchester united. I assume these fans have no idea about multiculturalism then ?
your urgency to tell everyone your cleverer than everyone else as you live in the smoke is utterly pathetic and condescending. But of course the poor people of ickle Ickle Blackpool are afraid and have no idea what goes on the big cities around the country, we’re so ignorant and thick. Absolute 🛎 end.
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"It’s the suggestion of personal failings on either side of the debate and the way that extreme ideas are put into others' mouths in an unprovoked way and without supporting evidence, that can lead to ill-tempered exchanges." And still the show goes on.
 
basilrobbie said:
Saying it's been "hijacked" is just an opinion, isn't it? It's certainly not a provable fact.

I think it is noticeable that the posters pushing back against this anti-BLM agenda include three of us who live in London, Manchester and near Leeds. I've said this before, but if you've never lived in a major city you don't really understand what multiculturalism is. Perhaps that explains why so many people seem to feel so threatened by it. And that includes feeling threatened by the notion that people who don't look like you, or lives their lives just like you, might just be entitled to some of the basic rights that you take for granted.
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Interesting that two teams from large multicultural cities take the knee in the league, but can't be bothered in Europe. Just for the record, Man U twice and Liverpool once. Any ideas why that might be ?
 
Mexboroseasider said:
Well that’s nice.

I hope they flick two fingers at the so called supporters booing them as well.

Cuts both ways lads - this free speech malarkey.
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"Communities and their football teams are inextricably linked"...

Just saying and it was pointed out on here many years ago.
 
Tangerinemoss said:
I think we need to be really careful before we label people, who disagree with the Political organisation BLM, as racist. I suspect the majority on here were very happy with Kick it Out, and embrace the concept the Black lives matter as much as any other human but have concerns over the political direction and anti white and anti semitic message of BLM's UK leaders. We should not be labelled racist.

Players should be free to stand or kneel as their conscience requires, but must not feel pressured to do one or the other. Other should be free to accept or protest their actions, that is the democratic way. To see the FA's representative offering to help with CCTV to identify those who boo so that THEY CAN BE CHARGED is chilling. Tolerance for different political opinions is the bedrock of where we as a society have come from and, unless Parliament makes a law outlawing opposition to BLM, alternate views and questioning should be accepted. We must never again allow any group free rein to do what it likes because of their ethnic background. Totalitarianism is wrong, from wherever it comes.
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Marvellous post Mossy 👏
 
ElBurroSinNombre said:
I'm not sure what you mean. There have been thousands attending BLM demos and the vast majority of them, I am pretty sure, do not want to overthrow capitalism. They just oppose racism, covert or overt as any decent person should. It's actually ludicrous to suggest that PL footballer millionaires, with the lifestyle and all the trappings, would support a movement that is trying to overthow capitalism. This issue is difficult to face for society and individuals as it means that we have to examine our own attitudes and actions. We are all prone to bias, it is a part of the human condition. But with racism, I don't think that there is a third way as you would like. You either oppose it or condone it (tacitly or vocally, it doesn't really make much difference). And that is what all this is about.

The attempt to conflate taking the knee with a sinister political movement is clarly a smear.
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Not a political movement yet they have made an application to become a UK political party.
 
Sadly it far too easy for just to brand someone as racist. It's highly insulting and all but impossible to argue your point. We even have the vicar of Dibley taking the knee on Christmas Day FFS.
It'll be very interesting to see what happens when we're back. Maybe I'll just turn my back so my views don't hurt anyone's feelings.

Edit - good to see some common sense prevailing. https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/55223935
 
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What bothers me about this row isn't the merits of the various arguments, most posters from both sides have made well-reasoned points along with one or two right whoppers, but the idea that you should boo your own players is taking things too far. I'm sorry but that is where I draw the line. By all means use message boards, social media, fanzines, local or national media, talk about it to anyone who will listen and bring it up with the club at a fans forum but to boo our own players on match day, that is beyond the pale.

You can cry freedom of speech all you want to but when we are allowed back anyone who boos my team needs to accept that they will be on the receiving end of some vehement free speech that might not be to their taste.
 
Halifax71 said:
Sadly it far too easy for just to brand someone as racist. It's highly insulting and all but impossible to argue your point. We even have the vicar of Dibley taking the knee on Christmas Day FFS.
It'll be very interesting to see what happens when we're back. Maybe I'll just turn my back so my views don't hurt anyone's feelings.

Edit - good to see some common sense prevailing. https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/55223935
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It's not common sense, it's cowtowing to the racist scum
 
And if they still boo the show of solidarity with anti-racism, will people still defend the actions from Saturday? I'm thinking they will. As above, racist scum covers it.
 
There was an interesting point of view on the Jeremy Vine show yesterday, whether you agree or not it was valid in my book.

Briefly, someone pointed out that during the first lockdown we all stood at our doors and clapped those at the frontline of the NHS, to show our appreciation of them. No one was forced to do this and some didn't, but were not decried.

After a period of time, the clapping stopped, but it did not mean that those who had partaken had suddenly stopped appreciating the NHS staff.

Likewise, taking the knee was done to show our solidarity against racism, if it were to stop it would not mean that the fight against racism had gone away.

It appears now to have run its course and is starting to cause division, which is not the intention of the act. His argument was that racism should be fought every day and the best way to do it is with education, not with an act that has run its course.
 
Curryman said:
There was an interesting point of view on the Jeremy Vine show yesterday, whether you agree or not it was valid in my book.

Briefly, someone pointed out that during the first lockdown we all stood at our doors and clapped those at the frontline of the NHS, to show our appreciation of them. No one was forced to do this and some didn't, but were not decried.

After a period of time, the clapping stopped, but it did not mean that those who had partaken had suddenly stopped appreciating the NHS staff.

Likewise, taking the knee was done to show our solidarity against racism, if it were to stop it would not mean that the fight against racism had gone away.

It appears now to have run its course and is starting to cause division, which is not the intention of the act. His argument was that racism should be fought every day and the best way to do it is with education, not with an act that has run its course.
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Well reasoned and thoughtful post. I don't fully accept that it had run its course. Many black players continue to find succor in their expression of self-worth through taking the knee. I am happy to continue recognising that. However, your point is understood.
 
two things about this thread , it has enlightened me to how much of a pompous buffoon basil Robbie actually is and it would also appear that if someone has a different point of view, they are scum😦
 
Curryman said:
There was an interesting point of view on the Jeremy Vine show yesterday, whether you agree or not it was valid in my book.

Briefly, someone pointed out that during the first lockdown we all stood at our doors and clapped those at the frontline of the NHS, to show our appreciation of them. No one was forced to do this and some didn't, but were not decried.

After a period of time, the clapping stopped, but it did not mean that those who had partaken had suddenly stopped appreciating the NHS staff.

Likewise, taking the knee was done to show our solidarity against racism, if it were to stop it would not mean that the fight against racism had gone away.

It appears now to have run its course and is starting to cause division, which is not the intention of the act. His argument was that racism should be fought every day and the best way to do it is with education, not with an act that has run its course.
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And the flip side is that, because of the booing, it’s likely that the whole thing will continue for far longer than it might otherwise; as an act of defiance. And the kneelers will point to the booing and say “well clearly football still has a problem with race; listen to the booing”.

If the critics took a chill pill, instead having a tantrum, the whole thing would probably just die a death. Just like applauding the NHS did.
 
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