Hertsseasider
Well-known member
Thanks. But you are as much sincere as the table in front of me.
Schools closed - load of bollocks!
- Thread starter Junior_BentsPlatformShoes
- Start date
20togo
Well-known member
Sorry, you think that way.Thanks. But you are as much sincere as the table in front of me.
Hertsseasider
Well-known member
so do I. Never met you though we were introduced in the queue at Exeter one day. Sure we'd enjoy a pint though I'd prefer a pint with Cat. Good night.
20togo
Well-known member
That's one of my bugbears. Why can't people disagree/argue or whatever you want to call it on one thread/issue but not be polite and civil andin agreement on others. I think so many people fall into the former. Like I was saying in my lengthy response to you, you judged me solely on the politics. People form an opinion about a poster on one issue and carry that opinion forward to every other subject.
Yes, I fully recall that day at Exeter and I would really have liked to have talked to you for longer about you know what but it was one of those occasions where everybody was saying hello and I was getting distracted here and there. My fault, I'm sorry.
Last edited:
Hertsseasider
Well-known member
No worries. But you are still not getting the last word. Good night.
20togo
Well-known member
A pint with..... nah best not go there.No worries. But you are still not getting the last word. Good night.
EagleDay
Well-known member
You're fired.................neglect of duty!
Macseasider
Well-known member
Weird you say that because you hound Cats on every post regardless of what it is.
TwelveAngryMen
Well-known member
The French one was from September so not sure of it's relevance to the current predicament be honest
On a more general level the list of key workers is now so long it makes a mockery of what was originally intended - and you only need one parent to qualify and as others have said they could be homeworkers
What this does in practice is make it far more difficult to teach those in class and those who must be taught remotely and yet that buffoon Williamson is advising parents of those being taught remotely to complain if they don't feel they are getting a minimum three - five hours online teaching ( depending on age ) each day https://www.gov.uk/government/speec...-statement-to-parliament-on-national-lockdown
How is a teacher mean't to achieve that balance when the average school still has 40% of their pupils in each day ?
20togo
Well-known member
Not really. He's a single agenda poster. Be it Brexit or Covid, it's all about his criticism of the govt and never in a pleasant manner. Have a look back if you don't believe me. Pretty much all his content is based around the same stuff. So if he doesn't or barely ever posts on other subjects there's nowt to comment or debate is there?
That said, I will give Cat credit. He clearly cares passionately about his beliefs even if I sometimes don't agree with them. It's also how he more often than not expresses them too.
Last edited:
Junior_BentsPlatformShoes
Well-known member
Exactly TAM. His little bit about informing Ofsted if parents aren't happy with online provision smacked of trying to have a dig back at teachers. As a head, I want to know first if parents aren't happy and I'll do something about it. I spent an hour this morning just trying to get a history lesson online for this afternoon, utter waste of valuable time. Not to mention one of the online platforms schools are using crashed yesterday due to the volume of traffic. Meanwhile, the children in school do exactly the same online work as I refuse to have a two tier system.The French one was from September so not sure of it's relevance to the current predicament be honest
On a more general level the list of key workers is now so long it makes a mockery of what was originally intended - and you only need one parent to qualify and as others have said they could be homeworkers
What this does in practice is make it far more difficult to teach those in class and those who must be taught remotely and yet that buffoon Williamson is advising parents of those being taught remotely to complain if they don't feel they are getting a minimum three - five hours online teaching ( depending on age ) each day https://www.gov.uk/government/speec...-statement-to-parliament-on-national-lockdown
How is a teacher mean't to achieve that balance when the average school still has 40% of their pupils in each day ?
The way numbers are increasing for places in school, we may as well be completely open, rather than 40-50%, which completely defeats the object of this supposed lock-down. The usual unplanned, dis-organised mess that's been the theme of the last 10 months.
hertfordseasider
Well-known member
Roads in Cambridge were same as usual this morning, school kids everywhere, this lockdown is a total joke. The last time we had it it was like a ghost town yet the virus is worse this time and the numbers double and rising. It's actually depressing to see, WTF is going on?
TwelveAngryMen
Well-known member
Same up here Herts
You wouldn't know there was a lockdown as traffic levels are pretty much the same during the day ( quieter on the commute to be fair )
Nothing like as quiet as in March - April
You wouldn't know there was a lockdown as traffic levels are pretty much the same during the day ( quieter on the commute to be fair )
Nothing like as quiet as in March - April
BFC_BFC_BFC
Well-known member
I’m struggling to make sense on the legislation front, but it looks to me like they have actually put the whole country into Tier 4 restrictions and then made some fairly limited modifications to those restrictions?
B
basilrobbie
Guest
Interesting, because it IS actually very quiet here, compared with what it has been. Most of us are at home, putting in a moat, and a couple of machine gun towers in case anyone comes for our bog rolls.
Hertsseasider
Well-known member
Its a lot quieter down here I'd say. Mind you the crap weather doesn't help. I think, this time round, more people have shut up shop for the duration
Last edited:
hertfordseasider
Well-known member
I knew you'd have a goodly supply of Bog Rolls, used to be beer but times have changed!!
It is strange isn't it? I guess some areas are going to do things differently, i wish it was quieter here.
TSSeasider
Well-known member
The issue is that there is so much variation in the quality of online provision and where in the country you live.
Up here, loads of people work in critical services; public sector and care therefore of course there's going to be a demand to get those kids in so their parents can work.
Then you've got huge numbers of kids who are vulnerable; loads looked after, loads with a statement, loads on FSM and loads without proper digital access through no device or data.
So we either sacrifice their education or we open the schools.
Then throw into the mix, plenty of schools locally whose online provision is shit. The profession asked to close the schools, but have inadequate online provision. So again we are sacrificing children's education.
I was on the radio this morning with a head teacher from a local primary school who have been giving their pupils iPads and data for seven years (using the equivalent of pupil premium) and guess what, they've just done it with barely a hiccup. Progressive, forward thinking and successful.
It's a mixed bag, but I struggle excusing not being prepared for something you were lobbying and taking industrial action for. That's terrible.
Up here, loads of people work in critical services; public sector and care therefore of course there's going to be a demand to get those kids in so their parents can work.
Then you've got huge numbers of kids who are vulnerable; loads looked after, loads with a statement, loads on FSM and loads without proper digital access through no device or data.
So we either sacrifice their education or we open the schools.
Then throw into the mix, plenty of schools locally whose online provision is shit. The profession asked to close the schools, but have inadequate online provision. So again we are sacrificing children's education.
I was on the radio this morning with a head teacher from a local primary school who have been giving their pupils iPads and data for seven years (using the equivalent of pupil premium) and guess what, they've just done it with barely a hiccup. Progressive, forward thinking and successful.
It's a mixed bag, but I struggle excusing not being prepared for something you were lobbying and taking industrial action for. That's terrible.
TwelveAngryMen
Well-known member
The situation is a product of the Government duplicitous approach which has left the schools up in the air
How do you expect a class teacher to deliver both online learning AND have children to teach in class
It doesn’t compute
TSSeasider
Well-known member
I'll assume 50% fewer kids in the class.
That's a TA keeping an eye on the chat box or the kids in the room and the teacher doing the opposite.
The teacher will have the full slide deck prepared, full lesson plan prepared etc. The days of winging it all long gone as you know.
Stick a webcam, blue tooth microphone and a projector together and you've got a fairly reasonable way to do it.
Personally, I'd send all that home as paper documents as well; certainly for younger children so that they don't get excessive screen time.
You can't give them the same amount of one to one support, but there's no excuse for what happened to TSJr (Y6) last time. One phone call and no work, abandoned because it was teacher assessed SATS. They didn't even try.
There needs to be a minimum standard of quality for online to be feasible and it didn't seem we have that. Schools/Academies have had 9 months to prepare, not all of them appear to have done so, but still requested closing of schools.
I understand the fear teachers will be working under, (even though they appear not to have a higher risk than anybody else) and those most at risk should work from home, but the vast majority of kids who get it are fine; and are having their education compromised on huge ways with lasting damage.
The only way I think we could get around it, would be to make every child stay back a year. It would cause problems at the very young end of the scale but it would ensure the kids have had a full education.
td53
Well-known member
Part of my job is to do with technology in education and your observation that some schools have done it well is true - that's because there's been no overarching strategy at all around how schools should use technology and even know, the DFE guidance is really poor - it just says what you have to do and gives you a few links to Google or Microsoft and that's literally it.
I can also tell you absolutely categorically that Ofsted/government were not that long ago discouraging school from such projects and encouraging them to focus on the traditional aspects of education. Schools that ignored that or were good enough that Ofsted couldn't deny that their tech use was excellent were fine but other schools, like my owns sons, where the head wasn't especially technologically minded were told 'technology is a fad - concentrate on maths and english, use books, handwriting counts etc' - there is some truth to the idea technology was a fad to be fair. I've seen schools buy 30 iPads and then realise they've no wifi afterwards, then just let them gather dust.
I also know that teaching unions lobbied hard for technology to be distributed and for support in learning it to be part of government strategy. For a school to learn a new system (like Microsoft teams for example) is a 2 year project ideally, from beginning to it being entirely embedded. They often lack the admin time or the dedicated IT that a business has and are naturally inflexible with training as timetables rule. It's quite hard working with a school to train or set up. No one is ever available as they're always busy. Schools haven't been funded to get the tech out, nor have they been able to take time to prepare because up until the point of lock down, they have been told in no uncertain terms 'there will not be a lockdown'
I agree that some schools do technology badly and are resistant to it. I am frustrated with my own sons school as I've offered several times to help, for free, to set up systems that are also free as I spend part of my time doing that at work and I know what I'm doing. I've been met with a polite 'we're fine thanks' even though, palpably, they're not. I couldn't find my lad's online work today and that's really poor. Told to log on to a system but no link to the system anywhere. Basic stuff not implemented right and confusing As I say though, they just haven't had the support, and prior to this, anything but encouragement in recent years. (use of technology in teaching has dropped out of the ofsted lesson observation framework in recent years irc - certainly down the framework anyway - I think post gove it's on it's way back, not sure) - I also know for a fact that in post 16 education colleges were being actively threatened with defunding if they didn't move towards full delivery - so where remote learning was being practised, (with 'young adults' who are better suited) as late as 22nd december, government were saying 'stop that!'
As TAM says - the government haven't provided the basics so they are asking for absurdity. I've been asked 'can I have something that will film my lessons so everyone can be seen and it swivel and follow me, but go to the kids when they're speaking, relay it live and translate at the same time and it cost about £600 because we're doing a discussion lesson and I have foriegn student who can't speak english' - no, you can use a crappy laptop camera with a mic attached and Google will do a bad job of translating, but that's the best you're getting.
The government have 'asked' for remote learning - they've done little to implement it - they've just chucked the ball at the schools and said 'this will happen everyone!' I'm not defending schools that are genuinely not trying but the central response from the government has been really poor imo and left schools flailing with a sudden u turn they denied for months and months.
td53
Well-known member
That's not good enough. I can see why you are pissed off. That's shite.
TwelveAngryMen
Well-known member
We will have to see how it pans out but from the limited info I have with the numbers actually in school the teachers are having to act a circus style jugglers between those in front of them and those not
td53
Well-known member
Yeah, I hear that too. Other half works in a primary school. Some classes have loads in, some have a few. To be fair to my lads place, I was critical above, but they've sent out work packs, differentiated for different kids and are doing online stuff from next week. I think it was sensible, send the kids work, take a week to get organised so the online stuff is better quality, rather than rush in and it not work well.
People have to remember that on Monday, the plan was 100% 'schools are the best place for children' and then by 8pm it was 'teach online'
I train people to use tech for different things and whilst I get frustrated with those people I train who seem to struggle to recognise a login button or don't know what 'refresh the browser' means, it's undeniable that not every person is naturally comfortable just jumping online and performing immediately, nor does teaching resemble say a business meeting, where you can just talk and assume everyone is listening. It's not an easy job and I don't envy people doing it to 6 yr olds at all at the best of times, let alone via a screen at a distance.
I do get why TS is frustrated tho - nothing is really poor and I'm not defending that at all. A bit of effort goes a long way in hard times.
TwelveAngryMen
Well-known member
BlackpoolWolves
Well-known member
Good luck to her! Year One was my favourite...but "face to face" not remotelyMy missus is doing Year One - you can imagine
To be fair she’s going for it
...very difficult to teach that age group effectively from a distance because so much of their learning is done practically and collaboratively with others. Concentration span and engaging and maintaining their interest are other issues too. Plus, the old chestnut that it depends entirely on the level of IT access and parental support at home. A 5 to 6 year old can't sort that out themselves
. But, of course, during these times we must try our best.
Wizaard
Well-known member
And in many deprived areas, including Blackpool, the kids at the other end of the virtual classroom won't have the kit to be able to get the full benefit of the lesson.
That doesnt lessen the professionalism of the staff, just a reflection of reality and not the perfect scenario envisaged by the powers that be.
catinstalbans
Well-known member
Just remember the large number of times that the most vulnerable in society have been attacked for having smart phones or the internet and how often we have been told that these are luxuries. Now it turns out that these items are in fact essential for any and every member of society to have.