Innoculation news

TSSeasider said:
It's there a chance that people may have immunity from catching it?

I'm not sure I've read a definitive answer.

But if 1.5m have tested positive and have immunity, and wet keep inoculating at the same speed, we could get to 70% a little sooner than we expect.
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Good point.
 
Recidivist3 said:
🙄 you might not have lost any sleep, chewing your blanket and worrying about Robbie’s post but to post again 16 hours after your previous post, is just a little disturbing

Never mind tho, I see that Dr Scara is there to give you moral support. Keep up the good work
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I see your obsession with me continues, you and shandy don’t seem to be able to post without mentioning me. Obsessed much.
 
Has anyone actually had their 2nd Jab?
Mine was supposed to be Tuesday of this week.
I got a phone call from the Drs a couple of weeks ago. They said I should call them on 12th March to arrange a 2nd one. 🙄
 
Davepick said:
Has anyone actually had their 2nd Jab?
Mine was supposed to be Tuesday of this week.
I got a phone call from the Drs a couple of weeks ago. They said I should call them on 12th March to arrange a 2nd one. 🙄
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My mum had her second one a week or two back. Sounds like she fell lucky with it.
 
Great news; well done Boris.
I assume all those who have slagged you off repeatedly will no doubt jump at the opportunity to get their vaccination.

Regarding the Boris haters, how much of a break do you think he has had since the onset of Covid?

The bloke deserves a break.
 
Nobody gets everything wrong and if the government get this country back to normal in the quickest time possible then I will be impressed, but this sort of thing is their job, I think they even prepare for pandemics by running through possible scenarios on a fairly regular basis. Makes me wonder if those exercises are a waste of time when you look at how things have panned out.
 
Davepick said:
Has anyone actually had their 2nd Jab?
Mine was supposed to be Tuesday of this week.
I got a phone call from the Drs a couple of weeks ago. They said I should call them on 12th March to arrange a 2nd one. 🙄
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My mates Mum has had her second dose but their was some sort of cut of date a few days after they announced the change in policy by the bloke in charge(not Boris!)in December.
I actually totally agree with the policy my friends in the 70's are quite a few years apart and would be would be worried sick if the younger partner had to wait a long time to be vaccinated.
 
gjr69 said:
Nobody gets everything wrong and if the government get this country back to normal in the quickest time possible then I will be impressed, but this sort of thing is their job, I think they even prepare for pandemics by running through possible scenarios on a fairly regular basis. Makes me wonder if those exercises are a waste of time when you look at how things have panned out.
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Many smaller organisations do not have the resources to carry out thorough continuity planning and may prepare specifically for certain events - imminent retirements, etc - but concentrate on dealing with the here and now.

Some Government departments are resourced to more perform more extensive planning but just play at it so I think you raise a fair point in questioning the usefulness of their planning exercises.
 
PoolBorn said:
The statement is 2.4 million vaccines administered - second doses are a tiny portion. So no misdirection -
but there are always those ready to rubbish good news.
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No one will be happier than me if they hit their target, although the qualification of the target number being people that 'have been offered' the jab strikes me as the usual Boris forked tongue speak.

He's been proven to be shifty at best, a downright liar at worst. Let's see.
 
Going Up the Pool said:
No one will be happier than me if they hit their target, although the qualification of the target number being people that 'have been offered' the jab strikes me as the usual Boris forked tongue speak.

He's been proven to be shifty at best, a downright liar at worst. Let's see.
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Half a million have had 2 jabs. Tiny proportion?
 
There’s a story that GP’s have been told to destroy any left over vaccine’s at the end of the day and not to use them as second jabs.

How accurate this is I don’t know but scandalous if true.
 
PoolBorn said:
440k second jabs out of 3.7million total. Ok, maybe not tiny but in last three days it was 30k out of 800k. You really are determined to look on the negative side aren't you.
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How can you say that? I've done nothing of the sort. If you think half a million is a tiny proportion of nearly four million, I'd say your maths is shit. Nothing more, nothing less.
 
I don't mean to piss on anyone's chips but I'm hoping the decision to delay the second jab doesn't come back to bite us on the arse.
And that decision will obviously inflate the numbers.
It's still a magnificent effort by the NHS and other staff involved in administering it. Hopefully we'll all be done in time for Festival season.
Back to the football.
 
Id expect nothing less than these comments from the usual suspects. I’m assuming their not to bothered about havi the jab themselves.
 
I'm still very concerned about failing to administer the second jab. If you read the British Medical Journal article about it, the decision to do that is based on very shaky logic. It might be that people who had the first jab may stop being protected if they don't have the second as per Pfizer's instructions and how it was tested. The nature of this vaccine is very different to that of the Oxford AstraZeneca one. The Pfizer vaccine efficacy reduces soon after the first jab. No testing was done leaving it longer. Assumptions were made based on frigging data and equating things to the test results of the Oxford AstraZeneca vaccine. However, the nature of that vaccine is that it can stay strong for longer.

There is even some concern that giving part doses is the ideal breeding conditions for the virus to mutate. Britain has been described as a living laboratory due to this decision.
 
BigHandsOliverKahn said:
I'm still very concerned about failing to administer the second jab. If you read the British Medical Journal article about it, the decision to do that is based on very shaky logic. It might be that people who had the first jab may stop being protected if they don't have the second as per Pfizer's instructions and how it was tested. The nature of this vaccine is very different to that of the Oxford AstraZeneca one. The Pfizer vaccine efficacy reduces soon after the first jab. No testing was done leaving it longer. Assumptions were made based on frigging data and equating things to the test results of the Oxford AstraZeneca vaccine. However, the nature of that vaccine can stay strong for longer.

There is even some concern that giving part doses is the ideal breeding conditions for the virus to mutate. Britain has been described as a living laboratory due to this decision.
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Right on cue along comes the most negative anti UK bore
 
Wizaard said:
How can you say that? I've done nothing of the sort. If you think half a million is a tiny proportion of nearly four million, I'd say your maths is shit. Nothing more, nothing less.
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Suggest you read properly..................I said "maybe not tiny"

PS No need to reply as I'm logging off now; better things to do with the rest of my day.
 
Davepick said:
So Boris has done this all on his own?
No one else involved?
Then 'Well done Boris'. 🙄
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If you listen to some on here Dave it's all his fault when it goes tits up.
So on the flip side surely all the plaudits should go his way when it's going well 🤷‍♂️
 
BigHandsOliverKahn said:
I'm still very concerned about failing to administer the second jab. If you read the British Medical Journal article about it, the decision to do that is based on very shaky logic. It might be that people who had the first jab may stop being protected if they don't have the second as per Pfizer's instructions and how it was tested. The nature of this vaccine is very different to that of the Oxford AstraZeneca one. The Pfizer vaccine efficacy reduces soon after the first jab. No testing was done leaving it longer. Assumptions were made based on frigging data and equating things to the test results of the Oxford AstraZeneca vaccine. However, the nature of that vaccine is that it can stay strong for longer.

There is even some concern that giving part doses is the ideal breeding conditions for the virus to mutate. Britain has been described as a living laboratory due to this decision.
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Yes I read the same article, it is a bit disconcerting that Pfizer say they have no evidence that the first jab of their vaccine provides immunity after 21 days.
 
L’étranger said:
I’m sure those that are having the Pfizer vaccine don’t give a fig about the Indian vaccine. Let’s hope the scientists assumptions that the vaccine will be effective after 21 days are proved correct.
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As someone who's just had the Pfizer vaccine the idea is that you carry on as before, so the immunity inbetween shots is irrelevant.
 
BlackpoolWolves said:
Except that's complete rubbish (as you know, I think - unless you only read what you find on certain, dubious internet sites)
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It's not rubbish at all. It is in the British Medical Journal. People need to read up on these articles below and see why there is such concern -

www.bmj.com

Covid-19 vaccination: What’s the evidence for extending the dosing interval?

On 30 December the four UK chief medical officers announced that the second doses of the covid vaccines should be given towards the end of 12 weeks rather than in the previously recommended 3-4 weeks. Gareth Iacobucci and Elisabeth Mahase look at the questions this has raised In a letter sent...
www.bmj.com www.bmj.com
blogs.bmj.com

John P. Moore: How do you take your vaccine—one lump or two? - The BMJ

The gradual rollout of the Pfizer and Moderna mRNA vaccines and the likelihood of additional approvals in the coming months provide hope for bringing the covid-19 pandemic under control in [...]More...
blogs.bmj.com
blogs.bmj.com

Covid-19 vaccines: to delay or not to delay second doses - The BMJ

The importance of successful vaccination strategies in controlling the covid-19 pandemic cannot be overstated and should be vigorously endorsed. Equally critical is that vaccines’ proven to be effective in a [...]More...
blogs.bmj.com

Pfizer are clear, this is a new kind of vaccine that has never been tested in the way the British government is now deciding to administer it. The decision made by the British is based on assumption, not evidence. This new kind of vaccine wears off quickly after the first jab (unlike the OxfordAstraZeneca one). Here is an extract:

" virus neutralising antibody production fall off markedly (suggesting limited survival and stimulation by the vaccine mRNA and its’ encoded Spike immunogen). However, the specific anti-viral immune response was strongly boosted with a 2nd injection of vaccine. [6] This raises concerns that extending a 2nd injection out to beyond 28 days could compromise vaccine efficacy."

This is why Pfizer are adamant that the second jab needs to be between 3 and 4 weeks after the first.

We could end up in a situation where millions of expensive initial vaccine doses end up being rended useless and those people needing to have two more administered (as per the manufacturers instructions and how it was tested).
 
BigHandsOliverKahn said:
It's not rubbish at all. It is in the British Medical Journal. People need to read up on these articles below and see why there is such concern -

www.bmj.com

Covid-19 vaccination: What’s the evidence for extending the dosing interval?

On 30 December the four UK chief medical officers announced that the second doses of the covid vaccines should be given towards the end of 12 weeks rather than in the previously recommended 3-4 weeks. Gareth Iacobucci and Elisabeth Mahase look at the questions this has raised In a letter sent...
www.bmj.com www.bmj.com
blogs.bmj.com

John P. Moore: How do you take your vaccine—one lump or two? - The BMJ

The gradual rollout of the Pfizer and Moderna mRNA vaccines and the likelihood of additional approvals in the coming months provide hope for bringing the covid-19 pandemic under control in [...]More...
blogs.bmj.com
blogs.bmj.com

Covid-19 vaccines: to delay or not to delay second doses - The BMJ

The importance of successful vaccination strategies in controlling the covid-19 pandemic cannot be overstated and should be vigorously endorsed. Equally critical is that vaccines’ proven to be effective in a [...]More...
blogs.bmj.com

Pfizer are clear, this is a new kind of vaccine that has never been tested in the way the British government is now deciding to administer it. The decision made by the British is based on assumption, not evidence. This new kind of vaccine wears off quickly after the first jab (unlike the OxfordAstraZeneca one). Here is an extract:

" virus neutralising antibody production fall off markedly (suggesting limited survival and stimulation by the vaccine mRNA and its’ encoded Spike immunogen). However, the specific anti-viral immune response was strongly boosted with a 2nd injection of vaccine. [6] This raises concerns that extending a 2nd injection out to beyond 28 days could compromise vaccine efficacy."

This is why Pfizer are adamant that the second jab needs to be between 3 and 4 weeks after the first.

We could end up in a situation where millions of expensive initial vaccine doses end up being rended useless and those people needing to have two more administered (as per the manufacturers instructions and how it was tested).
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Or


"Andrew Pollard, the head of the Oxford Vaccine Group and chief investigator into the trial of this vaccine, said that extending the gap between vaccines made biological sense. “Generally, a longer gap between vaccine doses leads to a better immune response, with the second dose causing a better boost. (With HPV vaccine for girls, for example, the gap is a year and gives better responses than a one month gap.) From the Oxford vaccine trials, there is 70% protection after the first dose up to the second dose, and the immune response was about three times greater after the second dose when the second dose was delayed, comparing second dose after four weeks versus second dose after 2-3 months,” he told The BMJ, referring to the MHRA’s summary of product characteristics.

“With the Pfizer vaccine, there are no published data comparing shorter and longer gaps between doses because all participants had the second dose at 3-4 weeks. However, the biology is straightforward and will be the same as with all vaccines . . . The immune system remembers the first dose and will respond whether the later dose is at three weeks or three months.”

In a statement the British Society for Immunology said, “Most immunologists would agree that delaying a second ‘booster’ dose of a protein antigen vaccine (such as the two approved covid-19 vaccines) by eight weeks would be unlikely to have a negative effect on the overall immune response post-boost. We also would not expect any specific safety issues to arise for the individual due to delaying the second dose, other than an increased potential risk of disease during the extended period due to lowered protection.”


There's actually little if any concern that that vaccine won't work with a 12 week delay, the concern is the protection within those 12 weeks and even that is conjecture from GPs.
 
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Fargo99 said:
Finally got my 92 year old ma vaccinated at Poulton yesterday, her first jab. Organisation there was really impressive and well run.
Had to nag the arse off her surgery to get her on a list. Feel a bit sorry for the old folk who have no one to do their badgering.
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Excellent news Fargo
 
Some good news on the vaccine supply front as vaccinators have found they can get 6 (and sometimes 7) vaccinations out of a vial of a nominal 5 vaccinations. Might explain a little why a small number of vaccinations had to be binned in a number of places.

This means that supply should not become the limiting factor in numbers vaccinated daily as early in the programme as previously thought.

Will be interesting to see the number of vaccinations reported later today for yesterday to see if daily numbers are maintained over the weekend. If they can be then the 15m figure by mid-February seems eminently achievable.
 
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