Backpass Henderson

Mr_Brightside said:
Kind of miss this thread from the old board, so to kick off, who was the worst back passer at BFC. I'll kick off with Barry Ferguson.
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I have to disagree, I think he was an expert backpasser. I acknowledge he did a fair job, was not a bad manager under the circumstances, but it used to annoy the heck out of me when he was lauded for his passing completion rate, when he unloaded the ball to anyone, even if it put them under more pressure than he was.
 
Nobody at the Mighty could ever, and I mean ...ever, be as overrated as Backpass Henderson, both at Club and especially International level.

( Waiting for the: ' Liverpool Captain who has picked up 3 trophies, blah, blah, blah 😔)
 
All I can say is that I think Jurgen Klopp is a better judge of a footballer than all those who named Henderson 'backpass'.
 
There is gonna be a lot of irate fans if Critchley instills a system with the players knocking the ball around waiting for an opportunity to arise to punish the opposition.
Give it 3 or 4 games and the usual suspects will be wanting a more direct approach.

Wonderful.
 
Just been on BBC Breakfast - decent lad in a world where heads can easily be turned. The next England Captain to lift a trophy?
 
Bend it like Suddick said:
Nobody at the Mighty could ever, and I mean ...ever, be as overrated as Backpass Henderson, both at Club and especially International level.

( Waiting for the: ' Liverpool Captain who has picked up 3 trophies, blah, blah, blah 😔)
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47 career assists and 31 goals suggest you probably don’t know what you’re talking about.
I don’t like Liverpool and I don’t rate Henderson particularly but he’s not what you make him out to be.
 
BlackpoolPuma said:
47 career assists and 31 goals suggest you probably don’t know what you’re talking about.
I don’t like Liverpool and I don’t rate Henderson particularly but he’s not what you make him out to be.
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Yep - 27 PL goals in 11 seasons in a side that usually scores for fun............I think I do have an idea about football.

47 assists in 14 seasons.....you're having a laugh. DeBruyne who some people are comparing him against has 39 goals in 6 PL seasons and just reached the 100 assist milestone! He also is more creative and tends to pass forward.
 
Barry Ferguson was quality for us and to just label him back pass is ridiculous.

Also check out I think it was Cardiff away he played a superb 40/50 yard forward through ball for Dicko who should have bagged.

Keith Southern wasn’t particularly great at forward through balls but never gets half the criticism Ferguson gets for being “back pass Barry”. Load of bullshit.

As for Jordan Henderson, he’s crap and wouldn’t be in England’s first 11 if it was up to me but sadly it isn’t. Never known a Liverpool captain lose possession as much as him.
 
Bend it like Suddick said:
Yep - 27 PL goals in 11 seasons in a side that usually scores for fun............I think I do have an idea about football.

47 assists in 14 seasons.....you're having a laugh. DeBruyne who some people are comparing him against has 39 goals in 6 PL seasons and just reached the 100 assist milestone! He also is more creative and tends to pass forward.
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They don't even play in the same position. So for someone that has an "idea" about football, it's not that good of an idea.

Steve Banks never scored as much as he should have for us either.
 
I remember him making an infuriating back pass against Slovakia at the Euros in 2016, last minute of injury time and England are pushing up as its 0 - 0 and Slovakia had put 10 men behind the ball all game, he has the ball on the halfway line and turns around and passed it back and the ref blew for full time. Couldn't believe it.

I don't watch the Prem often so I'm certainly no expert, but I hold him in the opinion that whilst he isn't anywhere near the individual ability of say Gerrard or Lampard he is clearly the type of player that functions extremely well within a unit, surely that is proven by the fact Klopp not only plays him but captained him in the most successful Liverpool side since the 80s.
 
SeasideKurt said:
They don't even play in the same position. So for someone that has an "idea" about football, it's not that good of an idea.

Steve Banks never scored as much as he should have for us either.
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Kurt - you need glasses more than I do. If you read the post precisely, I actually say 'some people' in relation to De Bruyne. My factual opinion about Backpass remains. Stevie Wonder in that Liverpool side would score more than Henderson, and more than likely have more assists.

Henderson lovers, do tend to fall back on the old adage ' he's a holding midfielder' regularly. Again, a poor defence (excuse the pun), for his lack of creativity, goals and assists ( not to mention his heading and tackling)
 
Bend it like Suddick said:
Kurt - you need glasses more than I do. If you read the post precisely, I actually say 'some people' in relation to De Bruyne. My factual opinion about Backpass remains. Stevie Wonder in that Liverpool side would score more than Henderson, and more than likely have more assists.

Henderson lovers, do tend to fall back on the old adage ' he's a holding midfielder' regularly. Again, a poor defence (excuse the pun), for his lack of creativity, goals and assists ( not to mention his heading and tackling)
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He's one of the best midfielders in the world according to all of the top coaches in the game. All of the top players. You just don't have a single clue what you're talking about.
 
SeasideKurt said:
He's one of the best midfielders in the world according to all of the top coaches in the game. All of the top players. You just don't have a single clue what you're talking about.
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I think you will find that the coaches 'admiration' stems from his Captaincy skills, not his football ones, which I have to agree with. As for who 'hasn't a clue', ummmm, I think its pretty obvious its not me.
 
Bend it like Suddick said:
I think you will find that the coaches 'admiration' stems from his Captaincy skills, not his football ones, which I have to agree with. As for who 'hasn't a clue', ummmm, I think its pretty obvious its not me.
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How can it not be you? You've been consistently wrong on this for years.
 
SeasideKurt said:
How can it not be you? You've been consistently wrong on this for years.
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Kurt, we all have opinions. I disagree with yours and vice versa. However I also quote facts and statistics which are irrefutable, so to say Im wrong is plainly not true.

I have 'over the years' maintained he's a good Captain ( which is obviously why Klopp keeps faith with him), but an International quality footballer...no. He's regularly gone missing in games against top sides, both domestically and abroad, and that's not me saying that, there are plenty of reports generated over the years.

He had a good season last year, I have to admit that...but again..one swallow does not make a Summer.
 
Bend it like Suddick said:
Yep - 27 PL goals in 11 seasons in a side that usually scores for fun............I think I do have an idea about football.

47 assists in 14 seasons.....you're having a laugh. DeBruyne who some people are comparing him against has 39 goals in 6 PL seasons and just reached the 100 assist milestone! He also is more creative and tends to pass forward.
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You can’t compare him to De Bruyne - the best midfielder in world football. Nobody gets anywhere near him. Just because Liverpool score loads, it doesn’t mean a deep lying central midfielder will help themselves to a ton of goals.
Liverpool were also bang average for a good 4/5 of those seasons. You also don’t rate Sterling either do you ???
The numbers suggest you might be a bit wrong on that too.
 
You also don’t rate Sterling either do you ???


Initially, no, I didn't. But I did change my mind quite a time ago. ( As per many posts)

Liverpool were 'bang average'. I really wonder how some people arrive at opinions? They were regularly in the top 4 or second. Hardly average. I didn't compare him to De Bruyne, other posters did. I just provided the stats.

I happen to agree about a deep lying central defender, not scoring as many, but his stats are appalling in that side. Also Klopp has encouraged him to play in a more attacking role, and still nothing changes.
 
Bend it like Suddick said:
You also don’t rate Sterling either do you ???


Initially, no, I didn't. But I did change my mind quite a time ago. ( As per many posts)

Liverpool were 'bang average'. I really wonder how some people arrive at opinions? They were regularly in the top 4 or second. Hardly average. I didn't compare him to De Bruyne, other posters did. I just provided the stats.

I happen to agree about a deep lying central defender, not scoring as many, but his stats are appalling in that side. Also Klopp has encouraged him to play in a more attacking role, and still nothing changes.
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Until Klopp took over they had one season under Rodgers when they looked like title material.
He has won everything worth anything at club level. Not every player has to be an absolute superstar. You simply can’t improve on Liverpool winning the title and winning the Champions League and in the process, lording it over a City side which is one of the best we’ve ever seen. Jordan Henderson undoubtedly weakens that Liverpool side if he’s not in it.
 
The great AVFTT Henderson debate, we've certainly been here before.

Like many debates on here, I think the "answer" - if that is the correct word - probably lies somewhere between Bendit and Kurt.

Perhaps Henderson doesn't get the credit he deserves for his consistency of performance and his leadership contribution during a great speel for his club side but let's not be kidding ourselves that he's going to trouble the Ballon d'Or judges.

As I say, we've been here before Bendit but personally I don't think you give Henderson enough credit for his contribution at Liverpool.

I know Klopp is never going to talk to us about any possible on field limitations of his captain but love him or loathe him - Klopp - he has been outstandingly successful at Liverpool and he clearly acknowledges the role that Henderson has played both on and off the pitch and I am not sure that Liverpool could have been so successful carrying passengers.

I wouldn't begin to compare his on field contributions with the likes of De Bruyne but overall I'd be closer to Kurt on this one than your goodself.
 
Bend it like Suddick said:
Kurt, we all have opinions. I disagree with yours and vice versa. However I also quote facts and statistics which are irrefutable, so to say Im wrong is plainly not true.

I have 'over the years' maintained he's a good Captain ( which is obviously why Klopp keeps faith with him), but an International quality footballer...no. He's regularly gone missing in games against top sides, both domestically and abroad, and that's not me saying that, there are plenty of reports generated over the years.

He had a good season last year, I have to admit that...but again..one swallow does not make a Summer.
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Bendit

Apologies as only read this now after spouting my chite above.

You are clearly giving Henderson a bit of credit here for his leadership skills, still probably not enough but perhaps I was overly critical of your apparent lack of appreciation of Henderson's overall contribution to Liverpool's success.
 
Mr_Brightside said:
Kind of miss this thread from the old board, so to kick off, who was the worst back passer at BFC. I'll kick off with Barry Ferguson.
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Cant understand this thing about Barry Ferguson, he was a class footballer, I consider myself privileged to have been able to watch the likes of him & Kevin Phillips, Lua Lua playing in front of me for my team...
 
SEASIDE2020 said:
Bendit

Apologies as only read this now after spouting my chite above.

You are clearly giving Henderson a bit of credit here for his leadership skills, still probably not enough but perhaps I was overly critical of your apparent lack of appreciation of Henderson's overall contribution to Liverpool's success.
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Appreciated that you actually read that particular post and corrected accordingly 👍 thank you

I probably do give him a hard time on this Forum, but I do so because I can remember players of similar ilk who were true stars. I just find with the greed league, posters and experts do tend to get carried away with how good a player is , without deeming them 'great' or a 'legend'.
 
Bend it like Suddick said:
Appreciated that you actually read that particular post and corrected accordingly 👍 thank you

I probably do give him a hard time on this Forum, but I do so because I can remember players of similar ilk who were true stars. I just find with the greed league, posters and experts do tend to get carried away with how good a player is , without deeming them 'great' or a 'legend'.
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Not important but I'm assuming you meant to say posters get carried away re a player and often overrate with the use of "great"/"legend" ?

I would certainly agree with you re the overuse of the term "legend" among the Facebook/FIFA generation and there seems to be a new "legend" every week but I still don't think you give Henderson enough credit.

There is no answer and we would could be going round and round forever, we aren't going to agree but that is certainly not to say that I am right and you are wrong.
 
Crainey often passed it back to his centre backs. He got dogs abuse from a bloke sat next to me every time he did it. I thought Barry was good for Pool. He and Martinez played well together.
 
Bend it like Suddick said:
Rusty, they did have certain shared qualities, but their abilities were very different. Charlie was always more of a footballer, whilst gnashes was a grafter and spoiler.
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What qualities are shared?

Southern was a gritty, tough tackling defensive midfielder. Charlie was the opposite. Attacking, scoring midfielder who couldn't tackle to save his fried Marsbar
 
Whenever someone says backpass the first thing that comes to mind is the Chris Clark backpass/own goal agaist QPR. Wasn't that game on Sky as well? I couldn't believe it when that went in.
 
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What qualities are shared?


Motivation,passion and commitment....hows that for starters?

or, how about drive, team ethic and love of the club?

or, never knowing when to give up.
 
Lewis_Winthorpe said:
I'd say a lot of footballers have those shared qualities though?
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Id have to agree to a point in lower leagues, but feel that loyalty and the qualities I highlighted seem to be replaced in the PL and some of the Championship by the greed of agents, wages and image rights.

Bizarrely, I would have to exempt Henderson from that categorisation, and possibly those qualities are recognised by Klopp.
 
Bend it like Suddick said:
Id have to agree to a point in lower leagues, but feel that loyalty and the qualities I highlighted seem to be replaced in the PL and some of the Championship by the greed of agents, wages and image rights.

Bizarrely, I would have to exempt Henderson from that categorisation, and possibly those qualities are recognised by Klopp.
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Thats fair enough 👍
 
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